Gaelscoils

Iwasfrozen

_meehan_ wrote: »

The Gaelscoileanna do address this in an indirect way. With the surge in numbers of Irish speaking primary schools, even if Irish is made non-compulsory at senior cycle, there will still be a significant number of students who take it as a subject, for the simple reason that they'll be competent enough in the language to do well in it.

Students are also obliged to take English and Maths post-Junior Cert, Irish is no more "forced" on them as these subjects are.

I just knew you were going to come out with some crap about "not being negative, just being realistic." The huge demand for places in Gaelscoileanna is the start of the resurgence. Things can only get better for the language, and as far as I can see, they have already started.

We've been told for decades now that the Irish language resurgence was just around corner, that Irish was becoming sexy, that it was popular with the kids and that in a few short years we would all be speaking our native tounges, courting comely maidens dancing at the crossroads and we'd all be better off for it. Yes siree, any day now. The restoration of Irish is just around the corner.

Meanwhile back in the real world we have been pumping the equivalent of billions on this failed pointless project since independence. Billions that could have been used to build hospitals or schools or improve our dire road network. But no instead we destroyed the more then adequate civil service we inherited from the British when it was decided that all civil service men and women would be required to know Irish. Ability to perform their job was inconsequential in the minds of the top brass (shows you what nationalism can do eh?).

And back in the real world even your precious gealscoils have problems. Notably one of the most pressing worries for the Irish language lobby and their ilk is the lack of teachers with an adequate level of Irish to make opening more schools feasible. This is a huge problem for them because they know existing teachers are un-likely to agree to go back to college to improve their irish language ability and colleges are going to take a less then dim view from a lobby trying to tell them how to run their courses. Even if there were enough teachers with enough Irish drawn from a wider pool brought in to teach in a gealscoil more senior teachers in the area without enough irish are going worry about being passed over by a more junior teacher with more irish and are going to lobby hard through their unions to prevent these schools being built.

I see no reason why this so called resurgence is going to be any different then other so called resurgences.

deirdremf

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Calling a apple a banana doesn't stop it being an apple just like calling Ireland a bi lingual country does not make it so. We are a nation of monoglots. Weather or not you and the rest of your mass attending gealgeoirs you assume are in every parish like it or not.

Irish will never be the language of Ireland stop flogging a dead horse, spare the kids their misery and give up the dream.

Sad to see your linguistic abilities in written English are so poor.
Ireland is bilingual, like it or not.
What's with the mass-attendance? I'm not a catholic, and the majority of the kids in my kids Gaelscoil can't even say a Hail Mary in English. Their parents only go through the motions at communion and confirmation time.

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

We've been told for decades now that the Irish language resurgence was just around corner, that Irish was becoming sexy, that it was popular with the kids and that in a few short years we would all be speaking our native tounges, courting comely maidens dancing at the crossroads and we'd all be better off for it. Yes siree, any day now. The restoration of Irish is just around the corner.

...

And back in the real world even your precious gealscoils have problems. Notably one of the most pressing worries for the Irish language lobby and their ilk is the lack of teachers with an adequate level of Irish to make opening more schools feasible. This is a huge problem for them because they know existing teachers are un-likely to agree to go back to college to improve their irish language ability and colleges are going to take a less then dim view from a lobby trying to tell them how to run their courses. Even if there were enough teachers with enough Irish drawn from a wider pool brought in to teach in a gealscoil more senior teachers in the area without enough irish are going worry about being passed over by a more junior teacher with more irish and are going to lobby hard through their unions to prevent these schools being built.

Lack of teachers with a good level of Irish is a problem, but in these days of emigrate or adapt, I think you will find that people are quite happy to do an extra course to get those scarce jobs, whether it is an IT course or an Irish course.

I see no reason why this so called resurgence is going to be any different then other so called resurgences.

Point is, this so-called resurgence is actually happening. I know lots of people who were brought up speaking English who speak Irish to their kids. Many of them - but not all by any means - went to a Gaelscoil themselves. As you are not close to this movement, you cannot see this - but I and many others can see it, because we are familiar with what is going on.
And it's inclusive. You're welcome to join in, as is our immigrant population.
I think it was Rooseveld that said "two cars in every garage, two chickens in every pot."
Well, I would add, two languages in every mind & every mouth.

Wibbs

deirdremf wrote: »

We suffer from a very similar situation: Irish people who identify strongly with England, the US and the "colonies" tend to dislike Irish and foster a dislike of the language in their children. See Colm Ó Broin's article http://insideireland.ie/2010/06/25/archive4614-4674/ for further discussion of the matter. One acquaintance of mine who was strongly anti-Irish used to have mementos of QEII's coronation in her cabinet - a family heirloom, it seems!!!

Well at least the breed is consistent. I was waiting for when the thinly veiled "west brit" accusations would come about. Not exactly thinly veiled mind. Anti-Irish language, hell even questioning it's value? = Must love the Queen of Engerland then. Gaaawd bless 'er. Sure sign. Probably wearing union jack underpants. Good fcuk. You're Irish, just not Irish enough. Well of course not you clearly identify as English, American and a royalist to boot.

_meehan_ you've suggested before you've never heard of elitist guff from the rabid gaelgoirs? Above is precisely the corner of the mouth cultish elitist nonsense I and others have noted among far too many in the "movement".

deirdremf wrote: »

Nice little racist comment there. You must be proud of yourself.

You're a bit hard of reading aren't you. Try reading it again and the context before you try and glean "racist" from it. But of course that wasn't your aim, was it? Kudos with the deflection.

deirdremf wrote: »

but I would put it down as "incipient bilingual" rather than "fully bilingual".

You could not make this ballsology up. :pac:

I have given some of my reasons for this above - the language is spoken in every part of the country; there is a network of primary and secondary schools; parts of the country are mainly Irish speaking. I grant that more people use the language in the home than in public, and that it does not have a high public visibility, but it is there -

Ohhhh look behiiiind you!! The Gaeligoires are lying in wait. Never mind incipient bilingualism this is Stealth bilingualism, all black* and angular and flying under your west british made radar. Funny though it may be, it's more of the usual guff from the pie in the sky gaelgoiri taliban*. Not happy with massaging the stats, hell blatantly lying about them at times, now they're claiming a super secret Irish language revival? No it's happening, its just you can't see it, you west brit you. You could not make this daftness up. Well clearly you could.

lying in wait for the wibbs and iwasfrozens of this world to rear up and confront them when they least expect it.

ahh jesus No really. Stop, you're killing me :pac: >_> <_< *checks to see the cast of Ros Na Run aren't sneaking up on me with knives between their teeth*

Various factors have come together to bring about this situation: in particular, a largish native population of Basque speakers, the Spanish state's long war against the Basque nationalist movement has radicalised people; the regional government requires Basque if you want a public service job; there is a TV station solely in Basque (not the piss-poor TG4 that we have here) and Ikastolak, their equivalent of the Gaelscoil movement. Doubtless there are many other important factors, but these are some of the most important.

The most important part being in bold. I've heard more Basque on the streets of Guernica in 24 hours than I've heard in a year in Ireland. And no I don't just hang out in Dublin. As for the rest? The Irish government requires Irish for public service jobs. The requirement used to be higher, yet the language kept going downhill. The TV and radio stations we have. Don't see what your issue is with TG4. Given it's driven by mostly native speakers and is a popular station among the Irish audience as a whole, fluent or not. Not radical enough for you? Not enough singing of the fields of athenry as gaelige? Not enough goosestepping to the crossroads?

The Gaelscoileanna are an important part of this evolution, which I believe is why the Dept of Ed puts every possible obstacle in this movement's way. But even that will be overcome.

Seriously. Listen to yourself. Now as well as the somewhat hidden nature of the resurgence you're seeing reds(or is that red whites and blues) under the bed. So in your mind, the mandarins of the dept of education are purposely opposing the resurgence of Irish? What? They've been at this from the start I suppose? Well given the parlous state of the language in public life. Obviously we're all fluent behind closed doors and all...

deirdremf wrote: »

Sad to see your linguistic abilities in written English are so poor.

A bit shabby to attack the chaps prose don't you think?

Ireland is secretly bilingual, like it or not.

FYP.

Point is, this so-called resurgence is actually happening. I know lots of people who were brought up speaking English who speak Irish to their kids. Many of them - but not all by any means - went to a Gaelscoil themselves. As you are not close to this movement, you cannot see this - but I and many others can see it, because we are familiar with what is going on.

Or you're so blinkered by your one track mind that it's all you obsess about? Or maybe your job depends on it? Irish teacher? Gaelthacht guest house that caters for kids exiled from the big schmoke? Translator? Armchair culturalist and cultural arbiter?

The rest of us? Most don't really care beyond the notion of "ah sure it would be terrible to lose it". If they can put their kids in a gaelscoil and it helps them they will. The interest in Gaelscoils is a welcome way to ensure a new generation gets some ear for it. Hopefully it is more concrete a resurgence than previous ones that fizzled out. I suspect Irish is in no danger of dying out and it will likely remain a strong(if minority) language of this nation. Good thing too.






*My use of the word black doesn't mean you can make a racism call. Knock yourself out with the taliban thing though.

Krusader

Wibbs your an absolute disgusting cúnt, i'll take my ban, worth it

mod:poster banned.

Wibbs

And there we have it. When the veil slips.. Did you not miss the "The interest in Gaelscoils is a welcome way to ensure a new generation gets some ear for it. Hopefully it is more concrete a resurgence than previous ones that fizzled out. I suspect Irish is in no danger of dying out and it will likely remain a strong(if minority) language of this nation. Good thing too." part? The Irish language I like. I dislike what has become of it through bad planning and waste of money. That's the joke. But apparently I'm a bit of a not nice person because I question the BS still being sputed about the language. Most of ye gaelgoiri seem to ignore when I've called people out for saying it's a dead language.

Krusader

Wibbs wrote: »

And there we have it. When the veil slips.. Did you not miss the "The interest in Gaelscoils is a welcome way to ensure a new generation gets some ear for it. Hopefully it is more concrete a resurgence than previous ones that fizzled out. I suspect Irish is in no danger of dying out and it will likely remain a strong(if minority) language of this nation. Good thing too." part? The Irish language I like. I dislike what has become of it through bad planning and waste of money. That's the joke. But apparently I'm a bit of a not nice person because I question the BS still being sputed about the language. Most of ye gaelgoiri seem to ignore when I've called people out for saying it's a dead language.

I'm sick of your generalisations, that's all, you live in the past with your generalisations, probably from a beating you took from a zealot christian brother

Wibbs

Oh right, the generalisations that all too often turn out to be scarily accurate? Them ones? And that's enough to call me an "absolute disgusting cúnt"? You've kinda proved my point.

EDIT Oh nice ninja edit with the christian brothers part. Nope hate to disappoint. No beatings or rogerings from clergy or pseudo clergy for me I'm afraid.

Krusader

Wibbs wrote: »

Oh right, the generalisations that all too often turn out to be scarily accurate? Them ones? And that's enough to call me an "absolute disgusting cúnt"? You've kinda proved my point.

EDIT Oh nice ninja edit with the christian brothers part. Nope hate to disappoint. No beatings or rogerings from clergy or pseudo clergy for me I'm afraid.

Well do you know every Irish speaker in the world => they are generalisations. Cop on

Pherekydes

Wibbs wrote: »

Oh right, the generalisations that all too often turn out to be scarily accurate?

Generalisations are always wrong.

I've lost all respect for you after your rantings on this thread.

Wibbs

Pherekydes wrote: »

Generalisations are always wrong.

Incorrect. In general fish live in water. In general adult women have breasts. In general French people speak French. In general Irish people speak ... oh wait. Well three outa four aint bad. Generalisations are not always wrong. They're just generalisations and can be mostly right or mostly wrong depending on reality and more often than not on viewpoint.

I've lost all respect for you after your rantings on this thread.

So? I dunno maybe you're more easily swayed than me. Rantings? Dial back on the oul hyperbole maybe? You know it is possible to respect one opinion and not another in the same person, without applying that globally to that person? I'm sure I'd respect other opinions someone like deirdremf held, if she ever expressed others around here. There are certainly folks on this site who I really don't agree with on one subject yet you will find my head nodding along with agreement reading other subjects of theirs.

Iwasfrozen

deirdremf wrote: »

Sad to see your linguistic abilities in written English are so poor.
Ireland is bilingual, like it or not.
What's with the mass-attendance? I'm not a catholic, and the majority of the kids in my kids Gaelscoil can't even say a Hail Mary in English. Their parents only go through the motions at communion and confirmation time.

This is the best you can come up with? Says much about your argument.

deirdremf wrote: »

Lack of teachers with a good level of Irish is a problem, but in these days of emigrate or adapt, I think you will find that people are quite happy to do an extra course to get those scarce jobs, whether it is an IT course or an Irish course.

I disagree these are state workers we're talking about. Workers with a very powerful union group and a government that has in the past bent over to accommodate them. There will be no wide scale teacher re-training.

deirdremf wrote: »

Point is, this so-called resurgence is actually happening. I know lots of people who were brought up speaking English who speak Irish to their kids. Many of them - but not all by any means - went to a Gaelscoil themselves. As you are not close to this movement, you cannot see this - but I and many others can see it, because we are familiar with what is going on.

I know lots of people who I stayed in contact with from my summer days in the gaeltacht. Some of them fluent speakers but all of them decent who are bringing up their kids solely through english. Primarily because their other halfs don't have a word of Irish and has no motivation to learn it.

deirdremf wrote: »

And it's inclusive. You're welcome to join in, as is our immigrant population.
I think it was Rooseveld that said "two cars in every garage, two chickens in every pot."
Well, I would add, two languages in every mind & every mouth.

No thanks, I haven't spoken a word of Irish since I passed my leaving cert exam. And it was Herbert Hoover that quote is attributed to, though he never actually said it.

Pherekydes

Wibbs wrote: »

Incorrect. In general fish live in water.

Were we talking about fish?

k

ShamoBuc

In general.... Irish people know a cúpla focal!:D

Iwasfrozen

Pherekydes wrote: »

Were we talking about fish?

k

Your man said generalisations were always wrong. He made an incorrect generalisation about generalisations.

Pherekydes

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Your man said generalisations were always wrong. He made an incorrect generalisation about generalisations.

Ghoti.

Iwasfrozen

Pherekydes wrote: »

Ghoti.

you're going to have to explain that one. No one mentioned spelling.

deirdremf

Wibbs wrote: »

Well at least the breed is consistent. I was waiting for when the thinly veiled "west brit" accusations would come about. Not exactly thinly veiled mind. Anti-Irish language, hell even questioning it's value? = Must love the Queen of Engerland then. Gaaawd bless 'er. Sure sign. Probably wearing union jack underpants. Good fcuk. You're Irish, just not Irish enough. Well of course not you clearly identify as English, American and a royalist to boot.
...
*My use of the word black doesn't mean you can make a racism call. Knock yourself out with the taliban thing though.

Aren't you a charming individual? Colm Ó Broin may have had you in mind when he wrote the article I mentioned in my post.
Let me quote a bit that fits your comments on this topic to perfection:

The D4 culture is ... about rejecting everything that is uniquely
Irish.

A classic case of this is the archetypal D4 character, Ross O'Carroll Kelly, who although a fictional character, expresses opinions that are found in Ireland. I first noticed this a few years ago and began noting how consistent the character was in rejecting everything uniquely Irish.

There was the Irish language, the use of Irish words in English, spelling names with fadas and phrases translated directly from Irish. Then there was Irish food, Irish sport, Irish music and Irish clothes.

...

It seemed odd that an Irish person would want to suppress their own culture. The traditional explanation for this phenomenon is that people with these views are suffering from an inferiority complex, that they literally believe that Irish culture is inferior to English culture.

....

After the event [Ryder cup] had finished the mood of the writer had changed however, gone was the usual confidence, replaced by an apprehension that we had embarrassed ourselves in front of the world by presenting a “stereotypical” view of Irishness, complete with terms such as “lepreachaun”, “cailín deas” and satire of Hiberno-English.

It was then I realised what the basis for the rejection of Irish culture was, and the basis of the entire D4/Angophile/Hibernophobic attitude. It was fear. Fear that others, people in England especially, may disapprove of us or may
laugh at us.

Given that you have been to Gernika, can I assume that you are fluent in the Basque language? Or is it only good enough for the Basque peasantry, as well?

UsernameInUse

Why would anyone pay for their kids to learn a dead language?
It just doesn't seem very economically viable in this climate.

Salty

UsernameInUse wrote: »

Why would anyone pay for their kids to learn a dead language?
It just doesn't seem very economically viable in this climate.

In Gaelscoileanna, they absorb the language moreso than learn it. They get the same education as their counterparts in English speaking primary schools, but with the added bonus that they're pretty much fluent in Irish.

byhookorbycrook

UsernameInUse wrote: »

Why would anyone pay for their kids to learn a dead language?
It just doesn't seem very economically viable in this climate.

Pay?How do you mean?Gaelscoileanna are public primary schools. Language is far from dead, I assure you.

UsernameInUse

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Pay?How do you mean?Gaelscoileanna are public primary schools. Language is far from dead, I assure you.

Someone is paying for it.

Language is not dead - Irish is. In what situation would it be useful to know Irish over English, German, French, Chinese, Spanish or Portuguese? Why on Earth would anyone be paying for this useless info?

byhookorbycrook

Primary schools all cost the same to run.Have you read any of the thread where the benefits of learning a second language at an early age have been outlined? As I have already stated, our pupils also learn German.

Dun

Yeah, let's wipe out everything that's not useful. And while we're at, have countries like Finland where their language is only really spoken there forced to learn one of the big six or seven languages cause they're actually useful.

byhookorbycrook

Interesting to see how people define "useful"?

UsernameInUse

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Primary schools all cost the same to run.Have you read any of the thread where the benefits of learning a second language at an early age have been outlined? As I have already stated, our pupils also learn German.

It is useful to learn a second language from an early age, but that depends entirely on what language is being learned. The time taken up learning a dead language should be going to learning a language that can be used in the real world.

Dun wrote: »

Yeah, let's wipe out everything that's not useful.

That seems to be the logical thing to do. I mean, whats the point in running a bus all night if there is nobody on it?

Peanut

Deleted User wrote: »

Personally, I see learning Irish as a hobby, as you say there is little point in having Irish for any of those subjects.

The peoples of just about every non English speaking country could say the same as well and abandon their national languages to take up English, in fact that is exactly what is happening in many African countries right now. The thing is, would you be prepared to drop English and speak, say, Mandarin or some other oriental language in the future if China becomes a dominant world power (Unlikely as I believe it will soon go "pop").

I think there will always be people interested in their national languages, even if it's only spoken by a minority of the population. Naturally, some people will be more inclined to learn whatever the lingua franca of the day is (in their profession). It doesn't necessarily mean that the original/native language has been abandoned though, after all, it seems to work pretty well in Scandanavia and northern continental Europe.

If Mandarin was at the same level as English is today, then I think yes, people would use it. (Although it doesn't bear thinking about right now.. I've struggled enough with cyrillic/greek street names, the thought of trying to decipher Chinese pictograms is a bit much)

Dun

UsernameInUse wrote: »

It is useful to learn a second language from an early age, but that depends entirely on what language is being learned. The time taken up learning a dead language should be going to learning a language that can be used in the real world.

That seems to be the logical thing to do. I mean, whats the point in running a bus all night if there is nobody on it?

First of all it's not dead. Secondly, if it's spoken anywhere, it can be used in the real world.

And if we judge that football leagues, time off work (modern invention), and the After Hours board are all innately useless, then let's get rid of them too, yeah.

byhookorbycrook

UsernameInUse wrote: »

That seems to be the logical thing to do. I mean, whats the point in running a bus all night if there is nobody on it?

Plenty of people hopping on the Gaelscoil buses!!We already have many children on the pre-entry list for 2015. There is huge demand for places,so it seems not everyone thinks like you.

Iwasfrozen

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Plenty of people hopping on the Gaelscoil buses!!We already have many children on the pre-entry list for 2015. There is huge demand for places,so it seems not everyone thinks like you.

I wonder how many people you would have if Irish was dropped as a mandatory subject from the leaving cert. Just a thought.

UsernameInUse

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

I wonder how many people you would have if Irish was dropped as a mandatory subject from the leaving cert. Just a thought.

Bingo.

It's something the Irish language nazi's fail to realise. Not only that, but it's pathetic they find some kind of legitimacy in pushing something down your throat. Nobody wants to learn it - get over it and move onto more useful subjects for crying out loud. It's a case of human freedom - and then I see people marching in the streets because FG wanted to get rid of it as a mandatory subject? LOL...do these people have any kind of shame - their fanaticism is out in the open. I'm sorry, call me a nutjob but I don't want to punish some little kid for not learning something he/she does not want to learn...but thats just me. Encourage them to excel at their own individual talents.

Gigabytes

If people don't want their kids to learn Irish, then get them an exemption or set-up a petition for the government or try set-up a lán-Béarla school but i'm betting yiz have neither the will or desire, moaning on Boards seems to be a bit easier for yiz

Salty

UsernameInUse wrote: »

Bingo.

It's something the Irish language nazi's fail to realise. Not only that, but it's pathetic they find some kind of legitimacy in pushing something down your throat. Nobody wants to learn it - get over it and move onto more useful subjects for crying out loud. It's a case of human freedom - and then I see people marching in the streets because FG wanted to get rid of it as a mandatory subject? LOL...do these people have any kind of shame - their fanaticism is out in the open. I'm sorry, call me a nutjob but I don't want to punish some little kid for not learning something he/she does not want to learn...but thats just me. Encourage them to excel at their own individual talents.

Generalisations? Check.

Hyperbole? Check.

A case for human freedom you say? Christ...who's the real fanatic here?

Sending children to a Gaelscoil is not punishing them, or forcing them to learn the language. Did you completely ignore my last post? It certainly seems you did. Let me remind you...

In Gaelscoileanna, they absorb the language moreso than learn it. They get the same education as their counterparts in English speaking primary schools, but with the added bonus that they're pretty much fluent in Irish

They are not at a disadvantage for learning Irish ffs.

Encourage them excel at their own individual talents? What about the children who are gifted at learning languages? Let's just squash their oppurtunity to learn a language directly tied to their country.

I don't think it would make much of a difference if Irish was made non-compulsory at LC level. More people have a genuine love and interest in the language than you would like to think.

Obviously, not everyone is enthused about Irish, but that is the fault of a flawed teaching system. The children who attend Gaelscoileanna develop a grá for the language, that many older generations never got to experience. Why deny them that?

Iwasfrozen

Gigabytes wrote: »

If people don't want their kids to learn Irish, then get them an exemption or set-up a petition for the government or try set-up a lán-Béarla school but i'm betting yiz have neither the will or desire, moaning on Boards seems to be a bit easier for yiz

Most people don't mind their kids learning Irish in primary schools. It's mandatory leaving cert Irish we have a problem with. Which is of course linked to numbers attending gealscoils.

UsernameInUse

_meehan_ wrote: »

Why deny them that?

No one is denying them anything. If there is a market for it, then the market will take care of that. The Irish language nazi's know they are losing the battle - hence the protests at making it non-compulsory. They'd lose in a vote to scrap it and they know it, therefore the duty to punish children for not learning it seems logical to them.

If Irish was scrapped as a mandatory subject tomorrow and it had popular support, it would live. If not, it would die and good riddance - democracy in action.

Gigabytes

I think you are more fanatical in your anti-Irish stance than the "Irish language nazis" are pro.

Iwasfrozen

Gigabytes wrote: »

I think you are more fanatical in your anti-Irish stance than the "Irish language nazis" are pro.

nah, we don't lecture kids for 35 minutes 5 times a week on the virtues of our position.

Salty

UsernameInUse wrote: »

No one is denying them anything. If there is a market for it, then the market will take care of that. The Irish language nazi's know they are losing the battle - hence the protests at making it non-compulsory. They'd lose in a vote to scrap it and they know it, therefore the duty to punish children for not learning it seems logical to them.

If Irish was scrapped as a mandatory subject tomorrow and it had popular support, it would live. If not, it would die and good riddance - democracy in action.

So the reason these so-called "Irish language nazis" were protesting was because they "know they are losing the battle." Get a grip. They were protesting because they love the language, and because it is foolish to scrap it as a mandatory subject at this stage when they are only at the beginning of revolutionising how it is taught.

What in God's do you mean by "the duty to punish children for not learning it seems logical to them." That makes no sense.

I'm in the last LC year that will be examined on the current Irish curriculum, and I must say, next years LCs have a much nicer course, one that is manageable, and not as taxing as the current one. It is an attractive course as the LC goes. This is a very positive step, and I'm sure other things will be changed as they go along.

Gigabytes

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

nah, we don't lecture kids for 35 minutes 5 times a week on the virtues of our position.

So teachers are fanatics, are science teachers science fanatics etc. etc. :rolleyes:

Panrich

My son attends a Gaelscoil and I am very happy with his progress.
There seems to be huge antipathy among some people here against others who have decided to send their children to a Gaelscoil. Many say that the language is dead and that money spent on teaching it would be better employed on other subjects. I can see where this point comes from. As an atheist, I would much prefer that time and money spent teaching useless religion to my son be spent on Maths etc. but I do not petition for that. The reason being that knowledge of any subject is useful and as long as people wish for gaelscoileana and religious education and the likes, then we should cater for those needs. If we ever arrive at a point where people are denied their freedoms because of the prejudices of others, then we are going down a very dangerous road.

Iwasfrozen

Gigabytes wrote: »

So teachers are fanatics, are science teachers science fanatics etc. etc. :rolleyes:

Never said that.

Salty

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

nah, we don't lecture kids for 35 minutes 5 times a week on the virtues of our position.

They have already changed the LC curriculum. I'll give you a comparison...

Old: 13 poems, 5 short stories, 10ish history topics, a drama.

New: 5 poems + a short story OR drama. Or 10 poems.
Also, their oral will be worth 40% instead of 25%.

The changes have begun, and the subject is being made much more manageable and attractive to take up, should it ever be made non-compulsory.

I found the likes of home-ec and biology far more painful to sit through than Irish. You can't say that children are forced to sit "35 minute classes 5 times a week" of Irish, because the same can be said for English and Maths.

Gigabytes

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Never said that.

It was implied

Dun

This thread was about gaelscoileanna, why is the mandatory teaching of Irish, which obviously has NOTHING to do with gaelscoileanna, being brought up anyway?

UsernameInUse

_meehan_ wrote: »

They have already changed the LC curriculum. I'll give you a comparison...

Old: 13 poems, 5 short stories, 10ish history topics, a drama.

New: 5 poems + a short story OR drama. Or 10 poems.
Also, their oral will be worth 40% instead of 25%.

The changes have begun, and the subject is being made much more manageable and attractive to take up, should it ever be made non-compulsory.

I found the likes of home-ec and biology far more painful to sit through than Irish. You can't say that children are forced to sit "35 minute classes 5 times a week" of Irish, because the same can be said for English and Maths.

Who cares if they change it or not? You're missing the point completely.

The fact is, that if somebody does not want to learn it, then they shouldn't be forced to. If you want to learn it, fine..but how it adds to your total score at the end of the day is absolutely bat-**** crazy on behalf of any intellectual discourse.

Iwasfrozen

_meehan_ wrote: »

They have already changed the LC curriculum. I'll give you a comparison...

Old: 13 poems, 5 short stories, 10ish history topics, a drama.

New: 5 poems + a short story OR drama. Or 10 poems.
Also, their oral will be worth 40% instead of 25%.

The changes have begun, and the subject is being made much more manageable and attractive to take up, should it ever be made non-compulsory.

I found the likes of home-ec and biology far more painful to sit through than Irish. You can't say that children are forced to sit "35 minute classes 5 times a week" of Irish, because the same can be said for English and Maths.

Fine, I have no problem with Irish being made more easier or more attractive as long as it's made optional. I and many others would never have chosen to do it no matter how easy it was made.

As for home ec and Biology, you're crazy. They were two of the handiest subjects in the exam. Just learn your text book cover to cover and you were set, never any nasty surprises. Irish didn't have nasty surprises eaither but if you were like me, having no irish even after fourteen years at school and having to learn off several eassays by sound hoping that you won't get marked down to badly to have any chance of getting a half to decent grade then you would hate it too.

Gigabytes

If you hate Irish why would you care if you failed it or not???

Iwasfrozen

Gigabytes wrote: »

It was implied

No it wasn't. You read between the lines and came to a wrong conclusion.

Dun

UsernameInUse wrote: »

Who cares if they change it or not? You're missing the point completely.

The fact is, that if somebody does not want to learn it, then they shouldn't be forced to. If you want to learn it, fine..but how it adds to your total score at the end of the day is absolutely bat-**** crazy on behalf of any intellectual discourse.

And yet, the same vehement abuse isn't being directed at English or Maths, both being mandatory as was already pointed out. I haven't had to discuss a poem or solve differential problems since I left school, so the usefulness argument is out the window there.

Iwasfrozen

Gigabytes wrote: »

If you hate Irish why would you care if you failed it or not???

UCD requires a pass. I wasn't prepared to let my aversion to the language hold me back.

Peanut

_meehan_ wrote: »

Obviously, not everyone is enthused about Irish, but that is the fault of a flawed teaching system.

In fairness, there may be many other reasons apart from the teaching system.

If you give me the best teaching system in the world, you still won't persuade me to learn Kazakh for instance, if I have no interest in it and little necessity for it in the outside world.