First 3 months of Fine Gael/Labour Government. How have they done so far?

It's coming up to 3 months since General Election 2011's result gave Fine Gael and Labour a historic mandate to run the country in a post bubble, post celtic tiger, and post Fianna Fáil Ireland. Bearing in mind their very vocal performances as opposition parties over the last several years and their ambitious election promises in the runup to the polls, how do you feel they have done in office so far?

My own personal opinion is that they started well, and rode a wave of public hope and goodwill that came with the ousting of FF for a while, but over the last several weeks their election manifesto has begun to be seen more and more as having been wishful thinking in comparison to the reality of what they can acomplish in office. It seems particularly clear that they have been largely strait-jacketed by the outgoing financial comittments made by the last government, and intend to steer much of the same economic course as the previous administration. The biggest indication so far of how they plan to run their taxation policy, the private sector pension levy, has been seen by many as short sighted, more of the same, easy option taxation.

Lately i feel that public sentiment has begun to move towards the view that FG/Lab are not turning out to be all that voters had hoped. The "anyone but Fianna Fáil" enthusiasm has waned, and our new government now has to be judged purely on it's own merits, and for me they are not showing enough intent to bring real reform to irish politics and live up to their pre-election promises.

I fear that if this stays unchanged, Ireland will fall back into the political disillusionment that was so evident in the Cowen Era of the last FF government.

I hope i am wrong. Opinions?

Sierra Oscar

I feel the government has done relatively well so far although it was always in my mind that the election manifesto promises of Labour & FG were unrealistic - which was evident when the programme for government was agreed.

All the same, the real tough decisions have yet to be made. There were plenty of token gestures in the first few weeks of the governments lifetime - but its first big move was the jobs initiative, which was surrounded in a controversy with the pension levy.

The government faces a tough time ahead, imho. Then again any government would given the situation we are in.

thebman

I agree any government would suffer at this moment in time as cuts are rarely popular.

So far, we don't seem to really have seen many cuts and the most visible thing the government has done is this pension levy which is a tax increase even if it is stealing from the future to pay for the present.

They have failed to get their 1% decrease in our loans from the troike too which is again negative.

All in all so far its been pretty much, stay the course from the government which for a government promising a lot of reform and fixing Ireland Inc. has been very negative.

They need to get moving on political reform or at least show it is still on the agenda.

Sierra Oscar

Nursing home scheme appears to be in crisis

First major unexpected challenge.

thebman

thebman wrote: »

They have failed to get their 1% decrease in our loans from the troike too which is again negative

I agree with this, and besides, they are barking up the wrong tree with the 1% decrease in the first place. The effect of it would be a drop in the ocean in comparison to our current defecit, even a small increase in our unemployment figures would wipe out it's effect in extra dole and social welfare costs. What's more, the troike is just throwing us a bone with talk of the 1% cut to keep us quiet so we don't push for REAL reform of our deal, especially at the moment. It's plain to many in the EU that ireland's bailout package and conditions are unsustainable, and the more noise we make about it right as greece's chance of repayment of their bailout is beginning to look shaky, the less solid the EU and the single currency's stability looks as a whole.

If there is to be a renegotiation it can't be us going back to them with a begging bowl like this looking for a drop in rates alone. The entire structure of the irish bailout is going to ruin ireland in order to save european interests. It is designed to keep us from sinking, but just barely so as to save expense, and that's if everything works out as planned in terms of growth predictions, which there's a good chance it won't. The deal has to be changed or we will be close to economic stagnation for a decade or so. We have essentially been left out in the cold so that they can close the door and keep the heat in.

The very structure of the irish bailout must be renegotiated, and burden sharing has to be a part of that deal. Our trump card in that scenario is that we can threaten to bring down the stability of the single currency-if we go down we can take them with us. We should not be afraid to make strong moves against the EU in our own interest, call their bluff, and sacrifice some political goodwill in order to ensure our own survival, and i'm not sure kenny and gilmore have the bottle to take such risks. Ironically after a decade or more of us distancing ourselves from our EU counterparts, we are now making moves to get closer to them through our new administration's change in thinking, at the very time we should be towing a harder line.

thebman wrote: »

All in all so far its been pretty much, stay the course from the government which for a government promising a lot of reform and fixing Ireland Inc. has been very negative.

They need to get moving on political reform or at least show it is still on the agenda.

Agreed, and i think this is a consequence of the general mismatch of ideaologies between Fine Gael and Labour who are pulling in different directions in terms of policy quite often. They're now looking like they paid a lot of lip service to reform as part of their election runup, and if the trend in this direction continues, along with the introduction of more taxes and levies that are percieved as easy options without any real foresight or change in thinking, they run the risk of losing public sentiment altogether. If that happens we'll be back where we were a year ago, with a government without a real-time popular mandate, who can only recite what happened back at the last election as justification for their actions.

Slydice

has the minimum wage been restored?

have any bankers been put in jail?

DJCR

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

I feel the government has done relatively well so far although it was always in my mind that the election manifesto promises of Labour & FG were unrealistic - which was evident when the programme for government was agreed.

They fed us with rubbish. They knew how bad things were.

thebman wrote: »

I agree any government would suffer at this moment in time as cuts are rarely popular.

So far, we don't seem to really have seen many cuts and the most visible thing the government has done is this pension levy which is a tax increase even if it is stealing from the future to pay for the present.

True, any government woul take a hit in its popularity in a recession - but they don't seem to have done much because to be fair alot of it was done before they got into the Dail - hence they appear to be just tweaking the policies of the last govt.

thebman wrote: »

They have failed to get their 1% decrease in our loans from the troike too which is again negative.

This to be honest isn't a big deal and its more for fanfair than to make any real difference... I imagine this will happen eventually, if not better than this after we see what happens with Greece.

thebman wrote: »

They need to get moving on political reform or at least show it is still on the agenda.

Hmm, they will hold a referendum on getting rid of the Senead and it will pass as its a popular topic so again fan fair central for the coalition govt. Broken Govt. we'll fix it.......... it will stay gone for a few years and tehn we will see something similar pop up a few years down the line.

Slydice wrote: »

has the minimum wage been restored?

have any bankers been put in jail?

Minimum wage has been restored and sadly no bankers have been put in Jail .....


While I realise I've been rather critical I think they are doing ok - I mean I certainly think they fed us crap during the election. They have ridden on the crest of a wave of anti FF more than Pro FGLAB but if anything has been shown is that they do see what the main issue is "the internal economy" - the jobs initiative is rubbish but its a start...... heres hoping that they build on this!!

MoodRacer

From what I can see, FG have implemented very little of their pre election 100 day / 5 point plan promisies. They seem to be meandering along with the same failed policies of the previous administration.

http://www.finegael2011.com/pressreleases.asp?artId=5E5A57

I don`t accept for one minute the suggestion that they `didn`t know how bad things were`. They, along with other opposition parties at the time, were briefed on several occasions by the DoF before the GE.

Just plain old electioneering and power hungry false promises. Sound fframiliar

Slydice

DJCR wrote: »

Slydice wrote: »

has the minimum wage been restored?

have any bankers been put in jail?

Minimum wage has been restored and sadly no bankers have been put in Jail .....

Thanks for your reply. Can you post a link to a webpage or news article that shows fine gael has already restored the minimum wage?

All I can find is articles with them saying it'll be done or that it's coming soon in legislation.

Killer Pigeon

Nothing much has changed for me.

Essexboy

On a micro-level, things have not improved.

I emailed my new FG TD with a simple request for information back in March. 2 emails and an automatic receipt later, I am still waiting for a response. His FF predecessor replied promptly when I contacted him.
A case of
"The working class can kiss my arse,
I've got the foremans' job at last."

redux

.....was a great sound bite, but never really achievable. This government, apart from being too inexperienced to deal with the disaster we live in, aren't very courageous and seem too easily rolled over by the EU.

It also seems like they are coasting while Europe governs us, instead of putting Ireland first.
But, all said and done, they are politicians and we really shouldn't be surprised at their inactivity and lack of creativity at home, they want to be loved in the wider world of politics, which means being popular within the EU.

No doubt in the next election, we will have a re-run of this one. Labour will mostly be blamed and go the way of the PD's/Green's, FF will come back all forgiven and FG will be shouting from the opposition benches.

Irish life rarely changes to the radical!

redux

redux wrote: »

No doubt in the next election, we will have a re-run of this one. Labour will mostly be blamed and go the way of the PD's/Green's, FF will come back all forgiven and FG will be shouting from the opposition benches.

Irish life rarely changes to the radical!

Except that unless this government retains it's popular mandate, we are out of options. There is no better alternative, FG were voted in because they were only marginally less credible than FF as of the last election, and a lot less unpopular, but if that changes and both they and the country continue to slide downwards in the rankings, who else can we give the country to to run?

We are out of credible options that don't mean a seismic shift in the socio-economic makeup of Ireland (adam's economically suicidal republicanism, or gilmore's diluted version of socialism). That would be a massive shift to contemplate given the gravity of the state's finances at the moment, and would change daily life in ireland completely.

If FG have no success at improving things within their current term and the country keeps sliding, I have actually considered emigration as the best move politically for myself and my family, for lack of better options, and I wouldn't be surprised if scores, or even hundreds of thousands of irish people felt the same way, and had just had enough and decided to get out.

BOHtox

Essexboy wrote: »

On a micro-level, things have not improved.

I emailed my new FG TD with a simple request for information back in March. 2 emails and an automatic receipt later, I am still waiting for a response. His FF predecessor replied promptly when I contacted him.
A case of
"The working class can kiss my arse,
I've got the foremans' job at last."

Yes, that's because you should email your councillor for Micro things. Fine Gael have one or two Macroeconomic policies to take care of first.

Lawrence1895

So there will be a cut to overtime and Sunday premium payments?

Well done, FG. Well done, Richard Bruton. Once again, those who are 'ordinary' workers, are hit with the hammer.

For me as a Care Support Worker, this is just a disgrace. In a job like this, you are supposed to work on Sundays, and I would loose out on €50-75 every fortnight.

I just hope, Labour can somehow stop their coalition partners

Lars1916

Lars1916 wrote: »

So there will be a cut to overtime and Sunday premium payments?

Well done, FG. Well done, Richard Bruton. Once again, those who are 'ordinary' workers, are hit with the hammer.

For me as a Care Support Worker, this is just a disgrace. In a job like this, you are supposed to work on Sundays, and I would loose out on €50-75 every fortnight.

This post is not to single you out, but rather to highlight your situation as part of the problem. With respect, why should you be paid more to work on a sunday unless it's over and above your usual 40 hours or whatever? Overtime pay for overtime work is fine but this antiquated view of Sunday as a catholic day of rest or some "special case" doesn't stand up to scrutiny in modern ireland.

Unless you can't get to work because a bus service is not running or something and you have to pay for a taxi instead, why should your work on Sunday not be paid the same as your work any other day, unless you're tripping into overtime hours? Furthermore, if you're in the public sector, there should be a question asked as to why are they even paying you an overtime rate when they could give you 40 hours, and then hire somebody else and pay them a standard rate for the rest of the work that you're being paid time and a half for over your 40 hour week?

If the health service was run like a private company focused on efficiency and cost management as well as on provision of services, that's what would happen. That pay is just money you're used to and don't want to let go of, not money you should have by right. It's just one example of the kind of widespread cost inefficiency in the irish public service and right now, the country can't afford to pay it.

Again, i'm genuinely not singling you out for a personal attack, it just sticks in my throat when i hear people complaining that the government never takes difficult decisions or cuts this waste or cuts that inefficiency, but as soon as they do (as in your case) they cry "no, not ME, it's not fair, hit somebody else".

EVERYBODY is somebody else, and there are too many bloody vested interests in Ireland that have the bloody place paralyzed into inaction every time somebody tries to do what must be done.

Lawrence1895

Deleted User wrote: »

This post is not to single you out, but rather to highlight your situation as part of the problem. With respect, why should you be paid more to work on a sunday unless it's over and above your usual 40 hours or whatever? Overtime pay for overtime work is fine but this antiquated view of Sunday as a catholic day of rest or some "special case" doesn't stand up to scrutiny in modern ireland.

Unless you can't get to work because a bus service is not running or something and you have to pay for a taxi instead, why should your work on Sunday not be paid the same as your work any other day, unless you're tripping into overtime hours? Furthermore, if you're in the public sector, there should be a question asked as to why are they even paying you an overtime rate when they could give you 40 hours, and then hire somebody else and pay them a standard rate for the rest of the work that you're being paid time and a half for over your 40 hour week?

If the health service was run like a private company focused on efficiency and cost management as well as on provision of services, that's what would happen. That pay is just money you're used to and don't want to let go of, not money you should have by right. It's just one example of the kind of widespread cost inefficiency in the irish public service and right now, the country can't afford to pay it.

Again, i'm genuinely not singling you out for a personal attack, it just sticks in my throat when i hear people complaining that the government never takes difficult decisions or cuts this waste or cuts that inefficiency, but as soon as they do (as in your case) they cry "no, not ME, it's not fair, hit somebody else".

EVERYBODY is somebody else, and there are too many bloody vested interests in Ireland that have the bloody place paralyzed into inaction every time somebody tries to do what must be done.

Let's put it this way: Carers are not the only ones who are required to work Sundays. Same as waiters or shop assistants, it is part of the contract.

And I'm not moaning about it, because I see Sundays as a 'special' or Catholic thing, as I'm an Atheist.

Still, if somebody relies on Sunday premiums to feed a family (and at the same time can't go out with his children, because he is working), will feel the cut big time.

So why are the Blueshirts such cowards and hit those, who were hit already by the old government?

eco2live

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

Nursing home scheme appears to be in crisis

First major unexpected challenge.

I agree this this. I am waiting to see how this turns out. A steaming present left by Mary Hearney.

Lars1916

Lars1916 wrote: »

Let's put it this way: Carers are not the only ones who are required to work Sundays. Same as waiters or shop assistants, it is part of the contract....Still, if somebody relies on Sunday premiums to feed a family (and at the same time can't go out with his children, because he is working), will feel the cut big time.

So why are the Blueshirts such cowards and hit those, who were hit already by the old government?

I just want to re-iterate again, i'm not having a go at you, and i totally see your point on a personal level that a cut like this will hit you hard, the point i'm making though is although you've gotten used to having that little bit of extra cash and your living standard has risen a little to correspond, there is no real justification for it having to be paid, and very many workers in the salaried public sector have no such comfort for the inconveniences they have to go through, either officially or unofficially, just to hold down their jobs.

I and many people i know have worked 12-14 hour stints for an 8 hour day, sacrificed family time and a whole other range of things, and asked for nothing more than their 8 hours pay, and that's the reality of life in ireland at the moment. I do not expect even to be paid overtime for any extra after hours or before hours work i do, and the thought of asking my company to give me a shift premium makes me laugh.

And for the record, i agree with what you say about our new government continuing to tax inequitably and hit the already marginalised, i think they've made a poor start and shown us how they mean to continue after all their talk about bringing the fairness back into the system and rejuvinating irish people's attitudes to politicians.

gaffer91

I must say I'm pretty disappointed with FG and Labour so far in government. They have broken several key promises- Varadkar saying they wouldn't put one more red cent into the banks pre-election and then proceeding with the recapitalisations after it, still no reduction in the interest rate, water charges, a possible reduction in Garda numbers, etc. It does seem that FG really did just engage in auction politics pre-election which is especially disappointing given that there was a real feeling in the country that we were moving away from that sort of rubbish in February.

However, there has been a few achievements-Kenny asserted himself well in Europe defending our corporate tax rate, and represented us well during the recent visits. I was also quite impressed with his choice of senators. Kenny has actually been the governments biggest asset so far in my opinion which is the opposite of what I had expected.

lille

Are we all just going to take this????? If the government can reduce the wages of the lowest paid workers in the country....people paid between 10-20 thousand a year.......they'll come after everyone ........eventually....there is no point saying ah i have a contract.....I have a contract and they are about to cut my wages and it'll go straight into the pocket of my employer.

If there is no work for people the employers are no going to pay staff to stand around....... working hours are based on sales....if they've no hours to give us now...with 250000 people down money....how are sales goin to improve?

Lawrence1895

lille wrote: »

Are we all just going to take this????? If the government can reduce the wages of the lowest paid workers in the country....people paid between 10-20 thousand a year.......they'll come after everyone ........eventually....there is no point saying ah i have a contract.....I have a contract and they are about to cut my wages and it'll go straight into the pocket of my employer.

If there is no work for people the employers are no going to pay staff to stand around....... working hours are based on sales....if they've no hours to give us now...with 250000 people down money....how are sales goin to improve?

Sales won't improve, because prizes for groceries won't go down as much as wages go down. People can't afford to buy stuff anymore, more and more factories go busted, more jobs get lost...and so on and so forth.

But still there are some winners after all, bankers, bondholders, developers, as they went away with blue murder once again :mad:

lille

Lars1916 wrote: »

Sales won't improve, because prizes for groceries won't go down as much as wages go down. People can't afford to buy stuff anymore, more and more factories go busted, more jobs get lost...and so on and so forth.

But still there are some winners after all, bankers, bondholders, developers, as they went away with blue murder once again :mad:

Why are we so laid back in this country.......we have a legal entitlement to our Sunday premium.and they can just take it from us.........i have a legal entitlement to my car, and my house, .........are they goin to bring in legislation to take them too when there is no money left in the country to pay the IMF/EU

lille

lille wrote: »

Why are we so laid back in this country.......we have a legal entitlement to our Sunday premium

The government you elected decides exactly what your legal entitlements are and are not. That's the power you gave them at the ballot box. They can change the laws to suit what they deem to be in the best interests of the country, within the scope of our constitution. This is what you elected them to do and it is exactly what they are doing, whether you agree with their thinking or the fairness of their actions or not.

You can't elect a government on a platform of reform and promises of tough decisions without expecting any of the consequences ever to touch you or your life.

lille

Deleted User wrote: »

The government you elected decides exactly what your legal entitlements are and are not. That's the power you gave them at the ballot box. They can change the laws to suit what they deem to be in the best interests of the country, within the scope of our constitution. This is what you elected them to do and it is exactly what they are doing, whether you agree with their thinking or the fairness of their actions or not.

You can't elect a government on a platform of reform and promises of tough decisions without expecting any of the consequences ever to touch you or your life.

Unfortunately the consequnces of this and the previous government have indeed had a negetive impact on my life as it has on many other peoples lives.......its the same people being hit all the time .....

Brian Lenihan couldn't change the contracts of the bankers when they were getting their bonuses after they destroyed the country..... yet when it comes to the ordinary person a different rule applys
............"We'll create a better Ireland" for whom?

Lawrence1895

lille wrote: »

Unfortunately the consequnces of this and the previous government have indeed had a negetive impact on my life as it has on many other peoples lives.......its the same people being hit all the time .....

Brian Lenihan couldn't change the contracts of the bankers when they were getting their bonuses after they destroyed the country..... yet when it comes to the ordinary person a different rule applys
............"We'll create a better Ireland" for whom?

'We'll create a better Ireland' just means, it will be better for all those, who got a ministerial post

The golden rule seems to be: 'Make promises, brainwash the electorate...and after being elected in government, just give a toss about those, who voted for you' :mad:

DJCR

Slydice wrote: »

Thanks for your reply. Can you post a link to a webpage or news article that shows fine gael has already restored the minimum wage?

All I can find is articles with them saying it'll be done or that it's coming soon in legislation.

Sorry, they actually haven't done it yet (surprise surprise). I'm going to assume they will use it as a sweetner in what is going to be a blood sucking budget.

Slydice

Slydice wrote: »

Thanks for your reply. Can you post a link to a webpage or news article that shows fine gael has already restored the minimum wage?

DJCR wrote: »

Sorry, they actually haven't done it yet (surprise surprise). I'm going to assume they will use it as a sweetner in what is going to be a blood sucking budget.

They shouldn't BE doing it, but a cut in the minimum wage alone by Fianna Fail wasn't a fair solution to the problem, and didn't work. All it did was make unemployment an even less unattractive option for many than minimum wage work, which gets us nowhere. Our minimum wage is one of the highest in Europe, which has hammered our competitiveness in terms of attracting FDI (foreign direct investment) in the last while and thus, our chances of staging an export led recovery. Problem is that FF lowering the minimum wage arbitrarily by a euro on it's own without taking any measures to lower costs of living etc which they allowed to spiral for years only has the effect of further marginalizing some of the most marginalized individuals in society, the working poor. It didn't do anything to address where the difference in our minimum wage and somewhere like poland or spain's is swallowed up. Despite the fact that they're paid more, minimum wage workers are no better off in ireland than they are in spain. They can only buy the same amount of stuff, groceries, petrol, etc, it just all costs much more.

Addressing this high cost of living is what has to be done before you can make such a big move which isolates so many of the people you are asking to go out and work for peanuts for the sake of the country (unless of course, like FF were, you're a government who knew it was out of power in 3 months anyway, which FG/Lab are NOT at the moment). That cut was yet another FF quick fix to keep a vested interest lobby happy. It benefitted no-one but the few sections of the private sector that rely on minimum wage work, and (according to Willie O'Dea on the last word last week) there has yet to be any real result seen by the exchequer for all their talk about how this would boost employment in the retail sector and so on. It's just gone straight into their profit margins, and the exchequer has been "hoodwinked".

If Kenny & co are going to follow through on their policy of taxing equitably based on ability to pay, then they have to address those cost of living issues before they cut one of THE poorest sections of society's take home pay by 12-15%. All that will do is drive swathes of people who have no prospect of earning the 35k+ salary needed to keep pace with unemployment benefits towards emigration or the dole queue.

PeterIanStaker

I really don't think they've made much of a difference at all, but then again I was never naive enough to think they would.
It'll be interesting to see how they spin the inevitable default to the people though.

kiermul

Deleted User wrote: »

It's coming up to 3 months since General Election 2011's result gave Fine Gael and Labour a historic mandate to run the country in a post bubble, post celtic tiger, and post Fianna Fáil Ireland. Bearing in mind their very vocal performances as opposition parties over the last several years and their ambitious election promises in the runup to the polls, how do you feel they have done in office so far?

My own personal opinion is that they started well, and rode a wave of public hope and goodwill that came with the ousting of FF for a while, but over the last several weeks their election manifesto has begun to be seen more and more as having been wishful thinking in comparison to the reality of what they can acomplish in office. It seems particularly clear that they have been largely strait-jacketed by the outgoing financial comittments made by the last government, and intend to steer much of the same economic course as the previous administration. The biggest indication so far of how they plan to run their taxation policy, the private sector pension levy, has been seen by many as short sighted, more of the same, easy option taxation.

Lately i feel that public sentiment has begun to move towards the view that FG/Lab are not turning out to be all that voters had hoped. The "anyone but Fianna Fáil" enthusiasm has waned, and our new government now has to be judged purely on it's own merits, and for me they are not showing enough intent to bring real reform to irish politics and live up to their pre-election promises.

I fear that if this stays unchanged, Ireland will fall back into the political disillusionment that was so evident in the Cowen Era of the last FF government.

I hope i am wrong. Opinions?

yes I would agree with you on everything you say it is more of the same. They are surprised that jobless numbers have gone up !!!! does no one realise that "extra taxes and charges and no wage increases for those that are working" = No spare money to spend.

Liam Byrne

Deleted User wrote: »

That cut was yet another FF quick fix to keep a vested interest lobby happy. It benefitted no-one but the few sections of the private sector that rely on minimum wage work, and (according to Willie O'Dea on the last word last week) there has yet to be any real result seen by the exchequer for all their talk about how this would boost employment in the retail sector and so on.

Any credible source available instead ? That weasel would say anything if he thought it'd get him somewhere, as proven by a recent lawsuit.

Liam Byrne

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Any credible source available instead ? That weasel would say anything if he thought it'd get him somewhere, as proven by a recent lawsuit.

True, and I was surprised to hear him spouting exactly the opposite to the FF line from not 6 months ago. I looked for his angle when I heard it, and all I could think of was that he was gently bashing the new government for not yet having scrapped the cut, but the fact remains that despite it, the jobless figures are still on the up, and it does appear not to have had any effect.

Pete M.

Bunker mentality already?

My mate blackiebest posted this on a regional forum earlier and I thought this was an appropriate place to share. So what do you think of this?

The piece isn't long and gives an insight into how one Junior Minister is handling the job.


http://soundcloud.com/oceanfm/minister-john-perry-fg-hangs?utm_source=soundcloud&utm_campaign=share&utm_medium=twitter&utm_content=http://soundcloud.com/oceanfm/minister-john-perry-fg-hangs


Not doing so well it seems.

Was just listening to joe duffy and his usual bunch of moaners. I normally can't stand his show, but there were actually some good points raised.

It's coming up to the first 100 days of Taoiseach E. Kenny, and i'd love to know:

What happened to hiring buses instead of expensive private drivers?
What happened to bringing an end to the corruption, nepotism, and "jobs for the boys" attitude in the Dáil and in our public service?
What happened to changing the public perception of politics in ireland?
What happened to "making the tough decisions"?
What happened to "sharing the pain around fairly?"
What happened to "not one red cent" more to crooked banks?

It's shameful. Is there really no way to hold these people to account for all the pre-election bullsh1t that they spun in order to get into power? I mean you expect it, to SOME level, especially from irish politicians, but the current administration is taking the p1ss....

Watching Peter Matthews of FG getting eaten alive on Vincent Browne. Totally unprepared and clueless, yet being wheeled out to defend the indefensible recent government u-turns and not even capable of trying.

Still no cut in bailout rates or structures, and now we see noonan telling us that income tax is likely to rise, after the pre-election promise that there would be no change. What's next?

thebman

I disagree Peter Matthews was unprepared TBH. Unwilling might be a better word.

Sierra Oscar

thebman wrote: »

I disagree Peter Matthews was unprepared TBH. Unwilling might be a better word.

You could clearly distinguish that he has absolutely no faith in what he was actually stating, all of which was dialogue that he was probably instructed to use by FG HQ.

In anycase, I am no supporter of this current government - but I really do not see it going the distance. I can see it collapsing in the face of mounting civil unrest after the next two budgets are implemented alongside with the associated austerity measures.

No doubt people will say that if we did not see social unrest under the FF government then the current government should be OK. I disagree. I believe that people did not take to the streets in violent demonstrations against the last government because they felt that there was an alternative in FG & Labour and they chose to wait and vent their anger in the ballot box when the opportunity arose. However when this government becomes unpopular there will be really very little choice for the voters. Accordingly I believe people will turn against the entire Irish political system.

I believe there is a very real chance that the first party political system of the Irish state could collapse in the near future.

Seloth

This is going to kind of jump from the "Anything but Finna Fail post".Quite recently I was talking to an older man who is involved with FF and was canvasing during the last election and he went on about how quite often they were given a response similar to that or "We cant vote for them this time" etc.Now he said his major gripe was when people stated they woudnt vote for FF as they caused this problem.

He stated why this angered him was is because people would often not look at FF policy's to help restore the economy but would blindly vote for another party as they offer the fast food equivalent of an economic plan.Now by all means he understood what FF role was in the recession and did think it was good for the party not to be in government(As well as being glad for those who have left and the interna changes going on) etc.but ignoring what party the man was in his words were true.

People did vote only for FG/Lab for this reason and the amount of the broken promises already is quite shocking.Being a student myself the one which blatantly annoys me the most is with Ruari Quinn.He made a pledge with the Union of students Ireland that he would not bring in Education fee's...Less than 100 days in he already broke that promise.

The same man as I mentioned in the beginning as well in which I'm quite often hear this on the radio is that when the opposition ask why did the FG/LAB coalition break these promises they're most common reply is that the former government put them into this position.Now what is annoying is that this is not a fair answer as they shouldn't have made such promises if they couldnt hold to them.

I despise party politics...at least in the way it currently works but I cant see it going anywhere.I think theres going to be a far more shift to the extreme left with partys such as SF and ULA gaining more power as was seen during this election.

It is truly an "Interesting" time for Irish politics.

thebman

Yes I don't buy the I'm not FF but... type posts.

I won't be voting FF or FG next election if FG don't get their act together.

Doesn't leave much options but I'm not going to vote for people who don't deliver on manifestos even if I have to work my way through the lot. This most likely makes me a SF voter next time if existing parties refuse to deliver the reforms they both promise (yes FF in opposition are promising reforms and failing horribly too).

Should add I'm not the only one I know with this opinion.

Seloth

thebman wrote: »

Should add I'm not the only one I know with this opinion.

To be honest I think that's the most common view at the moment as I said above in my own post.

In these next few years there probably will be huge juggling of different party's..Who knows maybe even the Green might come back heh.

But I can see SF growing quite big as of this.

Although we all have to admit it is still early to be judging who were going to vote for in the next election.

Sierra Oscar

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

when this government becomes unpopular there will be really very little choice for the voters. Accordingly I believe people will turn against the entire Irish political system.

I believe there is a very real chance that the first party political system of the Irish state could collapse in the near future.

I would dearly love to see it, but i don't have a lot of faith in the irish to bring about such a massive shift. Aside from pensioners and other vested interest groups like unions etc, we have shown that we won't come out and protest. At least not as just concerned citizens. I think this government will be judged on their success on turning the recession around regardless of their popularity. If they show they can steer the ship at least some way back toward safety, then as unpopular as they may be, they will probably be returned to office through lack of better options as well as the old "better the devil you know" attitude that has kept ireland from achieving its full potential over the last several decades.

I really don't see any other election option in terms of political parties in the current structure that won't result in a seismic shift in the day to day life of very many people in ireland. Who else from the current lot of options do we want running the country? Sinn Fein, with their pie in the sky economic policies, and less than a generation away from a smoking gun? Independents who are too concerned with vested interests and local politics and couldn't agree on a comprehensive programme for government if their life depended on it?

There really is very little option for a good government, short of a complete and real reform of the political system, which i can't see happening. It would take massive protest, which we don't do, and the only people with the power to enact it would all be part of our current political system.

Would turkeys vote for christmas? Nope.

Corsendonk

When does Enda start the Minister job reviews? Love to see how he handles a Labour Minister if they don't meet the standard set by him.

migemo

Am i alone in thinking that Enda Kenny is an idiot? Surely Fine Gael were always going to win the election? There was no way Fianna Fail were going to be returned. Why then did Kenny and company promise the sun, moon and stars if we elected them? Promises that they had no hope of delivering. And in the process alienate the country from Europe with his 'we'll show those Europeens who's boss' attitude. All they had to show for the 100 days was visits from the Queen (Thanks Mrs and Martin McAleese) and President Obama (Election coming up in America). And surely these were planned well in advanced and not during the couple of weeks of the Government.

Corsendonk

Can I recommend to anyone that posted in this thread to watch Yes Minister and Yes Prime Minister. Irish politics isn't much different.

Slydice

still 0 arrests of bankers after 100 days right?

unit 1

thebman wrote: »

Yes I don't buy the I'm not FF but... type posts.

I won't be voting FF or FG next election if FG don't get their act together.

Doesn't leave much options but I'm not going to vote for people who don't deliver on manifestos even if I have to work my way through the lot. This most likely makes me a SF voter next time if existing parties refuse to deliver the reforms they both promise (yes FF in opposition are promising reforms and failing horribly too).

Should add I'm not the only one I know with this opinion.

But surely you realise that NO party ever fulfills its election promises, even more so in recessionary times. Anybody who believed any of these so called election promises (which always seem to be vague) were naieve tbh. Enda Kennys only goal was to get elected and thats it.
Once in power (unfortunetly a coalition) they will then do what they see fit, except this time they are hamstrung by the bailout deal. The simple truth that people still do not seem to understand is that austerity is the order of the day, and keeping our heads down, unlike Greece, is actually part of their plan.
Once 2013 arrives and the new rules for dealing with bank debts are in place then they will make their move.
Untill then we are funded by the bailout and contrary to what the ps bashers keep on about, the deficit, we will turn it around if we, and the government hold our nerve.
While I suspect that this is their actual gameplan, no government would admit to anything like this, just like no government would ever admit to planning a devaluation, remember that. It's not pleasant, it's not fair, it's not very "open and transparent", but it's not impossible, and I think in the end Enda Kenny just might work out being one of our best leaders ever, we just won't realise it till some time after the fact.

EggsAckley

I thought Brendan Grace James Reilly's performance on the Frontline last night was pretty impressive. He answered every question convincingly and without evasion, seems to have vision and radical plans which the experts in the audience were willing to go along with, certainly no one rubbished them, as well as pragmatism in more immediate problems like the filling non consultant roles . One junior doctor contrasted the sense of despair under Harney with a new found hope under Reilly.
Prior to the election I had him down as all huff and bluster but now I'm beginning to think he may turn out one of the top performers of this cabinet

EggsAckley

EggsAckley wrote: »

I thought Brendan Grace James Reilly's performance on the Frontline last night was pretty impressive......Prior to the election I had him down as all huff and bluster but now I'm beginning to think he may turn out one of the top performers of this cabinet

I'd have to agree with this, i had always thought he was a strong opposition spokesperson on health who would make a good minister, and im happy to see him getting a shot. The man clearly has the will to straighten out the health service, and seems to be a bit more hands on and compassionate than his evil cow of a predecessor ever was. The biggest question however, is not whether he wants to effect change, it's whether the exchequer and the public sector unions will let him.

The health service in this country is just plain broken. I have seen and heard of Dickensian conditions in some of our major public hospitals recently. Mismanagement and bloated levels of staffing in the wrong areas and understaffing in others are to blame. Flexibility and agility are crucial to a company or organisation the size of the health service, and if you don't have them the problem just keeps getting worse and more and more expensive. Unfortunately, if the problem of the overbloated, inefficient health service is ever to be fixed, then the concept of flexibility of working arrangements will have to be re-introduced to it's workplace environment, and a lot of vested interests in management and staffing will have to be made a lot less comfortable. People will have to be laid off from their jobs or re-trained and re-deployed. Working arrangements, rates, contracts, and terms and conditions will all have to be looked at, and the culture of entitlement will have to go out the window. All of this will be a huge fight to achieve, based on the entrenched position of some union officials at the moment.

That's the real challenge Reilly has in front of him. Changing the culture of "looking after number 1" that's got us where we are. Good luck to him with it. Health has been a poisoned chalice in Irish politics for years, i would like to see him staying the course and effecting real change.

And LOL @ Brendan Grace. Minister "Bottler" is what i'll be calling him from now on.

thebman

unit 1 wrote: »

But surely you realise that NO party ever fulfills its election promises, even more so in recessionary times. Anybody who believed any of these so called election promises (which always seem to be vague) were naieve tbh. Enda Kennys only goal was to get elected and thats it.
Once in power (unfortunetly a coalition) they will then do what they see fit, except this time they are hamstrung by the bailout deal. The simple truth that people still do not seem to understand is that austerity is the order of the day, and keeping our heads down, unlike Greece, is actually part of their plan.
Once 2013 arrives and the new rules for dealing with bank debts are in place then they will make their move.
Untill then we are funded by the bailout and contrary to what the ps bashers keep on about, the deficit, we will turn it around if we, and the government hold our nerve.
While I suspect that this is their actual gameplan, no government would admit to anything like this, just like no government would ever admit to planning a devaluation, remember that. It's not pleasant, it's not fair, it's not very "open and transparent", but it's not impossible, and I think in the end Enda Kenny just might work out being one of our best leaders ever, we just won't realise it till some time after the fact.

Such logic that politicians will always lie is why we have lying politicians.

If we hold them to account like dogs, they will learn like dogs. Time to train Irish politicans to deliver on what they promise or not to promise it.

Chucky the tree

thebman wrote: »

Such logic that politicians will always lie is why we have lying politicians.

If we hold them to account like dogs, they will learn like dogs. Time to train Irish politicans to deliver on what they promise or not to promise it.

The reason politicians/political parties lie is to get elected, if they didn't lie they wouldn't get elected. It's like the chicken and egg story really. For them ost part the electorate are far to simple to be told the truth and then do what's right.

thebman

Chucky the tree wrote: »

The reason politicians/political parties lie is to get elected, if they didn't lie they wouldn't get elected. It's like the chicken and egg story really. For them ost part the electorate are far to simple to be told the truth and then do what's right.

Right so your unwilling to hold politicians to what they say before an election which is ridiculous as you can't vote for anybody if they are presenting you with fairy tale policies.

And hell with the last one your just saying we are too stupid to even try to have a functioning democracy.

Most people are smart enough to be told the truth and do what is right IMO but in Ireland, it hasn't been tried yet so how would we know?

People voted for FG to change and make cuts which was bad for them. If they really wanted to be clueless and vote for fairy tales they would have voted for the SWP or United Left Alliance etc...