Margarine and gaol

pickarooney

Why are they seemingly alone amongst English words in having a soft G before a broad vowel?
Are there any others?
Some people reckon 'marjareen' is wrong and that it should be pronounced with a hard G but I've never heard the same said of 'gaol'.

Dunjohn

A quick snippet from Wikipedia:

Generally, ‹g› is soft before ‹e›, ‹i›, and ‹y› in words of Romance origin, and hard otherwise; there are many English words of non-Romance origin where ‹g› is hard regardless of position (e.g. get), and three (gaol, margarine, algae) in which it is soft even before an ‹a›.

So it seems to be down to origin. Still, the fact that there's a pattern to when "g" is hard or soft is something I'd never noticed before, which might be useful, thanks!

pickarooney

I've been pronouncing algae with a hard G for a long time...

Dunjohn

...so have I...

...But it seems that either is acceptable. I've come across two pronunciations; "al-jee" and "al-gai."

Yakuza

It must be a bugger for folks learning English. There's no consistency about the sound of the G, be it before a broad or slender vowel.

"the old git was having a gin and tonic" (hard and soft g's respectively)

"I will get a gesture of support from them" (again, hard and soft g sounds).

As noted above, ga can have a hard or soft g sound. I can't think of any go- or gu- sounds that have a soft g, but 3 out of 5 vowels have words with both types of sound. Words with the gy (y as a semivowel) all seem to have a hard g too.

In the context of computer graphics, a "gif" is a format of image (it's an acronym of Graphics Interchange Format, but it has been adopted into the technical lexicon as a word in its own right). I pronounce it gif (hard g) but any Americans I know say "jif". But then again, they talk about "erbal" tea so what do they know, eh? )

pickarooney

Yakuza wrote: »

As noted above, ga can have a hard or soft g sound. I can't think of any go- or gu- sounds that have a soft g, but 3 out of 5 vowels have words with both types of sound. Words with the gy (y as a semivowel) all seem to have a hard g too.

Gyroscopes, gyrations... I read a version of Jabberwocky recently which gave Carroll's own notes on how to pronounce all the made-up words. Needless to say I'd been pronouncing the all wrongly.

looksee

Badger, badge, lodge, fudge, bridge - what is the d for?. Then there is large, forge, sponge. And fugue with a hard g amongst all those vowels!

pickarooney

looksee wrote: »

Badger, badge, lodge, fudge, bridge - what is the d for?.

To shorten the vowel.

Then there is large, forge, sponge. And fugue with a hard g amongst all those vowels!

Fugue has a broad vowel (u) after the 'g', like monologue, segue, harangued and Montague.

looksee

pickarooney wrote: »

To shorten the vowel.



Fugue has a broad vowel (u) after the 'g', like monologue, segue, harangued and Montague.

Fair points, thanks I thought after I had posted that I was probably stating the obvious/missing the point.

metrovelvet

Bernard Shaw's spelling for FISH = GHOTI.