The concept of Capitalism - Conformism v Self Aware

Drumpot

Intelligence can be defined as the ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills.

What constitutes being intelligent is obviously subjective, but I think that there is a cavaet when discussing this word under certain sub contexts.

We are told the biggest threats to humankind are global warming, declining stocks of food and diminishing fuel resources. There is also the potential "species" ending threats like severe changes in climate/weather or a meteor etc.

I would of thought it would make more sense to spend the vast majority of the worlds resources on trying to come up with solutions to these problems and by having the worlds greatest minds to work long and hard on the solutions. Next to the progression of medicine, surely any intelligent person would tell you that its basic prudence to do what you can to further the chances of long term survival of the human race . .

But no . . We live in a world where there is more money spent on research to produce "goods" that do little then make peoples lives more complicated then they need to be. Which car should I buy, which TV etc. We value solicitors, accountants over doctors or even lifeguards (people who actually save lives).

Dont get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with choice, I just wonder at what expense are we giving ourselves all these pointless choices ? When will it finally catch up on us ? When will people wake up to the conformist, consumerist, propaganda driven world that we have been born into ?

I genuinley believe that most people are like the people in the Matrix movie. Programmed to believe that this is as good as it gets, this is the best way of living simply because its better then the way things used to be.

Right at the top of the propaganda's agenda is our good old friend Capitalism. The "simple" marketing system. It's supporters protest that it has no place in discussions on democracy and is simply a system designed to progress business.

Quite frankly , it couldn’t be more obvious that Capitalism has superseded the value’s of democracy and has made our world more civil, but has not eradicated the Feudal system, its just alterered the parameters it encompasses.


Anything that’s goal is to progress society for the greater good should be encouraged, but the capitalism system encourages people to manufacture and sell Sh*t that we don’t actually need. Not just that, it encourages us to be consumers MAINLY to prop up the system.

The concept of Necessity is lost to the modern world. I would easily presume that more money is spent on research for Sh*t we don’t need, then on cures for diseases. Why ? Because its more profitable.

Of course, if I were rich I wouldn’t really care much, but that only proves that as a species we are quite happy to ignore the pain of our fellow man, once we are not on the receiving end of it.

I do not consider myself any more educated or intelligent then anybody I know, I simply believe I am just more self aware then a majority of the people in the world who accept the world they are born into with questioning the validity of some of its more questionable perceived “progressive” nuances. I think its hard to argue that a person is only as free as the money in their pocket. Larger corporations that are of systemic importance to an economy (that’s run by the capitalist system) have more of a say as to how a country will be run then the average Joe on the street. This is not democracy as most people would interpret it, this is an upper class run dictatorship under the guise of democracy. In truth the majority of the world running with Capitalism has been conformed into being more civilised so that their masters can run things as they see fit. Different settings, different masters, same sort of outcome.

That is not to say that things are not better for us minions then they were in the past, its just that we have been made into druggies (consumers). We are kept from revolution by propaganda, the shaming of those who question conventional wisdom and by a conformist education that looks to teach the way we should live as opposed to harness intellectual debate on the ways of the world. There is little in life that asks us to actually think about how we lead our lives, what do we actually need in our lives to make us happy and what parts of society do not make sense.

I have been called an anarchist by friends when I have given them my views on society, which in itself shows the fear people have at questioning conventionoal wisdom. I don’t promote a stateless society, only a more progressive one that’s got the greater interest at heart. Then I get called a communist, but I think the ideal behind communism was superior (Classless society) but the system itself was a failure. Capitalism is like giving an alcoholic a pub to run, its just asking for trouble and look at the kind of trouble average people get into when the financial markets get things wrong. In proportion to the actual “pain” suffered by the majority who have duped us all, those down the lower end of the foodchain are paying the most. This is not a society I think should be promoted, but the fact is that the more civilised a society we become, the more control the rich will have over us. Revolutions are usually brutal, but they serve a purpose.

Now, I am not saying I want my children to go through any sort of revolution, but I can objectively see that this is exactly what those in power (the rich, not the politicians) want it to be this way. I will conform while I have much to lose. As such, status quo will remain the same and people will continue to live their lives under the “guidance” and encouragement of our kings. All you need ask yourself is why are our banks being bailed out for their own mistakes ? The system is supposed to be a “live or die” by the sword, but socialism has been granted on our banks that are too important to our economies/society to fail. As such, they are the king makers. Like the car manufacturers or Insurance companies that were too big to allow to fail, the rest of us twits have had to shoulder their mistakes simply because of a financial system encouraged by a capitalist driven ideology just cant allow its greatest lubricant to disappear.

I don’t hate society or the world we live in. I just expect and think that we can get better. I see the world for what it is. Comparing it with periods of history allows me to awknowledge and feel gratitude for how much better we have it. However this does not mean I can ignore the hypocrisy and the corruption of those in power (banks are forever, politicians can only do so much damage!). The only way a society can truely progress is by starting to view itself warts and all.

You don’t have to have bad intentions to do bad. Likewise you don’t need some big bad bond villain for good people to do bad things. The biggest problem is that people do not ask questions, they just conform to the world, the office, the country or the financial system that they are programmed to believe in. Why didnt the bank trust the judgement of consultants telling them that they were over exposed to property (I know one bank that wouldnt listen to a friend of mine who has a masters in the kind of stress testing that is going on all over the world!) Because they prob had shareholders and the only god is Money. Money that’s used to make more money and so on. That makes sense to most, but to me that’s simply hardcore greed.

As a species Greed is indeed one of our most basic desires. More power, money and more of things we don’t need. Capitalism simply accommodates this greed and worst still encourages us to gourge on the concept of greed at other peoples expense. It does less to enhance our lives, more to simply make them more complicated, more stressful and looks to force us to take risks whether we want to or not. Simple example. If I put my money in the bank on deposit, the biggest risk is that Inflation eats into its value. If I put it under my mattress, not only is inflation a problem but my house burns down. So my alternative option is to invest my money in something more risky. Who do I rely on ? Ah yes, the financial markets, most of which are made up of major corporations looking to make as much profits as possible by Joe consumer

I think its obvious that most people like to be led. The feudal system is alive and well. Replace kings with the rich (major corporations, banks etc), Barons are the politicians that do their bidding, the knights are the laws that protect them and the serfs are every one of us schmucks just trying to surivive on whatever scraps are left or given to us to keep us quiet.

I am not saying that this is the way things have been manipulated over hundreds of years, I am saying that this is simple where we find ourselves. I do not subscribe to conspiracies unless their is factual (not circumstantial) evidence to back it up. I simply believe the world would be a better place if people asked more questions of how we are using our time and resources to "better" ourselves. I do not promote anarchy, I just promote objective debate for a better progressive society that looks after the many at the expense of the few, instead of the other way around.

Permabear

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Drumpot

Permabear wrote: »

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I can do it in 3 !

Capitalism + Humanity = Bad

Or

Capitalism erodes democracy

Or

Feudal system lives

You need only look at who is actually running our country (IMF/ECB) for proof.

Permabear

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Drumpot

Permabear wrote: »

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That is true about other Capitalist nations not needing a bailout, however the commandments of capitalism has made it only a matter of time before most countries give in, get greedy and pay for mistakes of others.

Are you suggesting that that in every capitalist society, they would let a large organistion like a bank, financial institution etc, fail if it fell on hard times the likes of what we have seen ?

The whole system is designed to make it imperitive for certain organistions to require a bailout of sorts if they become too big to an economy.

Were FF in power in the U.S. ? Did they combine and flog off a load of sub prime mortgages ? Did they invent sub prime mortgages (that were always a bad idea !). FF were the facilitators, fanning the flames, but everything was put in place for them by others. I am not absolving them of blame and I am not calling capitalism some big bad system. What I am saying is that Capitalism encourages greed and as such it seeps into most aspects of life eroding our freedom. Its all about expanding ones wealth for self gain, how can that be a good mantra for the way the world works ?

Of course the definition of Capitalism is not easy to pin down. For the purpose of my discussion, its basically a system that encourages economic growth at the expense of everything else. This system supercedes everything and represents the new religion that people are forced to follow.

Permabear

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silverharp

Drumpot wrote: »

Of course the definition of Capitalism is not easy to pin down. For the purpose of my discussion, its basically a system that encourages economic growth at the expense of everything else. This system supercedes everything and represents the new religion that people are forced to follow.

Thats the problem, nobody knows ahead of time what "growth" ought to be. As the saying goes the only thing that grows constantly is cancer. Your problem is more with the fact that a self appointed government decides that the economy needs to grow so that they can tax it to make government bigger.
As individuals or individuals business owners , we dont really care what happens in the round. We make decisions from our own perspective. It takes a government to decide that more women ought to be in the workforce for instance, or to borrow and spend money it doesnt have to create jobs and growth.
On the other hand I have no problem with all the boffins that come up with services and products that didnt exist a decade ot 2 ago.

EnderValentine

Sorry to say, but you are wrong drumpot. While money is spent on technology that is designed to make our life more comfortable and heighten our standard of living, this research is working to also lengthen the lifespan of humans and if given the cerebral ability to engineer many modern tech, the. Cro-Magnons would have no doubt accepted this way of living. And conforming is not bad unless you are conforming to make someone else feel good or to protect yourself. As soon as one allows a government or group to take away ones individuality is when the world goes back to the time of the cold war and the "red scare". Being self aware may lead to conforming if one has a low selfesteem that requires the approval of others, yet self awareness is what keeps the world from becoming completely nazist or Stalinist or even democratic.

Monumental OP..

An0n

Could you put important points in bold? Just to make it a little less robotic.

I really can't read all of it without getting distracted.

Sorry for the half-spam.

Drumpot

EnderValentine wrote: »

Sorry to say, but you are wrong drumpot. While money is spent on technology that is designed to make our life more comfortable and heighten our standard of living, this research is working to also lengthen the lifespan of humans and if given the cerebral ability to engineer many modern tech, the. Cro-Magnons would have no doubt accepted this way of living. And conforming is not bad unless you are conforming to make someone else feel good or to protect yourself. As soon as one allows a government or group to take away ones individuality is when the world goes back to the time of the cold war and the "red scare". Being self aware may lead to conforming if one has a low selfesteem that requires the approval of others, yet self awareness is what keeps the world from becoming completely nazist or Stalinist or even democratic.

Money is spent on technology designed to make our lives more comfortable ? I think money is spent on products designed to make money, the fact that some money is spent on making our lives more comfortable is just an obvious eventuality from wanting to self satisfy ourselves.

I dont believe most people I know are completely self aware, that was my point. Conformism is not good when it excuses and allows others to take advantage of a nation of followers. Corruption in politics, questionable banking practises and corporate greed protected from moral hazzard by the state. These are unquestionable problems with society yet people feel helpless (in a supposed democracy!) to do anything about it.

Yeh, the EU didnt cause all our problems, but what responsibility has the ECB taken with regards to the money it lent our banks ? Where was its own moral hazzard ? Oh wait, they gave us a choice didn they ? Go bankrupt or do everything we say. . Perhaps not putting a gun to our heads, but its like saying to somebody you can jump off a cliff or follow my dictatorship irrespective of how you feel.

Black Swan

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