Rottie Question

kennyw

Shanao wrote: »

Beautiful dogs. Have wanted a rottie for ages, pretty sure we'll get one eventually, though we'll have to move and get a bigger house first.

Thanks a mill.. i can tell ya now, you wont regret owning this fab breed. Just make sure you have the time to put into them as they do require alot of time an work..

im sure alot of other people will say to you also, that they are worth every bit of it and will give you everything they have in return.

andreac

Shanao wrote: »

Beautiful dogs. Have wanted a rottie for ages, pretty sure we'll get one eventually, though we'll have to move and get a bigger house first.

@ Andreac- what's the story with showing docked dogs over here? Is it the same thing that you cant show them if they've been docked after a certain time?

No, that law doesnt apply here. You can show a dog that has been docked at any time as its still legal to dock dogs in Ireland.

LucyBliss

kennyw wrote: »

have you got dogs yourself lucybliss..

I do, I have three. Rosie is a terrier cross, she was a rescue who was pregnant when we got her. We kept two of the pups and as they've grown and I've read various threads here, I've come to believe that Daddy was a bull terrier type dog because they display a lot of the temperament and are way bigger than Rosie. So they were 'hard' to train in that they made me work for every ounce of compliance they've given me but they're grand dogs, fantastic company & they all get on very well (despite being told that they'd be killing one another once they hit six months but we proved them way wrong!).

I'd love to get a Rottweiler or GSD in the future, but it seems disloyal to say that when I have these three because three dogs is my limit & I'd give my mother away before I'd give away any of them! (Sorry Mum!)

I have pictures of them here. Any excuse to show them off! Heh.

lrushe

kennyw wrote: »

When your training them for the show, on the stance.. how do you get them to keep their back legs braced.? is there a trick too making them hold it that way..??

If you take a good ring craft class they will show you most of the tricks of the trade, or if you can get someone in the breed to take you under their wing and divulge all their hard won knowledge even better, that's how I leant anyway

andreac

kennyw wrote: »

Thanks very much.. just wanted to clarify it.
The last thing i want to do is head out with them an have to turn around and come back..

But il be sure to be there for a look and to see your man cooper in action. He is stunning..

When your training them for the show, on the stance.. how do you get them to keep their back legs braced.? is there a trick too making them hold it that way..??[/QUOTE]

You just train them to stand and place their legs in a certain way. I started training my pup at 10 weeks old and you use food and basically move their legs into position by moving them and using a command.
If i meet you at the show in waterford ill show you how i trained mine.;)

**Vai**

andreac wrote: »

No, that law doesnt apply here. You can show a dog that has been docked at any time as its still legal to dock dogs in Ireland.

Did not know that, assumed it was the same as the UK. I know your dog is docked but I have to say its 1 thing I would never do. Im a big fan of tails, even on rotties and other breeds u dont usually see with them.

andreac

**Vai** wrote: »

Did not know that, assumed it was the same as the UK. I know your dog is docked but I have to say its 1 thing I would never do. Im a big fan of tails, even on rotties and other breeds u dont usually see with them.

Im sure we will eventually follow suit with the ban, but when i dont know.

toadfly

OP your dog is fab, rotties are such a gorgeous breed.

Just with regard tail docking I had my foster JRT at the vets on Monday for her shots and the vet commented that it's so nice to see her with a full tail and she was saying it is illegal for vets to dock now.

andreac

TillyGirl wrote: »

OP your dog is fab, rotties are such a gorgeous breed.

Just with regard tail docking I had my foster JRT at the vets on Monday for her shots and the vet commented that it's so nice to see her with a full tail and she was saying it is illegal for vets to dock now.

Its not illegal to dock in Ireland at the moment, but vets have been instructed not to do it as such, but its not illegal, yet.

kennyw

LucyBliss

'd love to get a Rottweiler or GSD in the future, but it seems disloyal to say that when I have these three because three dogs is my limit & I'd give my mother away before I'd give away any of them! (Sorry Mum!)

Hahaha thats priceless.. Fair play to you on the pack.. they seem so happy all munchin down the pigs ears.. My pair love them aswell, but htey last all of 2 min..lol

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TillyGirl Thanks very much..

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Andrea

You just train them to stand and place their legs in a certain way. I started training my pup at 10 weeks old and you use food and basically move their legs into position by moving them and using a command.
If i meet you at the show in waterford ill show you how i trained mine

Thank would be fantastic, Id appricate that alot. and also be nice to see your fella in the flesh. (",) Any help at all wud be great with training techniques.. the more info the better.

toadfly

andreac wrote: »

Its not illegal to dock in Ireland at the moment, but vets have been instructed not to do it as such, but its not illegal, yet.

That's what I thought alright.

kennyw

With relation to the tail docking situation..

Do many of you think that it makes much difference to the breeds which may "look" nicer to have a square finish rather than a hanging/waging tail..

I.e I personally think that the likes of boxers, it suits them to have the tail docked, also i think rotties look nice with there stumps. (",) and any other working dog that may need the tail removed for working purposes..

I do understand that tails are a great indication of what mood/emotion the dogs mind is in and its harder to judge/understand what the dog is thinking without tails..

Dogs have had there tails cut for years. Sum breeds are renowned for this trait. Why change it now.?

Just an opinon and wondering what you all might think of it..?

toadfly

I personnally think it's cruel and unnecessary to cut off a part of a dog purely for looks.

fatmammycat

Don't agree with docking at all, and if I ever get another dobermann I am going to insist the pup's tail remains undocked.

kennyw

I understand the unnecessary for looks sides of the statement you are saying.

with relation to the cruel sides of it, its painless once done correctly at the right age by the vet or by the registered breeder.

it is always going to come down to each persons opinon, thats the best things about these forums people like ourselfs can get to have a chat about what they feel an its always going to be a circle debate and it will only be made right by it been made Law all together.

I myself think it suits some breeds, i wouldnt say its something that has to happen.
If it came out in the morning as law that no docking is legal id support it 100 percent..

the main thing is that our pets are happy an kept happy and for our future pets are not put in harms way.

(",)

antomagoo

I much prefer to see a Rottie with a tail, esp when you see the poor job that was done on our girls tail. Docking the tail can affect their balance too

**Vai**

kennyw wrote: »

I.e I personally think that the likes of boxers, it suits them to have the tail docked, also i think rotties look nice with there stumps. (",) and any other working dog that may need the tail removed for working purposes..

I do understand that tails are a great indication of what mood/emotion the dogs mind is in and its harder to judge/understand what the dog is thinking without tails..

Dogs have had there tails cut for years. Sum breeds are renowned for this trait. Why change it now.?

Why change it to begin with? They were given tails for a reason, for many reasons actually. I do understand some working dogs need to have it done or at least thats what Ive been told but otherwise it should never be done. Its like cutting off a babies nose when its born and thinking, "hey yeah that looks much better".

kennyw

there is nothing worse than seen a botch/hack job on sum poor ol dog.. Yur right there is a balance issue once tail is removed, but if done at a young age they learn to cope very very well without..

have you got a rottie yurself Magoo.??

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Vai
I agree with both sides of the arguement. there is many people out there that are die hards for one way or the other.. thankfully, im just a pet lover and want to make sure the best is done for the dogs. Its not that i want every dog that is breed to have there tails removed.. or watever.. and i do understand that there is a lot more reasons to keep a tail than to loose a tail.. balance and communication are the big ones.

but going to the point of Its like cutting off a babies nose when its born and thinking, "hey yeah that looks much better". a dogs tail is not as extreme as a humans persons facial feature so its not relevant but i do get that you feel strongly about the removal of the tail.

As i said in an earlier post its to everyones own opinon so il respect that this is yours.

Im sure alot of people may agree or disagree with it, and have a lot of reasons for and against.. this is why the question was asked.. thanks for your input.

**Vai**

I wouldnt say Im die hard, Kenny, its not something I even think about usually because I feel its not something that needs to be thought about. I find it fairly open and shut to be honest. Granted, my example was extreme but that makes it no less relevant. As I said, for some working dogs, grand but otherwise it is just an aesthetic issue and that is the same as my overly-extreme point.
Anyway,as u say, its a matter of opinion and each to their own. Long as the dog is happy and healthy, thats the main thing.

kennyw

sorry vai, i wasn't intending on my point been picked up that your a die hard.. i wudnt judge ya even if you were, so its all gud..

Glad you have the same goal at heart that the dogs are happy an healthy.. (",)

antomagoo

kennyw wrote: »

have you got a rottie yurself Magoo.??

yup, female, Rosie about 2 1/2 - 3 yrs old

excuse to post pics

Whispered

kennyw wrote: »

with relation to the cruel sides of it, its painless once done correctly at the right age by the vet or by the registered breeder.

There is actually some debate about this, many people claim it is painful, and when you think about it, how could it not be.

Also - registered breeders can be you or me who decides to breed our registered dog, it really is no indication of any type of knowledge.

We are only beginning to fully understand exactly how important a dogs tail is to balance as well as social interaction with other dogs.

What is your opinion on ears being done?

piperh

My bitch was docked when we rescued her the day she was due to be pts, we nearly left her there because we were told she was a rottie/lab x and going to be a very big dog and i was unsure whether i'd have the space. Poor girl is no more a rottie x than i am so i understand even less the reason to dock her tail, and its very badly docked as well, the vet was horrified by the state of it.

Shanao

Personally, I despise docking and if i do get a rottie at some point, I will insist on it having a tail. Back when i was vet nursing, I had to watch a boxer pup being docked and it was one of the most horrifying things I have ever had to witness. I can understand some working dogs being docked, but I really dont see why boxers and rotties are still being done when its unnecessary. Not to mention that the docked tail (in my opinion anyway, though I'm probably way off) could be part of the reason rotties are a restricted breed. Its very hard to read the 'mood' of a docked dog, for both humans and other dogs alike, which has probably led to countless attacks when a distressed or anxious dog was pushed too far and no one could read it.
There is usually about two to three caudal vertebrae left when a dog is docked, so think about it, they are having several bones removed because people are used to how it looks. And even when done at a day or two old, they still have nerves so I dont see how they couldn't feel pain.

Personally, I hope it is banned here very soon.

LucyBliss

My dog Rosie's tail is docked. It was like that when we got her from the rescue. I don't like the idea of it myself and while there are no obvious signs of pain or distress in that area, she gives a warning noise anytime anyone or anything accidentally brushes against her in the tail/rear area. I assume it stems from the docking.

**Vai**

piperh wrote: »

My bitch was docked when we rescued her the day she was due to be pts, we nearly left her there because we were told she was a rottie/lab x and going to be a very big dog and i was unsure whether i'd have the space. Poor girl is no more a rottie x than i am so i understand even less the reason to dock her tail, and its very badly docked as well, the vet was horrified by the state of it.

Neither rottie nor lab, looks every bit a terrier to me. Shes absolutely gorgeous though.

**Vai**

LucyBliss wrote: »

My dog Rosie's tail is docked. It was like that when we got her from the rescue. I don't like the idea of it myself and while there are no obvious signs of pain or distress in that area, she gives a warning noise anytime anyone or anything accidentally brushes against her in the tail/rear area. I assume it stems from the docking.

Sounds like pain to me, why else would she give a warning growl? Might be a botch job and worth a vet visit.

piperh

**Vai** wrote: »

Neither rottie nor lab, looks every bit a terrier to me. Shes absolutely gorgeous though.

Thank you, Bonnys' my baby girl and we don't care what breeding she is but i think theres probably a few different ones in there lol. Clyde is a wheaten/lab x and the vet reckons the wheaten is obvious in him, he's a big gentle beast at 18kg already. Both spoilt rotton.

LucyBliss

**Vai** wrote: »

Sounds like pain to me, why else would she give a warning growl? Might be a botch job and worth a vet visit.

Oh, it's not a growl. It's the same noise she makes when she's lying on my lap and I have the audacity to stand up and she has to move, or when one of the other dogs comes over to see what toy she's playing with - a warning noise, a displeased noise. She was at the vet a few times with her cruciate ligament problem and she was okay with him checking her out in that area.
If I thought she was in pain, I'd have her at the vet in no time.