I no longer sink

Oryx

I hope to do turbo classes this winter, with proper hr stats this time. So note taken.

And I laughed my socks off at your 'only' a hm comment. Funny as.

elvis jones

Oryx wrote: »

I hope to do turbo classes this winter, with proper hr stats this time. So note taken.

And I laughed my socks off at your 'only' a hm comment. Funny as.

I found the turbo helped me in the "tri" position, it got my body used to it and when i did it 1st on my own bike is was a lot more natural than i thought it would be. So if the turbo bikes you'll be working on have the bars it will really help.

As for my HM comment, i've gone from taking the night before and day after off work to.

Working the night before, doing the HM, going direct to a gig ( shower at the gig ), dinner and off to another gig.

Its amazing how the body adapts and how more importantly the mind adapts. I remember doing my 1st sprint in April and thinking, how will i do this ??

Now i'd do a sprint tri any morning if asked and would beat that time from April;)

elvis jones

8K last night, slow pace for the 5k and uped it for the final 3. I'm inthe process of breaking in new runners so the slow pace with my wife at the start suited. Pushed it when she left me and it went well. Legs feel good today but not using the new runners for my LSR this weekend.

LSR is in the morning and its roughly 26KM.

I've got myself a regular Saturday night gig now so my weekends have some structure at last. I know Sat morning/fri evening will be for LSR. I'll have a lie in on a Sunday after work and the majority of my races will be on a Sunday from now on so i can prepare properly.

I feel happy that decisions i've made this week will lead to more organised weekends and therefore, family, social and training will have their parts:)

elvis jones

LSR on Saturday morning and i did 24K, it was tough and i did a course with repeating hills as i feel there is no point in doing flat runs.

I left a bottle with one gel at a place i'd pass a few times so i could grab it.

Ipod was dead so i was left with my own thoughts as i ran which is good as the no headphones are allowed at the 3/4 in Athlone.

I wore very light rain jacket at the start had to dump it after 3k, wow it might have looked cold and windy but it was warm once you got out there.

I was doing a loop of 8 and passing my water/gel twice per loop, i did touch it untill the 3rd time i went passed which was about 12.5k and i had drink, i walked to and from it as thats what i'm going to do on race day. Off i went until 15.5k and stopping again for my gel which i took with water.

I always feel good until about 16k and then i begin to drop for some reason ?

I kept going but the energy levels begun to drop as i went. I did stop to walk for 20 sec at 22k but off i went again until i hit 24k and honestly was in bits.

Pace according to my Garmin was 6:51 per km, i was aiming for 6:48 so happy enough with that.

I only changed some stuff this week to try and get more sleep but that will take a while to kick in.

Whats worrying me now is that next sat is the half in the park, but then 2 weeks after that is the 3/4 in Athlone so i have to raise my game by 4 miles in that short time and don't know if its possible:(

elvis jones

6k yesterday evening at 5:28 per km pace. Felt good and with a hill course i was pushing it all the way to the end.

I feel Saturday was a bilp now as i don't think i got enough fliuds into me on the run and as usual lack of sleep was an issue. Not to mention the 2 bottles of wine i had two days before the run:o

Swimming after work today, the basic breathing every 2 strokes got me to the end of the sprint tri this year but if i want to push on and get to Mayo next July i need to develop to breathing every 3 strokes. So its that i'm working on until i get it. Distance doesn't matter at all, its about getting those 3 strokes breathing and doing it again and again and again until its something i'm not in the water............natural.

Diet is good and all eyes are on the half on Saturday which i am going to run at DCM pace which is 2:15 finish time. I know thats slow but i need to work in race conditions and get my head around it.

catweazle

10 miles is about the time when it starts getting tough for me as well, I even ran a slow 10 miles last night and while my heart rate was in the 120s all the way around I could still feel the legs starting to give out near the end

However I do remember last years marathon training, towards the end 12, 13 miles felt like a short stroll so I am hoping things gets better soon.

You are making me feel guilty with that 2 stroke v 3 stroke swim training, from being a steady 3 stroke rotation last year I went back to a 2 stroke rotation this year. As the lap times I was doing got faster and harder I felt I needed more air and it just comes more naturally now.

Whenever I get worried I just look at an ITU race and seeing all those two strokers eases my mind a bit, albeit they are almost twice as fast as me. I suppose if I really needed to (waves coming in from my right side) I could go back to breathing on the other side. Someone like Interested or Shotgun would have more informed opinions on this anyways

elvis jones

catweazle wrote: »

10 miles is about the time when it starts getting tough for me as well, I even ran a slow 10 miles last night and while my heart rate was in the 120s all the way around I could still feel the legs starting to give out near the end

However I do remember last years marathon training, towards the end 12, 13 miles felt like a short stroll so I am hoping things gets better soon.

You are making me feel guilty with that 2 stroke v 3 stroke swim training, from being a steady 3 stroke rotation last year I went back to a 2 stroke rotation this year. As the lap times I was doing got faster and harder I felt I needed more air and it just comes more naturally now.

Whenever I get worried I just look at an ITU race and seeing all those two strokers eases my mind a bit, albeit they are almost twice as fast as me. I suppose if I really needed to (waves coming in from my right side) I could go back to breathing on the other side. Someone like Interested or Shotgun would have more informed opinions on this anyways

10 miles is normally a breeze but my sleep patterns with the kids are all over the place to energy levels haven't been great. I'm thinking of the week of DCM to sleep in a different room to try and be fresh for the day. BUT late nights from gigs don't help either and i have 2 weddings that weekend:o

On the swimming, i'm a newbie and i still find i'm gulping air when i breath so the 3 strokes will help me exhale a bit easier as i've been told i'm wasting a lot of energy doing what i am at the moment and therefore leaving myself breathless after no time at all.

I need to get my breathing slower and more natural like it is with my running which is fairly normal over long distances.

RedB

elvis jones wrote: »

Off i went until 15.5k and stopping again for my gel which i took with water.

I always feel good until about 16k and then i begin to drop for some reason ?

I kept going but the energy levels begun to drop as i went. I did stop to walk for 20 sec at 22k but off i went again until i hit 24k and honestly was in bits.

Pace according to my Garmin was 6:51 per km, i was aiming for 6:48 so happy enough with that.

I wonder if you should take the gel earlier e.g after an hour?

If you only took it after 15.5k then that was about 1hour 45mins into the LSR at 6:51 pace? I find it takes time for the gel to kick in so if you wait until you're suffering then its already too late and its hard to bounce back after the dip in energy levels. Any run I do longer than 90mins I try to get a gel in at the hour mark and every 30mins after that. No point keeping the gels just for emergencies

elvis jones

RedB wrote: »

I wonder if you should take the gel earlier e.g after an hour?

If you only took it after 15.5k then that was about 1hour 45mins into the LSR at 6:51 pace? I find it takes time for the gel to kick in so if you wait until you're suffering then its already too late and its hard to bounce back after the dip in energy levels. Any run I do longer than 90mins I try to get a gel in at the hour mark and every 30mins after that. No point keeping the gels just for emergencies

My thoughts on the gels are that i'm training my body to do without until a certain stage in training and not to take more than 1 on any LSR. So that on the day of DCM i can get them into me and the body will use them better as its already done so much with so little.........perhaps i'm wrong

catweazle

I remember having a discussion like this with Redb last year. I don't agree with that theory Elvis (as always I am no expert either). One gel for eg a 20 miler is going to be hard going particularly when you wont be running it to pace. It may well effect your ability to complete the 20 miler

I would go along with Red, usually the nutrition is needed at around the 90 minute mark but I also take one a bit earlier than that if I can

Get them down you is my opinion, note though I only start taking them when I know I am out for 2 hours +

If you also don't use them regularly be careful on the day or you might be needing a toilet stop on the way - at least Dublin will have the portaloos in abundance

elvis jones

catweazle wrote: »

I remember having a discussion like this with Redb last year. I don't agree with that theory Elvis (as always I am no expert either). One gel for eg a 20 miler is going to be hard going particularly when you wont be running it to pace. It may well effect your ability to complete the 20 miler

I would go along with Red, usually the nutrition is needed at around the 90 minute mark but I also take one a bit earlier than that if I can

Get them down you is my opinion, note though I only start taking them when I know I am out for 2 hours +

If you also don't use them regularly be careful on the day or you might be needing a toilet stop on the way - at least Dublin will have the portaloos in abundance

Thanks for that,

Perhaps i was leaving it too late and the gel kicked in when i was sitting on the couch:D

I'm using the same ones as DCM so that the belly is prepared !

I have the half this sat so i'll bring one to have at about 90 min.

But the week after is 27k so i'll aim for 1 every 30 min after 90. It will take some organising but i'll get it done and report back.

I also feel i'm not getting enough fluids in but don't want to get in too much. I'm going to stash a few small kids bottles on my route and sip. Gerry Duffy said he found it easier to take in fluids by sipping over a period of time rather than gulp down and upset the stomach.

RedB

elvis jones wrote: »

My thoughts on the gels are that i'm training my body to do without until a certain stage in training and not to take more than 1 on any LSR. So that on the day of DCM i can get them into me and the body will use them better as its already done so much with so little.........perhaps i'm wrong

It may be a personal thing and depend on your own body but I tried minimizing the gels I took in training last year in a similar hope that I was conditioning myself to rely on my own body fuel and to burn more fat. More often than not I ended up wrecked and recovery took a bit longer and I wasn't as fresh going into the next session and hence wasn't as productive. I pondered restricting gels in my log at the time and the queries from others I recall were typically 'what was the scientific source of this approach'. I didn't have any and I just assumed it was intuitive. However the feeling I was ending up with was of 'flogging a dead horse' which wasn't fun . I found that taking gels earlier and regularly worked for me and in last years DCM (3:42) I took them from 40mins in and every 25-30?mins after that and they worked a treat. You may find that you don't need them as much as you progress but IMO maybe experiment a little now rather than sticking to a plan that isn't working perfectly?

BTW well done on the great progress made since you started the log as I dip in from time to time and love to see such improvements especially when you've other challanges to juggle as well. Keep up the good work

RedB

elvis jones wrote: »

I'm using the same ones as DCM so that the belly is prepared !

I have the half this sat so i'll bring one to have at about 90 min.

But the week after is 27k so i'll aim for 1 every 30 min after 90. It will take some organising but i'll get it done and report back.

I also feel i'm not getting enough fluids in but don't want to get in too much. I'm going to stash a few small kids bottles on my route and sip. Gerry Duffy said he found it easier to take in fluids by sipping over a period of time rather than gulp down and upset the stomach.

The other thing is making it easy to use them and you'll have to develop your own system that works for you and the route that you're running. I got used to carrying water bottles (750ml - 1L) and gels with me either in hand or in a belt. I used to carry the water so far, drink maybe 250ml, and then leave it on a section that I'd be back to 45-60mins later. You can also use isogels or even carry those kids bottles (250ml - 500ml). If using regular gels then its important to also wash them down with water at that time so they absorb properly.

catweazle

RedB wrote: »

I found that taking gels earlier and regularly worked for me and in last years DCM (3:42)

I must compliment you on that time Red, I am training away but nothing I have done in training so far leads me to believe with any confidence that i could beat that time in Dublin. At this stage I am more leaning towards the 3.45 pacers, helped by the fact that Macanri and Shotgun are there so it will be a bit of craic anyways (For the first 20 miles)

RedB

catweazle wrote: »

I must compliment you on that time Red, I am training away but nothing I have done in training so far leads me to believe with any confidence that i could beat that time in Dublin. At this stage I am more leaning towards the 3.45 pacers, helped by the fact that Macanri and Shotgun are there so it will be a bit of craic anyways (For the first 20 miles)

I really believe the gels made the world of difference for me on the day. I hit the 16M mark feeling as fresh as the 1M mark and the squeeze only came on after 22M. I did do the training though as it was my A goal

elvis jones

I've been MIA for a few weeks and the mystery of being tired and no energy had been solved.

I went to the doctor last week and after numberous blood tests etc it was confirmed that i have type 2 diabetes.

My blood sugar has been all over the place and caused me to be tired and when it came time to get out and train the energy and will to do so wasn't there and little did i know the cure for that was to actually train and get my bood sugar to a normal level.

Anyway i'll have to change my diet, take tablets every day and keep the training up.

It has meant that i missed a lot of training sessions BUT am still going to do the marathon but am not aiming for a specific time now. Just to finsh and know that i've done it.

I have also been advised not to use gels during LSR as i have enough sugar in my blood to keep my going and actually when i finished a 17 mil LSR on
Sunday it was 4.8 which is normal.........

I got out last week and did 10k, 13k and 27k on sunday.

As i said i got out and did 27k on sunday, i did the 1st 10km at a slower pace and it stood to me in the end. All i took on was some water and a tiny drop of energy drink at 22k. I got to the end and felt great. I was able to eat afterwards and legs were grand.

Yesterday i got out and did a gentle 20k on the bike which went well. Later on in the day i run 6k at half marathon pace and that felt good as well.

I'm amazing that the extra pacing has brought energy towards the end of my LSR and legs felt great yesterday.

Onwards towards the 3/4 marathon on Sunday !

elvis jones

Nice one hr session on the turbo this evening. I borrowed one from a club member to see how I liked it. It took a few min to get my bearings but once I did I found it a good work out while watching football on tv.

I feel I'll do more of these sessions in the evening when the kids go to bed. I'd like to build to a 2 hr session.

elvis jones

Today Elvis rested, I did 3 days after my 27k on Sunday which I'm amazed I was able to do. Anyway body feels good and I'll run after work tomorrow then off to a gig !

Friday will be a gentle swim and sauna session

elvis jones

Plans went up in smoke when my wife forgot to bring my running gear to Dublin. Lucky for me i had my swimming gear in work so went for a swim last night.

I just worked on getting up and down the pool. 750m in total and it was easier than usual. I'm starting to relax a little more and not gulping in the air when i breath which means i don't have as much to exhale under water and thus saving energy.

Late night last night with a gig until 3am, same tonight but i'll do a nice 10k run either at lunch or in the evening that will leave my in a nice position for Sunday.

couerdelion

How's the diabetes interfering with training?

Nutrition is a complete nightmare for me as it is without having to consider low GI, sugars etc.

Good that you've got a diagnosis and can now get on with the important tasks like training

elvis jones

couerdelion wrote: »

How's the diabetes interfering with training?

Nutrition is a complete nightmare for me as it is without having to consider low GI, sugars etc.

Good that you've got a diagnosis and can now get on with the important tasks like training

It actually helps on long runs at the moment as my blood is storing lots of sugar that i can use. No need for gels or the like and at the end of a 17 miler my blood sugar level was perfect.

Its a reason also to keep going and get the weight down and fingers crossed tablets and doseage will drop.

My doctor explained my diet in one phrase........stop eating $hite ! He has it as well and runs so that helps to get advice from him.

I can feel energy levels coming back and i just have to be extra aware of what and when i eat. Cut out all the chocolate etc and moderate booze which is fine as i was a 1 night a week man and now that will be once a fortnight.

Christmas will be fun but my wife got me special chocolate which is nice and goes will with my favourite.........Merlot:)

RubyK

From my own experience, running will certainly help regulate your blood sugar levels.

elvis jones wrote: »

Christmas will be fun but my wife got me special chocolate which is nice and goes will with my favourite.........Merlot:)

Be careful with the diabetic chocolate, eat only small amounts of it. Read the recommendations on the pack It can do funny things to your stomach.

elvis jones

RubyK wrote: »

From my own experience, running will certainly help regulate your blood sugar levels.



Be careful with the diabetic chocolate, eat only small amounts of it. Read the recommendations on the pack It can do funny things to your stomach.

And your arse:D

yeah the running/cycling/swimming will help me and lucky for me that i'm in a grove of already doing it and don't have to start from scratch.

RubyK

elvis jones wrote: »

And your arse:D

yeah the running/cycling/swimming will help me and lucky for me that i'm in a grove of already doing it and don't have to start from scratch.

Yep!

Yeah, you're lucky exercise is already a big part of your life already. It's not a chore to get out there.

Best of luck with it

elvis jones

AAAAAAAAAAAhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

A change in work so no run this evening but i'll get out for a nice slow 6k tomorrow to get the legs ready for Sunday.

I'm starting to enjoy my running again.

If Dublin goes well i'm going to make a silly silly decision..........watch this space on Nov 1:cool:

Izoard

elvis jones wrote: »

AAAAAAAAAAAhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

A change in work so no run this evening but i'll get out for a nice slow 6k tomorrow to get the legs ready for Sunday.

I'm starting to enjoy my running again.

If Dublin goes well i'm going to make a silly silly decision..........watch this space on Nov 1:cool:

Any idea what pace you'll go at?

I'm down as a pacer for the "4hr" (albeit it will be actual ~ 4.15 pace, for the purposes of getting up for Dublin)...would be good to have you along!

elvis jones

Izoard wrote: »

Any idea what pace you'll go at?

I'm down as a pacer for the "4hr" (albeit it will be actual ~ 4.15 pace, for the purposes of getting up for Dublin)...would be good to have you along!

Did you hear about the guy who went to do a race..........with no runners:o

yes it happened to me yesterday morning with the rushing to get the kids out the door etc, i left my runners at home and only noticed when i went to put them on:(

So off i went home with my tail between my legs and in an awful mood. Got home and had no interest in running or moving off the couch but i pushed myself out the door and did 8 miles which lifted the fog and cheered me up a bit. At least i'm able to run, no injury and will do my 20 mile LSR mid week and i'll still be on track for DCM.

Swimming at lunch today, just to stretch out the body !

elvis jones

Been advised not to do the LSR i was planning mid week but to do it at the weekend and leave it as my last longest run and taper from there. So Sat/Sun ( depending on dj work ) i plan do do 33km, that will leave 9 to tack on to the end on Oct 31st.

Today its 16k run at a nice slow pace after work and tomorrow i shall turbo:)

elvis jones

13.25k was last nights run.

Slow pace at the start with my wife but i picked it up when she left and pushed it. Legs felt great and if i had time i would have done further. My little fella is playing up at the mo and will only let me put him to bed so i had to get home to do that.

I might swim/turbo today or i might just rest and look forward to 10k thursday evening.

I'm off to get my tablets next week and a little worried about starting them so close to DCM so i might ask him if its ok if i leave off starting them until after it.

Diet is really good and i know i have to get more off but that will come with time. Portion size will be my focus after DCM, untill then i'm getting good calories into and little sugar to help stabilise my bloods !

elvis jones

Groin was a little sore yesterday so nothing done.

Feels a lot better today but not going to risk it.

I'll do a nice warm up in the morning and its the big 20 miler. I'll get my wife to place some water bottles along my route and this evening i'll have a nice feed of pasta.

Tomorrow is my 3/4 marathon ( a week late ).