Galway roundabouts set for upgrades

left_behind

Taken from the advertiser facebook

Six roundabouts in the city to be upgraded to signalised junctions at a cost of 4m over the next two years. There are serious concerns among councillors that every junction will end up like the junction at Moneen...

This could be a disaster.

Wompa1

Just heard that on the radio...watch this backfire! It's such a dumb idea. They need to think outside of the box. Forget roundabouts and junctions for now...come up with something more significant which can ease the traffic significantly enough so that the junction would work.

I can imagine people coming from Parkmore will face even longer tail backs if it's a junction...but what do I know...I'm not an engineer or a politician

challengemaster

More roadworks obstructing traffic for 2 years, yay!!! :rolleyes:

what_traffic

FYI: This was also discussed a few weeks back in the Galway City boards thread: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056216631

Madame Razz

Galway city council in another stupid traffic decision shocker:rolleyes:

desaparecidos

They should use non slip tarmac on the roundabouts this time round.

Mrs OBumble

Wompa1 wrote: »

come up with something more significant which can ease the traffic significantly enough so that the junction would work.

Buses!

But seriously folks: for pedestrians and cyclists, roundabouts are even more dangerous when traffic is lighter.

I'm in favour of this work.

brianthebard

They must really love that 'most congested city' title, someone ought to tell them its not an award they should be aiming to hold on to....

challengemaster

JustMary wrote: »

Buses!

But seriously folks: for pedestrians and cyclists, roundabouts are even more dangerous when traffic is lighter.

I'm in favour of this work.

How exactly is a roundabout dangerous for a pedestrian? Why are pedestrians trying to use a roundabout? :P

And I've yet to see a cyclist properly use a roundabout instead of cycling onto the paths and around (as they do for all sets of traffic lights)

snubbleste

I think this is an excellent decision.
GCC have realised that they cannot go about spouting that Galway is pedestrian-friendly and encourage more pedestrian traffic unless they provide a safe environment. This is a very traffic friendly decision.


Love this bit

..for every euro spent on the project, there would be a cost benefit of €4. This was created by reduced journey times, health benefits caused by greater levels of exercising and environmental payoffs as a result of fewer emissions.

TristanPeter

challengemaster wrote: »

How exactly is a roundabout dangerous for a pedestrian? Why are pedestrians trying to use a roundabout? :P

Is this a serious question Have you never tried crossing the road at/near a roundabout? People crossing the road at the roundabout at the end of the Quincentennial Bridge next to Tesco practically have to run across it as soon as there's a break in the traffic. It's crazy and it's extremely dangerous. The roundabouts should be much more pedestrian/cyclist friendly.

philbo

challengemaster wrote: »

And I've yet to see a cyclist properly use a roundabout instead of cycling onto the paths and around (as they do for all sets of traffic lights)

exactly. because they know it's instant hospitalisation if they even attempt to use a roundabout. the only time I've ever managed to get around one on my bike is at the back of the hospital, when there was hardly any traffic. Even then, some fool came flying out onto it without feeling the need to pause for a look and nearly took me out of it.

I try to avoid walking anywhere near the quincentennial roundabout. I end up just skipping up the dyke road to avoid trying to cross at the actual junction!

jimbobaloobob

If i remember correctly when the lights were put at moneenageesha it was supposed to allow for free flow out the old dublin road, so in theory if you were at the speed limits you wouldnt get held up.

I dont believe that ever worked and then they added a set of lights as you come out from Mervue Church onto the Dublin Road.

At present there isnt a route across the city not effected by Road works. In this day and age you would imagine they could devise a plan that would focus resources on one route until its finished besides making a mess of traffic flow on all routes.

I dont think they consider the effects on business, not only the ones who have road works outside their door but also businesses outside the city that are dependent on commuting traffic or commuting customers.

snubbleste

Actually philbo, you need to assert yourself more. I know plenty of cyclists who use the roundabouts.
Go into the centre of the lane to prevent the car behind from passing, eyeball any potential wayward motorist..casually saunter through the junction enjoying each cycle of the pedals until you reach your signalled exit and continue.

The only reason roundabouts are so prolific is becasue they are the cheapest junction to create and maintain, however they only take the motorist into account.

McTigs

From galwaynews.ie

studies found that although 24% of residents live less than 2km from work, with 54% living within 4km, 64% of them commuted by car

This my friends is why we have traffic congestion and the sooner everyone wakes up to it the better.

Anything that promotes cycling, buses or walking over getting in a car for such a short commute as 4k is a good idea.

I have no problem cycling through any roundabout but i've been cycling these roads for years but i can see how for anyone new to it would be terrified. And yeah, crossing the road anywhere near a roundabout is pure russian roulette.

antoobrien

philbo wrote: »

exactly. because they know it's instant hospitalisation if they even attempt to use a roundabout. the only time I've ever managed to get around one on my bike is at the back of the hospital, when there was hardly any traffic. Even then, some fool came flying out onto it without feeling the need to pause for a look and nearly took me out of it.

I try to avoid walking anywhere near the quincentennial roundabout. I end up just skipping up the dyke road to avoid trying to cross at the actual junction!

I've used roundabouts as a cyclist for years going to/from college and only had 1 problem before I moved out of town. I used the quincentennial roundabout every morning and cemetary cross roundabout every evening without any issues. The only problem I had was when going around the roundabout @ JJ Flemming's to go out the dual carriageway I was hit by a car who wasn't watching the road - (he'd have hit whatever was on front of him that day). Since they converted that RAB to 3 lanes in on the Tuam road I use the paths, otherwise I cycle on all RABs I use (Galway or Dublin and they're far more ignorant up here).

antoobrien

It's not the roundabouts that are causing the traffic problems, it's the facilities that have to be put in place to allow for local traffic and pedestrians that are causing the traffic to block up the roundabouts. Before we can even think about attacking the traffic problem at roundabouts we need to have a serious systematic look at how and where we
a) allow access to residential areas e.g. renmore
b) provision pedestrian access

If we don't do this, changing the roundabouts to lighted junctions won;t make a dammned bit of difference - the lights at Moneenaghesa are an example of this (anyone I know avoids the Monivea road now unless going to the bank). This is now terrible in light traffic as well as heavy traffic.

I'd be in favour of things like using pedestrian footbridges and lowering the level of the road between Moneenaghesa and Merlin Park in order to remove pedestrian lights. There'd have to be other things as well, such as stopping right turn access at Renmore park and have a serious look at the access to Renmore @ Duggans and Mervue church at Glenina.


As for the Roundabout in Briarhill I have to make a submission to City hall to outline a proposal I made on the previous thread a couple of weeks ago

KevR

Traffic lights work better than roundabouts at peak times in most towns/cities on this earth. Could you imagine if you replaced loads of major traffic light junctions in Dublin, Cork, London, Manchester, Birmingham...etc with roundabouts?! Those places would grind to a halt with roundabouts at most of their major junctions. Traffic lights can be frustrating off-peak when there is little traffic - you can get held up for no real reason.

I think traffic is better through Moneenageisha at peak times now. I don't believe the whole "people avoiding it like the plague" arguement. Moneen could be better though - Galway drivers are way too laid back and slow; GCC should trial an amber warning light just before the green comes on, it's infuriating that some people take 5-8 seconds to start moving when the light goes green. And I'm not sure that they need to allow four right turning movements at Moneen..
People can't stand Moneen because they sometimes get held up a bit longer off-peak.

If Moneenageisha actually was better when it was a roundabout then why not replace the N6/Newcastle Rd junction with a roundabout and all other major crossroad junctions in the city? Other cities would surely follow suit..

PS - upgrading roundabouts to traffic lights is a cheap short term solution. I'm not even sure you could call it a solution, it won't make enough of a difference. They need to look at grade separation, flyovers, pedestrian bridges/underpasses and the Galway Bypass if they are going to give us a solution worth talking about.

brianthebard

challengemaster wrote: »

How exactly is a roundabout dangerous for a pedestrian? Why are pedestrians trying to use a roundabout? :P

And I've yet to see a cyclist properly use a roundabout instead of cycling onto the paths and around (as they do for all sets of traffic lights)

I can use a roundabout perfectly well, better than 90%+ galway drivers. I know not to go stopping in the middle of the roundabout and how to use the lanes correctly as well as how to signal, all basic skills lacking for galway drivers.

what_traffic

Had a look at the plans today. Only available to view in City Hall. They expect it should take under 6 months to construct. Anybody know/remember how long did it take for the 1st phase of the Moneen Roundabout -> Traffic Lights take? (I know the added the Left filter lane from Wellpark during a 2nd phase.)

what_traffic

from http://www.galwaycity.ie/GeneralNews/260511_02.html
on the 26 May 2011

Notice is hereby given that Galway City Council will host a Public Meeting on the proposed changes to the N6 Lynch Roundabout (Briarhill) on Thursday, 2nd June, 2011 at 7.30 p.m. in the Menlo Park Hotel.

also checkout the link:
Bothar na dTreabh (N6) Multi Modal Corridor Improvement Scheme

http://www.galwaycity.ie/GTU/190511_01.html

This would be an absolute disaster, its putting back the roundabout they replaced they should be not getting rid of the other ones. Moneenageisha is a disaster anytime Ive gone near it, and I know plenty who just avoid it altogether. There is even traffic there at off peak time that would never be there with the roundabout.

Also sorry if I offend pedestrians but theses are major road junctions on the outskirts of the city. Roundabouts will work better for cars, lights being better for pedestrians shouldn't really be a consideration as its whats best for car thats important on these major routes into the city.

For the roundabouts that have a bigger number of pedestrians I would just put a zebra crossing 50 yards or so before the roundabout, this would be the least inconvenience to cars as they only have to stop when there is someone crossing not waiting looking at pedestrian lights on a sequence with no one crossing and going mad. It would also give a perfectly safe place to cross the roads so best of both worlds.

dloob

Was reading in the tribune the engineers will be doing a presentation in the Menlo on June 2nd.
They expect at least a 15% reduction in journey times with the junctions.
They say they have the before and after traffic flow figures to prove that moneenageshia now has a 15% reduction in time it takes to get through it.

seabre

dloob wrote: »

Was reading in the tribune the engineers will be doing a presentation in the Menlo on June 2nd.
They expect at least a 15% reduction in journey times with the junctions.
They say they have the before and after traffic flow figures to prove that moneenageshia now has a 15% reduction in time it takes to get through it.

Perhaps This is due to the fact that people go out of their way to avoid using it!

Mrs OBumble

Dream Modern Bowler wrote: »

For the roundabouts that have a bigger number of pedestrians I would just put a zebra crossing 50 yards or so before the roundabout, this would be the least inconvenience to cars as they only have to stop when there is someone crossing not waiting looking at pedestrian lights on a sequence with no one crossing and going mad. It would also give a perfectly safe place to cross the roads so best of both worlds.

Ahh, yeah, I can see that now. Walking 50 yards down the hard shoulder on the dual carriageway between Briarhill RAB and the Morris RAB, so I can cross the road more safely. That's gonna work. :rolleyes:

Mrs OBumble

what_traffic wrote: »

from http://www.galwaycity.ie/GeneralNews/260511_02.html
on the 26 May 2011

Notice is hereby given that Galway City Council will host a Public Meeting on the proposed changes to the N6 Lynch Roundabout (Briarhill) on Thursday, 2nd June, 2011 at 7.30 p.m. in the Menlo Park Hotel.

also checkout the link:
Bothar na dTreabh (N6) Multi Modal Corridor Improvement Scheme

http://www.galwaycity.ie/GTU/190511_01.html

Am I the only one who thinks it's rather odd that this this meeting is being held half-way across the city from the RAB in question?

Sure meeting rooms at the Clayton are probably more expensive, but if you're going to consult about a neighbourhood, wouldn't it make sense to do so in that neighbourhood so that the locals can attend????

antoobrien

JustMary wrote: »

Am I the only one who thinks it's rather odd that this this meeting is being held half-way across the city from the RAB in question?

Sure meeting rooms at the Clayton are probably more expensive, but if you're going to consult about a neighbourhood, wouldn't it make sense to do so in that neighbourhood so that the locals can attend????

They don't want the locals attending, they might hear ideas that make sense - lights at briarhill definitely don't make sense. What they need to do there is:
Close off the Monivea road exit (outbound) from the RAB. Build a road in through the business park to come out in the scrubland beside western motors and put a RAB at the current entrance to the park.
Build a pedestrian overpass over the dual carriageways onto the roundabouts (I can't remember if anyone objected to the tunnel, but everyone in the area knew it wasn't going to be used).
Create a mini roundabout at the entrance to the Clayton or Doughiska and don't allow right turns into and out of Dunnes (similar to the set up of the retail park in Moneenagesha pre lights, if you want to turn right coming out, use the RAB).

Your solution to a congested roundabout is to add two more?

Iwannahurl

Dream Modern Bowler wrote: »

Also sorry if I offend pedestrians but theses are major road junctions on the outskirts of the city. Roundabouts will work better for cars, lights being better for pedestrians shouldn't really be a consideration as its whats best for car thats important on these major routes into the city.

For the roundabouts that have a bigger number of pedestrians I would just put a zebra crossing 50 yards or so before the roundabout, this would be the least inconvenience to cars as they only have to stop when there is someone crossing not waiting looking at pedestrian lights on a sequence with no one crossing and going mad. It would also give a perfectly safe place to cross the roads so best of both worlds.

This is what most of the pro-roundabout rhetoric is about, IMO. Cars, cars, cars. The day of road pricing/congestion charging can't come soon enough, I reckon.

Question for those who are happy to prioritise private cars at the expense of pedestrians and cyclists.

In terms of public transport efficiency (and priority) at peak traffic times, what are the advantages and disadvantages of traffic lights versus roundabouts?

ciotog

Dream Modern Bowler wrote: »

Also sorry if I offend pedestrians but theses are major road junctions on the outskirts of the city. Roundabouts will work better for cars, lights being better for pedestrians shouldn't really be a consideration as its whats best for car thats important on these major routes into the city.

For the roundabouts that have a bigger number of pedestrians I would just put a zebra crossing 50 yards or so before the roundabout, this would be the least inconvenience to cars as they only have to stop when there is someone crossing not waiting looking at pedestrian lights on a sequence with no one crossing and going mad. It would also give a perfectly safe place to cross the roads so best of both worlds.

The notion that traffic planning should be about causing the least inconvenience to cars is ridiculous. It's a culture that has brought us to the era of massive congestion and motor travel for even the shortest distances. I don't disagree that zebra crossings are a viable alternative to lights but the notion that they should be located for the convenience of the motorist instead of the pedestrian is flawed planning and a waste of money.

Iwannahurl

VISSIM videos on this City Council webpage: http://www.galwaycity.ie/GTU/Model.html

Would be handy on YouTube.