Painter/Decorator - Price for internal woodwork

sasol

Hi, I am in the process of finishing out a house in the mid-west area.

I am looking for someone to do the following
1) Sand, varnish and paint a semi solid stairs.
2) Sand and paint door frames and arcitrave (for 18 doors). Door are already finished so do not require further work.
3) Paint skirting and do a few 'touch ups' to hide/disguise nail marks. It is a 2000 sq ft house, so a good bit of skirting.

Skirting, architrave and frames have all, already got two coats of paint by me, I just require the painter/decorator to finish it out.

What would be a reasonable labour price for this ?

I got a quote of 2000 (labour only) for this work and I thought it was obscene. I will obviously be shopping around, but just wanted some opinion.

slowburner

You might get more opinions over in the DIY forum. Personally, I don't think the price is obscene - there's a lot of very time consuming work involved.

bazmak

slowburner wrote: »

You might get more opinions over in the DIY forum. Personally, I don't think the price is obscene - there's a lot of very time consuming work involved.

OP.what would see as a reasonable daily rate of pay for a professional tradesman?

you pay for what you get when it comes to getting a pro painter.
a fully qualified painter would not work for 60E a day for instance as
advertised on some classifieds.

you would definetly be looking to pay between 1200 & 2000 !

go with the pro !

Paul.C

Price should be daily rate of between 150-200 euro if your paying vat etc. If its a nixer it could be between 100-150 daily rate.

This is not gospel, but remember you get what you pay for;)

sasol

Bazmak - I would be thinking that 120 to 150 a day would be more than enough in this day and age. I would reckon that there is no more than a 5 or 6 days work in it.


I got a quote of 950 this evening from a painter/decorator who did a similar job for a friend of mine recently. I will be going with that. Over 1K saved from previous quote. There are still tradesmen out there who still think the celtic tiger is alive and kicking!!

Paul.C

sasol wrote: »

Bazmak - I would be thinking that 120 to 150 a day would be more than enough in this day and age. I would reckon that there is no more than a 5 or 6 days work in it.


I got a quote of 950 this evening from a painter/decorator who did a similar job for a friend of mine recently. I will be going with that. Over 1K saved from previous quote. There are still tradesmen out there who still think the celtic tiger is alive and kicking!!

Yes I agree that the first quote was too high, but dont forget "tradesmen" still have to pay mortgages/rent, VAT, insurance, diesel, tools bills, electricity bills, gas bills and other overheads that im surely forgeting. These tend to cost money and then he has to do the unthinkable like feed his family:rolleyes:

€120 a day is about €2400 a month thats if the chap is luck enough to get 5 full days filled a week. lets say his after tax €1950 per month, mortgage is maybe €1200pm, diesel 150pm.

This leaves the chap with €600 to pay van/car insurance, gas, electricity, phone andother overheads per month. Again all before he puts food on the table. And again thats if he works every mon-fri from 9-5 every week which is unlikely.

So forgive me if I dont agree with the statement. Im off to another leaving do this time next week for another 3 of my friends that have been there and tried that. Unless you have no family and your on the dole doin nixer work, this isnt goin to sustain any kind of even average kind of living.

Would you be able to budget that lot? Id imagine youd find it hard:P

ronaldo84

bazmak wrote: »

OP.what would see as a reasonable daily rate of pay for a professional tradesman?
fully qualified painter would not work for 60E a day

there are lads working for as little as this. and i know plenty of them. its better than starving isnt it??

sasol

Paul.C wrote: »

Yes I agree that the first quote was too high, but dont forget "tradesmen" still have to pay mortgages/rent, VAT, insurance, diesel, tools bills, electricity bills, gas bills and other overheads that im surely forgeting. These tend to cost money and then he has to do the unthinkable like feed his family:rolleyes:

€120 a day is about €2400 a month thats if the chap is luck enough to get 5 full days filled a week. lets say his after tax €1950 per month, mortgage is maybe €1200pm, diesel 150pm.

This leaves the chap with €600 to pay van/car insurance, gas, electricity, phone andother overheads per month. Again all before he puts food on the table. And again thats if he works every mon-fri from 9-5 every week which is unlikely.

So forgive me if I dont agree with the statement. Im off to another leaving do this time next week for another 3 of my friends that have been there and tried that. Unless you have no family and your on the dole doin nixer work, this isnt goin to sustain any kind of even average kind of living.

Would you be able to budget that lot? Id imagine youd find it hard:P

120 a day works out at 2600 a month.
150 a day works out at 3250 a month.

There are an awful lot of people that would snap your hand off if they were offered these sort of wages on a job, myself included.
The only overheads that he will need for my job are is a paintbrush. I will be supplying all other materials.

The other things you mentioned - mortgages/rent, diesel, electricity bills, gas bills - are all things that every one of have to pay and has no relevance to what my painting job costs, otherwise your logic would imply that the bigger mortgage etc that a tradesman has, then the bigger a quote he is justified in giving someone ?

The 2000 quote I got was obscene. The 950 quote was reasonable and I got it without any haggling. I am firmly of the opinion that good tradesmen who offer value for money will still get a good deal of work, whereas those who still persist in trying to rip off people (and god knows there were enough of them in the boom years), will struggle for work.

Paul.C

sasol wrote: »

120 a day works out at 2600 a month.
150 a day works out at 3250 a month.

There are an awful lot of people that would snap your hand off if they were offered these sort of wages on a job, myself included.
The only overheads that he will need for my job are is a paintbrush. I will be supplying all other materials.

The other things you mentioned - mortgages/rent, diesel, electricity bills, gas bills - are all things that every one of have to pay and has no relevance to what my painting job costs, otherwise your logic would imply that the bigger mortgage etc that a tradesman has, then the bigger a quote he is justified in giving someone ?

The 2000 quote I got was obscene. The 950 quote was reasonable and I got it without any haggling. I am firmly of the opinion that good tradesmen who offer value for money will still get a good deal of work, whereas those who still persist in trying to rip off people (and god knows there were enough of them in the boom years), will struggle for work.

Wrong! the relavance is they still have to be paid. The bigger the mortgage the tradesman has the bigger the jobs he has to land. As I have already said yes the first quote was a joke and you got a proper one 2nd time round.

€60 a day would be €1200 per month and that would pay a mortgage but nothing else. If a lad is on the dole making this aswell the grand, no worries, people still have to eat. But as I have said, someone that isnt claiming benefits and that works every day to feed himself to pay the bills wont find this possible to do.

You MUST be mad to think otherwise. Its amazing how public servants scream when they receive pay cuts buy 5-10% Would you say the would work for €60 a day?

And the same people expect other people ie.Tradespeople to recieve 50-80%cuts and then say stupid things like, ah well €60 should be enough for him for a days work.:rolleyes: Like they are beggers at your door. Your arrogance is shocking.

Laymans terms...the ones who do it for €60 a day are on the dole, the ones that are not on the dole Cant!! Would you say that the lads pay VAT?? Not a hope.. so are tradesmen expected to break the law and avoid VAT to keep you happy?

And dont think I personally have a problem with the lads who do it for €60 a day because I dont. They have to survive too..

sasol

Paul.C wrote: »

Wrong! the relavance is they still have to be paid. The bigger the mortgage the tradesman has the bigger the jobs he has to land. As I have already said yes the first quote was a joke and you got a proper one 2nd time round.

€60 a day would be €1200 per month and that would pay a mortgage but nothing else. If a lad is on the dole making this aswell the grand, no worries, people still have to eat. But as I have said, someone that isnt claiming benefits and that works every day to feed himself to pay the bills wont find this possible to do.

You MUST be mad to think otherwise. Its amazing how public servants scream when they receive pay cuts buy 5-10% Would you say the would work for €60 a day?

And the same people expect other people ie.Tradespeople to recieve 50-80%cuts and then say stupid things like, ah well €60 should be enough for him for a days work.:rolleyes: Like they are beggers at your door. Your arrogance is shocking.

Laymans terms...the ones who do it for €60 a day are on the dole, the ones that are not on the dole Cant!! Would you say that the lads pay VAT?? Not a hope.. so are tradesmen expected to break the law and avoid VAT to keep you happy?

And dont think I personally have a problem with the lads who do it for €60 a day because I dont. They have to survive too..

Where are you pulling €60 a day out of ?

I said I would think €120 to €150 a day would be reasonable. I have given someone the job for €950 for 5 to 6 days work which is, worst case scenario €160 a day, or €190 a day if he gets it done in 5 days.

Whether the tradesman pays VAT, or breaks the law, is their choice and I am sure they have factored that decision into their price. It is none of my business.....I am paying enough taxes, I am not going to loose sleep over whether someone else is paying theirs.

But it doesn't take a genius to figure out that if someone is on this €60 a day you are on about, then they they are probably drawing dole.

Paul.C

sorry sasol, I just reread the thread! I did think you suggested the €60 thing.:o
apologies again. Also I thought you were in Dublin, where mortgages are a lot higher. A 4 bedroom house for instance bought in the boom can reach as high as €1800pm.

bazmak

ronaldo84 wrote: »

there are lads working for as little as this. and i know plenty of them. its better than starving isnt it??

its a dog eat dog situation :(but i doubt very much someone who served their time as a painter and went to college etc. is going to work 40 plus hours a week for E60 a day!
i have lost numerous jobs because so called painters have priced 60 0r 70 a day to the client! and have also been called to finish jobs that someone has done on the cheap.its true that you get what you pay for and thats it!

bazmak

sasol wrote: »

Where are you pulling €60 a day out of ?

I said I would think €120 to €150 a day would be reasonable. I have given someone the job for €950 for 5 to 6 days work which is, worst case scenario €160 a day, or €190 a day if he gets it done in 5 days.

Whether the tradesman pays VAT, or breaks the law, is their choice and I am sure they have factored that decision into their price. It is none of my business.....I am paying enough taxes, I am not going to loose sleep over whether someone else is paying theirs.

But it doesn't take a genius to figure out that if someone is on this €60 a day you are on about, then they they are probably drawing dole.

well said

slowburner

Interesting and relevant programme on TV3 last night re. painter/decorator charging €120 per day while simultaneously claiming various state benefits.

http://tv3.ie/shows.php?request=fiddlingthesystemirelandsdolecheats

Scroll the timeline to about 25 minutes to see the most relevant segment.

creedp

You MUST be mad to think otherwise. Its amazing how public servants scream when they receive pay cuts buy 5-10% Would you say the would work for €60 a day?

Btw I agree with most of your comments re: people earning a fair days pay for a fair days work and €60 for a self-employed tradesmen will not sustain his business. However, I would just like to point out one thing .. you take grave exception to people who downgrade tradespeople and then you turn around and downgrade public servants. I take exception to that comment! So what public servants are fair game but please don't criticise tradespeople?

Not relevant for a construction forum I know and certaintly fits wit hthe Sunday Independent jaundiced view of the world.

Paul.C

creedp wrote: »

Btw I agree with most of your comments re: people earning a fair days pay for a fair days work and €60 for a self-employed tradesmen will not sustain his business. However, I would just like to point out one thing .. you take grave exception to people who downgrade tradespeople and then you turn around and downgrade public servants. I take exception to that comment! So what public servants are fair game but please don't criticise tradespeople?

Not relevant for a construction forum I know and certaintly fits wit hthe Sunday Independent jaundiced view of the world.

That was meant as and analogy as opposed to a dig at the public sector. Apologies, I get my back up over foolish things.

This entire thread I have just tried to defend tradespeople as some people would love work for nothing. I understand that everyone is struggling and has their own issues but my point is, if you want a job done well then you pay a fair price. If you want a job cheap then you get a rushed finish and little or no chance or a callback if any problem arises.

Also I have posted a few times in this thread while mixing up what people were saying(misinterpreted the comments and duly apologised)

creedp

Paul.C wrote: »

That was meant as and analogy as opposed to a dig at the public sector. Apologies, I get my back up over foolish things.

This entire thread I have just tried to defend tradespeople as some people would love work for nothing. I understand that everyone is struggling and has their own issues but my point is, if you want a job done well then you pay a fair price. If you want a job cheap then you get a rushed finish and little or no chance or a callback if any problem arises.

Also I have posted a few times in this thread while mixing up what people were saying(misinterpreted the comments and duly apologised)

Sorry I was unecessarily tugging on the chain there. At the risk of completely overdoing this issue I just want to agree with you on people's expectations of what they can 'get for themselves' out of the recession. An example, and I know an example doesn't make it a rule, is a guy I know who changed job recently and got a €20k pay increase complaining bitterly about the price a carpenter was charging to make up a play house/area for his dear son. In fairness it was more like a small house! Anyway he told me that he let the guy know in no uncertain terms that didn't he know there was a recession on and everyone was sufferring so he would have to slash his price if he wanted the job!! This is the problem a lot [of course not all] of people are taking the advantage of the recession for others to make a saving so that the 11 plate can be purchased and the essential nice holiday can be upgraded. By the way Im guilty as the next for making sweeping statements here:)

As a consequence a few peole I know in the construction industry are taking jobs at cost simply to ensure their workers continue to earn a wage. Difficult for these guys to constantly listen to the sometine faux recession thing!

Paul.C

Couldnt agree with you more:)

People who are really hit by the recession couldnt dream of having work done. They are busy keeping a roof over their heads.

Others simply use it as an excuse to belittle tradesmens work.

Again not always the case, but the price of diesel is having a negative affect on materials too:mad:

Positivity is a hard one to maintain when you have people taking advantage. (especially when its blatant)

slowburner

It is increasingly difficult for tradespeople to allow for the increasing costs they have to pay. There are a lot of people about who think that the recession is a great excuse to squeeze the tradesperson and get a knock down price, even when the tradesperson's price is fair and justified.
So the tradesperson is being squeezed at both ends - costs of materials and fuel have risen dramatically and the prices people expect to pay have fallen. Simple economics.
There is increasingly less room for profit and without profit there can be no business.
Gloomy stuff I know - but I can't forsee an improvement until the price of fuel starts to come down - if ever.