**Spoilers** Series 6, Episode 2 - "Day of the Moon"

Something that continually sticks in my mind is that when we first see the Doctor in this series he is sitting on a car and his future TARDIS is nowhere to be seen. I highly doubt that's a coincidence and where he left it or, more likely, who he left it with will be important I think.

Also, is there even a remote chance that River is actually Jenny?

bren2001

Deleted User wrote: »

ven a remote chance that River is actually Jenny?

The kiss at the end of the episode. I don't think they would promote incest....

bren2001

bren2001 wrote: »

The kiss at the end of the episode. I don't think they would promote incest....

Despite the title of the previous episode Jenny is not the doctors daughter, she is a clone of him. The way she fought the silents and her comment about he old man getting angry when she does that reminded me of 10 shouting at her about violence etc.

iMax

We're all assuming that the doctor that was shot, is in fact the real doctor & not a clone...

Killer_banana

iMax wrote: »

We're all assuming that the doctor that was shot, is in fact the real doctor & not a clone...

Well Canton did say something along the lines of 'I'll save you some time, that isn't a clone or a fake, that is the real Doctor.' Whether that's meant to mislead us or not is open to debate but personally I think it is the real Doctor.

iMax

Ah... didn't cop that part

ríomhaire

CRAZY THEORY TIME. DO NOT READ IF YOU DO NOT WANT YOUR MIND BLOWN.

Knowledge of the Silence fades over time if you're not reminded. Notice how everyone forgot about the little girl as the episode went on? Notice how they forget to try to save her? Notice how Amy can't remember seeing the photos or the room? (they even do a big flashy thing to point this out to us)

The girl is part Silence part Time Lord. She doesn't erase herself straight away like the actual Silence do but they all forget about her over time. She is the Silence's master plan. Possibly she was what was piloting the TARDIS when it exploded during the Big Bang but maybe this is a different plan. In any case she has the Silence's ability to make people forget about her!.

campo

ok great episode I think the child is defo Amys especially with the pregnacy scanner in the tardis at the end as it was popping up positive and Negative this could only be because as they were travelling through time at some stages she was pregnant in others stages she wasnt.

I think the big question is and always was who is Amy I for some reason thinks she is River Song only because River/Pond part and Amy is probably latin for song or something and in turn River Song is Romana all very confusing I know but cant wait till it is revealed

spiritcrusher

Another strong episode. Setting up a very interesting overall story arc, which I love. I generally prefer a constant story over a series than episodic stand alone ones, and I think Moffat has found a good balance between the two.
Really doubt everything will be wrapped up this year, there just seems to be too much to give everything the time it'll need, The Silence, Amy and the baby, the little girl, the Doctor's death, River Song, maybe even that woman that peeked through the door... They probably are all interlinked but even still, that's a lot to wrap up neatly and satisfyingly. I have faith though, I like to be confused for a little while :pac:

As for this week's episode, I thought the first half or so in particular was exceptional stuff. Not really sure why everyone was on the run and a prison needed to be built but it was enjoyable. The bit in the children's home was absolutely fantastic though. The flashing light in the hand and the marks appearing on Amy was a wicked touch.
Glad I waited til it was dark to watch it, 6 p.m. during the summer is a stupid time, complete atmosphere killer.

Gonna try not think about where the plot might go too much, I like to be surprised! Although I reckon it's

the Doctor

in the spacesuit at the start.

DinoRex

I did like it a lot... but they tried to fit WAY too much in there so it all felt a bit disjointed...

Saw this earlier... God damn it Steve!

Wibbs

campo wrote: »

and in turn River Song is Romana

I dunno I've thought since the start of the new rejig in the naughties that Romana's still out there. I'm old enough to remember Tom Baker's him leaving her in another dimension(with a bloke with a dog face IIRC ) so kinda hoped too. She would have avoided getting killed in the great time war and all that stuff and because she's in another dimension he wouldn't sense her presence. Actually there's a point... IIRC the second the Master opened the watch and became a timelord again Tennants Doc sensed him and IIRC didn't he say beforehand he just knew he was the last one? So how come a) he didn't sense his daughter coming back to life and b) this girl being a timekid? River being her? Dunno. Might explain how she can drive the Tardis better cos she could drive it better back in the day too?

Jessibelle

Was Amy leaving messages for herself in blood about the orphanage? Just thought her 'hand' message was remarkably verbatim to those on the walls, that Renfrew was washing off?

Also eta: Is it the silence will fall or the silents will fall, cause that could make for an interesting anti-hero...

Doctor DooM

Anyone else finding themselves slightly more sympathetic to River instead of browned off after the last/first (Lurst?) kiss?

ríomhaire

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Anyone else finding themselves slightly more sympathetic to River instead of browned off after the last/first (Lurst?) kiss?

I'm quite a bit more sympathetic to her now after we saw her realising she's already had the last kiss she ever had with the man she loves

Doctor DooM

ríomhaire wrote: »

I'm quite a bit more sympathetic to her now after we saw her realising she's already had the last kiss she ever had with the man she loves

Exactly. She was annoying me with "spoilers" right up to that moment.

Maybe I am getting soft in my old age.

bren2001

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Exactly. She was annoying me with "spoilers" right up to that moment.

Maybe I am getting soft in my old age.

You are getting soft in your old age as I'm young and shes bloody annoying.

Doctor DooM

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Exactly. She was annoying me with "spoilers" right up to that moment.

Maybe I am getting soft in my old age.

Well I'm young and I also thought it was heartbreaking

Maybe we're both just big softies instead!

Cormic

Deleted User wrote: »

Maybe we're both just big softies instead!

More like 'Sweeties'

I did like Rivers dive into the swimming pool in the Tardis.

mach1982

This episode answered a question from series 5 , why was the tardis like ship in "the Lodger" was abandon. Cause, it crew the Slience were killed. Craig or who ever own house before must had seen the moon landing , and there Silence telling them to kill them.

The Mad Hatter

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Exactly. She was annoying me with "spoilers" right up to that moment.

Maybe I am getting soft in my old age.

She played that superbly, though - the shock registering on her face just as the Doctor steps into the TARDIS. 'twas a great counterpoint to her poignant speech in the first part.

I really enjoyed this episode, though as some have commented I'm not sure about the Doctor's moral decision - seems like a fairly abrupt genocide. I'm loving the number of questions I have about the series now, though.

Yahew

I dont have the link to any version of the Lodger, however I do remember a child's voice in The Lodger saying "Help Me" - to drag people into the house.

Same speech but was it the same voice? Anybody know?

pixelburp

Hmmm you know, it just occured (shush, I'm slow); sure humans are now preconditioned to kill The Silence wherever they find them - then forget they ever did - what would happen the corpses? Surely people would notice the sudden number of alien corpses lying about?

The Mad Hatter

pixelburp wrote: »

Hmmm you know, it just occured (shush, I'm slow); sure humans are now preconditioned to kill The Silence wherever they find them - then forget they ever did - what would happen the corpses? Surely people would notice the sudden number of alien corpses lying about?

YUU SHOULD KILL US ALL ON SIGHT. AND THEN CLEAN UP.

Jessibelle

pixelburp wrote: »

Hmmm you know, it just occured (shush, I'm slow); sure humans are now preconditioned to kill The Silence wherever they find them - then forget they ever did - what would happen the corpses? Surely people would notice the sudden number of alien corpses lying about?

Ever notice a really bad smell like something died and is rotting and you don't know where it's coming from??? now you do....;)

off.the.walls

Lady with the eye patch is back in episode 7

DinoRex

She's also the therapist who looks like Roy's mother from the IT Crowd.

popebenny16

This year Moffatt has promised we would see the angry side to the doctor. from reading his interviews I took the impression this happened around the mid season cliffhanger, but guess he is showing it early. Then again, the Family of Blood know all about him getting a bit hot under the collor on occasaion.

" the old Man" and that kiss should wrap up the River Story, but we will be seeing her again. Could do with a break form her for a year or so now. Overall I really liked this one, it was lovely and dark, it was shot and directed well, and it was clever without showing off clever. I agree with yonder poster above who speculates that the Silence were piloting the TARDIS and tried to destroy it. They could have created this girl as a means of doing that, in effect she is an assassin they have created to kill the Doctor before he kills them. It seems right now as they both succeeded which is a very Moffatt timey whimey thing to do. She could pilot the TARDIS right before their eyes, but they cannot remember her doing it. Also explains how we get to hear them in the TARDIS. Then again, we get to hear them again later on this year

the "i killed them all" bit

.

Some questions remain, are the silence an alien species at all? Are they actually indiginous? Also, this may be me on the slow here, but I dont understand how they all suddenly remembered the silence in the first place to allow them to count them and mark their arms. Surely they would have forgotten the first one and therefore never get off the mark (as it were) and so wouldnt the plan at the start fail?

Also, if the silence has always been here, where do they get their clothes? I see that Burtons did very well from them in the 60's (maybe they had an account, maybe they are the ultimate shoplifters), but at other times?

As for Rory, he helpfully answered my question from last week about remembering those 2000 years. Of course at that point the Doctor should have said "shouldnt you be plastic, then?"

As for the kiddies - all mine would speculate was on the timelord girl. They are convinced she is jenny or romana (romana haivng beein in e space all this time) and because Moffatt made a big thing in an interview they read about "her returning". They dont think of Amy or River or the Doctor being any more connected to it than that. Very good episode all round.

Stark

Good episode but I felt the editing was very choppy due to trying to cram too much stuff in. The scenes with Nixon especially felt very forced.

popebenny16 wrote:

Also, this may be me on the slow here, but I dont understand how they all suddenly remembered the silence in the first place to allow them to count them and mark their arms. Surely they would have forgotten the first one and therefore never get off the mark (as it were) and so wouldnt the plan at the start fail?

Presumably the picture Amy's phone played a part. But again, the editing was quite choppy so it seemed like quite a bit of joining the dots got left out.

ríomhaire

popebenny16 wrote: »

Some questions remain, are the silence an alien species at all? Are they actually indiginous? Also, this may be me on the slow here, but I dont understand how they all suddenly remembered the silence in the first place to allow them to count them and mark their arms. Surely they would have forgotten the first one and therefore never get off the mark (as it were) and so wouldnt the plan at the start fail?

I think they left out what happens between the end of episode one and the start of episode two on purpose. Something interesting happened then that we don't know.

As for when they figured it out; could have been simply a case of one of them seeing a Silent when the rest weren't looking and shouting "Oi there's an alien over here" and then forgetting and them figuring it out from there. Remember that they also had the photo on Amy's phone to test the memory thing in a safe environment. By the way do we see when they find out that they're called the Silence or does it happen in the gap between the episodes? I don't remember :eek:.

I would also point out something that seems to be confusing people around the internet. In general when the characters look at a Silent they don't remember all the other times they saw them. Amy remembering that in the bathroom seems to be a once-off (possibly due to her magical crack'd memory?).

One last comment on the episode. I can see why the Doctor would think that his plan worked after he did it (because he couldn't possibly actually remember doing it) but Amy shouldn't be able to remember what he did (he could have explained it to the others beforehand, even though he normally doesn't). Shouldn't she be curious? Then again, she may not even remember being kidnapped.

Oh yeah, almost forgot. Oh wait. I forgot what I was going to say again. I'm not sure if it's the exams or the Silence ****ing with my brain. Let me think...

Oh yeah. If the Doctor had actually succeeded in his plan and changed history/created a stable time loop Amy, Rory, the Doctor and possibly River should all be programmed to attack the Silence on sight. Is this an oversight, a plot hole or intentional?

I presume they mark themselves whilst looking at them?

DinoRex

Papa Smut wrote: »

I presume they mark themselves whilst looking at them?

I know what I'll be drawing on the next Doctor Who fan I see passed out drunk at a party anyway...

The Mad Hatter

Papa Smut wrote: »

I presume they mark themselves whilst looking at them?

They do - we even saw River Song doing this at the beginning of the episode.

(How they do it so neatly I'm not so sure, but willing to let slide...:pac:)

Doctor DooM

DinoRex wrote: »

I know what I'll be drawing on the next Doctor Who fan I see passed out drunk at a party anyway...

Well, that's me never staying over in yours

DinoRex

But I've got plenty of Sharpie markers and a medicine cabinet filled with Triazolam!

DinoRex

DinoRex wrote: »

I know what I'll be drawing on the next Doctor Who fan I see passed out drunk at a party anyway...

I can't tell if that's more or less frightening then when a friend of mine joked about leaving weeping angel cut outs outside of doors I'm exiting o.O

Jessibelle

Deleted User wrote: »

I can't tell if that's more or less frightening then when a friend of mine joked about leaving weeping angel cut outs outside of doors I'm exiting o.O

I'd actually die. :eek:

DinoRex

Then there's the Vashta Nerada trick where you secretly turn on an extra light source... point at a persons second shadow and say 'I'm sorry... I am so sorry!'

popebenny16

Papa Smut wrote: »

I presume they mark themselves whilst looking at them?

if you forget them after seeing them how do you remember then in order to come up with that plan in the first place? whilst you are watching them you dont know that you are going to forget them afterwards, because you have forgotten that you forget.

popebenny16

ríomhaire wrote: »

I think they left out what happens between the end of episode one and the start of episode two on purpose. Something interesting happened then that we don't know.

well they left several months out, including hatching a great big plan to seal the doctor into a room which the silence cannot penetrate. Problem is that since you forget them there could be a couple dozen of them in that seal off cell/room/thing. Just like I think we all know there have been silence(s?) in the TARDIS last year.

Silence in the Library anyone? No? Thought not.

one possible explation is that when they looked at the hologram of the silence in the TARDIS they can rememeber that one because its a hologram of one and not a real one. But, I think they forgot that one too, didnt they?

I should have looked at the repeat, but I forgot. :eek:

K-9

popebenny16 wrote: »

well they left several months out, including hatching a great big plan to seal the doctor into a room which the silence cannot penetrate. Problem is that since you forget them there could be a couple dozen of them in that seal off cell/room/thing. Just like I think we all know there have been silence(s?) in the TARDIS last year.

Silence in the Library anyone? No? Thought not.

one possible explation is that when they looked at the hologram of the silence in the TARDIS they can rememeber that one because its a hologram of one and not a real one. But, I think they forgot that one too, didnt they?

I should have looked at the repeat, but I forgot. :eek:

They forgot the hologram too which I found odd.

popebenny16 wrote: »

if you forget them after seeing them how do you remember then in order to come up with that plan in the first place? whilst you are watching them you dont know that you are going to forget them afterwards, because you have forgotten that you forget.

Isn't that why the chips are in the hands? Or something like that!

Must watch it again, it's on BBC3 on Friday I think. 7pm.

DinoRex

K-9 wrote: »

They forgot the hologram too which I found odd.

Well recordings have to be forgotten as well otherwise the moon landing plot wouldn't have worked.

Haha... and speaking of going back to look for the Silents in the last season... look what we get if we go a little further back again:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WeFZi4zYrC0#t=9m08s

That's fairly awesome tbf

ríomhaire

popebenny16 wrote: »

if you forget them after seeing them how do you remember then in order to come up with that plan in the first place? whilst you are watching them you dont know that you are going to forget them afterwards, because you have forgotten that you forget.

*Amy looks at her phone*
"Oi Doctor, there's something on my phone."
"What is it?"
*Amy looks at the Doctor* "What's what?"
"On your phone. You said there was something on your phone."
"There's nothing o- Holy crap an alien!"
"What sort of alien?"
"Alien? Were we talking about aliens?"
"You said there was a photo of an alien on your phone but then when you looked back at me you forgot."
*Doctor tests the memory thing with the photo of the alien and they figure out a plan*

It's really not difficult to come up with a situation where they'd figure it out.

Aldebaran

Jessibelle wrote: »

I'd actually die. :eek:

...

popebenny16

ríomhaire wrote: »

*Amy looks at her phone*
"Oi Doctor, there's something on my phone."
"What is it?"
*Amy looks at the Doctor* "What's what?"
"On your phone. You said there was something on your phone."
"There's nothing o- Holy crap an alien!"
"What sort of alien?"
"Alien? Were we talking about aliens?"
"You said there was a photo of an alien on your phone but then when you looked back at me you forgot."
*Doctor tests the memory thing with the photo of the alien and they figure out a plan*

It's really not difficult to come up with a situation where they'd figure it out.

But the Doctor would also want to see the alien on the phone, and when he does, he also forgets, so you are back to square one.

In fact the Doctor must remember the silence in order for him to come up with the plan, otherwise he will be in Apollo 11 wondering why he is in Apollo 11 in the first place, but he cant remember them, because he should have forgotten.

I agree there are many easy ways out of it, but its something that should ahve been said on the screen.

Cannot believe I have become a nit picker like this. I used to be such a better class of poster....

Stark

The amnesia effect only comes into play when they're looking at the Silence. If someone tells them there's these aliens called the Silence when there's no Silence around, the amnesia effect doesn't apply.

K-9

Stark wrote: »

The amnesia effect only comes into play when they're looking at the Silence. If someone tells them there's these aliens called the Silence when there's no Silence around, the amnesia effect doesn't apply.

Mystery solved I think. I'm happy with that or else my head will explode!

popebenny16

Stark wrote: »

The amnesia effect only comes into play when they're looking at the Silence. If someone tells them there's these aliens called the Silence when there's no Silence around, the amnesia effect doesn't apply.

how can that somebody know, since that somebody would also forget? I mean, its a great idea - dont get me wrong, love the concept - its just too good a defence though. I mean, prisoner zero and the rest should also have forgotton about them (or never have been told in the first place)

ah, forget it, I am even annoying myself at this stage.

ríomhaire

Stark wrote: »

The amnesia effect only comes into play when they're looking at the Silence. If someone tells them there's these aliens called the Silence when there's no Silence around, the amnesia effect doesn't apply.

Exactly. The Doctor looking at the phone wouldn't make him forget that Amy mentioned there was an alien on the phone in the first place.

(but remember information regarding them fades over time too unless you're reminded too so you need to keep talking about them with people too)

Yahew

ríomhaire wrote: »

Exactly. The Doctor looking at the phone wouldn't make him forget that Amy mentioned there was an alien on the phone in the first place.

(but remember information regarding them fades over time too unless you're reminded too so you need to keep talking about them with people too)

yes, once they all start talking about the aliens they remember talking about the aliens. in the middle of these conversations they may well see a Silence and forget him, but not the general conversations.