Klitschko-Haye in doubt yet again, Press conferences cancelled....

Boooourns

cowzerp wrote: »

I enjoyed the fight and wlad went for it in fairness-Haye done the bare minimum and was just too scared of wlad, I'm sick of all the people saying heavyweight boxing is dead!! There's no Tyson but most generations same could be said on reality.

I think we're the only two that did enjoy it haha.

Johner

People who enjoy boxing as a sport would enjoy and realise how good a boxer Wlad is, but the problem is most people who tune in want to see a KO and someone getting there head torn off!

heyheyhey1982

Vlad is actually a very good boxer and his amature record speaks for itself. But the fact that a cruiser weight can come in and within 4 fights be one of the best boxers in the division is mad. I know a bit about boxing and i follow it, and in my eyes its dead. Last night wasnt a good advert for the game. Look back at the fights in the 90's- epic advertures. Last night wasnt even a fight- looking at both faces at the end they where in good nick.

Squall19

nacho libre wrote: »

A lot of Klitschko's past opponents would say the same thing. Wlad is not a joke.
He's not exciting to watch, but he is a heavyweight champion on merit. He's beaten the best this era has to offer at heavyweight. He can't do anymore.

He didn't avenge his defeats though.

Just got his brother to beat them

He could fight Sanders 100 times and he wouldn't have beaten him, good boxer and all but he is afraid to get hit, any of the big hitters from the previous generation like Bowe, Lewis, Tyson would have smelled that fear and banged him out.

He runs away, not joking, he actually does run:D

You couldn't run away from someone like Bowe.

Haye is a joke though.

Holyfield is 50 years old and he would have given Wlad a better fight.He's not scared of anyone and would have thrown a few at Wlad, while Haye the pussy just ran away all night.

In his prime Holy would have beaten Wlad, he would bring the heat in that one.

plasmaguy

Daroxtar wrote: »

Explain?
30 years ago there was Larry Homes and sweet fúck all else.

Maybe not 30 years ago...35 years ago though....

Frazier, Ali, Foreman, Norton, Shavers, Young, Lyle, Quarry...tough tough cookies...

Even Foreman in his prime struggled in that era. He came back 20 years later and nearly cleaned out the same division in his mid 40s!

plasmaguy

cowzerp wrote: »

On the toe thing! It was his little toe, when power punching your on the ball of your foot and there is less weight on little toe as when just standing on it! It's a brutal excuse, i boxed with broken rib and just manned up and did not let it get to me and that's worse than a little toe!!

He's a bad loser and been honest is a poor heavyweight and boring too, he threw barely anything and what he did was sloppy and just hoping for lucky punch, let's put Haye been top heavyweight to bed once and for all

Agreed...many boxers fight on with broken noses and jaws ffs!

Was Haye in agony, was he wincing throughout the fight when he leant on his sore toe, no he wasn't, I just watched a replay of the fight there and not once does Haye show any sign of pain from his foot.

Added to that, he probably had stuff injected into the foot to nullify the pain.

He just didn't have what it took to beat Klitchscho, and he doesn't deserve a rematch.

Squall19

walshb wrote: »

Very disappointed with Haye. I wonder how much the broken toe affected him. It had to affect him, but how much? Wlad came out like a man possessed, and really contained Haye for almost every round. The jab being his key weapon. Haye took some very good shots in there. All around it was a very dull affair. I am not surprised. Hype hype hype. I think a peak Tyson or Holyfield would take both men out in the same night.

Haye wouldn't even get into the ring with those two.Holy right now at 50 would probably beat Haye lol.

I think Wlad would have a decent chance against Holy in his prime, as I dont Holy had tnt in either hand but Tyson would floored Wlad eventually, would have been a brutal KO too.

Wlad would have been badly hurt against Tyson, possibly hospital stuff.I think that because when a shot comes Wlad runs away, doesn't cover up and just looks very awkward.A few times Haye's wild swings almost caught him while he was running lol.

Tyson would have done some damage no doubt, actually most heavy hitters who weren't afraid to get hit would.

If Haye wasn't such a pussy and not afraid he could have won, Wlad doesn't come out of this fight looking too good either.
He looked even more vulnerable than Haye.

eagle eye

A broken toe won't affect you at all. All that you do is tape it to the one next to it. Its unlikely to cause any pain. Of course there will be an exceptions to what I say but very, very few.

Its just any sort of bull to try and safe some face after an embarrassing performance. And saying he answered questions concerning his jaw isn't really accurate either. Its hard to nab a guy who is backing away most of the fight and diving on the floor at any given opportunity.

I said to my friends today that this whole circus reminded me of the movie the Great White Hype. It was like a real life version of that.

Jayob10

Amazing to still see such disrespect for Wladimir Klitschko. Technically an excellent fighter and I didn't need to see that fight last night to make that judgement.

Wlad has had tougher fights than that. People keep mentioning his suspect chin (which isn't cast iron I admit) and questionable character, but he is churning out win after win against ranked fighters and mandatory challengers.

Haye is just another of those "bums" he spoke about before the fight. To be the man you have to beat the man and despite the fact every other heavyweight seems to criticise Wlad and his brother, none seem to be able to beat them in the last 7-8 years nearly. Sure he uses his size to his advantage, but his footwork for a big man is excellent and he has deceptively good handspeed. Also his amateur record speaks for itself.

Haye has proven himself to be a pot shot fighter, relies on landing a big shot. When he cannot knock out a guy who is also mobile then he has no real technical skills such as a basic jab to win rounds. Also for a guy so quick, his footwork is atrocious.

I also mentioned before the fight how I think his training is questionable aswell. He always looks in chiselled shape but I have heard he cuts alot of corners when it comes to cardio. He isn't the first to do it but he never does any running for instance.

People who slaughter the heavyweight division saying its scandalous that a blown up cruiserweight is the best out there apart from the Klitschko's, should watch more heavyweight boxing. The landscape is poor, however i'd fancy Haye to be beaten by other heavyweights such as Adamek (whose a better technical fighter than Haye), Chambers, Solis, Helenius, Povetkin and Chagaev. And Vitali obviously.

Ill never forget what the f*cker said about Chagaev when there was talk of him getting his mandatory, he claimed he didn't even know who he was, probably some bum. Hes a guy who also beat Valuev and John Ruiz.

I'd also give Arreola a shot at beating Haye mainly because I don't think Haye knocks him out, he doesn't have the capability of boxing his head off, and Arreola just keeps coming.

Also i'd give Chisora and hell even Mike Perez a fighting chance against Haye. When Haye cannot knock someone out he is in trouble really.

Jayob10

Johner wrote: »

Vitali is a better boxer, unreal chin and has more power. Wlad admits himself that Vitali would beat him.

Not all true, Wlad admits Vitali would beat him claiming he is the more natural fighter.

Wlad is the better boxer by far, vitali has the better chin and is also easier to hit. But Vitali is the better fighter, more likely to mix it up, hence he is seen as being slightly more ballsy and entertaining than Wlad.

Wlad hits harder apparently this is backed up by punch power stats, but Vitali lets his hands go more freely and is obviously no slouch in terms of his power either as his fight to knockout ratio suggests.

Any fight between both would be a glorified sparring session, would be intriguing though if both were not related though, im not sure Vitali wins it as comfortably as people suggest. Wlad has far superior technical skills and Vitali is getting on. A younger Vitali wins by vicious KO though.

Vudgie

I watched the fight on Saturday and like everyone else I was really disappointed. It was clear with a good few rounds left that Haye was only defending his reputation by staying on his feet, he took zero risks to even land his big punch.

I had hoped that he would go all out and take a few chances to keep this weight division alive. Even if he had gotten knocked out trying to get inside the jab I think people would have given him much more respect so it is ironic that by doing nothing and being able to say 'I lost on points' it is infionitely worse than getting sparked out in my eyes.

He obviously lacks skill, some of his technique was embarrassing, throwing wild hail mary punches. He also lacks the pure agression that you need as the smaller man. Not to harp on about Tyson but in his prime his smaller stature counted for nothing as he had animalistic agression to get inside a jab and then use his punching power.

Another let down unfortunately.

ebbsy

Vudgie wrote: »

I watched the fight on Saturday and like everyone else I was really disappointed. It was clear with a good few rounds left that Haye was only defending his reputation by staying on his feet, he took zero risks to even land his big punch.

I had hoped that he would go all out and take a few chances to keep this weight division alive. Even if he had gotten knocked out trying to get inside the jab I think people would have given him much more respect so it is ironic that by doing nothing and being able to say 'I lost on points' it is infionitely worse than getting sparked out in my eyes.

He obviously lacks skill, some of his technique was embarrassing, throwing wild hail mary punches. He also lacks the pure agression that you need as the smaller man. Not to harp on about Tyson but in his prime his smaller stature counted for nothing as he had animalistic agression to get inside a jab and then use his punching power.

Another let down unfortunately.

Yeah I have to agree with that, if he had gone down swinging, which was very apparent that he had to do halfway through the fight, at least he could have backed up his talk to some extent.

Also all this talk about his trainer being a Roach or Steward proved to be total nonsense.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Anybody else hearing anything about Haye being hurt ?

Wow my sources were right. I was also told to put money on Klitschko to win on points. But i dont gamble

Neil3030

I really enjoyed the fight. Klitschko's performance was tactical boxing in its near purest form. Anyone who says otherwise is not a fan of boxing, but a fan of seeing people getting hurt. These people should f**k off and watch rodeo or something.

Daroxtar

One little thing about how pathetic it is that a blown up cruiserweight could be regarded as one of the best HWs out there...... Evander Holyfield.

Its got fk all to do with size. Its about being good enough. I think a blown up flyweight beat a former middleweight world champ a couple of years ago...

Johner

cowzerp

Squall19 wrote: »

You couldn't run away from someone like Bowe.

Haye is a joke though.

Holyfield is 50 years old and he would have given Wlad a better fight.He's not scared of anyone and would have thrown a few at Wlad, while Haye the pussy just ran away all night.

In his prime Holy would have beaten Wlad, he would bring the heat in that one.

Bowe was 1 of the toughest large heavyweights ever, i only put Big george ahead of him.

Holyfield would be hurt in a fight with either Klitsckho now, he is joint with Ali the most successful heavyweight ever add that to his cruiser weight greatest ever and saying he would beat wlad is no disgrace at peak.

walshb

Holyfield now is just sad. Far too old to be competitive. In his peak, I think Wlad is lucky to last five rds. Holyfield far too good, heavy handed and full of fight. He wouldn't at all be afarid to get inside the jab and pound Wla with vicious shorts shots, from all angles. For Wlad's sz and height and advantags, he really is very ordinary. A poor mans Lennox Lewis. I used to criticise Lewis's stylke as being too cautious and boring, but next to Wlad, Lewis is an animal.

The divivion is a joke if those two are the supposed best. Looking at heavies from the past 15-20-30 years. Guys like Mercer, Briggs, Ike,
Morrisson, Moorer, Whiterspoon, Tubbs, Dokes, Ruddock and some more, all were better. And these weren't the cream. Add in Holyfield, Tyson, Lewis. Then, Foreman, and even Gerry Cooney from 1990 would beat those two from Saturday night.

walshb

Neil3030 wrote: »

I really enjoyed the fight. Klitschko's performance was tactical boxing in its near purest form. Anyone who says otherwise is not a fan of boxing, but a fan of seeing people getting hurt. These people should f**k off and watch rodeo or something.

What?

I am no fan of guys getting hurt, but I do like a competitive and well fought fight, especially when the hype is sky high. That wasn't a competitive fight, it was a freaking snooze fest. They did their best to do as little as possible. Tactical? Skillful? My backside. Wlad walking after Haye; Haye moving away from Wlad. Jab, jab, step back, fall in, moan, REPEAT!

Watch DeGale-Groves for an example of a high octane, skilled and competitive scrap, where they threw and landed, and fought for 12 rds. That had ZERO to do with hurt and pain. It was a well fought and interesting battle, with actions and skill, and patience.

walshb

Squall19 wrote: »

I think Wlad would have a decent chance against Holy in his prime, as I dont Holy had tnt in either hand but Tyson would floored Wlad eventually, would have been a brutal KO too.
.

Rewatch some old Holyfield scraps. Dokes, Cooper, Foreman, Douglas, Bowe; and then tell me he couldn't get to and hurt Wlad. Brewster and Sanders landed and took him out. Holyfield is so superior in all departments to these guys. Holyfield had very decent power, and threw so much leather as well.
No, max 4-5 rds and Wlad is stretchered out of there.

ringadingding

We flew to Hamburg for the fight, great weekend let down by a poor show by haye and a worse venue.

Could tell from the 3rd round he was hoping for a one punch wonder knock out, he kept springing from far too low, no jab really and he certainly didn't leave it all in the ring, I naively thought he would go all out in the last couple of rounds as he hadn't a sniff of winning on points. You could see his big punches coming from around the corner.

Klitschko didn't take any risks, and to be honest, he was clever enough to know he didn'y need to.

I do believe that haye hurt wlad more than wlad hurt him, he def broke his nose im sure, but couldn't capitalise on it, wlads corner was visibly ****ting it after that, but haye couldn't follow it up.

The venue was a joke, not covered and pissing rain for the whole 4-5 hours, but security was an absolute joke, in as much as we blagged from our **** seats and into 3rd row ringside ( 9k tickets - next to johnathon ross) ) and for some reason haye was brought through the crowd and got a good trampling.


I don't think there will be a rematch, but if there is, I think it may be better than this fight, but honestly, i cant see klitchko giving him it, too much to lose, although he has nobody left to fight i guess.

Im not even sure if these boys should have been pitted together in the first place, if only on size difference, in no other weight class could they have fought.

Boooourns

Have to say i really enjoyed Hayes head movement the other night, he made Wlad miss a hell of alot, it's just a pity he didn't follow it up with counters.
He's getting called allsorts because of the sh!te he was spouting before the fight but looking back on his performance it wasn't that bad, i actually thought he had a chance throughout the fight but he just didn't leave his hands go and when he did he couldn't time Wlad.

Frank Bullitt

Haye isn't helping himself with the excuses.

hellboy99

Just seen Haye on Sky News with his sore toe :rolleyes:

nacho libre

corny wrote: »

All the stunts and the hype (the toe just being the next chapter) have made him a rich man and with respect, affecting your sensibilities is a small price to pay. I found his remarks and his antics equally distasteful, his toe actually made me laugh, loudly, but i think where you and i disagree is i think its premeditated. I think Haye is all business and everything and anything he says outside of the ring means nothing to him. Sure if i'm honest i'd say Wlad was in on it or at least was privy to "right i'm gonna talk lots of **** now. Won't be pretty but it will make us both rich". I doubt his ego even comes into it. He's probably secretly ****ing delighted with how the evening went. Skys phone lines crashing, 15 million in the pocket and Wlad hardly damaged his pretty boy features. Maybe one more money spinning fight (where the over riding goal again is: **** winning, don't get tagged by these fellas) and he can swan off a rich man.

Rather than it being all theatrics to maximize the viewing audience, I think Wlad was genuinely annoyed by some of Hayes stunt concerning his family, but he duped Haye into thinking he'd fight angry because of them. There is a lot of pantomime in professional boxing, with manufactured hostility to sell fights, but equally over the years some fighters have genuinely disliked each other.
Is Haye being a bit more humble today just another part of the strategy to keep the Haye Brand alive? I'd say it's more a case of people close to him told him to cop on. He is no doubt very wealthy from his antics, and looking at his bank balance won't feel to badly about people disliking him, but rather than simply wanting to make even more money in another fight, his motivation in reconsidering his retirement date could well be about pride and ego after failing to live up to the hype. He doesn't want to go out on a loss. There comes a point where the satisfaction from winning is more important.
Not everyone who competes in professional sports does so purely for the money.

Kaneda_

Kaneda_ wrote: »

Off topic but i didnt want to start a new thread...

Would you reckon david haye drinks alcohol or not?

Random question i know!

A relative in the UK was telling me he met him yrs ago at a house party and apparently he doesn't drink and i think he may have mentioned he is big into Christianity.

Paparazzo

Drumpot wrote: »

Agreed.

How many people here have been watching the Ukrainian fights with such anticipation. Doesnt matter Haye sucked, he possibly did more for boxing in the build up to this game then either Ukrainian have done by being champs!

And haye undone all his work with a terrible performance. The only thing more pathetic than hayes performance was his little toe excuse.

nacho libre

Squall19 wrote: »

He didn't avenge his defeats though.

Just got his brother to beat them

He could fight Sanders 100 times and he wouldn't have beaten him, good boxer and all but he is afraid to get hit, any of the big hitters from the previous generation like Bowe, Lewis, Tyson would have smelled that fear and banged him out.

He runs away, not joking, he actually does run:D

You couldn't run away from someone like Bowe.

Haye is a joke though.

Holyfield is 50 years old and he would have given Wlad a better fight.He's not scared of anyone and would have thrown a few at Wlad, while Haye the pussy just ran away all night.

In his prime Holy would have beaten Wlad, he would bring the heat in that one.

He did avenge one of his defeats, if i'm not mistaken. I disagree that Wlad would lose to Sanders now or Puritty. He learned a lot from his defeats and is a much better fighter than he was back then. Wlad would likely lose to a prime Tyson, Lewis, and Holyfield. That's why I said the best from this era.
Speaking of Holyfield, as you mentioned a tremendous warrior in his day and an easy to like man, but he is seriously deluded at this stage. I read an interview he did recently with Jeff Powell(boxing writer for the Daily Mail) where he was talking about unifying the titles by the time he is 50. Both Klitschko's would give him a terrible beating now.

corny

nacho libre wrote: »

Rather than it being all theatrics to maximize the viewing audience, I think Wlad was genuinely annoyed by some of Hayes stunt concerning his family, but he duped Haye into thinking he'd fight angry because of them. There is a lot of pantomime in professional boxing, with manufactured hostility to sell fights, but equally over the years some fighters have genuinely disliked each other.
Is Haye being a bit more humble today just another part of the strategy to keep the Haye Brand alive? I'd say it's more a case of people close to him told him to cop on. He is no doubt very wealthy from his antics, and looking at his bank balance won't feel to badly about people disliking him, but rather than simply wanting to make even more money in another fight, his motivation in reconsidering his retirement date could well be about pride and ego after failing to live up to the hype. He doesn't want to go out on a loss. There comes a point where the satisfaction from winning is more important.
Not everyone who competes in professional sports does so purely for the money.

No definitely not and i don't hold this view of every professional fighter.

We'll never know whether it is just business with him or whether he has professional pride. But just a couple of things.

Watching Wlad at the weigh in he was about as calm and as jovial as he could be. He shook everyone by the hand and laughed when Haye refused to shake his hand. He knew it was all rubbish, Haye knew it was all rubbish. Wlad was cool as a cucumber before, during and after fight.

If Haye wanted satisfaction from winning he'd have stayed at cruiserweight and not moved up. However, if he was in it for the money the path he's taken (fighting fraudley etc.) was the logical progression. Even very early retirement is logical. Fighting Ruiz, Fraudley, running away from Valuev and Wlad, retiring after a big payday strike me as the actions of a man who doesn't really care about legacy or professional pride.

corny

walshb wrote: »

I am no fan of guys getting hurt, but I do like a competitive and well fought fight, especially when the hype is sky high. That wasn't a competitive fight, it was a freaking snooze fest. They did their best to do as little as possible. Tactical? Skillful? My backside. Wlad walking after Haye; Haye moving away from Wlad. Jab, jab, step back, fall in, moan, REPEAT

Completely agree with that.