**Spoilers** Series 6, Episode 4 - "The Doctor's Wife"

Doctor DooM

Alot of thoughts. Bear with me.

At first I thought Gaiman had let me down, stereotypically gothy designs and a lazy story idea (Timelords? Alive? ZOMMMG!) especially after me trying to convince pixelburp it wouldn't be like that.

But it really worked very well when it got cracking, I liked the rift energy line harkening back to 9 having to recharge in Cardiff. Sexy was a really likable character, although indeed she came across as a direct mix of the female endless' Death (endearing all knowing sexy goth chick) and delirium (what it says on the tin).

It was really dark- finally, perhaps, too dark for a kids show- but really good for me, I enjoyed the idea of an intelligent entity playing with them (I recall a very similar sci fi short story from the 60s, must try and find it).

The idea of a human Tardis companion is indeed from the who books, I believe she was a companion of 8.

http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/Compassion

Like all things Who though- if it's not in the series it's not canon, and even then, shaky

I like that Gaiman played a little and added to the ethos. That's some old stuff he was working with there, was a joy to see.

I also smiled to myself when I realised Sexy's dress was patterned with roundels

BlitzKrieg wrote: »

I'm more of a pratchett fan then Gaiman but I've never been against Gaiman, in fact I find his writing style and humour quite similar to Gaiman's so I found House very reminiscent of Death from the discworld books.

I have to say I don't understand this. Pratchett's Death is as far from house as you can get- Ultimately, Death is hugely angered by cruelty (especially to cats) and the rare time he will be roused to right a wrong and find a way around THE RULES will be in response to entities like house. The only thing they shared were the ability to SPEAK LIKE THIS really.


I also thought the writing was really, really good- some hugely funny and touching lines in there.

It's amazing how bad I felt for the Doctor with the forgiveness line, and I felt for him and the Tardis when they said hello.

Bunk beds- awesome. Knowing why he can snap his fingers now- awesome. "Timelords- good ones!"- awesome.

I think thats all I can remember right now.

mach1982

Coldzone wrote: »

Hmm I just watched the episode again and anyone else think the TARDIS energy is very similar to the Doctor regenerating energy and maybe the girl from ep2 is regenerating using TARDIS time energy.

Interesting thought , but the doctor said that a human body can not hold the tardis soul , but what about a Time Lords, or a Human/Time Lord hybrid. if the Silence been around for ever they have chance to steal a Time Lord DNA, and mix with a humans. Also their ships are pseudo-tardis like .

Killer_banana

Just remembered, we now have confirmation that Timelords can regenerate as male or female regardless of their original gender; 'he didn't feel like himself without a tattoo, or a few times herself.' I'm not sure what it says about me thing I thought was 'What does this mean for Timelord sexuality?'

Manach

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Alot of thoughts. Bear with me.

It was really dark- finally, perhaps, too dark for a kids show- but really good for me, I enjoyed the idea of an intelligent entity playing with them (I recall a very similar sci fi short story from the 60s, must try and find it).

[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Have_No_Mouth,_and_I_Must_ScreamI_Have_No_Mouth,_and_I_Must_Scream[/URL]
Story in question?

old hippy

Gaiman and a look beyond the main control room. That's the inner nerd in me satisfied

Doctor DooM

Manach wrote: »

[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Have_No_Mouth,_and_I_Must_ScreamI_Have_No_Mouth,_and_I_Must_Scream[/URL]
Story in question?

The exact one, thank you.

ríomhaire

Killer_banana wrote: »

Just remembered, we now have confirmation that Timelords can regenerate as male or female regardless of their original gender; 'he didn't feel like himself without a tattoo, or a few times herself.' I'm not sure what it says about me thing I thought was 'What does this mean for Timelord sexuality?'

Well the Doctor is sexually attracted to a blue box.

Links234

Killer_banana wrote: »

Just remembered, we now have confirmation that Timelords can regenerate as male or female regardless of their original gender; 'he didn't feel like himself without a tattoo, or a few times herself.' I'm not sure what it says about me thing I thought was 'What does this mean for Timelord sexuality?'

That was a great little moment. I actually came out to a very good friend of mine by telling him that I was going to regenerate, and explained it to him like "you know the way the doctor regenerates, he changes and he looks different, but he's still the same person, he's still the doctor?"

pixelburp

ríomhaire wrote: »

Well the Doctor is sexually attracted to a blue box.

Amy: "She's the TARDIS?"
Doctor: "And she's a woman"
Amy: "Did you wish really hard?"
Doctor: "Shut up."
Idris: "Hello I'm .... sexy"
Doctor: "Still shut up."

old hippy

I'm still intigued by this Timelord character; The Corsair. Great name.

ScrubsfanChris

The title of this episode reminded me of the Doctor's clone daughter, what ever happened with that plot/story arc?

old hippy

ScrubsfanChris wrote: »

The title of this episode reminded me of the Doctor's clone daughter, what ever happened with that plot/story arc?

Good point but I really hope they don't bring her back... hmm, isn't there a clone Doctor knocking about with Rose in a parallel universe as well?

And the evil Doctor; The Valleyard - was that him last season or just a distillation of the Doc's evil?

Questions, so many questions.

Bajingo

Was this console in the corner of the screen at one stage..within the console room of the last doctor?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BRqYmn0JwQ&feature=related

Or one similar to it?

Killer_banana

ScrubsfanChris wrote: »

The title of this episode reminded me of the Doctor's clone daughter, what ever happened with that plot/story arc?

The only reason she lived was 'cause Moffat requested she be kept alive so we will probably see her again. However he's already brought back River Song and the silence arc isn't completely resolved yet either and there's a possible mini-Timelord running around out there. As well as all that he said that he doesn't like to bring back old characters without good reason so I'd say if she comes back it won't be for a good while yet.

BlitzKrieg

I have to say I don't understand this. Pratchett's Death is as far from house as you can get- Ultimately, Death is hugely angered by cruelty (especially to cats) and the rare time he will be roused to right a wrong and find a way around THE RULES will be in response to entities like house. The only thing they shared were the ability to SPEAK LIKE THIS really.

It was the scene when he was in the tardis and asked Rory why he shouldnt kill them, it was the very matter of fact approach to the issue that I found the humour very reminiscent of death (not the character, I specified it was gaiman's similarity in humour to pratchett) The sequence with Rory trying to explain why they should live I found went to same logic path in humour as death's attempts to forget in Sould Music, there's this approach to issues (that yes is coupled with the voice) that is straight as an arrow and functional.

K-9

After watching it again tonight, I thought that was an excellent episode, found it quite dark and adulty at times. Rory being the stronger character was an interesting change, though I think him and Amy sometimes aren't able for the more serious scenes.

Idris was very good, completely understand the Helen Bonham Carter and Burton comparisons, hard to believe she is a "soap" actress.

It's a shame Sheen was only used as a voice but still, he was still good!

Overall, a very good episode, I'd say top 5 of Smith's episodes.

popebenny16

Killer_banana wrote: »

The only reason she lived was 'cause Moffat requested she be kept alive so we will probably see her again.

for all you know Jenny has since died/regenerated as a kid and that was her we saw in Day of the Moon (or a joke by moffat about how we all slagged off matt smaith for being so young and not a girl etc etc and now you got one)

as for The Doctors Wife - I have never read (AFAIK he used to write for 2000AD so I must have read something if his back then) anything by Gaiman so i did not know what to expect. What I experianced, though, was a very well written, thought out, articulated and enjoyable story.

It changed the whole gameplan of the relationship between the Doctor and the TARDIS (as in she chose him, the mad doctor) it gave a great answer to how the doctor and gang always end up in trouble (i bring you where you are needed) and had a good few jokes (what does it say on the door - pull to open!) and the best thing about them was that they were all those things you hear and say "why didnt I ever think of that!?", because they seem so obvious in retrospect that you think yes, that must have been how it happened.

The fact that this one story had so much in it in so little time just shows what happens when you get a fan (he has watched it since it started) with real talent and quality to write a story.

The dialogue was witty ("I'm scared" "I would say so") and intelligent, the dark parts were amazing but not too scary for kids (11,10 and 6 year old took it in their strides) as i think things like that just dont get through the reality filter of kids, but big scary monsters do.

There are lots of great little things and moments going on, (including the 70's TARDIS console) and hopefully NG will come back again, we need the likes of him to keep SM on his game.

Also, kudos to SM, not just for having NG write for him, but to place this episode right after a weak one. He did this last year too and it does work. It was never certain where this story was going to be placed (it was actually due last year but the budget wouldnt stand up for it, and it was also substantially changed along the way) in this years line up, but it works in so many ways it helps greatly to position it wisely.

I have a horrible feeling that the next two parter is going to be not great

Killer_banana

popebenny16 wrote: »

for all you know Jenny has since died/regenerated as a kid and that was her we saw in Day of the Moon (or a joke by moffat about how we all slagged off matt smaith for being so young and not a girl etc etc and now you got one)

I meant the character of Jenny, not Georgia Moffet specifically. Your right we could have seen her already but somehow I don't think we have myself.

jasonb

Just watched this one for the second time, and I thought it was very good. Probably Matt Smith's best episode.

At first I was worried. Things being bandied around like 'there are more Time Lords out there' and 'We're leaving the universe, where we've never gone before' just had me worried that it was all gonna be hyperbole and nothing else.

But it all came together excellently I must say. All the actors were very good, even the smaller actors like Uncle captured their part brilliantly. The chemistry between the Doctor and Idris was just perfect, and as someone else said here, it shows how much story can be fit into the time slot when it's excellent writing. It was great just getting a little more info from a different angle on events that are part of the lore now ( like the Doctor stealing the Tardis ).

As I said, I think it's Matt Smith's best performance to date. He was given a lot to work with ( the hope of getting friends back, wanting to be forgiven, meeting his true companion, losing her again etc ) and he very much delivered. I thought he brought the anger ( 'Fear me, I've killed them all' and 'Go get him Girl' ) very well, along with the pain & lonliness The highlight, really, was when the Tardis moved the control on 'her' own at the end, and his face lit up.

Roray & Amy are still a bit meh to me, and I'm getting tired of one of them dying every episode. At times, when they were running through the corridors, I just wanted to leave them to it and go back to the excellent interplay between the Doctor and Idris.

The only mis-step I thought was the Doctor's 'Another Ood I failed to save' which just seemed far too flippant for me.

Anyhow, excellent episode, here's hoping Gaiman writes more. And, for the record, I always thought the 'Pull to Open' instruction on the Tardis was for the little panel that the phone's behind, not the main door!

J.

pixelburp

popebenny16 wrote: »

I have a horrible feeling that the next two parter is going to be not great

Ah to be fair, the writer did write Life on Mars; let's try and forget his only previous contribution to Dr. Who was "Fear Her", and give him a chance

Basq

pixelburp wrote: »

Ah to be fair, the writer did write Life on Mars..

Did spot Marshall Lancaster (Chris Skelton) in the promo too.

flazio

My word that was a STUNNING episode. I loved every second of it. I'll admit that I wan't overly familiar with Gaiman's work, seen Coraline and Stardust but none of the literature. But putting that aside, this episode left me with the satisfied feeling I used to get when we had a Moffat story within the RTD era. I thought everything about the episode was pitched just perfectly. Suranne Jones was superbly dotty and worked great opposite Smith who really went through every emotion going and did it fantastically. Far and away my favourite episode since I started watching Doctor Who in 2007.
And if you haven't, I strongly recommend you find a way to watch the accompanying Confidential 'Bigger On The Inside', the script readings from Gaiman and the classic clips overlayed all across the TARDIS are every fans daydream brought to life.
Seriously one of the best Saturday nights viewings of my life.
We need a novelisation of this story by Gaiman for Christmas.

ríomhaire

pixelburp wrote: »

Ah to be fair, the writer did write Life on Mars; let's try and forget his only previous contribution to Dr. Who was "Fear Her", and give him a chance

Oh god I didn't need to know that. I was looking forward to it until now :P

Actually I'm still looking forward to it. I like the scary ones.

flazio

flazio wrote: »

We need a novelisation of this story by Gaiman for Christmas.

Did you see the Confidential? By all accounts, the script was a novelisation!!!

The Mad Hatter

Here's the drawing of the TARDIS console, done by an 11-year-old girl. Gotta say, they recreated it fairly accurately

I love the telephone wires...

"One for tea + one for milk so the doctor can have a brew"

Ridley

Gaiman Q&A

popebenny16

The Mad Hatter wrote: »

Here's the drawing of the TARDIS console, done by an 11-year-old girl. Gotta say, they recreated it fairly accurately

I am all mixed up, because I thought that the design a tardis winning entry was the console we saw in The Lodger last year. Since this story was meant to run last year, I guess I got that wrong.

Great design though!!

DirtyBollox

again this doctor just flippantly kills some species off. first the silence and now house. i think its good and lends to the dark episodes i hope to see.

on another note, and i'm not too sure if anyone else noticed but yer wan with the eye patch and small hatch wasn't in this episode. could it be because they were outside the universe? its killing me having to wait for the answer to that and the whole river in the forest quote.

all in all great episode.

oooh 1 last thing. the other timelords symbol was a snake. what would the doctor's be?

flazio

michaelpower wrote: »

oooh 1 last thing. the other timelords symbol was a snake. what would the doctor's be?

There was a serpent on the arm of the Third Doctor.

pixelburp

michaelpower wrote: »

oooh 1 last thing. the other timelords symbol was a snake. what would the doctor's be?

A fez, of course

Morag

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLF-6TkZL2Y

blastman

aligator_am wrote: »

I haven't read any of the Sandman comics but have heard great things about them, I'd heartily recommend American Gods, and they're making it in to a mini series soon which I'm delighted about

Actually just bought this yesterday with a leftover Waterstone's voucher from Christmas, so thanks for the reassurance that I've spent wisely.

Loved the Who episode too, great idea well realised, and some fantastic performances to boot.

Sleepy

Doctor DooM wrote: »

Knowing why he can snap his fingers now- awesome.

Because the Tardis chose him? because it's sentient and deterministic? Or did I miss a line?

Doctor DooM

Sleepy wrote: »

Because the Tardis chose him? because it's sentient and deterministic? Or did I miss a line?

No, just because it's sentient and it wants to... it's also able to move it's own levers and stuff It does it at the end.

VicNoir

I really enjoyed this episode. I've read a lot of Gaiman's work before and he is a high quality writer, and that showed in The Doctor's Wife. I've watched it twice so far and it seems destined, like The Eleventh Hour, to be one of those episodes that I'll rewatch over and over again. Most of what I loved in this episode has already been talked about, but one of my favourite things was just how he really did pack in love of almost 50 years of Doctor Who, while still managing to add to it, like the TARDIS noting that the Doctor has been pushing past a Pull to Open notice since his first incarnation. I also love the idea that the TARDIS loves when The Doctor calls her 'old girl'. This is such a great bit of retroactive brilliance. I was listening to an Sixth Doctor audio drama yesterday, in which The Doctor called the TARDIS 'old girl' and I couldn't help but smile. That one line has, for me at least, made every time The Doctor has called the TARDIS 'old girl' into a kind of sweet moment. Considering that he's been calling her that (to my recollection) at least as far back as Tom Baker, it really does add just a little extra spark of sweetness every time he does so. An affectionate pet name that we now know the TARDIS has always liked.

The Mad Hatter

Gaiman has posted about the episode on his blog. Link includes three videos where he discusses scenes that didn't make it into the final episode.

cwrenn

six pages of comments, and not one mention of Samuel Beckett?!:-)(long time lurker,first time poster!)

Cookie33

I thought the Doctor was supposed to be compassionate? The ending for House was a little, woah.. (but deserved after all he messed with Sexy):D

The Mad Hatter

Cookie33 wrote: »

I thought the Doctor was supposed to be compassionate? The ending for House was a little, woah.. (but deserved after all he messed with Sexy):D

Mm, this incarnation of the doctor has been showing a rather nasty killer side, what with the genocide of the Silence a couple of weeks ago too.

old hippy

The Mad Hatter wrote: »

Mm, this incarnation of the doctor has been showing a rather nasty killer side, what with the genocide of the Silence a couple of weeks ago too.

They haven't gone away, you know

Yahew

The genocide of the Silence is assumed. We have no idea. They can always feck off and not appear in front of humans, or do so less often and learn to run. It was more a get off the planet thing, or a hide in the shadows thing. And, any human who wanted to kill a silence automatically on seeing them would have to have a gun, otherwise it would just disappear around the corner and you'd forget. Also they can fight back, with the electrical blow people up malarky. Frankly I still see em as having the upper hand outside Texas.

Ridley

More Gaiman Q&A

Coldzone

Hmm i've just been watching some of the eps and Amy and Rory talk about the Doctor dying like in the 1st few mins of the Doctors Wife.
So im thinking the eye patch woman and the rest of her army take the baby river cause they think its her who kills him
Just like we are all doing on here lol