New traffic lights planned on Skehard Road. Still time to object!

twowheelsonly

25 Years living in Mahon and driving that route regularly.
Just saw my first accident there - A 'rearender'.
Some might say that can happen anywhere, anytime but it's the first time I've seen one there.

Milly33

I spotted the other fantastic set of lights they have put in there now. and that wonderfull cycle lane.. hope the accident wasnt bad. tis only a matter of time now until a bad one happens there, twill either be a car, cyclist or pedestrian

the beer revolu

twowheelsonly wrote: »

25 Years living in Mahon and driving that route regularly.
Just saw my first accident there - A 'rearender'.
Some might say that can happen anywhere, anytime but it's the first time I've seen one there.

I seriously suspect that the rear ender was caused by someone planning to break the lights but got caught out when the car in front changed their mind and correctly decided to stop at the red light.

If that was the case, it is hardly the fault of the junction.

I see people breaking red lights on a daily basis just a matter of time before it causes an accident.

D'Agger

I have to say the number of people breaking red lights at the junction (that I've come across) is quite high.

Coming from the well rd. going right towards Super Value yesterday the lights went green and a car came sailing through from the Cork Con side - there's a few seconds delay between that light going red and mine going green I'd imagine, yet she still went through.

the beer revolu

D'Agger wrote: »

I have to say the number of people breaking red lights at the junction (that I've come across) is quite high.

Coming from the well rd. going right towards Super Value yesterday the lights went green and a car came sailing through from the Cork Con side - there's a few seconds delay between that light going red and mine going green I'd imagine, yet she still went through.

I see this happening every day - across pedestrian crossings too!
Green man comes on and sometimes two cars will continue across the junction.
The junction by The Opera House is a particular black spot for this behaviour.

pwurple

It's the position of the lights, they are a bit weird. I see it going up from the well road. People go both ways on green, even though there are two lights next to each other... The road layout coming down templehill makes the red light there tricky to notice for newbies to the road.

I was 1 car away from a few dents on tuesday at the junction down to the silver quay. Person turned right into the junction, into the back of a car which was parked on the corner, partially on the footpath, partially on a double yellow.

I wish to christ any of the markings there were enforced. It is hard enough to see up that road to the right of that silver quay junction without the line of sight being competely blocked by cars parked in the weirdly wide bicycle lane thing that looks like a giant parking bay. People are using it as a park and ride. Park up in the morning and hop on the 215 into town.

Vivara

Coming from the Cork Con. side, there's a green light to allow you to go straight ahead towards the Skehard Road, and there's a green light (an arrow pointing right) to allow you to turn right onto the Well Road.

The first several times, I mistook the green light for straight on to be the light that allows you to turn right as well, and I have seen four people this week do the same thing.

You end up in the middle of the road and cars are streaming at you. And these lights are right next to each other so it's fairly confusing!

V.

ShamoBuc

Vivara wrote: »

Coming from the Cork Con. side, there's a green light to allow you to go straight ahead towards the Skehard Road, and there's a green light (an arrow pointing right) to allow you to turn right onto the Well Road.

The first several times, I mistook the green light for straight on to be the light that allows you to turn right as well, and I have seen four people this week do the same thing.

You end up in the middle of the road and cars are streaming at you. And these lights are right next to each other so it's fairly confusing!

V.

But..but... they are the most intelligent lights ever!:rolleyes:

lapsed

Unbelievable mess. No indication at all that you have to suddenly veer left ( coming uphill from Supervalue side ) in order to get down Well Road. All this chaos in order for 100 yards of bus lane. Job justification prizewinner.

twowheelsonly

ShamoBuc wrote: »

But..but... they are the most intelligent lights ever!:rolleyes:

Unfortunately whoever installed them might possibly not have the same level of intelligence!!

Coming down the hill towards Scallys to the new lights at the Silverdale entrance the lights on the right hand side are your 'natural' line of sight. There are two poles with lights there. Unfortunately the one for the straight through traffic is the further away one. Coming down that hill you can be faced with both a Red and Green light on your right hand side, one of which is a pedestrian light (the one nearest to you). Particularly in the dark/wet this is causing people to brake or stop unnecessarily or to drive straight through a red light as the nearest light is green. It may be a green man but that's impossible to distinguish in the dark/wet.

Check it out in daylight and in the dark if you're passing through there. First time I noticed it was at night when I just thought that 'There's something wrong here...' Looking at it in daylight the positioning of those poles on the right is just all wrong!! IMO it's going to be a magnet for more rear-enders.

pwurple

Saw another rear-ender yesterday in that junction on my way home.

Spindle

Correct braking distance perhaps would have avoided the crashes???

I have been through this junction a lot, and fail to see what all the fuss is about, you have to cross a bike lane, but when changing lanes, you always need to check to your left anyways, as there are nearly always cyclists going up that side of you in a city location.

The road is now wider and a lot safer for all users, if they obey traffic lights, which is a problem that some people seem to have.

pwurple

The whole road is wider, but it now has 5 lanes there instead of the previous 2. The lanes themselves are about 1.5m to 3m narrower.

I actually think the junction itself is ok (apart from the dopey light positioning, traffic jams and badly marked lanes). Every traffic light junction has that, so we can probably just suck it up.

It's the impact it has had on the surrounding residential areas which is the bad part, and this continues to piss me off. Those previously very quiet roads are now far too busy and dangerous with the rat-runners avoiding the lights.


People only travelling the main road never see that.

twowheelsonly

Spindle wrote: »

Correct braking distance perhaps would have avoided the crashes???

I have been through this junction a lot, and fail to see what all the fuss is about, you have to cross a bike lane, but when changing lanes, you always need to check to your left anyways, as there are nearly always cyclists going up that side of you in a city location.

The road is now wider and a lot safer for all users, if they obey traffic lights, which is a problem that some people seem to have.

The problem seems to be the layout of the lights themselves. I also heard of another rear-ender there during the week - That's 3 now (that I know of..) in the last couple of weeks where previously it was almost unheard of. That to me says that there is a problem there.
The road is now wider and theoretically safer but being a new layout there's always going to be a few problems. Is anybody monitoring this or is it a case of letting people get used to it? I honestly believe that the whole layout needs to be re-assessed. If you get a chance have a look at those lights that I mentioned earlier, both in daylight and in darkness. It is very confusing for people that don't realise it.

Barr

Whatever numpty designed the layout deserves to be sacked. If your coming from Skehard Rd onto the Well road its just dangerous. The left turn comes from no where. If you didn’t know any better you would end up veering into oncoming traffic.

pwurple

You know, as soon as I see people saying 'Why don't people just'... to prevent accidents, you know there is bad design somewhere.

Like any of Don Norman's books on design. Simple things done wrong cause mess ups. Simple example is push signs with a pull handle... along with the shopkeeper saying 'why don't people read the sign'.


When all they needed to do was use the correctly designed push plates


There is enough going on at that junction when you're driving. It's a hill start, you are changing gears, and indicating. Maybe you have a passenger or the radio on. You are crossing a bike lane, 3 sets of "intelligent" lights facing you, traffic coming from in front of you, and to your left, plus an awkward sharp turn with a high curb. Is it any wonder someone can lose sight of whether the person in front has slammed on the brakes?

If it keeps happening, it's a fairly good sign that the design is wrong, not that every user is wrong.

parsi

twowheelsonly wrote: »

Coming down the hill towards Scallys to the new lights at the Silverdale entrance the lights on the right hand side are your 'natural' line of sight. There are two poles with lights there. Unfortunately the one for the straight through traffic is the further away one. Coming down that hill you can be faced with both a Red and Green light on your right hand side, one of which is a pedestrian light (the one nearest to you). Particularly in the dark/wet this is causing people to brake or stop unnecessarily or to drive straight through a red light as the nearest light is green. It may be a green man but that's impossible to distinguish in the dark/wet.
.

Those lights are very odd - the pedestrian ones need to have some sort of filter over them - way too bright and confusing.

two wheels good

Hi
Some readers\contributors here may also be interested in this thread re. the County Council's "Douglas Land Use and Transportation Strategy "

3rd and Final Public Consultation Exhibition
Venue: Rochestown Park Hotel
Date 29th and 30th January 2013
Time 4pm to 9pm

gubbie

Another failure: They initially said that it was being done to be safer for pedestrians and cyclists however when I was driving past a few days ago, the cycle lane by the Silver Quay was completely taken up by parked cars. As a cyclist I was pissed off. The failure doesn't lie with the cars, the failure lies with the council not making it obvious that it is a cycle lane (all its got is one sign at the end saying "end of cycle lane". I initially questioned myself that it was a cycle lane)
Has anyone else noticed that?

It was brought up on Prediville again today saying that the left turn from the Well road going towards Ballintemple is too tight. I agree with that

I also think that since the road is wider it encourages speeding...

pwurple

gubbie wrote: »

Has anyone else noticed that?

Yup. It's being used as a park-and-ride for the bus.

Solair

I actually find a lot of the new LED traffic lights are so bright that I can't always easily distinguish the difference between an arrow <-- fly light and a full circle light. They're just blindingly bright at night.

The white-grey coloured lights in Dublin are even worse, but a lot of the new cork ones are really bad too.

I have never had any issue with the older designs of light, it's just a recent thing.

You can see the effect above too where the camera hasn't picked up the arrow shape either as the light is way too bright.

Also, in around Mahon Point and elsewhere many of the pedestrian lamps are somehow not put together properly and are displaying what looks like a full green/red traffic light instead of a red/green man!

Then the other Cork City Council special is the junctions where they haven't bothered to put in a fly light, yet have programmed them as if it were there.

E.g. when turning from behind the Garda HQ onto the South Link. The light goes full green, yet holds the traffic back coming towards you as if there were a flight light there.

Drivers familiar with the junction know this, and continue on, other drivers occasionally slam on the brakes to see if the traffic is going to let them cross (as you would normally do on a standard junction without fly lights).

Then Cork's also full of junctions where if you're at the stop line you can't see the lights as there's no repeating light at the opposite side of the junction.

I'm sorry to say that traffic light placement/design isn't a strong point down here!

Leonard Hofstadter

This has got to be the worst 'joke' played upon the people of Blackrock, Mahon and Douglas in a long time, unfortunately it's been a bloody expensive 'joke' and has wasted €1 million of the people of Cork everywhere else in the country's money.

There was NOTHING wrong with the roundabout that was there before, and it should have been left alone. I hope people will remember what councillors voted to waste €1 million of the peoples' money when the local elections come up next year and vote accordingly....

One united

Know this is a bit off topic I'm from the north side and the road that wreaks my head is the lower glanmire rd west bound outside silversprings hotel two lanes along the dual carriageway into one at the slip to mayfield no one takes any notice of it and create there own to go straight on towards the city .that way at least fifteen years some one has surely looked at this in planning and decided against it .
Thunder and lighting just there !!!
Glad to get that one off my chest !!

RahenyD5

The white-grey coloured lights in Dublin are even worse, but a lot of the new cork ones are really bad too.

The Euro-spec grey lights put up in Dublin, Fingal, Dun Laoghaire LA areas are pretty bad for their intense brightness though the traditional looking UK-spec lights favoured in South Dublin county, Cork, Limerick and up North can be quite bright but are no way as bad as the Euro-spec!

I can see more of these Euro-spec lights going up around Galway replacing the numerous roundabouts on the N6 ring road but two junctions recently had UK-spec lights fitted instead - strange!

You can see the effect above too where the camera hasn't picked up the arrow shape either as the light is way too bright.

That's the reason I prefer the older previous UK-spec design which had larger green arrows which were easier to spot. Apparently this was outlawed by the UK DoT in the early 2000s, I guess Ireland followed soon after as most Irish lights, apart from the Euro-spec ones, seem identical to British ones. Thankfully there are still plenty of these still in use in Cork and other cities.


Then Cork's also full of junctions where if you're at the stop line you can't see the lights as there's no repeating light at the opposite side of the junction.

I've noticed Cork's lights mostly are placed high up on mast arms at the stop line but not always at the opposite side, so this is a weak point if the repeater lights cannot be seen at the other end.

South Dublin County & Dublin City councils seem to get round this problem by putting up double repeaters - one light stacked above another - at the opposite side instead of mast arms such as this example from Clondalkin - http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=dublin&hl=en&ll=53.337869,-6.407669&spn=0.006496,0.013969&sll=52.8382,-2.327815&sspn=6.677397,14.304199&hnear=Dublin,+County+Dublin,+Ireland&t=m&z=16&layer=c&cbll=53.337882,-6.407548&panoid=Jy27sl_xYnMtOYKxGbWK7A&cbp=12,269.17,,1,-0.83 and Drumcondra - http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Clonliffe+Road,+Dublin,+Ireland&hl=en&ll=53.363332,-6.257529&spn=0.00322,0.006984&sll=52.8382,-2.327815&sspn=6.677397,14.304199&oq=clonliffe+road&hnear=Clonliffe+Rd,+Dublin,+County+Dublin,+Ireland&t=m&z=17&layer=c&cbll=53.363361,-6.25774&panoid=ZOwAkBZi76MnUhgQDESA9g&cbp=12,290.46,,1,-1.9

Stepping Stone

gubbie wrote: »

Another failure: They initially said that it was being done to be safer for pedestrians and cyclists however when I was driving past a few days ago, the cycle lane by the Silver Quay was completely taken up by parked cars. As a cyclist I was pissed off. The failure doesn't lie with the cars, the failure lies with the council not making it obvious that it is a cycle lane (all its got is one sign at the end saying "end of cycle lane". I initially questioned myself that it was a cycle lane)
Has anyone else noticed that?

It was brought up on Prediville again today saying that the left turn from the Well road going towards Ballintemple is too tight. I agree with that

I also think that since the road is wider it encourages speeding...

Had a good look at this sign today and not only is it the only one indicating that there is a cycle lane, it is placed in the grass, inside the footpath, so you might even think the concrete path was the cycle path.

Similar stuff near Turners Cross though. If you approach it from the funeral home side and turn right towards Douglas, there used to be a box for cyclists up in front of the lights. Then they changed it so that what used to be the right turn filter lane became a cycle lane first, them the filter lane further along, with the cycle lane on the left of the car right hand turn lane (handy for making a blind spot an issue). The cycle lane ends at the footpath on the other side of the road and there they placed the sign to mark the end of it. People constantly drive in it because there is nothing to indicate that it is a cycle lane.

It is making cycling more dangerous and difficult. If I had a euro for every time I looked at a lane and wondered if it is supposed to be for bikes, not cars, I would be doing well.

beer enigma

This from tonight's council meeting

"@horganp: Cllr Denis O'Flynn describes the Skehard Rd as a success. says he hopes the ppl who came in to council and gave stick, come in again #CorkCC"

bladebrew

It may get better in future but people seem to be mystified by the layout, the other day i saw a people carrier driving up the well road into the right hand turn lane, when both green lights came on they indicated and turned left then started to drive down the wrong side of the road in the lane to turn right down the well road:eek:
I also saw a micra using the cycle lane as an extra lane to drive in!
not to mention all the crashes people have seen!

pwurple

When are they going to fooking finish it? The road markings arn't done. there is no sound on those pedestrian lights yet. I have heard rumours of this road and that road being made one way to try to alleviate SOME of the trouble being caused there.

Churchyard lane seems to have ridiculously permanent bollards. What is the plan muppet councillors? Limbo of railings and plastic hoardings forever?

I am on for going in to another meeting. We need some councillor to raise a motion though. It is a mess.

AugustusMinimus

What an unmitigated mess.

Councillors should absolutely hold their head in shame. Millions wasted on a junction which needed nothing done to it. Absolutely shambolic.

All this junction has seemed to do is cause accidents and hold up traffic.

Hogzy

Iv seen so many cars (coming from the Silver Key direction) go through the red light and turn right for Douglas. There are 2 lights when travelling that direction. One for turning right and one for going straight on. When the light for going straight on is green and the light for turning right is red, people still run the red light.

THe amount of retards who dont know the rules of the road is baffling. There is going to be a serious accident one of these days.