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AL Cadet programme
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Wise words :pac: I think I've come to see that things aren't that easy, from say my cousin who is an unemployed pilot and also from the members of boards. That is one reason why I'm glad that it doesn't require so specialist college courses for example, like I can persue other jobs and then come back to that when I've saved up enough.I can understand the 'dream job' idea. I felt the same. I was pretty sure when Aer Lingus and or the Air Corps saw my enthusiasm they would snap me up. But they declined my kind offer on the first occasion. There was sadly no second occasion as one stopped taking cadets and the other changed the rules.
You really have to leave the dream job notion behind and start considering it like any job. Just as anyone looking at accounting or architecture or Zoology. What are the requirements? What do I need? What are the job prospects and career prospects? You also have to be realistic and decide if you are really cut out for the job.
True. What I was thinking was to try and get inside for some work experience (difficult, I know... may have to pull a few strings) and see the different sides of working at an airline, whether it be as an FA, dispatcch, check in ect. I could have a chat and see what they all think. Then, I could try the IAA for tower. With this I could then try and aim for a simple job like that inside the airline, save up for a few years and then going about training for being a pilot. If my feelings towards the job change then hey, I've got plenty of money in my back pocket.You cannot depend on cadetships either. They might be gone next year and a whole new method of selection found. One thing you can be sure of though is that you will be paying for your training. Whether it be a cadetship or on your own initiative.
I know it's hard for a 16 year old to grasp this but you have to think about ten years into the future or even longer in terms of achieving your career ambitions as a pilot. That means you will have to make decisions now that will give you best chance of finding yourself actually sitting at an interview to be a pilot in any airline sometime in the future.
The key thing is not to throw all your eggs into the one pilot basket. It may not work out and you might end up wondering where it all went wrong.
Oh yeah, I never specifically meant EI it was just an example, and by the person I quoted I think. Still, there is a sense of patriotism for the big green birdsAlso don't get too caught up in getting into AL. We all know the saying: 'A bird in the hand.........' It doesn't matter about the colour of the aircraft or indeed the type. It's about the flying. Take any flying job.
But still, I would be happy with anything, except really Ryanair. They seem like they just dampen the job and make it like driving a bus on fear of losing your job.
Well he doesn't sound that smart about it then! Were his original plans very different?I know a guy who is about to throw away golden opportunity to work as a pilot. He has the ratings and the door is being held open for him but he still clings to the original idea and hasn't really grasped the opportunity. What will happen is that someone else will move in there and pass him by. He'll be left with his dream while the other guy will be getting on with the practical reality of his career.
See the thing is I don't know how to get in really without connections. I know there's plenty that I could throw into the letter, my grandad was up in the top three of airlinguses flyers because he commuted to the states back in the 90's and early 00's! Aswell I know a lot about fflying and airline working, my Granny was training for her PPL and so I read all her theory books and tought myself to fly on fsx. Inquisitive mind eh? The problem is trying to get these in without sounding too desperate. I feel like I need to get in though and see whta it's all sbout, and I've heard about people who got into EI without connections, had a good time and then got good references. This not being a perfect world, I'm just not sure how to set this plan into action... the nearest connection I have is someone flying for emirates..:rolleyes:On the point of connections, it's all about connections not just in Aer Lingus. In fact I am one of the few people I know who did it without connections. What I had was timing and luck. That's good but connections are better. You still have to meet the standards but having someone point you in the right direction is always a help.
Eitherway thanks for your reply, looks like there are going to be a lot of tough decisions..0 -
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I would suggest that perhaps that's not such a good idea. None of those jobs are particularly well paid, well except ATC. Essentially it was one of the mistakes I made. I got a job in aviation thinking I would use the money to learn to fly. In a way it worked but it wasn't well paid and without qualifications I couldn't rise up through the ranks and improve my salary, only when I got redundancy that I managed to finish the ratings. Those are perfectly good jobs to go into after you qualify as a pilot to mark time until a flying job comes your way. You can always find pilots doing these jobs waiting for their opportunity.
Your best bet actually is to go and get qualified in something you like that is sufficiently well paid that you can afford to either save hard or be in a position to borrow or both. Higher education of some sort.
It's also worth remembering that ATC is very desirable job in it's own right so thinking of it in terms of using it as a stepping stone is not neccessarily the best way. However I do know an EI Captain who started in ATC.
Low paid jobs are not a good idea for someone seeking to gather money to be a pilot. Unless you intend to be a teetotal recluse who never goes anywhere and only owns one pair of shoes, a 'I'd rather be flying' t-shirt and scruffy jeans, can't afford to have a girlfriend, lives with his parents and drives a bicycle while saving up for flying lessons. Then you'll need more than minimum wage. Not a good image for a future airline Captain.
The irony of becoming a pilot when haven't got the money upfront is that you have to make a success of one career to get to the other.
Oh the dissappointment
What was it, if you don't mind me asking you did? ATC actually sounds really interesting but I'm not sure if I could put up with the tediousness for a life long career. Also, how badly paid are other airline workers? What type of qualifications are actually needed to go up thorough the ranks? If it's languages I know Irish English French and have started learning Dutch. My mum and dad also speak German and Italian so I could learn those easily enough 
You seem to be very in the know anyway, as someone who would really, really love to work in aviation what would your tips be? Especially regarding LC languages. I'm turning 16 in a week and so from then I'm trying to get fit, maybe try and start logging the occasional hour but really I realistacally will end up studying and getting fit for a medical. I'm not unhealthy in any way, I just need some more strenght and fitness.
Also, do you know of the phone number of the HR department? That was what another thread told me to ring to have a higher chance of getting in. Anyway else to get in for WE? Because realistically, I'm still young and although it's the only area I have a passion in (before, hell a few weeks ago before I started to think about it more there was nothing at all that interested me) I want to know if I'm certainly interested, what is involved ect.0 -
Dubhaltach wrote: »Oh the dissappointment What was it, if you don't mind me asking you did? ATC actually sounds really interesting but I'm not sure if I could put up with the tediousness for a life long career. Also, how badly paid are other airline workers? What type of qualifications are actually needed to go up thorough the ranks? If it's languages I know Irish English French and have started learning Dutch. My mum and dad also speak German and Italian so I could learn those easily enough
You seem to be very in the know anyway, as someone who would really, really love to work in aviation what would your tips be? Especially regarding LC languages. I'm turning 16 in a week and so from then I'm trying to get fit, maybe try and start logging the occasional hour but really I realistacally will end up studying and getting fit for a medical. I'm not unhealthy in any way, I just need some more strenght and fitness.
Also, do you know of the phone number of the HR department? That was what another thread told me to ring to have a higher chance of getting in. Anyway else to get in for WE? Because realistically, I'm still young and although it's the only area I have a passion in (before, hell a few weeks ago before I started to think about it more there was nothing at all that interested me) I want to know if I'm certainly interested, what is involved ect.
You're like me 10 years ago!:D
Getting a job in Aer Lingus isnt as simple as picking up the phone and asking for one. It also pins you to Aer Lingus as you have zero chance with Ryanair if you worked in Aer Lingus, even as a toilet cleaner.
There is no real LC criteria for flying. A good grasp of maths and physics helps a fair bit for ATPLs but you could get by without them and with a basic maths knowledge. Languages are not really that so much of an issue. English is the language of the air and you would only need another language if you were based overseas and even then it's not a must.
Concentrate on school and getting good grades! It wont get you all the way but it looks better than failing stuff at any rate!0 -
You're like me 10 years ago!:D
Getting a job in Aer Lingus isnt as simple as picking up the phone and asking for one. It also pins you to Aer Lingus as you have zero chance with Ryanair if you worked in Aer Lingus, even as a toilet cleaner.
There is no real LC criteria for flying. A good grasp of maths and physics helps a fair bit for ATPLs but you could get by without them and with a basic maths knowledge. Languages are not really that so much of an issue. English is the language of the air and you would only need another language if you were based overseas and even then it's not a must.
Concentrate on school and getting good grades! It wont get you all the way but it looks better than failing stuff at any rate!
Never knew thata about ryanair. LEarn something new from boards every day I thought if you wanted anything to do with pax such as f/a you needed more languages for a better chance of the job 
True yes no job is guaranteed but then again aren't EI getting a big shipment in a few years? Do you by any chance know where to find their number? 0 -
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Ok, thanks for clearing it up for me. I guess it's just sit tight for a while and earn some money then go back when I'm older. It does seem strange, like you said though to try and get into a career just to make enough money that you can get out of it.Languages are always handy for a pilot and an airport worker but won't help much getting a pilot job. It may or may not help with other airport jobs. It won't do any harm. But the biggest emphasis for pilots is on technical subjects. Most pilots are technically oriented.
Ringing HR won't help, they'll tell you to send in a CV. But if you want to talk to them. Just ring the main number and ask to be put through.
As for describing ATC as tedious, ouch!:eek: It's far from it. Just listen in on any ATC frequency. Flying can be tedious too, everything can be.
Yes many airport jobs are low paid, most in fact. Even Aer Lingus now. Even pilots are low paid now in comparison with the past.
Aim to go to college is my advice and work from there.
Yes, I probably insulted a few ATC's there
*digs up rusty old radio* I dunno, I guess in my imagination I could picture every additional plane landed or that takes off another one off the list but by the end of the day you feel like you couldn't do any more, only to start the next day! These are the reasons I want to have a look in TY and see what it's all about 
Dubhaltach, I think you misunderstand what experience an airline looks for in a pilot. Working for an airline or for the DAA will give you a good insight into airport life but very little insight into day to day flight ops. To get to the level of dispatch or flight line ops you would have to move up the ranks of an airline and that would take many years. During the last Aer Lingus cadetship an awful lot of Aer Lingus ops staff applied and were turned down.
In this day and age it's dog eat dog and the only experience that matters to the vast majority of airlines, Aer Lingus included, is the numbers in your logbook and on what type of aircraft they were done. Most Aer Lingus newbies come in from other airlines with a few 1000 jet/tprop hours and maybe even an A320 type rating.
If you worked for Aer Lingus to fund your training...well that may be a problem. Pay aside, when another airline saw Aer Lingus on your CV at a pilot interview they would assume straight off the bat that there is a pretty good chance you were going to be leaving to go back given the chance. Ryanair who were and may in the future again be the biggest hiring force will not actually hire staff that worked at another airline. Airlines don't hire FOs...they hire future Captains and if it looks like you'll be on your merry way when Aer Lingus call that will not look good. Notable exceptions to this rule are Ryanair and Aer Arran who more or less know that most of their pilots will move on...but Ryanair wont hire you with Aer Lingus on your CV!
Well yeah, I didn't think that it's count for much flying experience but it would still be a day job in an area of intrest, although if it pays badly, like that, it's kind of pointless. What I don't get, thouhg, is the part in gold... I wouldhave thought that they might have appreciated someone they knew more maybe, also I remember people saying that if there was a cadetship it pays to be connected. Aswell there's a new shipment of AC in a few years, who knows who and how many they'll be hiring! Still, time to keep all doors open methinks.0 -
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Dubhaltach wrote: »I'm in the same situation as you, I don't know there's just something so alluring about it. And the fact that your office is just in another world must be nice I'm only 16 I'm going into transition year but still have the same tough decisions, try really hard to get a good LC and wait for a cadetship or work in other jobs in the airline to save up for modular training... I don't see my self even halving the 6k for a PPL never mind the 100k for the whole lot, but even if I need to spend years in some thing less interesting I still feel like it's a good goal. I'm like you, whenever we were driving up the old airport road I had my face glued to the window
Aer lingus is very alluring but being a pilot anywhere for any airline is the goal for now , But Aer Lingus is the dream try your best in the LC , I got my Results the other day went well Got the 3 C's in Higher level to apply for Airlines . The money side of training is mental I know , Cadets would be great would only have to come up with 50k ( Its do-able) some how ? . But look at Atlantic flight centre its 60-65k and Weston NFC do it for 68 . Hope you do well in the LC and hope you like me end up pilots 0 -
The Aer Lingus aptitude test is quite strict, you will need a good standard of English among other things. Not only that the same test is applied even to experienced pilots aiming to get into Aer Lingus.
I can understand the 'dream job' idea. I felt the same. I was pretty sure when Aer Lingus and or the Air Corps saw my enthusiasm they would snap me up. But they declined my kind offer on the first occasion. There was sadly no second occasion as one stopped taking cadets and the other changed the rules.
You really have to leave the dream job notion behind and start considering it like any job. Just as anyone looking at accounting or architecture or Zoology. What are the requirements? What do I need? What are the job prospects and career prospects? You also have to be realistic and decide if you are really cut out for the job.
You cannot depend on cadetships either. They might be gone next year and a whole new method of selection found. One thing you can be sure of though is that you will be paying for your training. Whether it be a cadetship or on your own initiative.
I know it's hard for a 16 year old to grasp this but you have to think about ten years into the future or even longer in terms of achieving your career ambitions as a pilot. That means you will have to make decisions now that will give you best chance of finding yourself actually sitting at an interview to be a pilot in any airline sometime in the future.
The key thing is not to throw all your eggs into the one pilot basket. It may not work out and you might end up wondering where it all went wrong.
Also don't get too caught up in getting into AL. We all know the saying: 'A bird in the hand.........' It doesn't matter about the colour of the aircraft or indeed the type. It's about the flying. Take any flying job.
I know a guy who is about to throw away golden opportunity to work as a pilot. He has the ratings and the door is being held open for him but he still clings to the original idea and hasn't really grasped the opportunity. What will happen is that someone else will move in there and pass him by. He'll be left with his dream while the other guy will be getting on with the practical reality of his career.
You would think this is the exception. In my experience it's not.
On the point of connections, it's all about connections not just in Aer Lingus. In fact I am one of the few people I know who did it without connections. What I had was timing and luck. That's good but connections are better. You still have to meet the standards but having someone point you in the right direction is always a help.
Agreed Cant depend on Cadetships but you have to look abroad too , For cheaper training or cadets like Etihad ,British Airways ,Flybe , + Loads More . Any Idea on how to fund the training can't really ask my mam and dad to Re-mortgage or get a Loan on the house can I ? The economy seems to be against me and everyone else ...... 0 -
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Rumours and not confirmed but lookslike recent process went well and theya re due back April 2013 to start type rating
Yalk is of repeating the process in 2013
I didnt want to restart this this ****wheel but I heard tell the pay/conditions for these cadets is very much in line with the standards set by Ryanair and it's ilk.
If the process re-runs(and I would regard that totally as a rumour) people should ask about the pay/base/conditions issue etc!0 -
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