Petrol Not given out

Del2005

slimjimmc wrote: »

But the meter is still running, so aren't you still paying for air?

No. I go up to the counter and tell them no fuel came out. It's much easier not to pay, for the expensive fresh air, then get the money back

Kiss1037

Meter in pump is driven by the fuel passing through it , they can drift slighty over time but ususally ( if not always , to the customers benefit) , there are standards set by NSAI as to tolerances and legal requiremnets for measure checks,
have a lot of experience with pumps , and have only seen issue where these claims could be justified once , feasibly can happen if fuel is heavily frothed , but still very unlikely, you probably don't like hearing it but fault is with you gauge in the car.

as for it happening across 2 grades , impossible

Del2005

Kiss1037 wrote: »

Meter in pump is driven by the fuel passing through it , they can drift slighty over time but ususally ( if not always , to the customers benefit) , there are standards set by NSAI as to tolerances and legal requiremnets for measure checks,
have a lot of experience with pumps , and have only seen issue where these claims could be justified once , feasibly can happen if fuel is heavily frothed , but still very unlikely, you probably don't like hearing it but fault is with you gauge in the car.

as for it happening across 2 grades , impossible

How can it be impossible when several people have had it happen?

tallaghtoutlaws

Here is a good article from a US website talking about Faulty pumps:

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2008/07/01/20080701biz-gaspumps0630.html

If you're already mad about gas prices, prepare to get madder.

Besides paying prices at the pump that were unthinkable a few months ago, many consumers also are getting ripped off by the pump itself.

About 9 percent, or about 2,000, of the 20,400 gas pumps inspected this fiscal year by the Arizona Department of Weights and Measures since July 1, 2007, failed to pass muster.

Half of those were malfunctioning to the detriment of customers.

Pump operators either were physically shorting customers on gas, overcharging them by starting the price meter before gas started to flow (meter jump) or letting it run after the flow had stopped (meter creep).

An examination by The Arizona Republic of 1,547 gas-station inspection records spanning a broader period, from Jan. 2, 2007, to June 5, 2008, found that at least 380 locations had violations that resulted in customers being overcharged for gas.

The failed inspections produced 1,104 citations that drew fines of $300 to $500 per violation. A single station could rack up a number of violations if multiple pumps are found to be out of calibration.

Of the 1,104 citations, 453 involved pumps that delivered less gas than the customer paid for, 390 were cited for meter jump and 261 involved meter creep.

There also could be many more bandit pumps that have gone undetected.

Infrequent inspections

Arizona inspects its 66,000 gas pumps every three years, while most other states do it at least once a year. Paltry fines provide little incentive to repair malfunctioning pumps.

"Only one state, Texas, has less frequent gas-pump inspections than we do," said Sen. Robert Miranda, D-Phoenix.

Arizona has had trouble keeping to its every-three-year schedule. Last year, the department inspected only about 15,000 pumps. Inspections have jumped to more than 20,000 this year, largely because of pressure from Miranda and Arizona Gov. Janet Napolitano, according to Steve Meissner, a spokesman for Weights and Measures.

Understaffed agency

Miranda said the Legislature cut funding for Weights and Measures in the 1980s and it increased the time between inspections because of the loss of inspectors.

The department now has 22 inspectors that, in addition to gas pumps, must verify the accuracy of scales at package shippers, supermarket cash registers and other devices.

"We do what we can with what we have," Meissner said. "We have limited resources."

The department says that overall, 95 percent of the state's pumps are accurate, which mirrors the findings of a 2003 nationwide survey conducted by the National Conference on Weights and Measures. Each nozzle and each grade, including diesel, counts as a pump and is inspected.

Arizona's 66,000 pumps are mostly at the 2,051 gas stations that fall under the state's purview.

A disparity of 6 cubic inches draws a citation, Meissner said. There are 231 cubic inches in a gallon.

Among some of the major offenders, according to The Arizona Republic's record search:


• Six high-flow diesel pumps at Sunmart in Ehrenberg were off from 120 to 200 cubic inches in May 2007.


• Six pumps at Superpumper in Scottsdale had discrepancies from 10 to 32 cubic inches in April.


• Eight pumps at a Valero station in Phoenix dispensed from 7 to 17 cubic inches less per gallon than the meter registered.

Insufficient fines

At current prices for regular unleaded, a 6-cubic-inch disparity amounts to 11 cents per gallon.

"Over a year or more, that could amount to thousands of dollars," Miranda said.

The potential for a windfall profit and insufficient fines for abusers provide little incentive for pump owners to make repairs, Miranda said.

"It can cost $800 to recalibrate a pump, and the fine for a first-time offense is only $300," Miranda said. The fine is per pump. Multiple violations could draw a larger fine.

Miranda has proposed legislation that would increase the first fine to $1,000, and he is hopeful the increase in revenue would pay for more inspectors.

"We need to get (that) so that we are inspecting these pumps once a year, instead of every three years," he said.

The Department of Weights and Measures has collected $297,000 from 420 offenders since July 1, 2007, up from $212,700 collected from 343 offenders the 12 months before. This year, $3,100 in fines went unassessed because the pump or operator already had been fined the maximum allowed.

Annual caps are $5,000 per pump and $50,000 per operator. An operator with more than 100 stations in Arizona, such as Circle K, could be fined a maximum of $50,000.

Complaints on the rise

Meissner said that, besides scheduled inspections, the department also responds to complaints, which have been rising with gas prices.

The department has received 2,907 gas-pump complaints since July 1, 2007, compared with 2,583 for the same period a year earlier.

High gas prices are bringing pump issues to light that once went unnoticed, Meissner said.

"People are paying a lot more attention," he said.

Awareness of meter jump and meter creep are up nationwide because of the high prices, said Judy Cardin, chairwoman of the National Conference on Weights and Measures.

older i get better i was

usually i feel the same when i've just been fleeced by a taximan nd he's speed'n off after not issuing a receipt, welcome to the club. did the garage rob your phone too after you left in on the counter?

Archeron

Interesting post above with the report on people being ripped off in the states.

I posted earlier in the thread about a garage that I feel charged me money and gave me no fuel as well. Interestingly, that exact same garage is where I had noticed before that when you stop the flow of petrol, take out the pump and go to place it back in its holder, and extra 10c or so was going onto the bill. This was very obvious to me as I am a bit anal, and always get an exact amount of moneys worth of fuel. This meant that I put in €10 worth of fuel, but when I am replacing the pump on its holder, the bil was going up to €10.10

I posted here on Boards to ask if anybody had seen this before and was told there wasnt a hope that this could happen as the pumps are monitored too closely.

This is very interesting thread, and I wonder how many other people have seen this happen and just let it pass.

20goto10

Care to name and shame? It will make you feel better about losing your tenner and prevent others falling foul to their scam :-)

-Corkie-

20goto10 wrote: »

Care to name and shame? It will make you feel better about losing your tenner and prevent others falling foul to their scam :-)

Do not name and shame OP it could ruin a business with one post.

I was running very low on diesel last year and my the car showed I had 0KM left before running out. I stopped at a filling station and put in 6 euro of diesel and the car still registered that until I got home.

Your gauge isnt going to show 6 litres of fuel and as for that taxi driver with his 22MPG he was talking through his arse.....

maxer68

If anyone has any issue with a garage and its pumps, they can send a report to the NSAI.

The fines for having a pump mis-calibrated are extremely high. €10,000 for first offence.

Inspectors inspect all pumps up to 2 times per year and inspect the fuel itself. All visits are without notification and can take place at anytime.

Naming a garage based on one person's feeling and zero evidence or proof would lead to an immediate legal action against boards and possibly the poster and I doubt very much boards would like that.

On a very empty tank 6 litres would not register. How long was the OP driving with the guage at or near empty?

One further point. All changeable measuring components are security sealed, similar to an ESB meter. If these are tampered with, it is also an offence.