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Gerry Adams to run for President ?

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    #422
    Manassas61
    Registered Users Posts: 313 ✭✭Manassas61


    Would you mind not describing the failed state as Ulster? Ulster is a province of Ireland.
    The political disagreements are in Ulster and not the Island as a whole. Hope you understand.


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    #423
    SoulandForm
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,096 ✭✭✭SoulandForm


    Manassas61 wrote: »
    Perception is everything. The police force would be the Garda and that might not go down so well in certain areas and could feel like an occupation.

    The elements within the "PUL" community you are talking about already feel this way about the PSNI (or the PSNIRA as they sometimes call them). Until these people are willing to accept basic rules of reason and justice there is little that outsiders can do in terms of engaging them.



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    #424
    Karl Stein
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,689 ✭✭✭Karl Stein


    Manassas61 wrote: »
    The political disagreements are in Ulster and not the Island as a whole. Hope you understand.

    What the hell are you talking about? The administrative boundary takes in 6 counties not 9.


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    #425
    SoulandForm
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,096 ✭✭✭SoulandForm


    Charlie Rock wrote: »
    What the hell are you talking about? The administrative boundary takes in 6 counties not 9.

    Twice the old Stormount regime wanted to remain the statelet Ulster and were told no by Westminster- Ulster sounds a hell of a lot cooler than Northern Ireland to be honest.

    If you talk to some Loyalists about Ulster having nine counties they will tell you that Ulster's border has changed over the centuries and that she lost three counties in the 1920s.

    Than there is the myth that Ulster Scots are the lost tribes of Israel and that Irish Gaels are "seed of Canaan" (actually the name of a sermon by George Seawright) as well as the one about the Ulster Scots being the original owners of Ulster who were pushed out by Gaelic Imperialists- and that Cuchulain was a forerunner of the UVF.

    This is the sort of thing that happens when you do your best not to communicate with others.


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    #426
    Karl Stein
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,689 ✭✭✭Karl Stein


    SoulandForm wrote: »
    If you talk to some Loyalists about Ulster having nine counties they will tell you that Ulster's border has changed over the centuries and that she lost three counties in the 1920s.

    Than there is the myth that Ulster Scots are the lost tribes of Israel and that Irish Gaels are "seed of Canaan" (actually the name of a sermon by George Seawright) as well as the one about the Ulster Scots being the original owners of Ulster who were pushed out by Gaelic Imperialists- and that Cuchulain was a forerunner of the UVF.

    This is the sort of thing that happens when you do your best not to communicate with others.

    Bizarre and a little creepy.


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    #427
    Manassas61
    Registered Users Posts: 313 ✭✭Manassas61


    Charlie Rock wrote: »
    What the hell are you talking about? The administrative boundary takes in 6 counties not 9.
    People have different names for it. Doesn't get in the way of the factual point.


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    #428
    SoulandForm
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,096 ✭✭✭SoulandForm


    Manassas61 wrote: »
    People have different names for it. Doesn't get in the way of the factual point.

    Are you a fan of Ian Adamson?


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    #429
    Manassas61
    Registered Users Posts: 313 ✭✭Manassas61


    SoulandForm wrote: »
    Are you a fan of Ian Adamson?
    Who?


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    #430
    junder
    Registered Users Posts: 2,706 ✭✭✭junder


    SoulandForm wrote: »
    Twice the old Stormount regime wanted to remain the statelet Ulster and were told no by Westminster- Ulster sounds a hell of a lot cooler than Northern Ireland to be honest.

    If you talk to some Loyalists about Ulster having nine counties they will tell you that Ulster's border has changed over the centuries and that she lost three counties in the 1920s.

    Than there is the myth that Ulster Scots are the lost tribes of Israel and that Irish Gaels are "seed of Canaan" (actually the name of a sermon by George Seawright) as well as the one about the Ulster Scots being the original owners of Ulster who were pushed out by Gaelic Imperialists- and that Cuchulain was a forerunner of the UVF.

    This is the sort of thing that happens when you do your best not to communicate with others.

    Yer, that's what we in loyalism call bollocks


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    #431
    junder
    Registered Users Posts: 2,706 ✭✭✭junder


    Charlie Rock wrote: »
    Would you mind not describing the failed state as Ulster? Ulster is a province of Ireland.



    Which is why trying to persuade them is a total waste of time and energy. Pro UI parties should just play for the 50%+ that's all that's needed really.

    Semantics, the republicans fall back option when thier arguments fail


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    #432
    Painted Pony
    Registered Users Posts: 209 ✭✭Painted Pony


    SoulandForm wrote: »
    Twice the old Stormount regime wanted to remain the statelet Ulster and were told no by Westminster- Ulster sounds a hell of a lot cooler than Northern Ireland to be honest.
    In fairness we are no great position to lecture unionists for taking liberties by using the term “Ulster” for their patch when it is actually 3 counties short of the full geographical province.

    After all we call out Southern state “Ireland” even though it’s 6 counties short of the full geographical island.

    In any case, it’s hardly the greatest wrong committed in out ancient quarrel wouldn’t you say?


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    #433
    Karl Stein
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,689 ✭✭✭Karl Stein


    Manassas61 wrote: »
    Doesn't get in the way of the factual point.

    What factual point? Ulster is an Irish province - the 6 counties NI whatever you want to call it is not Ulster, that's a fact.
    junder wrote: »
    Semantics, he republicans fall back option when thier arguments fail

    What? Would you mind addressing what specific point is 'semantics'


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    #434
    Manassas61
    Registered Users Posts: 313 ✭✭Manassas61


    What factual point? Ulster is an Irish province. the 6 counties NI whatever you want to call it is not Ulster, that's a fact.
    I can call it what I want. I call it Ulster. Others don't. Get over it and stop complaining about a name. Most of the disputes come from Ulster and not the rest of the Island. That is the fact.


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    #435
    Karl Stein
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,689 ✭✭✭Karl Stein


    Manassas61 wrote: »
    I can call it what I want. I call it Ulster. Others don't. Get over it and stop complaining about a name. Most of the disputes come from Ulster and not the rest of the Island. That is the fact.

    I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised that you've created your own little alternate reality. Does it rain lemonade there too?


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    #436
    Manassas61
    Registered Users Posts: 313 ✭✭Manassas61


    Charlie Rock wrote: »
    I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised that you've created your own little alternate reality. Does it rain lemonade there too?
    I don't see the big problem you have with naming it Ulster which is what the province is called. That is what I call it when I travel up and down the green pleasant fields of Ulster.

    I always thought it was acceptable to call it that.


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    #437
    SoulandForm
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,096 ✭✭✭SoulandForm


    Painted Pony wrote: »
    In fairness we are no great position to lecture unionists for taking liberties by using the term “Ulster” for their patch when it is actually 3 counties short of the full geographical province.

    After all we call out Southern state “Ireland” even though it’s 6 counties short of the full geographical island.

    In any case, it’s hardly the greatest wrong committed in out ancient quarrel wouldn’t you say?

    Fair point- it annoys me when people insist on calling the 26 counties Ireland. Its not. Its a part of Ireland.


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    #438
    SoulandForm
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,096 ✭✭✭SoulandForm


    Manassas61 wrote: »
    Who?

    Crank "historian", expert linguist and mayor of Belfast at one point.


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    #439
    Lacerda
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19 ✭Lacerda


    I used to have little or no opinion of Gerry.
    Then over the years I had a grudging respect for him as he is definitely an articulate and intelligent man.
    But two things have made me lose any of that respect.
    1. He denies that he was ever a member of a paramilitary organisation which means (in my opinion) that he thinks we are all morons
    2. He knew his brother was a nonce and he never did anything about it.


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    #440
    Painted Pony
    Registered Users Posts: 209 ✭✭Painted Pony


    SoulandForm wrote: »
    Fair point- it annoys me when people insist on calling the 26 counties Ireland. Its not. Its a part of Ireland.
    But it is. That's the official name of the state.


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    #441
    Karl Stein
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,689 ✭✭✭Karl Stein


    Manassas61 wrote: »
    I don't see the big problem you have with naming it Ulster

    When you conflate the 6 counties, NI, with Ulster it causes confusion. See, Ulster is an Irish province consisting of 9 counties.

    You know the Ulster Rugby team includes Monaghan, Cavan and Donegal? Are you okay with that or would you rather have a Norniorn rugby team that has nothing to do with the rest of the island?


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    #442
    Manassas61
    Registered Users Posts: 313 ✭✭Manassas61


    Charlie Rock wrote: »
    When you conflate the 6 counties, NI, with Ulster it causes confusion. See, Ulster is an Irish province consisting of 9 counties.

    You know the Ulster Rugby team includes Monaghan, Cavan and Donegal? Are you okay with that or would you rather have a Norniorn rugby team that has nothing to do with the rest of the island?
    Occupied six counties, Six counties and so on. Why does it bother you so much what people call it?

    Most Unionists call it Ulster among fellow Unionists.


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    #443
    Happyman42
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,066 ✭✭✭✭Happyman42


    Manassas61 wrote: »
    I don't see the big problem you have with naming it Ulster which is what the province is called. That is what I call it when I travel up and down the green pleasant fields of Ulster.

    I always thought it was acceptable to call it that.

    I live in Ulster and it has 9 counties. You are factually incorrect but I suppose if you guys say it is, then it must be. :rolleyes:


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    #444
    Karl Stein
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,689 ✭✭✭Karl Stein


    Manassas61 wrote: »
    Most Unionists call it Ulster among fellow Unionists.

    See here's where the confusion arises; most Unionists call what Ulster?


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    #445
    Godge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,727 ✭✭✭✭Godge


    Happyman42 wrote: »
    I live in Ulster and it has 9 counties. You are factually incorrect but I suppose if you guys say it is, then it must be. :rolleyes:
    SoulandForm wrote: »
    Fair point- it annoys me when people insist on calling the 26 counties Ireland. Its not. Its a part of Ireland.


    I live in the state of Ireland, it has 26 counties. Fact.

    Everything else is wishful thinking and hoping.


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    #446
    Happyman42
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,066 ✭✭✭✭Happyman42


    Godge wrote: »
    I live in the state of Ireland, it has 26 counties. Fact.

    Everything else is wishful thinking and hoping.

    We all live in Ireland.


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    #447
    Godge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,727 ✭✭✭✭Godge


    Happyman42 wrote: »
    We all live in Ireland.


    Wrong, in political terms, some live in Ireland, a 26-county state, some live in Northern Ireland, a part of the UK.

    In geographical terms, all live on the island of Ireland, one of the British Isles.

    As I said, the rest however laudable the aspiration, is only wishing and hoping.


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    #448
    Karl Stein
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,689 ✭✭✭Karl Stein


    Godge wrote: »
    I live in the state of Ireland, it has 26 counties. Fact.

    You also live on the island of Ireland which, as you can see from this satellite photo, is an Island to the west of Britain.

    Unlike your 26 county Ireland the above has been a fact for thousands of years and will be for thousands more barring some catastrophic event.

    Fact.


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    #449
    Happyman42
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,066 ✭✭✭✭Happyman42


    Godge wrote: »
    Wrong, in political terms, some live in Ireland, a 26-county state, some live in Northern Ireland, a part of the UK.

    In geographical terms, all live on the island of Ireland, one of the British Isles.

    As I said, the rest however laudable the aspiration, is only wishing and hoping.

    Ask somebody from Finchley where you are from, if you are in doubt.


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    #450
    Godge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,727 ✭✭✭✭Godge


    Charlie Rock wrote: »
    You also live on the island of Ireland which, as you can see from this satellite photo, is an Island to the west of Britain.

    Unlike your 26 county Ireland the above has been a fact for thousands of years and will be for thousands more barring some catastrophic event.

    Fact.


    I agree with you. The island of Ireland is indeed a part of the British Isles.
    Godge wrote: »
    Wrong, in political terms, some live in Ireland, a 26-county state, some live in Northern Ireland, a part of the UK.

    In geographical terms, all live on the island of Ireland, one of the British Isles.

    As I said, the rest however laudable the aspiration, is only wishing and hoping.


    The geographical reality though has no effect on the political reality. Ask the Koreans.


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    #451
    Karl Stein
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,689 ✭✭✭Karl Stein


    Godge wrote: »
    I agree with you. The island of Ireland is indeed a part of the British Isles.

    Ah the good old slave mentality. You'd wonder why they go to the bother of calling the Lions 'the British and Irish Lions' and not just the old empire term of British Lions.


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