Is it morally wrong to buy weed?

Show Time

In a straight up choice between weed and drink then give me the weed every time. Alcohol is by far a worse drug in what it turns people into when they are drunk.

UglyBolloxFace

To the journalist (using that term lightly) who started this thread, do your own ****ing research!

jill_valentine

tayto lover wrote: »

Exactly, but the moral and legal issues still remain until the law is changed.

Sure, but in terms of the legal aspect, it's hard to justify legislation that's quite so patently absurd. The morality angle is complex, and varies depending on the circumstances of the individual, but I don't blame people for ignoring a law that serves nobody, particularly when it's so easy to do.

The law system in any country is a process. In Ireland, it has failed to move fast enough to reflect the society it serves in this and many other regards, so it's only natural people don't respect it.

Chuck Stone

tayto lover wrote: »

Involving children in the criminal justice system is never a good idea. So are you blaming the police instead of the parents as cannabis is still illegal or would you prefer that everyone turn a "blind eye" to the issue ?

I already said it was a parenting issue if children are doing stuff which is inadvisable - services could help parents and children with issues they might have. The fact that drugs are illegal only makes things worse.

You keep trotting out these red herrings and non-arguments. You've already said you support violence against non-violent people who choose to take drugs.

You support violence against non-violent people. I don't.

/debate.

tayto lover

jill_valentine wrote: »

Sure, but in terms of the legal aspect, it's hard to justify legislation that's quite so patently absurd. The morality angle is complex, and varies depending on the circumstances of the individual, but I don't blame people for ignoring a law that serves nobody, particularly when it's so easy to do.

The law system in any country is a process. In Ireland, it has failed to move fast enough to reflect the society it serves in this and many other regards, so it's only natural people don't respect it.

The big BUT is you get a criminal record in court which effects travel and job prospects so you cannot ignore the law.

Wetbench4

the latest studies show that cannabis actually has antitumor effects. I think this plant, which was part of everyday life up until the 20th century, has been campaigned as an evil drug to such an extent that people have forgotten the history of the wonder plant.

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/cam/cannabis/healthprofessional/page4#Section_26

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/cam/cannabis/healthprofessional/page1

The evidence that it inhibits or causes cancer in humans is still inconclusive because the proper studies on humans have yet to be performed, but it works on mice and rats.

Free The Weed

Seachmall

tayto lover wrote: »

The big BUT is you get a criminal record in court which effects travel and job prospects so you cannot ignore the law.

You can ignore the law if those things are irrelevant to you (self-employed, don't travel). Of course you'll still suffer the consequences (a fine?) which I agree you should do, even though I disagree with the law.

mikom

tayto lover wrote: »

Exactly, and is alcohol not illegal at that age too ? Is it also morally wrong ? I think you will agree that both answers are yes.

Alcohol is regulated.
Weed is unregulated.
Guess which one is easier to source on a school day by the average 12 or thirteen year old.
Do you see where I am going with this?
Or perhaps the dealers around your way ask for the Garda age card before dispensing....

tayto lover wrote: »

The big BUT is you get a criminal record in court which effects travel and job prospects so you cannot ignore the law.

Great way to keep the county ticking along....... more unemployables to support and we can't even rely on OZ to soak them up.
Do you see the flaw in the law?

tayto lover

Chuck Stone wrote: »

I already said it was a parenting issue if children are doing stuff which is inadvisable - services could help parents and children with issues they might have. The fact that drugs are illegal only makes things worse.

You keep trotting out these red herrings and non-arguments. You've already said you support violence against non-violent people who choose to take drugs.

You support violence against non-violent people. I don't.

/debate.

No you can't twist what people say to make a point. I said that the actions of the police are dictated by the law and if they have to use violence to uphold that law, even if as you claim it is an outdated law, then thats all the weapon they have. I support the law until its changed and you cannot deny that as it is there will always be criminals who will try to gain from the fact that drugs are illegal.

tayto lover

mikom wrote: »

Alcohol is regulated.
Weed is unregulated.
Guess which one is easier to source on a school day by the average 12 or thirteen year old.
Do you see where I am going with this?
Or perhaps the dealers around your way ask for the Garda age card before dispensing....

It does not effect the morality of the issue currently being debated.

Chuck Stone

tayto lover wrote: »

No you can't twist what people say to make a point.

I'm not twisting what you said - just highlighting it.

I said that the actions of the police are dictated by the law and if they have to use violence to uphold that law, even if as you claim it is an outdated law, then thats all the weapon they have. I support the law until its changed and you cannot deny that as it is there will always be criminals who will try to gain from the fact that drugs are illegal.

Yes ^^ you support violence against non-violent people - that's exactly what youre saying - you are twisting words not I.:rolleyes:

tayto lover

Wetbench4 wrote: »

the latest studies show that cannabis actually has antitumor effects. I think this plant, which was part of everyday life up until the 20th century, has been campaigned as an evil drug to such an extent that people have forgotten the history of the wonder plant.

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/cam/cannabis/healthprofessional/page4#Section_26

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/cam/cannabis/healthprofessional/page1

The evidence that it inhibits or causes cancer in humans is still inconclusive because the proper studies on humans have yet to be performed, but it works on mice and rats.

Free The Weed

The Health issue is only part of the debate. Mice and rats do not get criminal records and don't choose to be used in experiments. Is it morally right to break the law as it stands ?

mikom

Originally Posted by mikom
Alcohol is regulated.
Weed is unregulated.
Guess which one is easier to source on a school day by the average 12 or thirteen year old.
Do you see where I am going with this?
Or perhaps the dealers around your way ask for the Garda age card before dispensing....

tayto lover wrote: »

It does not effect the morality of the issue currently being debated.

The morality of allowing children access to weed due to the current prohibition and regulatory setup you mean.

tayto lover

Chuck Stone wrote: »

I'm not twisting what you said - just highlighting it.



Yes ^^ you support violence against non-violent people - that's exactly what youre saying - you are twisting words not I.:rolleyes:

BECAUSE its against the law of the land. Irish law. I also support violence if it is used for self-protection so do you think thats wrong too ?

jill_valentine

tayto lover wrote: »

The big BUT is you get a criminal record in court which effects travel and job prospects so you cannot ignore the law.

That's a decision for the individual to make. For now, it's up to them if that's a risk they want to take. Thousands of people do, without ending up among the few token convictions. If the law is not morally just - which it isn't - nor consistently enforced - which it isn't either - then you cannot expect it to be held in absolute esteem.

The question of whether it's moral to break the law is a distinct one to the question of whether or not it is moral to break this law. We're not asking the former here.

Seachmall

tayto lover wrote: »

The Health issue is only part of the debate. Mice and rats do not get criminal records and don't choose to be used in experiments. Is it morally right to break the law as it stands ?

Laws don't define morals. You, as an individual, define your own morals. As do I.

"One has a moral responsibility to disobey unjust laws" - MLK

tayto lover

mikom wrote: »

Originally Posted by mikom
Alcohol is regulated.
Weed is unregulated.
Guess which one is easier to source on a school day by the average 12 or thirteen year old.
Do you see where I am going with this?
Or perhaps the dealers around your way ask for the Garda age card before dispensing....




The morality of allowing children access to weed due to the current prohibition and regulatory setup you mean.

You cannot continue to leap-frog the morality issue. The law is there so is it morally wrong to break it ?

Fluorescence

tayto lover wrote: »

Exactly, and is alcohol not illegal at that age too ? Is it also morally wrong ? I think you will agree that both answers are yes.

It is. And regulations are in place to prevent alcohol getting into the hands of minors. It is incredibly easy for youngsters to get their hands on weed (much much easier than booze). If it was legalized and regulated in a similar fashion to alcohol, it would be more difficult for minors to obtain (not impossible, but these things never are :P ). Considering weed is only really harmful healthwise to people under the age of about 20 (and still less so than tobacco or alcohol) would you not agree this is a good solution?

The links between weed and mental illness are tenuous at best to be honest. There's no screening between patients with prior history of poor mental health and and those who are stable. Although weed can cause some amounts of paranoia, it tends to only do so in a large degree in people who are already depressed or psychotic (exacerbating their symptoms more so than causing them). Mentally ill people are advised to abstain from mood-altering substances like alcohol, tobacco etc anyway, so why would cannibis be any different?

Wetbench4

A law is usually a majority opinion, and when it comes to weed, the majority seems to be shrinking as the years go by.
Also the human body has a whole system designed for cannabis, like natural thc receptors in the brain, which have no other use than for cannabis. This shows the the human body has evolved over millions of years , for the use of weed. Who are we to disagree with evolution and mother nature.

So i personally think its morally wrong to make it illegal.

tayto lover

jill_valentine wrote: »

That's a decision for the individual to make. For now, it's up to them if that's a risk they want to take. Thousands of people do, without ending up among the few token convictions. If the law is not morally just - which it isn't - nor consistently enforced - which it isn't either - then you cannot expect it to be held in absolute esteem.

The question of whether it's moral to break the law is a distinct one to the question of whether or not it is moral to break this law. We're not asking the former here.

I know plenty of people who have convictions and as such are not allowed to travel to the U.S., Canada, Australia etc Tell them that their convictions are just token.

jill_valentine

I'm pretty sure they can probably look at the dozens of others they'd know of who've suffered no such penalties and see for themselves.

tayto lover

Seachmall wrote: »

Laws don't define morals. You, as an individual, define your own morals. As do I.

"One has a moral responsibility to disobey unjust laws" - MLK

So i can go to court on any charge and plead that i am morally against that law. How do you think i would get on ?

tayto lover

jill_valentine wrote: »

I'm pretty sure they can probably look at the dozens of others they'd know of who've suffered no such penalties and see for themselves.

That would just add fuel to the fire and make them feel worse.

tayto lover

Wetbench4 wrote: »

A law is usually a majority opinion, and when it comes to weed, the majority seems to be shrinking as the years go by.
Also the human body has a whole system designed for cannabis, like natural thc receptors in the brain, which have no other use than for cannabis. This shows the the human body has evolved over millions of years , for the use of weed. Who are we to disagree with evolution and mother nature.

So i personally think its morally wrong to make it illegal.

It has been already made illegal. When it becomes legal then i will support that law too and feel morally right, but its not and as such is illegal.
The very high T.H.C. content is very bad for your lungs too so there are still swings and roundabouts.

jill_valentine

I'm not trying to be confrontative, but I'm at a loss as to your thought process here.

mikom

tayto lover wrote: »

So i can go to court on any charge and plead that i am morally against that law. How do you think i would get on ?

If you were a gay man caught in a homosexual act and dragged up in front of the court a few years back, how would you plead? And how do you think you would get on?

tayto lover wrote: »

It has been already made illegal.

Give me a one or two line answer as to why it was made illegal.

FlutterinBantam

mikom wrote: »

Alcohol is regulated.
Weed is unregulated.
Guess which one is easier to source on a school day by the average 12 or thirteen year old.
Do you see where I am going with this?
Or perhaps the dealers around your way ask for the Garda age card before dispensing....


Great way to keep the county ticking along....... more unemployables to support and we can't even rely on OZ to soak them up.
Do you see the flaw in the law?

No ,I don't see any flaw in the law.

Chuck Stone

tayto lover wrote: »

BECAUSE its against the law of the land. Irish law. I also support violence if it is used for self-protection so do you think thats wrong too ?

That is not the initiation of violence. Self defence is what happens when someone else initiates violence against you.

More red herrings and obfuscation.

I'm getting bored of this tbh.

mikom

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

No ,I don't see any flaw in the law.

Give the specs a clean there horse.

FlutterinBantam

Going for the cryptic approach are we?

What flaw are you referring to sir?