The French

IvyTheTerrible

I'm living in France, and I haven't met this supposed archetype of French arrogance yet. I must not be mixing in the right circles. :rolleyes:

To the OP: You do realise there are 60 million French people? Some of them are bound to be feckers, similarly some Irish people aren't nice either.

inforfun

I wouldnt move in with 3 people of the same nationality, whatever the nationality.
But on top of my list would be the French because you can forget about them speaking a word of English.

Knasher

Knasher wrote: »

I have nothing against the French, I've known a fair few of them and have gotten on pretty well with them. So when I was told that the Irish were quite racist against the French my initial reaction was to think the French person didn't know what the hell she was talking about. But perhaps some people are a little racist.

So now I'm wondering where this racism is coming from. We don't have a contentious history with the French and I haven't noticed them to be especially rude. The only conclusion that I can come to is that we are actually importing it via TV from England, after all they have had a contentious history together, what with the wars and them killing their monarchy. Assuming I'm correct, it's a little bit insane to be racist towards the French considering our history with the English.

I don't think Irish people are xenophobic towards the French. I met loads of people in Dublin who were really into French culture and the language. Sure, a lot of people mention frogs legs and smelly cheese and arrogance, but I've yet to meet anyone from anywhere who didn't have that impression. If anything, I'd say the Irish are quite accepting of the French compared to most of Western Europe. Anyone I've met who didn't like them is basing that on personal experience, not history. I've only ever heard the 'cheese eating surrender monkeys' stuff in jest.

Knasher

AllYourBass wrote: »

In fairness, I would have had a dislike for French people purely based on my personal experiences with Parisiennes when I was interrailing a good few years ago, so I don't think your suggestion holds water. However, this was a bit short-sighted of me as I stated previously, because my g/f and her friends and family, who are French, have the same feelings towards the vast majority of Parisiennes.

Is it possible that you were exposed to the negative stereotype of French people before travelling and when you were exposed to an example of it, rather than viewing it in isolation as you normally would you view it as proof of the stereotype you were exposed to?

Additionally I'd take the French view of Parisians with a pinch of salt, after all you'd get a similar view of Dublin from outside it (or indeed of any major city from the people who live outside of it).

Big Nasty

French people are generally sound in my experience. They may take their time to get to know you and may possibly even be what we might consider 'a little off' with you until they have your measure but once they do you have a friend for life. To mee this is better than being all over someone from the get-go and dropping them a week later.

In relation to the France>Paris thing, that train of thought is the exact same in relation to every capital city worldwide.

DrHLecter

theyre necessary when the brits are in the equation.

someone has to be louder, richer and more pig headed. thats the americans
someone has to be just that bit more efficient and pragmatic. thats the germans.
someone has to snidely look down on the poshest people and make them seem loud and tacky even if theyre not. thats the french.

a french person only needs a cigarette and a frown to make anything seem tacky and vulgar as a gypsy wedding.

meh...c'est qu'un vulgarite

OutlawPete

Yup, handled that ball on purpose, may they simmer in the fires of hell.

Make a good unpasteurised Goat's cheese though.

Kevin Duffy

Deleted User wrote: »

I just checked an amazing house... rooftop terrace, games room, class living room and kitchen, massive bedrooms and all for a good price.
But my housemates would have been 3 french people and I just couldn't do it.. Give me any and I mean any other nationality in the world and I would have taken it ina heartbeat. But with French people? No way.

Anyone else feel like this? Am I racist? Or is it built up anger at having to study their camp language for 6 years so I could goto college? Or is it just the fact that almost all the French I've met have been loud and crap?

I know you say "with any other nationality", but I'd be inclined to feel that it's a power-bloc in the house, who speak a common language, making it easy, almost natural, to exclude and conspire against you and that's what you're thinking. That would be lessened if it was people of 3 different nationalities, or all the same nationality but English speaking. As it stands, you might as well be moving in with 3 Orcs.

FWIW, I don't think you're racist, that's a whole other order of bigotry, you just have reservations about moving into a situation that might turn out to be unsuitable.

DrHLecter

i dont get the americans using this surrender monkey thing btw.
france tore azz throughout history.

napolean .

MCMLXXV

MCMLXXV wrote: »

French people are generally sound in my experience. They may take their time to get to know you and may possibly even be what we might consider 'a little off' with you until they have your measure but once they do you have a friend for life. To mee this is better than being all over someone from the get-go and dropping them a week later.

In relation to the France>Paris thing, that train of thought is the exact same in relation to every capital city worldwide.

A little 'off'? When I worked in France for the summer a few years back, it took about 4 weeks for people to say hello to me. My first day, I walked into the kitchen for lunch (it was a communal table with long benches either side) and was completely ignored. Nobody introduced themselves or even looked at me. They did warm up after about a month, but that's just pig ignorant. I wasn't expecting hugs, just acknowledgment that I was actually there. I know what you mean about people being initially friendly with no substance but there is a happy medium! And I'm fluent in French and had already spent loads of time there, and I still felt like a spare part.

IvyTheTerrible

Manuel Squeaking Smallpox wrote: »

A little 'off'? When I worked in France for the summer a few years back, it took about 4 weeks for people to say hello to me. My first day, I walked into the kitchen for lunch (it was a communal table with long benches either side) and was completely ignored. Nobody introduced themselves or even looked at me. They did warm up after about a month, but that's just pig ignorant. I wasn't expecting hugs, just acknowledgment that I was actually there. I know what you mean about people being initially friendly with no substance but there is a happy medium! And I'm fluent in French and had already spent loads of time there, and I still felt like a spare part.

Did you introduce yourself or say hello?

AllYourBass

Knasher wrote: »

Is it possible that you were exposed to the negative stereotype of French people before travelling and when you were exposed to an example of it, rather than viewing it in isolation as you normally would you view it as proof of the stereotype you were exposed to?

Additionally I'd take the French view of Parisians with a pinch of salt, after all you'd get a similar view of Dublin from outside it (or indeed of any major city from the people who live outside of it).

I'm not saying it's impossible, but I can honestly say the people I came across were really not pleasant towards me or my group, and prior to this I had no opinions either way on the French, or in fact any countries denizens who we came across and fraternised with. The French peoples views I was referring to are from Creteil, which geographically is a suburb of Paris, so it would certainly have been based on their interactions rather than presumptions.

If I could just add for clarification, I was using the post to illustrate that the OP's opinions on the French maybe, as you suggested, based on prior stereotypes rather than experiences. Or he just met French from Paris.

IvyTheTerrible

IvyTheTerrible wrote: »

Did you introduce yourself or say hello?

Walked in, smiled, said bonjour. Didn't get a chance to say much more because they were so busy talking amongst themselves. When I went to put my plate away, I introduced myself to a few people and they said their name and that was it. No questions, no interest, no smile, nothing. I had sort of been expecting that, but another Irish girl (the only other foreigner) was really upset. She was nearly in tears afterwards, wondering what on earth we'd done to make people so hostile towards us. Even when things were a little better, a few weeks later, one of the guys told the entire table that the boss of the hotel had been nagging him to take us out with them at the weekend because we had no friends and no car to go anywhere. In front of us. They just really don't seem to give a s**t about anyone's feelings. I'm well used to it now (I still work with French people all the time) but I still find that really strange.

IvyTheTerrible

Manuel Squeaking Smallpox wrote: »

Walked in, smiled, said bonjour. Didn't get a chance to say much more because they were so busy talking amongst themselves. When I went to put my plate away, I introduced myself to a few people and they said their name and that was it. No questions, no interest, no smile, nothing. I had sort of been expecting that, but another Irish girl (the only other foreigner) was really upset. She was nearly in tears afterwards, wondering what on earth we'd done to make people so hostile towards us. Even when things were a little better, a few weeks later, one of the guys told the entire table that the boss of the hotel had been nagging him to take us out with them at the weekend because we had no friends and no car to go anywhere. In front of us. They just really don't seem to give a s**t about anyone's feelings. I'm well used to it now (I still work with French people all the time) but I still find that really strange.

That's very strange, I've honestly never came across anything like that over here. Or maybe I don't notice it?

tfitzgerald

Some of them are bound to be feckers, similarly some Irish people aren't nice either.[/QUOTE]

Come on leave the Dublin crowd out of this:)

IvyTheTerrible

IvyTheTerrible wrote: »

That's very strange, I've honestly never came across anything like that over here. Or maybe I don't notice it?

Dunno. I've heard plenty of stories like mine, I've heard other people say the French were lovely to them. I suppose it depends on where you work and a billion other factors. I know in my case, I was really, really trying to join in and enjoy it, and it was still awful.

Pyr0

I've a mixed experience with the French myself, went to a festival two years ago and my French wasn't too great. Most people were very happy to try help me out in either French or English if I was in a shop for example but some would act like arseholes if you couldn't speak the language well.

Got talking to two very sound French blokes who were in the air force, had decent English too so we helped each other out depending on the language used at the time. They really, really hated the English though, not Welsh or Scottish people, just the English, said it was very common view in France.

Big Nasty

Anyone ever read that book about the English dude who goes to work in France? I think there was two books in fact. Hates them at first but after a while when he comes home for a weekend all he wants to do is get back to France. Very funny and very good read - anyone who has ever lived in France could relate to his stories very well!

MCMLXXV

MCMLXXV wrote: »

Anyone ever read that book about the English dude who goes to work in France? I think there was two books in fact. Hates them at first but after a while when he comes home for a weekend all he wants to do is get back to France. Very funny and very good read - anyone who has ever lived in France could relate to his stories very well!

Think there are three books, but the first (A Year in the Merde) is the best, IMO.

Madam

I love the French(must as I have family there)their almost as nice or as nasty as the Irish! Btw they do absolutely love the Irish for some odd reason:rolleyes:

mikemac

They have free electricity in France

I know as I lived with three of them in college in a houseshare and they had the immersion on 24/7.

First ESB bill was over £400 punts and that's for a small house with 4 occupants :eek:

Same in another houseshare too, French couple had the immersion going all the time. Electric heaters blazing all the time which caused no end of rows

Dionysus

DrHLecter wrote: »

i dont get the americans using this surrender monkey thing btw.
france tore azz throughout history.

napolean .

Indeed, and not only was the United States the johnny-come-lately into WWII (and WWI), but the United States recognised the collaborating Vichy régime as the legitimate government of France following the Nazi invasion. That is very rarely mentioned.

There is a depressing amount of nationalistic revisionism by both Americans and British regarding the pro-fascist leanings of their respective foreign policies prior to their entries into WWII.

Big Nasty

Manuel Squeaking Smallpox wrote: »

Think there are three books, but the first (A Year in the Merde) is the best, IMO.

That's it - brilliant book!;)

Einhard

The French- a great bunch of lads!

Seriously, I love the French.

HavingCrack

I found there does appear to be a big enough difference between French from the north and those from the south. I've been to college with a few French people from Grenoble and they're a really sound bunch altogether. The one's from Lille....not exactly the friendliest. Anyway, the Grenoble one's even said themselves that French people are quite rude and unpleasant to each other and stuck to their group of friends religiously. What they liked in Dublin was that you could jsut be invited to a party by people you've only just met and it's no big thing. Apparently that just never happens in France.

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

Racists would, I'm sure.

Yup. You're stereotyping based on perceived racial characteristics.

No, it's the racist thing again.

Anecdotal 'evidence' plays a large part in becoming a racist.

You definitely shouldn't move in with them, obviously being a racist towards French people would make it very uncomfortable.

FFS, calling the OP 'racist' is absurd. He clearly isn't too keen on living with three french people at the same time mroe than anything else which is fair enough. I'd take the same view if I was moving into a house with any nationality. If I was living with three Russians or three Chinese or Italians etc. I'd feel a bit out of the loop as well.

'Racial' characteristics-bit much no? I'm a bit unconvinced 'race' even exists, at least as it's commonly understood, but surely 'white' French people are pretty much the same 'race' as us?

Pyr0 wrote: »

They really, really hated the English though, not Welsh or Scottish people, just the English, said it was very common view in France.

I never quite understood this. The UK and France were allies in both world wars and the UK helped to liberate them. Why did it go downhill so suddenly?

flyswatter

I have several French cousins and they are nice, smart people.

Each of them has made a good effort to learn English.

One of them came over to Trinity for a few years to study science. Think he's continuing his postgraduate studies back in France now. When I see him from time to time, we talk about football, French football, European football, Arsenal, whatever.

They organise things much better in France than here. The country is extremely clean with almost no litter, the police are armed so straight away you know you most likely wouldn't mess with them. You can get a savage house in a lovely place for a lot less than you would here.

You will get pricks anywhere to be honest, not all French people are arrogant, rude people. Some are though.

I remember a French guy openly tried to come on to my mam in a Supermarket once. Complimented her on the kids she had. Said she had done well. :eek:

That was weird as hell. They have good confidence in themselves though, I'll give them that!

Dangerous Man

I'm a fan of the French. I've had a few French people live in my house in Dublin over the years and they've been for the most part, great. I've had two French girlfriends in the past too and you couldn't really ask for better. Also, I love going to France, particularly the French countryside. The French value their culture, know how to live well without costing a bomb.
They are arrogant though.

Funglegunk

HavingCrack wrote: »

FFS, calling the OP 'racist' is absurd. He clearly isn't too keen on living with three french people at the same time mroe than anything else which is fair enough. I'd take the same view if I was moving into a house with any nationality. If I was living with three Russians or three Chinese or Italians etc. I'd feel a bit out of the loop as well.

That would make sense if not for this sentence in the OP:

Deleted User wrote: »

Give me any and I mean any other nationality in the world and I would have taken it ina heartbeat. But with French people? No way.

It's clear his beef is specifically with French people, any other nationality would have been fine.

HavingCrack wrote: »

'Racial' characteristics-bit much no? I'm a bit unconvinced 'race' even exists, at least as it's commonly understood, but surely 'white' French people are pretty much the same 'race' as us?

You're technically correct, but you know yourself that everyone uses the word 'racist' in this way, it's easily and quickly understood.

The_B_Man

Lived with a loada French on me travels. Didnt have any problems with them. All laid back and up for a beer and a sing-song.

Though one of them claimed he wasnt French, but he was from Bretagne! Apparently they see themselves as Celtic and have their own dialect. Was interesting.

But ye, I'd move into that gaf if it was nice. I've a base level of French though.

steddyeddy

rented with a french woman for a while it is not an experience I am going to repeat. She was a rude, lazy sly person who thought she owned the house. Two other sound english guys were renting with us also and she went out of her way to make them feel uncomfortable and made it clear that they were a bother to her. She rang up the landlord with a load of lies about the two english guys and they were evicted. These guys came from a rough area in manchester and left to ireland to try and make a life for themselves and this was the first experience they enocunterd.

flyswatter

It's a great place to live. I've been there countless times. Went every year for 10 years, sometimes for 2 months or more. Been to most areas in France. Brittany, Loire, Dordogne, Auvergne, Normandie, Languedoc, Aquitane, Alsace, Paris. Enjoyed most of them.

They love the Irish too.

mikemac

The_B_Man wrote: »

Though one of them claimed he wasnt French, but he was from Bretagne! Apparently they see themselves as Celtic and have their own dialect. Was interesting.

Some from the Basque region is Southern France do the same

steddyeddy

Ps can someone explain why the french (some of them) hate the english. The english did kind of liberate france from the germans.

mikemac

Remember the D Day Landings commemoration a few years back

The French invited the Americans but never bothered to invite anyone from England.
Bit of a snub and a cheap shot

suicide_circus

I love their women ...but then I enjoy a full bush.

steddyeddy

feelingstressed wrote: »

Remember the D Day Landings commemoration a few years back

The French invited the Americans but never bothered to invite anyone from England.
Bit of a snub and a cheap shot

I do remember that and even though I am not english I was offended by the ingratitude of it all. They had a f-ing cheek to say the least!

HavingCrack

feelingstressed wrote: »

Remember the D Day Landings commemoration a few years back

The French invited the Americans but never bothered to invite anyone from England.
Bit of a snub and a cheap shot

I've a theory some of the 'snobby' French have a strange sort of inferiority/superiority complex going on as regards the UK. I think some of them are a bit pissed off that English has overtaken French as the most common language to learn and keep saying how much they 'hate' the English (but it seems mroe like jealously) as a result.

pickarooney

steddyeddy wrote: »

Ps can someone explain why the french (some of them) hate the english. The english did kind of liberate france from the germans.

Because the British and French are very similar. Deep down, they have more of a begrudging respect than a hatred for one another.

Hootanany

CreepingDeath wrote: »

"Cut le grass"

NO Mow de Lawn

K-9

HavingCrack wrote: »

I never quite understood this. The UK and France were allies in both world wars and the UK helped to liberate them. Why did it go downhill so suddenly?

De Gaulle wasn't there biggest fan by all accounts, stopped them and indirectly us from joining the EEC for a long time.

CreepingDeath

pickarooney wrote: »

There really is nothing more pathetic than this crap from Irish people. It's sad enough having petty gripes with people who have historically been hostile to you but to piggyback other countries' rivalries is ****ing cringeworthy. It's the barstooling of nationalism.

This is AH, you have to take a lot of posts with a sense of humour.
That sort of response will have people thinking you're half German.

Saila

Deleted User wrote: »

I just checked an amazing house... rooftop terrace, games room, class living room and kitchen, massive bedrooms and all for a good price.
But my housemates would have been 3 french people and I just couldn't do it.. Give me any and I mean any other nationality in the world and I would have taken it ina heartbeat. But with French people? No way.

Anyone else feel like this? Am I racist? Or is it built up anger at having to study their camp language for 6 years so I could goto college? Or is it just the fact that almost all the French I've met have been loud and crap?

whats a crap person?

someone who's full of shit

Bodhisopha

Currently watching Amelie on Film 4. The French are fine by me.

HxGH

I have had some seriously bad experiences with the french... I'm allowed be racist towards them!

ejmaztec

If I was visiting my French flat-mates for the first time, I'd give them a big piece of cheese and a framed photograph of some chimpanzees, all wrapped in a white flag. That would break the ice a treat, and we'd probably be friends for life (or 5 minutes, whichever's the shorter).

Oh_Noes

I lived with a French couple for two years who were initially strangers and became friends over time. They ate very well and always offered to share, minded their own business and were very polite. If the neighbours or anyone else in the house píssed them off, they wouldn't hesitate in confronting and sorting it out.

When the French couple moved out, two lads from Donegal moved in. GAA players, both about 22-23 years old and sharing a bedroom. They regularly made shíte of the place and left smelly GAA gear everywhere and the sink full spud peel every night.

Most of the Irish women I've lived with eat a lot of toast and rubbishy stuff, get stupidly drunk and would resort to leaving you an anonymous note if you accidentally used their milk for a cup of tea.

Generalisations are generalisations I know, but that's my experience. I think people easily latch onto the British/American attitude of just disliking the French by default. I really don't subscribe to that, I think we could learn a lot from the French as a nation.

Toby Take a Bow

HavingCrack wrote: »

FFS, calling the OP 'racist' is absurd.

It's not absurd, he asked specifically whether it makes him racist!

He clearly isn't too keen on living with three french people at the same time mroe than anything else which is fair enough. I'd take the same view if I was moving into a house with any nationality. If I was living with three Russians or three Chinese or Italians etc. I'd feel a bit out of the loop as well.

I'd understand that. It can be easy to speak your native language, and if you've three mates who are French, Russian or Chinese or whatever, it might make you feel excluded. His specific gripe was with the French.

'Racial' characteristics-bit much no? I'm a bit unconvinced 'race' even exists, at least as it's commonly understood, but surely 'white' French people are pretty much the same 'race' as us?

The OP framed the whole things in terms of either being a racist or not. I just went with it. I'd say he's stereotyping based on perceived cultural traits. For a lot of people that'd be racism (if you think French and Irish are different races).

I never quite understood this. The UK and France were allies in both world wars and the UK helped to liberate them. Why did it go downhill so suddenly?

The animosity expressed in the media, by the politicians and so forth was nearly always between France and England, they've been the traditional enemies since (someone correct me) Agincourt? The rise of Germany from 1870 until 1945 forced them to make an alliance, but after Germany was no longer a threat, they just went back to what they'd been doing for centuries.

HxGH

Oh_Noes wrote: »

...and would resort to leaving you an anonymous note if you accidentally used their milk for a cup of tea.

Payback time. :pac:

pickarooney

pickarooney wrote: »

You're pretty much just racist, but not in a way that affects anyone else so not really a problem. Are you going to stay on for a long time in the 'Nam?

I'll give it a year or two here saving, travel some more and then settle in the Philippines for a while.

Hootanany wrote: »

Where the house

Beside West Lake, Hanoi, Vietnam.

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

You definitely shouldn't move in with them, obviously being a racist towards French people would make it very uncomfortable.

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

The OP framed the whole things in terms of either being a racist or not. I just went with it. I'd say he's stereotyping based on perceived cultural traits. For a lot of people that'd be racism (if you think French and Irish are different races).

Yep.. By your definition, I'm a flaming racist and I'm perfectly happy with that. But at the same time, your definition is complete and utter bollocks.
Disliking a country is just that, disliking a country. I'll chat away and drink with them, I just don't want to live with them.

If I dislike a person because of skin, it's alot different. I find it funny that the people on their high horse shouting racist! at everybody are the same people who are diluting the word's meaning so much that it's comically worthless.

How racist can I be living in Asia? I'm hardly a white supremacist am I.

Slunk

Live with a French fella at the moment. He's sound. His mate came over for a few days though. Didn't like him so much. So in my experience its 50 50