Gerry and Kate Mcann promoting Book on Late Late next week

Savage Tyrant

PapaQuebec wrote: »

I've had a copy for while but was only tempted to read it after following a similar thread on politics.ie.
I've given many copies to close friends who are/were in AGS and I can honestly say they were shocked by the nature and quantity of vital info that were kept from both the media and the Portuguese Police!!

After reading the book 4 times I am in no doubt as to the likely events of that night!

Is the file small enough to be emailed? I'd like to read it.

MagicMarker

K-9 wrote: »

Putting big sway on them is naive too, cases have been dismissed because of their lack of reliability.

And murderers have been convicted because of their reliability.

PapaQuebec

Savage Tyrant wrote: »

Is the file small enough to be emailed? I'd like to read it.

Anyone who wants a copy can PM me with a valid email address
filesize is 570Kb

K-9

MagicMarker wrote: »

And murderers have been convicted because of their reliability.

Madeleine: McCanns consult American lawyers over 'cadaver dog' evidence | Mail Online

Depends on the individual dogs record it seems, the defence in that case reckoned it was only 22%, 29% and 38% for 3 different dogs.

I remember reading up on it at the time and a summary of the book PapaQuebec is on about, I do reckon there definitely is suspicious stuff there.

Why was the detective removed from the investigation?

PapaQuebec

K-9 wrote: »

Madeleine: McCanns consult American lawyers over 'cadaver dog' evidence | Mail Online

Depends on the individual dogs record it seems, the defence in that case reckoned it was only 22%, 29% and 38% for 3 different dogs.

I remember reading up on it at the time and a summary of the book PapaQuebec is on about, I do reckon there definitely is suspicious stuff there.

Why was the detective removed from the investigation?

You could also ask why Gerry McCanns phone records for the night in question were "deleted" or even why a request from the investigators for the McCann's financial records showed them to have NO credit or debit cards despite it being known that they used such cards to book flights, accomodation and hire-cars!

amdublin

Have you ever seen the Oprah interview with Kaye McCann?

Yeah so just to warn you:
The DLB interview will be nothing like the Oprah one.

PapaQuebec

Reading matter found in subsequent search of Gerry McCann's bedroom:

"- Missing and Abducted Children: A Law-Enforcement Guide to Case Investigation and Program Management, National Center for Missing & Exploited Children;

- Training Courses, CEOP (Serious Organised Crime Agency - Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre);

- Making Every Child Matter...Everywhere, CEOP (Serious Organised Crime Agency -
Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre).

Mark Harrison (one of the British Police team) himself wonders how Gerald McCann could have obtained these books."

Wolflikeme

Dan133269 wrote: »

Is this true? Source?

Only hearing about this now? What rock have you been living under?!

It's been well documented.

maebee

Animord wrote: »

I know this is a daft thing, but at the time it I thought it was odd that Kate McCann was wearing ribbons in her hair when they were filmed walking on the beach a few days after. I can't imagine anyone getting up in the morning in their circumstances and putting ribbons in their hair.

My interest in the case came about after something similar Animord. At first, I believed their story but when I saw them jogging and blogging their jog times within a week of their daughter's "abduction" I felt very uneasy. I too noticed Kate's ribbons and hair do's, which I don't really pay much attention to. What is far more worrying is the Gaspars statements and the Final Report of the police findings declaring that Madeleine died in the apartment and that her body was concealed. I could be wrong but I suspect that she died from an overdose or by other sinister means and that her body could not be presented for autopsy. For those who find this thought horrific (as I do myself) please read the Official Polices Files, widely available on the Internet.

PapaQuebec

maebee wrote: »

My interest in the case came about after something similar Animord. At first, I believed their story but when I saw them jogging and blogging their jog times within a week of their daughter's "abduction" I felt very uneasy. I too noticed Kate's ribbons and hair do's, which I don't really pay much attention to. What is far more worrying is the Gaspars statements and the Final Report of the police findings declaring that Madeleine died in the apartment and that her body was concealed. I could be wrong but I suspect that she died from an overdose or by other sinister means and that her body could not be presented for autopsy. For those who find this thought horrific (as I do myself) please read the Official Polices Files, widely available on the Internet.

Pretty similar conclusion to myself. Though if you read one of my posts above (the one concerning Majorca 2005) there may be other reasons why a body couldn't be presented for PM!

Donal Og O Baelach

TheZohan wrote: »

The questions can't be loaded if you're innocent.

This is 100% true... in the world of The Easter Bunny, Santa and the ToothFairy.

MagicMarker

K-9 wrote: »

Madeleine: McCanns consult American lawyers over 'cadaver dog' evidence | Mail Online

Depends on the individual dogs record it seems, the defence in that case reckoned it was only 22%, 29% and 38% for 3 different dogs.

I remember reading up on it at the time and a summary of the book PapaQuebec is on about, I do reckon there definitely is suspicious stuff there.

Why was the detective removed from the investigation?

Yeah, I read that earlier myself, how the judge dismissed evidence in that case concerning Eugene Zapata. However, 5 months after that article in the Daily Mail Eugene Zapata pleaded guilty to murdering his wife. So it appears the dog was right, and the defence was wrong. Seriously, what else would the defence say? Of course they're going to give those kind of numbers.

Lady von Purple

PapaQuebec wrote: »

Reading matter found in subsequent search of Gerry McCann's bedroom:

"- Missing and Abducted Children: A Law-Enforcement Guide to Case Investigation and Program Management, National Center for Missing & Exploited Children;

- Training Courses, CEOP (Serious Organised Crime Agency - Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre);

- Making Every Child Matter...Everywhere, CEOP (Serious Organised Crime Agency -
Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre).

Mark Harrison (one of the British Police team) himself wonders how Gerald McCann could have obtained these books."

Any idea how long after the alleged abduction these were found?
Immediately after, or a short time after, suspicius as hell.
A few months, it could've been a father trying to follow an investigation of his missing daughter.

But yes, it's an incredibly suspicious case and without the massive media frenzy, the McCanns would have definitely been treated very differently by the police. There might've been a chance at an actual trial then...

PapaQuebec

Lady von Purple wrote: »

Any idea how long after the alleged abduction these were found?
Immediately after, or a short time after, suspicius as hell.
A few months, it could've been a father trying to follow an investigation of his missing daughter.

But yes, it's an incredibly suspicious case and without the massive media frenzy, the McCanns would have definitely been treated very differently by the police. There might've been a chance at an actual trial then...

They were found in the rented premises the McCann's moved to after vacating the holiday apartment. I think it was early August.

I should have copied the following lines:
"With amazement the police officers discover a series of books and manuals exclusively intended for police services and government agencies."

maebee

PapaQuebec wrote: »

Pretty similar conclusion to myself. Though if you read one of my posts above (the one concerning Majorca 2005) there may be other reasons why a body couldn't be presented for PM!

Majorca 2005 and the Gaspars statements are the key to this case imo.

K-9

MagicMarker wrote: »

Yeah, I read that earlier myself, how the judge dismissed evidence in that case concerning Eugene Zapata. However, 5 months after that article in the Daily Mail Eugene Zapata pleaded guilty to murdering his wife. So it appears the dog was right, and the defence was wrong. Seriously, what else would the defence say? Of course they're going to give those kind of numbers.

Well they are the defence......Duh!

They can't just make them up though and the judge accepts it.

I remember reading about the phone records and they seemed odd!

AudreyHepburn

Donkey Oaty wrote: »

According to them.

What proof have you that it was otherwise? Not saying you're wrong mind, but if you're going to make statments like this back them up.

Dudess wrote: »

You wouldn't be comfortable regarding their safety under the supervision of a babysitter in a foreign country so you'd leave them with nobody? That is some ironic stuff. Those complexes provide professional child-minding services - if there was a problem with them it would be known about. In fairness, I can understand parents feeling apprehensive in relation to a new babysitter, but the McCanns were close by enough to pop in and check all was going ok for them.
And so what if the babysitter wouldn't have been able to stop it. Maybe they would? At least they'd have been there to try. But anyway, I'm talking about the irresponsible nature of the decision in a general sense, not as a reason to blame them for Madeleine's disappearance. I fully agree they're over-paying for that decision now and deserve sympathy. Disingenuous to say it was a run-of-the-mill parenting mistake though.

Please don't include me in that with your "all" business, as I'm agreeing with you fully on that score.

To be fair I wouldn't leave them alone either but I don't think that gives me or anyone else the right to judge other people's choices as parents when I don't know the circumstances surrounding that choice.

It was mistake, not a run-of-the-mill one maybe but a mistake nonetheless and one which they'll spend their lives paying for.

And like you I just feel that they really don't need all cruelty and vicious unfounded rumours being levelled at them.

I wasn't including you in the 'all' btw it was refering to others, sorry for the confusion!

TheZohan wrote: »

No they didn't, Gerry McCann said it might have been 40min and Kate said she didn't open the door she listened at the door to hear them breathing, she didn't check visually to see if they were ok.

Links? Again you may be right but back it up.

PapaQuebec

maebee wrote: »

Majorca 2005 and the Gaspars statements are the key to this case imo.

Plus the constant interference by the UK authorities. Blocking requests for info etc, (the hair-sample that was proven by DNA to belong to Madeleine was never returned to the Portuguese). The "deletion" of Gerard McCann's phone records for the relevant period. The denial that the McCann's possessed credit-cards etc.
If the events of 2005 are to be believed then one must wonder how far this went? Who else might be involved? People of such "significance" that the McCann's must never be prosecuted?

maebee

This vid was filmed by a Portuguese TV station 6 days after the "abduction".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VlS-gO5Ask&feature=player_detailpage

He doesn't look very much like the father of an abducted child, to me anyway.

Donkey Oaty

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

What proof have you that it was otherwise? Not saying you're wrong mind, but if you're going to make statments like this back them up.

There have been different accounts, for example:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-502666/Key-witness-casts-doubt-Kate-McCanns-account-Madeleines-disappearance.html

ISDW

PapaQuebec wrote: »

Plus the constant interference by the UK authorities. Blocking requests for info etc, (the hair-sample that was proven by DNA to belong to Madeleine was never returned to the Portuguese). The "deletion" of Gerard McCann's phone records for the relevant period. The denial that the McCann's possessed credit-cards etc.
If the events of 2005 are to be believed then one must wonder how far this went? Who else might be involved? People of such "significance" that the McCann's must never be prosecuted?

Seriously? So now this isn't a case of the child being accidentally killed and the death being covered up, this is an international conspiracy including the UK police and government?

Devil's advocate, alot of people are coming down hard on the McCanns for writing the book, what was the Portugese policeman's motive for doing the same? How much did he make from it?

I honestly don't know the answer to this, but why was he taken off the case?

maebee

The statement of Yvonne Martin (Social Services & Child Protection) is very pertinent to the case. She also had suspicions about David Payne, one of the Tapas 9.

http://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/t8423-statement-of-yvonne-martin

PapaQuebec

ISDW wrote: »

Seriously? So now this isn't a case of the child being accidentally killed and the death being covered up, this is an international conspiracy including the UK police and government?

Devil's advocate, alot of people are coming down hard on the McCanns for writing the book, what was the Portugese policeman's motive for doing the same? How much did he make from it?

I honestly don't know the answer to this, but why was he taken off the case?

Not at all.

After reading the book I came to the conclusion that there is possibility that these "group holidays" were more than they seemed!

Since Gerry McCann's telephone records for the key period suddenly got "deleted", no-one will ever know who he spoke to that day.
The loss of the records was not "Portuguese incompetece" as the records were held by a UK service-provider. Just who (the author asks) would have the power to "lose" a customers record of calls?

Who would have the power or authority to tell financial institutions to issue blanket denials that the McCann's ever possessed credit or debit cards?

The portuguese had lots of evidence that they had used such cards!!

Why the cover-up??

PapaQuebec

ISDW wrote: »

Seriously? So now this isn't a case of the child being accidentally killed and the death being covered up, this is an international conspiracy including the UK police and government?

Devil's advocate, alot of people are coming down hard on the McCanns for writing the book, what was the Portugese policeman's motive for doing the same? How much did he make from it?

I honestly don't know the answer to this, but why was he taken off the case?[/QUOTE]

Because "abduction by person or persons unknown" was the pre-ordained conclusion.
Amaral followed the evidence!

PapaQuebec

ISDW wrote: »

Seriously? So now this isn't a case of the child being accidentally killed and the death being covered up, this is an international conspiracy including the UK police and government?

Devil's advocate, alot of people are coming down hard on the McCanns for writing the book, what was the Portugese policeman's motive for doing the same? How much did he make from it?

I honestly don't know the answer to this, but why was he taken off the case?

As far as I'm aware he made nothing. The book remains banned!
It was released public-domain to make it's contents known to a public that has been fed a carefully managed diet of bullsh*t for several years!

maebee

PapaQuebec wrote: »

As far as I'm aware he made nothing. The book remains banned!
It was released public-domain to make it's contents known to a public that has been fed a carefully managed diet of bullsh*t for several years!

The ban on Amaral's book was overturned in October 2010:



http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2010/10/mccann-book-ban-freedoom-has-returned.html

PapaQuebec

maebee wrote: »

The ban on Amaral's book was overturned in October 2010:



http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2010/10/mccann-book-ban-freedoom-has-returned.html

Thanks for the info. I stand corrected.
As far as I'm aware the copy I have is the only english translation available in the public domain

ISDW

PapaQuebec wrote: »

ISDW wrote: »

Seriously? So now this isn't a case of the child being accidentally killed and the death being covered up, this is an international conspiracy including the UK police and government?

Devil's advocate, alot of people are coming down hard on the McCanns for writing the book, what was the Portugese policeman's motive for doing the same? How much did he make from it?

I honestly don't know the answer to this, but why was he taken off the case?[/QUOTE]

Because "abduction by person or persons unknown" was the pre-ordained conclusion.
Amaral followed the evidence!

OK, officially why was he taken off the case?

TheZohanS

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Links? Again you may be right but back it up.

Timeline according to PJ 57-page report summary, 21 July 2008

- at 20H30, the couple went out to the restaurant;

- at 21H05/21H15 the father went to check the children, noticing that all was normal, the window and the blinds were closed, however the door to the room seemed more opened than when he had left;

That's between 35 and 45 minutes.

In another statement Gerry says Madeleine was not in her bed, and he assumed that the twins woke her up with their crying, and she went into her parents bedroom (which he did not check).

Read the 57 page Police report, it won't take long.

kowloon

dark crystal wrote: »

You know, this reminds me of the case where the Chamberlains in Australia were villified by the press and public for leaving their baby daughter alone in a tent whilst they ate barbeque nearby. The child was then dragged off by a dingo and they were put on trial for manslaughter by the police, who blamed them for concocting such a ludicrous story.

Of course, people were so quick to judge their parenting abilities, it never occured to them that they may be innocent, grieving parents thrown to the wolves by the press and the baying mob, simply for the committing the crime of leaving their child on it's own temporarily whilst they ate dinner as their child slept, as they thought, safely. She was jailed, later to be pardoned, when the story turned out to be true.

It's sad that a family can be torn apart by something as simple as a pack of wild dogs - Jack Handey.