Salary ranges in IT

c_man

Will be starting a grad job (development) this Summer at 33k. Might be because I have a Masters behind me (well thesis submission is soon!).

Was offered a place with another company as well though. It was for a structured grad program and they were offering 30k. Was told that this was the standard pay for all those they were taking on.

balcony swimmer

c_man wrote: »

Will be starting a grad job (development) this Summer at 33k. Might be because I have a Masters behind me (well thesis submission is soon!).

Was offered a place with another company as well though. It was for a structured grad program and they were offering 30k. Was told that this was the standard pay for all those they were taking on.

c_man where are these positions ? in galway or dublin ?

any one know what the going rate in galway is for someone with 3 years .net dev experience and 4 years .net experience ? my friend and I are thinking of maybe heading that direction in near future

Ludo

Scruff wrote: »

me thinks it also depends where in the country you are working. You get paid way more in Dublin than you do elsewhere.

Not true in my experience. I worked in java development in Dublin for 10 years. Moved back to Cork a few years ago. Applied for and got offered 2 jobs here. One offered me 25% less than I was on in Dublin....the other offered me 10% more than I was on. Guess which one I took :-)

The jobs I had in Dublin varied wildly in their pay also. I feel it is more about individual companies rather than location.

c_man

balcony swimmer wrote: »

c_man where are these positions ? in galway or dublin ?

Galway. As I understand it, both (grad) intakes are full.

There's a list of Galway based IT hiring companies here

Anima

Hmm I just started a grad position in Galway and I'm getting around 28. I'm getting fleeced :pac:

but43r

That list looks about right.
Starting a graduate position at 30k + good few benefits.
It's funny how some employers play the recession card even in the IT sector.
Got offered position at 24k with no benefits but decided not to accept it, and I was right in doing so

2ygb4cmqetsjhx

It seems the grass is greener in Germany.

Interview for a job in Munich today for a job with a starting salary of €42k. It database development. Not bad if I got it considering I am 22 with no experience. Finish up masters at the moment and hopefully I get offered and can emigrate in September Find out thursday!

murphaph

Kylan Great Stimulation wrote: »

It seems the grass is greener in Germany.

Interview for a job in Munich today for a job with a starting salary of €42k. It database development. Not bad if I got it considering I am 22 with no experience. Finish up masters at the moment and hopefully I get offered and can emigrate in September Find out thursday!

Not to discourage you (I think you should take it) but just so you're ready....German income taxes are heavy going. You will also have to find somewhere to live in what is probably Germany's most expensive city. On the flip side...your taxes actually get you sh!t in return....excellent healthcare (ok, this comes from compulsory insurance but it's taken out with your taxes), top class infrastructure (underground, motorways everywhere), clean streets (in Munich anway!), safety-plenty of police and Germany is in general very safe, even late at night in unfamiliar parts.

Oh, make SURE when you first register your abode (you have 3 months to do so when first moving to Germany as an EU citizen) that you tell them you are of NO RELIGION, otherwise when it comes to your first payslip you'll see tax deducted for the church!

Oh, best of luck with it! Munich is a lovely city with great access to the Alps, Austria, Italy....

Edit: A quick check says you'll come out with €25,441 after tax, so a little more than 2k in your pocket each month, which should be fine.

srsly78

fsck working in Germany. I quit my job there in 2009 and returned back here, get so much more take-home pay. Remember there is +5% solidarity tax to rebuild the east as well as mandatory health insurance. Also +1% for religion if you don't declare as atheist (lol).

On the topic of salarys: fsck salaries as well, contracting ftw \o/

ALSO, note if you work internationally you will have a MASSIVE pain in the bollix if you take salaried/perm roles. Took me years to sort out tax after working in belgium+uk+germany, you will massively overpay tax. Being a contractor gives you freedom to work internationally without this grief (subject to 183 day rule naturally).

murphaph

srsly78 wrote: »

fsck working in Germany. I quit my job there in 2009 and returned back here, get so much more take-home pay. Remember there is +5% solidarity tax to rebuild the east as well as mandatory health insurance. Also +1% for religion if you don't declare as atheist (lol).

On the topic of salarys: fsck salaries as well, contracting ftw \o/

ALSO, note if you work internationally you will have a MASSIVE pain in the bollix if you take salaried/perm roles. Took me years to sort out tax after working in belgium+uk+germany, you will massively overpay tax. Being a contractor gives you freedom to work internationally without this grief (subject to 183 day rule naturally).

I suppose it depends on your priorities. I couldn't contract yet even if I wanted to as I don't really have enough expertise IMO. As for Germany leaving you with a lot less take home pay, very true....but if someone has a child here it doesn't cost an average industrial wage for childcare, as it seems to in Ireland. There are state run kindergärten everywhere, which cost next to nothing to use. Need to see the doctor? Will cost a maximum of €40 per annum (€10 per quarter). Prescritions covered by compulsory insurance. It's just a different way of doing things I suppose. Ireland gives you more take home, but takes it off you elsewhere.

Many of the lads in my office are contractors alright and they swear by it (once you have the contacts and skills built up). I'd like to try it someday too.

fasty

How does one get into contracting? I'm a salaried employee atm, secure enough job given the times but I want to do some more freelancing/contracting now.

srsly78

I used to think it was by being technically good, but after seeing many terrible contractors I know that isn't true.

It's more about having a brass neck and ability to sell yourself than anything else. Having lots of experience helps naturally, but I have seen younger guys get into it as well. Being a specialist in whatever niche area also helps.

Poster above was right about Germany, if you have kids then that changes the equation a lot. Also car ownership is very cheap. If you don't drive or have kids tho then forget about it! Also, I remember going to Dentist there... They asked me for a tenner, I responded "oh I thought it was free", they told me "oh that's for registration and covers you for the year"

Also, they have no time for contractors in Germany... very strict tax laws.

fasty

I have experience and know how to get things done without writing horrible code. Do I just phone up some recruiters and go from there?

srsly78

Pretty much yeah. It's all about selling yourself. I hope you are made of tough stuff tho, contractors have no job security and tend to get landed with the nasty stuff

You will have to set yourself up as self-employed too, but don't bother with this until you are sure you got something lined up. Also note that some asshole UK recruiters won't deal with an Irish company. The more experience you have the more you get to dictate your terms however. You can setup with a UK umbrella but they are just parasites in my experience. If you setup an Irish company you can avail of the corp tax exemption for 3 years (note: not if you quit your job, exemption only applies to startups creating NEW jobs, I got away with it because I returned home from abroad).

murphaph

srsly78 wrote: »

Also, they have no time for contractors in Germany... very strict tax laws.

I think it must depend on the company. I'm looking at 4 contractors sitting across my desk right now

seamus

Here's an example of a spam job mail I got in today from an Irish recruiter entitled "Senior IT Roles":

Those are all Senior IT Roles for a giant Technological company.

For your kind consideration, I am enclosing the details below:

Benefits:

· Salary - €26 to €30K per annum

· Relocation assistance of €1000 with 1st salary

· Performance Bonus of up to €300 every month

· Vouchers to do Microsoft Certifications

· Subsidised canteen

· Free shuttle bus service,

· Gym membership,

· Discount on HP products

Requirements:

A minimum of 3-4 years experience in IT, remote support experience is preferable.

Fluent in German and English

A suitable candidate must demonstrate a good working knowledge of one or more current Microsoft Operating systems and Exchange architecture (Windows Server 2003/2008, Exchange 2000/2003/2007)

Good working knowledge of Active Directory architecture with proven background in troubleshooting

At least one or more Microsoft Certifications or be studying towards MCSE and/or MCITP qualification.

Also have expertise in all of the following:

· Windows Server 2003/2008

· Outlook 2003/2007

· Advanced networking knowledge

· Client operating systems (XP/Vista)

· Active Directory

Location: Dublin, Ireland

There are obviously a couple of funny things here. It's blatantly a call centre job in HP. It's not "Senior" by a long shot, as the salary, minimum experience and qualifications show. And the qualifications are all over the shop. Working knowledge of one MS OS plus Exchange & AD, but you must know Windows Server, Exchange, AD, "advanced networking" and Client OSes.

It's stuff like this that makes it hard to gauge salaries in IT. On one hand they're looking for someone with fluent German, strong skills in Exchange, AD & networking and 3/4 years experience, and offering a "Senior Role", but on the other hand the salary they're offering would be considered "entry level" or "junior" by many people.

Maybe a degree really does count for a lot, I notice it's not mentioned in that spec.

srsly78

murphaph wrote: »

I think it must depend on the company. I'm looking at 4 contractors sitting across my desk right now

German ones or Irish? I would take a short contract in Germany but not a long one. Once you become tax resident you are fooked (see earlier post). Germany is not a contractor-friendly country.
Aside: Netherlands has a 25% tax exemption for in-demand skilled workers (that means software developers). Pretty sweet. Boss used to even drive me to coffeeshop!




Seamus: Those are support jobs, it's low skill work. There is massive oversupply of people with those skills so they can offer joke money. Not comparable to development roles.

2ygb4cmqetsjhx

Yeah if the gross was €42k and net was €26k would I be better off. I actually speak German fluently and have lived in Munich before. I feel that money goes much further over there!! For example food etc is pretty cheap and I'd probably have a lot spare every month. It's not all about the money actually. I think life would be sweeter in general over there. Loads of mates in the area already. Good transportation. Loads of things to do. Might just take it.

srsly78

Many parts of Germany are cheap, not Munich tho

Just to clarify something else: When I talk about contractors I mean self-employed people.

2ygb4cmqetsjhx

Munich is cheaper than Ireland though. You can certainly live cheaper in Munich than Dublin.

srsly78

No. Last few years have seen Dublin rents and prices come down a bit. Dublin slightly cheaper nowadays.

murphaph

srsly78 wrote: »

German ones or Irish?

They are German lads yeah. The thing in Germany is that you can write a lot of stuff off against tax, even as a "PAYE" worker. Transport costs to work and everything.

Still pay more tax on average though.

Webmonkey

I never lived in Munich but i spent a few weeks off and on over there. I thought it was quite cheap enough food wise and hotels were good too but the quality of the hotels left a bit to be desired :pac: - at least the cheap ones.

seamus

For reference, you will will take home €5k more per year in Ireland on €42k than you do in Germany. As pointed out general cost of living is cheaper, but more crucially the public services in general are better, so you'll probably feel like that €5k is being used better.

srsly78

I got a double room with ensuite in shared house in Ballsbridge. Rent = e400/month. Landlord came around and gave us rent reduction out of the blue last year...

You will not get even close to that in Munich. Also be aware there many hidden costs when living in Germany. I just had a bill arrive for a few hundred quid a few weeks ago, for my time in Germany in 2009!!! They quote rent as "kalt meite", heating and management fees come on top. It can be quite misleading. They also love screwing foreigners over.... (this is the same everywhere tbh, Irish are just as guilty)

Don't get me wrong, Munich is a lovely city (so much nicer than Dublin). The German stereotypes are bull****, they are polite friendly people in my experience. Just don't go to Munich expecting it to be really cheap is all I'm saying :0 (food and booze is actually quite cheap, but rent is a killer)

8k2q1gfcz9s5d4

Tim Robbins wrote: »

Grad = 30K

maybe 5 years ago, defo now now! 25k topps for a grad.

COYW wrote: »

I think he is spot on with the exception of the graduate salary.

Im 6 months in my first job, have a 2.1 degree and a masters. spent 9 months looking for a job (was with a few bad recruitment companies), In that time i didnt see one graduate job offering more than 25k. Having the masters didnt really matter! im now working in a large financial with two people from my undergraduate class!

8k2q1gfcz9s5d4

Tim Robbins wrote: »

Grad = 30K

maybe 5 years ago, defo now now! 25k topps for a grad.


Im 6 months in my first job, have a 2.1 degree and a masters. spent 9 months looking for a job (was with a few bad recruitment companies), In that time i didnt see one graduate job offering more than 25k. Having the masters didnt really matter! im now working in a large financial with two people from my undergraduate class!

Scruff wrote: »

me thinks it also depends where in the country you are working. You get paid way more in Dublin than you do elsewhere.

yea, that is true. Has to be though as the cost of living is higher.

Jayo_M

Sebastian Gorgeous Voodoo wrote: »

maybe 5 years ago, defo now now! 25k topps for a grad.

If you look through this thread you'll see that clearly isn't the case. 25k is at the lower end of the scale.

8k2q1gfcz9s5d4

Jayo_M wrote: »

If you look through this thread you'll see that clearly isn't the case. 25k is at the lower end of the scale.

well it does vairy. for a grad with 0-6 months experience, I would be amazed if they much over 25k. I have not been looking at jobs for 6-7 months so i could be a bit off, but it couldnt have changed that much in 6 months. Im aware some jobs are going to pay better than others. but for a .net/SQL developer 23-28k would be the range, 28k for maybe having a 1.1, masters or over a years experience. also location is a big thing. I dont work in dublin, that is worth around 4k a year to me on rent/transport

Placebo

How much should a web designer/developer be on? [i do both, i know craaazzzzy]
I've been in work for the past 3 years. And during college/workexperience i've racked up 2+ odd years experience.
BSc Computer Science./Software Engineer
Msc multimedia/Graphic design

i guess it would depend on quality of my work, just looking for general ball park figure