AL Cadet programme

owenc

I was gonna apply for one of these programmes this year but now i'm kind of not sure. I have no flying experience (although my dad has a plane and i'm getting some hours soon). I got B's in my A levels this year.

With the thousands that apply why would they pick someone with no experience over an ex RAF pilot? I was reading pprune and the people on there said it was mostly ex pilots who got these jobs. In this case why even bother to advertise this as people like me haven't a chance.

Bsal

The cadetship is for people with zero flying time or maybe just a couple of lessons under their belt.

owenc

So if I get my ppl is that bad?

ArphaRima

The more you should know the more difficult questions they'll ask.
The majority of cadets have no previous flying experience. Anyone who says otherwise either doesn't know what they're talking about or are just trying to psyche you into not applying.

Tenger

owenc wrote: »

I was gonna apply for one of these programmes this year but now i'm kind of not sure. I have no flying experience (although my dad has a plane and i'm getting some hours soon). I got B's in my A levels this year.

With the thousands that apply why would they pick someone with no experience over an ex RAF pilot? I was reading pprune and the people on there said it was mostly ex pilots who got these jobs. In this case why even bother to advertise this as people like me haven't a chance.

ex-RAF and already qualified pilots will apply to EI under their direct entry program. As Above, cadetship is for EI to take people with little or no flying experience and mould them into future EI pilots. 1000's will apply for only under 2 dozen positions. Anything that sets you apart (ie already working towards a PPL) will be in your favour.

owenc

fluffer wrote: »

The more you should know the more difficult questions they'll ask.
The majority of cadets have no previous flying experience. Anyone who says otherwise either doesn't know what they're talking about or are just trying to psyche you into not applying.

Maybe the British Airways one is different.

It is a fantastic offering though as it gets you straight into a career. I am going for their one as they are a strong airline and i'd like to fly long haul.

owenc

Tenger wrote: »

ex-RAF and already qualified pilots will apply to EI under their direct entry program. As Above, cadetship is for EI to take people with little or no flying experience and mould them into future EI pilots. 1000's will apply for only under 2 dozen positions. Anything that sets you apart (ie already working towards a PPL) will be in your favour.

How do they pick people though?

Like what is the point in applying? Like if I say I have a plane and have been up tons of times will that make a difference?
(although my plane is a kit plane which is almost built so maybe I could say I have seen the inner workings of an aircraft lol)

Tenger

owenc wrote: »

How do they pick people though?

If I knew that I would be selling the information.
You get the gig by demonstrating an deep interest in aviation and a desire to be a pilot above all else. They will look for people who made the effort to get hours, to work at an airfield, to learn about the company,to know as much theory as possible. They will look at your confidence in interview, you performance on computerised tests and group excercises.

owenc wrote: »

It is a fantastic offering though as it gets you straight into a career. I am going for their one as they are a strong airline and i'd like to fly long haul.

You do know that you don't go straight to long haul? And EI do have some longhaul flying. Looking at it another way you should be applying to any and all cadet schemes if you really want to fly. Location/airline/aircraft or route type should not be an obstacle, if it is then you don't want it enough.

owenc wrote: »

Like what is the point in applying? Like if I say I have a plane and have been up tons of times will that make a difference?

If your attitude is "whats the point?" then you have already failed.
Look at it this way, 2 candidates...one has made the effort to get into an aircraft and get hours logged, the other had the opportunity but never bothered.....which would you pick?

owenc

Tenger wrote: »

I fi knew that I would be selling the information.
You get the gig by demonstrating an deep interest in aviation and a desire to be a pilot above all else. They will look for people who made the effort to get hours, to work at an airfield, to learn about the company,to know as much theory as possible. They will look at your confidence in interview, you performance on computerised tests and group excercises.

You do know that you don't go straight to long haul? And EI do have some longhaul flying. Looking at it another way you should be applying to any and all cadet schemes if you really want to fly. Location/airline/aircraft or route type should not be an obstacle, if it is then you don't want it enough.


If your attitude is "whats the point?" then you have already failed.
Look at it this way, 2 candidates...one has made the effort to get into an aircraft and get hours logged, the other had the opportunity but never bothered.....which would you pick?

I have work experience in an airport and i'm getting some hours this year although that might be risky.

I'm going to apply but i'm just not really having much hope of getting it due to the amount of people applying..

Tenger

owenc wrote: »

....
I'm going to apply but i'm just not really having much hope of getting it due to the amount of people applying..

That is not the attitude of a commercial pilot. You need to fix that, the interviewers can smell that as you walk into the room.

My last promotion interview I walked in 'knowing I had the job already' I was verging on cocky. I knew my own abilities and knew the role inside out. I had the experience and the knowledge to back up my confidence. And I had mulitple examples and incidents to back up my self assurance.
In my feedback meeting post-promotion the HR rep stated that my confidence and composure in the interview made me stand out from other candidates.

owenc

Well I am from the country and don't appreciate arrogance so I'm not going to act as if I am better than others

But anyway thank you for the advice it does make me more hopeful as reading PPRUNE it came across that anyone could apply.

Tenger

owenc wrote: »

Well I am from the country and don't appreciate arrogance so I'm not going to act as if I am better than others.

I am "from the country" too. (and not very far from your location either)
I didn't say be arrogant, I said be assured and confident. Arrogance is not wanted in a cockpit, but confidence, calmness and ability is.

And "better than others" isn't what you need to show. "more suitable as a candidate" is what you are aiming to prove. An applicant he thinks they are better than the others will not make the cut.



Now I have tried to give you some advice this morning. You asked and I answered. But in the past on this forum you have come across as negative towards opinions that do not match your own. (quote above being an example) I hope you do not exhibit this in person as this is not a good trait in a cadet. Being able to see others point of view is a good trait. I don't intend to sound mean to you, just trying to be honest. You are obviously interested in aviation by being a regular poster here.

owenc wrote: »

But anyway thank you for the advice it does make me more hopeful as reading PPRUNE it came across that anyone could apply.

Well anyone can apply, doesn't mean everyone should. EG I would love for my oldest son to apply, but I can see he doesn't have the mindset and/or focus to make it, so I'm not going to push him.
But allow the HR people to discard all the chancers and gob****es who throw their name in the hat. The 1000's applying are not your concern. You focus on yourself and ensure that whichever airline program you apply for want you to join them.

owenc

Ok. Well thank you lol.

Well flying isn't the only reason that i'm doing it. I'm also doing it for travelling and the money.
For me I am only interested in commercial planes, I have no interest or excitement when I see a private plane or a military jet..

phonypony

owenc wrote: »

I'm also doing it for travelling and the money.

Can of worms: opened

eatmyshorts

owenc wrote: »

Ok. Well thank you lol.

Well flying isn't the only reason that i'm doing it. I'm also doing it for travelling and the money.
For me I am only interested in commercial planes, I have no interest or excitement when I see a private plane or a military jet..

To be honest, from reading your posts, you'll only be wasting your time applying anyway.

billie1b

owenc wrote: »

Ok. Well thank you lol.

Well flying isn't the only reason that i'm doing it. I'm also doing it for travelling and the money.
For me I am only interested in commercial planes, I have no interest or excitement when I see a private plane or a military jet..

You should never become a pilot, a pilot does his/her job for the love of flying the aircraft, no matter which aircraft it is or where the destination, no pilot enters the job for the money as most aspiring pilots have to spend upwards of €80,000 to get to where they want to be, money should never be your priority, with that attitude I wouldn't like to fly with you.

KnotABother

owenc wrote: »

Ok. Well thank you lol.

Well flying isn't the only reason that i'm doing it. I'm also doing it for travelling and the money.
For me I am only interested in commercial planes, I have no interest or excitement when I see a private plane or a military jet..

Pilots make money? :pac:

If you want to be a pilot and want to love it the things you love should not be the money and the uniform and the cabin crew throwing themselves at you(the last thing they are likely to throw at you is themselves).

It's the sensation, atmosphere, the views and the challenge that excites a pilot. The one thing I can tell you is that the first 20 hours of flight training are a hoot...however the next 200+ are not. Couple that with vomit inducing study programs for your 14 ATPL written theory exams with 75% pass marks and limited sittings and the fun is even more absent.
Then if you survive the training minefield you have the probable joy of handing over a large sum to an airline for a job where you are paid peanuts and the CEO gets to punch you in the face 3 times a day 4 days weekly.

Having read your posts you are either very young or very immature...or perhaps a mix of both. If you want to be a pilot screw your head on or somebody else will be screwing you instead.

Killinator

Has a new cadetship been announced?

owenc

I really don't care about anything to do with relationships.. it annoys me how people automatically have this judgement against late teenagers. It is naive to expect a rural 18 year old to have a mature head about money and an unknown industry, give me a break.

Tenger

owenc wrote: »

I really don't care about anything to do with relationships.. it annoys me how people automatically have this judgement against late teenagers. It is naive to expect a rural 18 year old to have a mature head about money and an unknown industry, give me a break.

Having grown up in a rural part of south Ulster I can assure you that many 18 yr olds have a good head about money.

The industry is only unknown if you don't read up on it. You have I'm sure read many threads head and elsewhere about the race to the bottom in aviation over the last 10-15 yrs. The days of gold plated wallet wielding pilots are over. (unless you got to Mid East as a Captain perhaps) The reality is that begin an airline pilot is a job, a well paid job, but a job nonetheless. You will be up at 0330 some days, home after 0100 others. You will be doing 4 sector 10-12 hours days. You will be working 5 days a week, up to 160 duty hours a month. You will be tired after work, at work and at home. You will have to work your bollix off during the training to ensure you pass. You will continue to study throughout your airline career as a/c change, airline SOP change and perhaps you move up the ladder.

A Cadetship is seen as a golden ticket as the airline partially funds your training. On your own you could have to pay up to 100K Euro to get fully licensed.

There are several threads on boards that give blunt but true advice about being a pilot. Why not read up and try to decide how much you want this?
Travel and money are NOT good reasons to want to be a pilot.
As I stated above, you are obviously interested in aviation as you post here...but is it your passion? After the guts of 2 decades in the industry I still look at aircraft overhead, landing or taking off, it stills grabs at me.


As an aside you have stated your age as 18. Now can you get a sense of how some of your previous posts in other threads giving generalisations based on 1-2 experiences as fact can be seen as naive?

owenc

If you think i'm naive you have no clue about the typical teenager. (or even the Northern Ireland populace ) Most teenagers really do not care about life experiences or money; I know classmates who will now be heading to Queens to waste £3,000 a year on drinking/failing.

I'm not sure where my interest in aviation is but you and your fellow posters aren't exactly being encouraging. Living in rural NI I am at the end of my tether with this negative attitude towards anyone who goes outside their boundary.
I don't care what anyone says, I will be applying for these courses and if I am accepted I am accepted and if I am rejected I will just go onto UNI, it won't kill me.

I have been interested in airliners since about 6/7 and have always said I would be a pilot but as i've said before the main reason for this is the ability to travel and be in other countries at a moments notice. I am not interested in any other form of transport.
Time of operation does not bother me as I have a crappy sleeping pattern anyway. I'm sure after a few lessons I will know where I am at..

Oh and BTW I don't do sarcasm or this tough luck attitude..

basill

By all means apply to whatever scheme you choose since it will (for the most part) cost you nothing.

From the thousands upon thousands that apply some sort of online testing will whittle down the numbers to a more manageable level and to be brutally honest get rid of the time wasters and no hopers.

Of the few hundred that are called forward to the final stages you can safely assume that 90% will have done the following....

- prepared a quality CV
- brought a suit (you would be surprised what some people turn up in!!!!)
- had a haircut and shave (see above)
- know why they want to be a pilot and more importantly make sure that its a sensible reason backed up by a valid thought process
- know the target airline inside out having done an exhaustive due diligence eg: CEO, fleet size and type, route structure, profitability
- have read a number of interview books and be prepared to answer all the standard HR type questions eg: strengths/weaknesses, time of conflict etc etc.
- practiced various numerical and literacy exams using online sources
- trawled the interweb for any information that will be relevant in passing an airline interview
- plus a whole lot more that will show the interviewer that there is something about this person that makes them stand out

If hand on heart you cannot answer the above in the affirmative then I would be thinking of joining your buddies at Queens and enjoy a beer or two for three years. You never know you might learn something along the way and save yourself a trip to London or Dublin.

owenc

I know. I will have to speak to a professional before applying. Research will come when the program opens.

I am desperate to get out of this backward dump of a country, I have no interest in Queens. They didn't exactly present themselves well in their open day in any case.

Jack1985

owenc wrote: »

Well I am from the country and don't appreciate arrogance so I'm not going to act as if I am better than others.

PMSL, you come across as the most arrogant person on this forum!! You need to correct your attitude pronto, or your career will be job seeking. You've got plenty of very good advice, use it. Also as pointed out, if you want this job for money - you will not fit in well to the sector. Anyone who loves the job, the pay is second initially.

Tenger

owenc wrote: »

If you think i'm naive you have no clue about the typical teenager......

I'm not sure where my interest in aviation is but you and your fellow posters aren't exactly being encouraging. Living in rural NI I am at the end of my tether with this negative attitude towards anyone who goes outside their boundary.
I don't care what anyone says, I will be applying for these courses and if I am accepted I am accepted and if I am rejected I will just go onto UNI, it won't kill me.

I have been interested in airliners since about 6/7 and have always said I would be a pilot.....

I have 2 teens at home and as I stated I am from Ulster....an have most of my family still there. But I would agree with your assessment that many late teens only look 1-2 years in advance.

Being interested in aviation for over 10 years is a good start, I don't think anyone here has an issue with someone 'going outside their boundaries' In fact I would be impressed with your determination to leave what you know for further fields.

As I stated twice already you will receive blunt but honest advice from posters here who are already commercial pilots. Look at what basil posted above...some people would read that and then ask for the answers, others will do the research themselves.

I would encourage you to apply owenc. Don't be put off by the 1000's of other applicants, present yourself as est you can. And truthfully if you want this as a means to travel then see it as your chance, put everything you can into it. Just don't tell the interviewer that you want to use the job as a means to travel!

Scotty15

I'm 17,currently in 6th year and my plan is to get a job with my father for 4 or 5 years when I'm finished school while living as cheap as possible and just saving for an Intergrated or Modular course,I will also apply for the cadetships that come up.
My dream is to become a pilot and I have a plan.

billie1b

Scotty15 wrote: »

I'm 17,currently in 6th year and my plan is to get a job with my father for 4 or 5 years when I'm finished school while living as cheap as possible and just saving for an Intergrated or Modular course,I will also apply for the cadetships that come up.
My dream is to become a pilot and I have a plan.

The very best of luck to you

KnotABother

While funny, its not helpful to the ongoing discusion

Scotty15

billie1b wrote: »

The very best of luck to you

Thanks

ProfessorPlum

Good news for EI wannabes.

Check out http://careers.aerlingus.com

Opens on sept 14th