Departmental Trading Accounts

ciarashauna

Ok so I'm just wondering is any other accounting student looking at departmental accounts for the Leaving Cert. Our teacher has told us to look at them as a possibilty, even though (as far as I know) they've never been examined? Just wanted to check quickly with other 6th years.

spurious

If they are on the syllabus they can be examined, whether they have been before or not.

Ditzie

are you doing OL or HL out of curiousity? because our teacher is doing them with the OL students as she feels there's a good chance of them coming up but I'm not doing them...

ciarashauna

Yeah I know they can be examined. Just wondering about possibilty that's all. I'm doing HL, out teacher didn't mention them until very recently. We just went through one quickly.

Jdivision91

im doing accounting higher level and all we are looking are the sole trader, company and a quick look over manufacturing if departmental came up i think most of us would be doing two of the other three questions! i think if they wanted to change things about it would be a manufacturing this year instead of company! (hopefully )

what.to.do

My teacher covered them briefly with us at HL, but she thinks that they are far too easy to come up on the HL paper.

Sure, feck them, we've enough to be doing!

Jdivision91

what.to.do wrote: »

My teacher covered them briefly with us at HL, but she thinks that they are far too easy to come up on the HL paper.

Sure, feck them, we've enough to be doing!

couldnt agree with you more!.the accounting course is far too long.

**Timbuk2**

what.to.do wrote: »

My teacher covered them briefly with us at HL, but she thinks that they are far too easy to come up on the HL paper.

Sure, feck them, we've enough to be doing!

That's what my teacher said as well last year. We covered them (mainly because our class was a mixed class and departmental accounts come up frequently for OL). The layout is considerably different but they aren't difficult, and you use the same basic principles. However, if they do come up, they'll probably be a bit easier because it's the first year and many people will do 2x60marks instead.

Although depreciation by reducing balancing came up in 2010 for the first time, having never been examined before - but then again it's a minor change to a common question, as opposed to a separate question in its own right.

Jdivision91 wrote: »

couldnt agree with you more!.the accounting course is far too long.

The accounting course is gigantic :eek: We went right into the very last week of 6th year, and even at that we had to rush through Incomplete Records. In fairness to the teacher, she was great and we covered everything on the course as well as doing all the past questions (as we covered the material) - I have friends in other schools who left out things that we're unlikely to come up, or even so far as not covering the 120mark question because they were told they had to do the 2x60mark questions.

ciarashauna

We've been told to do 120 mark question. So we haven't really gone through the 60 mark qs. We've done things that usually appear as 100 marks like Tabs etc, but haven't looked at control accounts or revaluation/depreciation questions. The course is way too long to be covered in two years.

what.to.do

Not cover the question one? That's my favourite question!
Madness, I tell you!

We skipped farm accounts, and we've had the course finished since the beginning of April (well, we only covered enough of depreciation and revaluation accounts enough so we could attempt the sixty markers and do the working in other questions), so we're just revising everything now. But a fair few (I say a fair few when there's nine between higher and ordinary in the class..) are iffy enough with management.

And if farm come up in section two, we'll all probably cry there and then in the exam hall. Question five's aren't the most loved by us!!

Jdivision91

what.to.do wrote: »

Not cover the question one? That's my favourite question!
Madness, I tell you!

We skipped farm accounts, and we've had the course finished since the beginning of April (well, we only covered enough of depreciation and revaluation accounts enough so we could attempt the sixty markers and do the working in other questions), so we're just revising everything now. But a fair few (I say a fair few when there's nine between higher and ordinary in the class..) are iffy enough with management.

And if farm come up in section two, we'll all probably cry there and then in the exam hall. Question five's aren't the most loved by us!!

you dont like question fives?? dont worry every single other accounting student is with you there!

what.to.do

Jdivision91 wrote: »

you dont like question fives?? dont worry every single other accounting student is with you there!

Haha, for sure!
Its marked so weirdly, I find.

Oddly enough, its the formulae that I dislike, the essay/note part - I love it!!

We were given a second mock there on Monday.. Finished with about 25 minutes to spare! But, naturally, nothing worked out.

Jdivision91

what.to.do wrote: »

Haha, for sure!
Its marked so weirdly, I find.

Oddly enough, its the formulae that I dislike, the essay/note part - I love it!!

We were given a second mock there on Monday.. Finished with about 25 minutes to spare! But, naturally, nothing worked out.

yeah same with me actually i find the part b's easy compared to some part a's ye had a second mock? did you just use the other mock paper available or did you teacher set it?? i have a weekend and then acccounting as my last test so im guessing my weekend will be mostly question 5s

luciemc

ok so I've never heard of Departmental Trading Accounts?

and we dont do 60 mark questions..no reval/depreciation accs.. just the club tabs suspense etc that come up in section 2..

what's involved in them? if they've never come up where could i get a sample question and could i teach myself?

Jdivision91

luciemc wrote: »

ok so I've never heard of Departmental Trading Accounts?

and we dont do 60 mark questions..no reval/depreciation accs.. just the club tabs suspense etc that come up in section 2..

what's involved in them? if they've never come up where could i get a sample question and could i teach myself?

if you have an accounting textbook you could have a look there im sure they are in it its on the syllabus yeah im sure you could ive thought myself most of the course (lets just say my teacher couldnt find snow in a blizzard ) and it is very unlikely that departmental will come up and if it does it should (hopefully!) be easy enough since most students would automatically do the other questions :cool:

luciemc

Jdivision91 wrote: »

if you have an accounting textbook you could have a look there im sure they are in it its on the syllabus yeah im sure you could ive thought myself most of the course (lets just say my teacher couldnt find snow in a blizzard ) and it is very unlikely that departmental will come up and if it does it should (hopefully!) be easy enough since most students would automatically do the other questions :cool:

thanks! yeh I have one but haven't ever used it! it seemed long, boring and confusing.. just work off teacher's notes and exam papers- probably why i haven't come across these departmental ones.. I do accounting outside school, once a week kind of thing:p

il root around for that book anyways...:)

**Timbuk2**

luciemc wrote: »

thanks! yeh I have one but haven't ever used it! it seemed long, boring and confusing.. just work off teacher's notes and exam papers- probably why i haven't come across these departmental ones.. I do accounting outside school, once a week kind of thing:p

Wow that must be tough - we had four 40 min classes a week and even in that it was tough to get everything done!

We just worked mainly from teacher's notes and exam papers as well. We had a textbook, it was wasn't great and we didn't use it much except for the odd bit of a theory (being honest it was a waste of money). Can't remember what it was called but it was a big huge purple one.

I think students who aren't so good at accounting like Q5s because they can do well enough in Q5, whereas students who are aiming for an A tend to not like Q5 as, while it's easy to get over the pass mark in Q5, it's hard to get near full marks in it, as it's essay style, and different things seem to be required different years in the marking scheme.

My favourite question was definitely Flexible Budgeting - it really is so easy once you get used to it! A 100 mark Cash Flow Statement question is also lovely. The only thing you have to do extra from a 60mark question is to make out the abridged Profit and Loss statement, which certainly takes much less time than the extra 10-15 minutes you get. There's probably some extra theory or something to make up the extra time, but it's usually quite alright!

I did accounting in 2010 (HL) and I can't remember exactly what came up, but I think it was a nice enough paper compared to some years (like 2008!!) but I think Service Firm Accounts came up as a 100mark and it was very long as there seemed to be more adjustments than usual!

what.to.do

Jdivision91 wrote: »

yeah same with me actually i find the part b's easy compared to some part a's ye had a second mock? did you just use the other mock paper available or did you teacher set it?? i have a weekend and then acccounting as my last test so im guessing my weekend will be mostly question 5s

We just used the second mock paper.

I've physics and accountancy that day, one of my only two days that I have more than one exam.
None too excited!

Still, think about the FREEDOM that follows!

xclw

they have never come up ever before my teacher said, but next week we're gonna just do the start of one because other than that they are relatively like the other q1s

xclw

what is everyone learning for the actual exam?

i was gonna do
Q1. Manufacturing, company and sole trader
Q5. Ratios
Q6&7. Incomplete, Tabs, Club, Service firms, Cash Flows and Published if i've time
Q9. Budgeting

whats everyone else doing?

Jdivision91

what.to.do wrote: »

We just used the second mock paper.

I've physics and accountancy that day, one of my only two days that I have more than one exam.
None too excited!

Still, think about the FREEDOM that follows!

yes thats all that is getting me through these days now, thinking about the freedom after same my only days with two exams are Wednesday and Monday! it will be nice to have it all finished with!

xclw wrote: »

what is everyone learning for the actual exam?

i was gonna do
Q1. Manufacturing, company and sole trader
Q5. Ratios
Q6&7. Incomplete, Tabs, Club, Service firms, Cash Flows and Published if i've time
Q9. Budgeting

whats everyone else doing?

i am doing the exact same as you only costing for question 8 which im hoping is marginal costing and maybe a second part to it

magicianz

Just looking at all the people who are saying the course is too long and I still can't get my head around it.....I started the course in September this year and finished it before the pres covering every single topic

everything is linked like, club/service are so alike, incomplete is just a P&L, BS and a few workings, farm accounts are just a few I&E accounts and a P&L, published and cash-flow the hardest parts are remembering all the titles.

Management is a joke apart from that pesky halfquestion in CVP one year about showing marginal and absorption costing for the 8000 units.

Reval/depr/control accounts short and easy, suspense can be tricky from time to time and 100 marker tabs can betricky with VAT and that.

Most of the questions in S1 and S2 revolve around taking figures and putting them into P&Ls with some workings. Same as most courses, learn the basics and apply to more complex Qs.

what.to.do

magicianz wrote: »

Just looking at all the people who are saying the course is too long and I still can't get my head around it.....I started the course in September this year and finished it before the pres covering every single topic

everything is linked like, club/service are so alike, incomplete is just a P&L, BS and a few workings, farm accounts are just a few I&E accounts and a P&L, published and cash-flow the hardest parts are remembering all the titles.

Management is a joke apart from that pesky halfquestion in CVP one year about showing marginal and absorption costing for the 8000 units.

Reval/depr/control accounts short and easy, suspense can be tricky from time to time and 100 marker tabs can betricky with VAT and that.

Most of the questions in S1 and S2 revolve around taking figures and putting them into P&Ls with some workings. Same as most courses, learn the basics and apply to more complex Qs.

What you're saying makes sense, yeah.

But I will state what I say daily at school, some people could do the leaving in one year and get 600, not all of us are lucky enough to be able to do it all.
I find the course rather long, six 35/40 minute classes a week sounds like a lot.. but my gosh, it isn't!!!

peckingduck

We focused primarily on the Q1s with a run through of the 60 mark Qs just before we finished up. Our teacher has a sneaky suspicion that departmental will be on this year, because it would throw so many people. We spent a while going over them to ensure that we could still do the Q1 if they do try that trick

plein de force

I'd be so fecked if a departmental account came up, never done one!
I hope company final accounts come up i know all the workings by heart(hate manufacturing ones)

my dream paper would be

SECTION 1
Q1-Company final accounts
Q2-Tab statement
Q3-Cash flow (just in case the company final account had loads of workings)

SECTION 2
Q5 Ratios- love this question
Q6 Incomplete records

Section 3
Q8- Marginal costing (full marginal costing question, so easy)

magicianz

My teachers predicting tab, reval and cashflow in S1, S2 - ratio, incomplete and published, S3 - Production costing,CVP i think =]

xclw

My teacher predicted

1) Company
5) Ratios (dunno how he predicted that one..)
6 & 7) Tabs, Incomplete or Published
8)Marginal
9)Production