Lesnar Out Carwin in to face JDS

d_jordan

Lesner has Diverticulitis again so Carwin steps in to take his place.

Hopefully he gets better soon

riffmongous

source?

edit: ah, I see Junkie have it http://mmajunkie.com/news/23586/brock-lesnar-out-of-ufc-131-junior-dos-santos-now-faces-shane-carwin.mma

themandan6611

all over the web - ufc twitter etc etc

Remmy

Jesus thats a cu'nt hope Lesnar gets better soon anyway.Whats the thoughts on JDS v Carwin so?

YouSavedMyLife

Remmy wrote: »

Jesus thats a cu'nt hope Lesnar gets better soon anyway.Whats the thoughts on JDS v Carwin so?

Carwin to gas after throwing two punches, gets KO'd 27 seconds into the first round

Xlami

Pat "HD" Barry - Official Fan Page
"TOTALLY OUT OF CHARACTER FOR ME- BUT MY FRIEND HAD A RELAPSE OF SOMETHING THAT ALMOST KILLED HIM AND LEFT HIS WIFE A WIDOW AND KIDS FARHERLESS! AAAAAAANYBODY GOT SOMETHING ****TY TO SAY ABOUT HIM DUCKING A FIGHT OR BEING SCARED, COME FIND ME AND I'LL HEAR YOU OUT EYE TO EYE!!! IF U GOT THE SAND! #UFCSummit"

Pat "HD" throwing out powerful stuff to any Lesnar hater. Huge fan of Pat and I think he's spot on here.

Mellor

Agreed,like Lesnar or not, but anybody throwing any abuse his way is a disgrace

Denners.ie

Was having a glance through other forums earlier in relation to this and some of the abuse was just ridiculous, really are fortunate that there are people here who don't like fighters but can rationalise when to show support and compassion.

I hope Brock gets better but I would be quite scepticle whether he will fight again. It is a very serious injury anyway, I'm not sure would somebody risk a third relapse of something which could potentially have a devastating effect his family.

BloodyElbow.com

Roy Nelson predicted this a while back. His belly is like a magic 8-Ball.
http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2011/5/12/2168159/brock-lesnar-diverticulitis-roy-nelson-junior-dos-santos

BloodyElbow.com wrote:

If you need some tips on your future, apparently the best person to talk to is nicknamed "Big Country." Way back on January 21st, UFC heavyweight Roy Nelson was asked about Brock Lesnar and Junior dos Santos facing off in June. Here's what Nostradamus had to say:

"I think Brock Lesnar is done," Nelson said. "I think Brock doing TUF is one way to basically take a situation and make it win-win for him. I think Lesnar doing the show is a way to introduce Junior Dos Santos to the American fan base in the way the show does. TUF introduces "stars in the making" to the casual UFC fan and while JDS is the number one contender he still needs some help with the American fan base. So the conspiracy basically comes down to the fact that Shane Carwin has no one to fight in June. I think Brock Lesnar will walk off the TUF set and then Carwin will take his spot or Frank Mir will come in to "save the day" and fight JDS for title contention. The reason I believe Frank would be the guy is because Mir is coming off a win and I was already supposed to fight Shane so fans were already hyped to see it. Or Carwin could move in to face JDS and I could still face Frank but it doesn't really matter to me as to who fights who because all that really matters is the fans want to see me fight somebody. A lot of things could happen over the next six weeks but it seems a bit off that Carwin doesn't have an opponent right now and all of the top heavyweights are spoken for."

Not a lot of people took Roy seriously back then. I mean, at the best of times, Roy is a prankster and a pretty jovial guy. What he was talking about was pretty far-fetched...or so we thought. Obviously Roy didn't get the details right, but his basic point was "Brock bows out, Carwin or Mir step in to fight Junior dos Santos in June". Clearly if he had known that HE would be fighting Frank Mir, he would have refined his theory down to Carwin. And the UFC giving Carwin a debuting fighter left this possibility wide open.

Not the biggest revelation in the world, but a pretty good call nonetheless

Ush1

As a fellow sufferer of bowel disease and someone who has always been active, I feel for the guy big time.

Used to dislike him but after the Carwin fight I had alot of respect. Hope he gets better and fights again.

RoryMac

Disappointing but hopefully Lesnar can come back strong again, some good fights at heavyweight to be made if him and others can stay fit

Bodhidharma

Thats a pity, I was looking forward to this fight. I dont think he'll be back either, I think he likes the competitive element but my impression is that its a distant second to his family in terms of priority.

Carwin is gonna get a beating.

leeds87

how do you make out that carwin is going to get a beating. If carwin has improved his cardio he could do real damage to any heavyweight. the fact that he only has 30 days or so to prepare wont help however.

DeVore

I think Lesnar will bow out quietly and seal the deal by returning to WWE next year for that big whatever-they-call-them when The Rock or someone is supposed to come out of retirement.

Carwin needs a gas tank and tbh he should have been able to finish Lesnar with strikes. But he certainly can punch. Still, I think JDS is going to take it and then the Velaquez machine simply eats whoever wins as a tasty snack.

I've been saying since Cain vs Nog, Cain is an animal. Almost flawless standup imho.

DeV.

Bodhidharma

leeds87 wrote: »

how do you make out that carwin is going to get a beating. If carwin has improved his cardio he could do real damage to any heavyweight. the fact that he only has 30 days or so to prepare wont help however.

I think JDS is a far superior athlete and is strong in all areas of the game. Carwin didn't impress me against Lesnar, he gassed really bad, and at his age you dont suddenly improve your cardio a great deal over a short period. Obviously one punch perfectly timed will take down any man, but I just dont see it.

ScareGilly

leeds87 wrote: »

how do you make out that carwin is going to get a beating. If carwin has improved his cardio he could do real damage to any heavyweight. the fact that he only has 30 days or so to prepare wont help however.

Carwin is old school Chuck, except without the cardio, kicks, or footwork. All he has is his wrestling and a heavy hand.. What happened when Chuck started facing elite strikers? He went 1-4... Apart from Wandy the only fight I can remember him facing an elite striker that he beat was Belfort, and that wasn't really an exciting fight..

People say Carwin has good stand up.. Sure, he knocks guys out, but this doesn't mean he has good stand up. He's facing probably the best boxer in the HW division. JDS' footwork, head movement, better technical skills, hand speed and his cardio is how I make out Carwin will get a beating.. Why do you think he won't get a beating? Just as a matter of interest..

He's been out almost a year so I expect his cardio to up big time, but with that much muscle, doesn't your body need to take in more oxygen, which makes you gas out quicker, not sure about that one though.. But half of that time he was out with a back problem so he couldn't have done much cardio then.


But then again, it's MMA, and all it takes is one punch.. :rolleyes:

leeds87

i didnt say i expect carwin to win, all im saying is i wouldn't be putting my house on it that jds will win. Yeah i agree the age is a factor but as i said if his cardio has improved you just never know, i wouldn't bet against him anyway.

MMAIRELANDFAN

Im devastated Brock is out
This was his chance to prove he's the no 1 in the world
He will be back to beat all the wannabe Champs.

Mellor

MMAIRELANDFAN wrote: »

Im devastated Brock is out
This was his chance to prove he's the no 1 in the world
He will be back to beat all the wannabe Champs.

Yup, made that specifically for you

ufcdaily

dos santos will walk through carwin !!!

The Bored One

MMAIRELANDFAN wrote: »

Im devastated Brock is out
This was his chance to prove he's the no 1 in the world
He will be back to beat all the wannabe Champs.

How does fighting the contender to the championship make him the number 1? Surely he would have to beat say...the current champion? You know the one who beat him rather convincingly in their last fight?
Brock is a good fighter, with a lot of potential but he still has too many gaps in his game to be considered the best in the world. He seems like he is very willing to work on those gaps and improve his abilities, so with time and dedication he could be the best. If he'd been given more time to build up rather than getting thrust in the deep end of the pool, we'd probably see a much better rounded and dangerous Lesnar. But till he's given time to develop his fights will be a mix between him overwhelming people, and people discovering a gap in his training that they exploit thoroughly.

calex71

Brock and JDS were hardly selling the fight in TUF anyway, that said I would have my preferred that to JDS vs Carwin

There are a few I'd rather see fight JDS, Frank Mir for example but he's got a fight with Nelson at 130.

JJayoo

I think Nelson is the bjj of Mir, or at least he was? Could make for a very interesting match

Ush1

DeVore wrote: »

I've been saying since Cain vs Nog, Cain is an animal. Almost flawless standup imho.

DeV.

In fairness, Kongo did drop him.

Might be in the minority here but I think JDS will beat both Carwin and Cain.

DeVore

To be fairer... when you have to go back to UFC 99 to remember a time when he was "dropped" by someone who was comprehensively hammered by him in the same fight... well, you kinda prove my point

DeV.

Ush1

DeVore wrote: »

To be fairer... when you have to go back to UFC 99 to remember a time when he was "dropped" by someone who was comprehensively hammered by him in the same fight... well, you kinda prove my point

DeV.

:pac:

I see your point about him being a winning machine, but I'm just not sure about almost flawless standup when he got dropped by a quite average fighter. Kongo is the last decent striker he has fought hence why I have to go back to UFC 99.

Just watched it again, he actually drops Cain twice.

onlyasuggestion

And Kongo looked like he could have finished him if he wasn't intent on trying to take him down for whatever reason. His stand up has looked much improved since though, he'll be a hard man to beat.

El Guapo!

Just because someone gets dropped doesn't mean they have flawed stand-up.
Anybody can get dropped at any time. It happens. Nobody's invincible. I think JDS will win comfortably. I'll predict TKO 2nd round.

Ush1

Dean09 wrote: »

Just because someone gets dropped doesn't mean they have flawed stand-up.
Anybody can get dropped at any time. It happens. Nobody's invincible. I think JDS will win comfortably. I'll predict TKO 2nd round.

Cain has great stand up but against Kongo he stood in the pocket and didn't block the punches coming at him and could have lost the fight.

I just happen to think JDS will beat both Carwin and Cain.

Xlami

I don't think Cain would have an issue with JDS at all. At the same time the fight I want to see the most in MMA at the minute is JDS Vs Overeem and if he wins then it becomes probable.

Also MMAIreland you really havn't a clue. I suppose you probably have Chris Turshucker ranked No. 2 then?

Remmy

Xlami wrote: »

I don't think Cain would have an issue with JDS at all. At the same time the fight I want to see the most in MMA at the minute is JDS Vs Overeem and if he wins then it becomes probable.

Also MMAIreland you really havn't a clue. I suppose you probably have Chris Turshucker ranked No. 2 then?

I didn't think of that matchup but JDS v Overeem would be very interesting alright.Both fighters with legit standup not just heavy hands.

I dont have a clue about the politics, what is stopping overeem fight in the UFC?

Mellor

Ush1 wrote: »

:pac:

I see your point about him being a winning machine, but I'm just not sure about almost flawless standup when he got dropped by a quite average fighter. Kongo is the last decent striker he has fought hence why I have to go back to UFC 99.

Just watched it again, he actually drops Cain twice.

But you are ignoring the fact that at that point Cain had only 5 fights.
He how has 9 fights, the last 4 would of been far better standard than his first 5. He has no doubt also been recieving better coaching over the last 2 years then those first few. He has no doubt improved.

JDS beats carwin and then loses to Cain, JDS will put up a better fight than Lesnar did imo

Fromvert

He's always trained at AKA, his training hasn't improved.

He has improved as a fighter but Kongo was the best striker he has faced and showed he can be caught. We don't know how much his striking has improved though as he hasn't fought another striker.

Mellor

Fromvert wrote: »

He's always trained at AKA, his training hasn't improved.

He has improved as a fighter but Kongo was the best striker he has faced and showed he can be caught. We don't know how much his striking has improved though as he hasn't fought another striker.

how do you know his training hasn't improved? I am aware he is still with AKA but;
Do you not think that he is spending more money on training. Specific coaching, Various testing etc. i would say at the very least he got more coaching attention coming up to the Lesnar fight than he did coming up to Jesse Fujarczyk or Brad Morris

Fromvert

I could ask you, how do you know it's improved?

We can't prove either way but AKA have been bigging Cain up since he started training there, so I'd guess they have been giving him the best training they can since the start.

jimpump

Remmy wrote: »

I didn't think of that matchup but JDS v Overeem would be very interesting alright.Both fighters with legit standup not just heavy hands.

I dont have a clue about the politics, what is stopping overeem fight in the UFC?

so overeem doesnt have heavy hands??? watch some K-1 / ITS SHOWTIME events

allistair would kill any MMA HW in stand up....hes the K1 GP champ FFS!!

jimpump

sorry man, i read yer reply wrong bout overeem and jds

after reading again i get what ya mean

btw, JDS and overeem cant fight cos they are in different promotions at the moment....give it a year tho and we should see overeem in the octagon

Mellor

Fromvert wrote: »

I could ask you, how do you know it's improved?

We can't prove either way but AKA have been bigging Cain up since he started training there, so I'd guess they have been giving him the best training they can since the start.

I wasn't saying AKA suddnely started trying harder with him, I said Specific coaching, Various testing etc. I was talking about external stuff.

I remeber a while ago see Cain doing a lactic threshold test, which scored very high in btw, that what I refer to. At top level this kind of awareness allows you to maximise training, esp in terms of cardio and training for 5 rounds.

jimpump wrote: »

sorry man, i read yer reply wrong bout overeem and jds

after reading again i get what ya mean

btw, JDS and overeem cant fight cos they are in different promotions at the moment....give it a year tho and we should see overeem in the octagon

Where is it in the rules that people in different promos can't fight?
It would of happened last year due to neither wishing to co-promote, but that's no longer an issue

Ush1

Fromvert wrote: »

He's always trained at AKA, his training hasn't improved.

He has improved as a fighter but Kongo was the best striker he has faced and showed he can be caught. We don't know how much his striking has improved though as he hasn't fought another striker.

Exactly what I was going to say.

How do you know his stand up has improved since he hasn't fought a decent striker since Kongo?

DeVore

I guess because he's world champion which brings with it a fair chunk of money and one could reasonably expect that he has spent at least some of that money on coaching/training. I don't think he is invincible and JDS will probably be his greatest test, but I think he's a good bet to win it, presuming JDS beats Carwin. I'd hate to see what Cain would do to Carwin.

DeV.

Ush1

DeVore wrote: »

I guess because he's world champion which brings with it a fair chunk of money and one could reasonably expect that he has spent at least some of that money on coaching/training. I don't think he is invincible and JDS will probably be his greatest test, but I think he's a good bet to win it, presuming JDS beats Carwin. I'd hate to see what Cain would do to Carwin.

DeV.

I don't doubt he has spent money on it, but hey, I'm sure Brock did aswell.

I think JDS is a superior boxer to Kongo. I reckon Cain might out wrestle Junior but I would like to see a standup war.

DeVore

Ok but stand-up isnt all about boxing you know... there are kicks too and I would do just about anything not to get kicked by Cain :)

I dont doubt JDS vs Cain will be a war. I think JDS is by far the #1 contender. i'll most likely be buying the PPV if its not on at stupid-o-clock!

DeV.

Gunsfortoys

I don't get why they couldn't have just done a big buildup of JDS vs Cain over the coming months. I mean Cain was expected to be ready as early as 136 so that would have given both lads time to prepare for the big match and UFC time to promote the hell out of it.

Still looking forward to it though and I reckon people may underestimate Carwin in this one.

cowzerp

jimpump wrote: »

allistair would kill any MMA HW in stand up....hes the K1 GP champ FFS!!

Overeem won the k1 title but in fairness luck of the draw and battered opponents made it much easier for him, I'd pick both Cain and Junior to both beat him in the stand up and Overeem is susceptible to punches and has been Ko'd 4-5 times in MMA alone.

He's also been Ko'd 3 times in K1 too so he's vulnerable

flahavaj

Mellor wrote: »

how do you know his training hasn't improved? I am aware he is still with AKA but;
Do you not think that he is spending more money on training. Specific coaching, Various testing etc. i would say at the very least he got more coaching attention coming up to the Lesnar fight than he did coming up to Jesse Fujarczyk or Brad Morris

You're speculating really. All we can go by is what we've seen. The last striker he fought dropped him. The jury is out until he proves himself in the octagon.

cowzerp

flahavaj wrote: »

You're speculating really. All we can go by is what we've seen. The last striker he fought dropped him. The jury is out until he proves himself in the octagon.

It does make sense in fairness, it can be very easy to look good striking against a non striker if it stays standing and not be a good judge of striking skills, just like a average grappler can look great versus a striker in the grappling.

When against a striker then you get to see how good a striker both are..

Mellor

Obvious i'm speculating, do you think i'm wrong that he hasn't had better specialised training.
I think he should have improved, i never said he is now world class, or now unbeatable, i said "improved".

You think he hasn't improved in the last 2/3 years

calex71

calex71 wrote: »

Brock and JDS were hardly selling the fight in TUF anyway, that said I would have my preferred that to JDS vs Carwin

There are a few I'd rather see fight JDS, Frank Mir for example but he's got a fight with Nelson at 130.

Jesus thats some weight cut for the both of them


I joke I joke