TUF 14:Bisping V Mayhem

DrPhilG

Deleted User wrote: »

Overlooking "The Filipino Wrecking Machine"?
Munoz is next in line imo. if he beats Leben that is, then Chael then winner of Bisping/Mayhem.

I reckon Chael talks himself into the shot though and then Munoz Vs Bisping/Miller for the next one.

I think Munoz or any other contender needs to beat one of the top ranked guys in the division. Belfort, Okami, Sonnen are the three that I'd put in that category at the minute.

Maia is close enough to that group to be considered worthy for Bisping to gain a title shot off the back off and Bisping would IMO beat him. He wouldn't beat Belfort, Okami or Sonnen.

DrPhilG

DrPhilG wrote: »

I think Munoz or any other contender needs to beat one of the top ranked guys in the division. Belfort, Okami, Sonnen are the three that I'd put in that category at the minute.

Maia is close enough to that group to be considered worthy for Bisping to gain a title shot off the back off and Bisping would IMO beat him. He wouldn't beat Belfort, Okami or Sonnen.

But Maia just lost to Munoz. Munoz is on a three fight winning streak now, if he beats Leben he should get the shot.

Maia needs a few more fights until he's a top contender again, also Dana is going to be a bit apprehensive about making another Silva Vs Maia.

Lets look at Bisping and Munoz in terms of their last three fights. You're only as good as your last three anyway.
Bisping has beaten: Jorge Rivera, Yoshihiro Akiyama and Dan Miller.
Munoz has beaten : Aaron Simpson, CB Dolloway and Demian Maia.

I think Munoz faced the higher level.

Kent Brockman

Sorry guys but can someone tell me where and when this series is being shown?
I can find them online (well the first 3 episodes so far), and can't wait to see the next one........batter that mole lol!

DrPhilG

Deleted User wrote: »

But Maia just lost to Munoz. Munoz is on a three fight winning streak now, if he beats Leben he should get the shot.

Maia needs a few more fights until he's a top contender again, also Dana is going to be a bit apprehensive about making another Silva Vs Maia.

I'm not saying that Maia is a top contender. I'm saying that he's high profile enough to be passed off as one if Bisping beat him, so they could propel Bisping straight to a title shot rather than have him face Belfort, Sonnen or Okami.

DrPhilG

DrPhilG wrote: »

I'm not saying that Maia is a top contender. I'm saying that he's high profile enough to be passed off as one if Bisping beat him, so they could propel Bisping straight to a title shot rather than have him face Belfort, Sonnen or Okami.

No I don't think he is, he'd have to beat Okami to have any shot at the title imo.
Belfort wouldn't be high profile enough either. The middleweight division is getting a complete overhaul atm. The up and comers are starting to establish themselves. Tim Kennedy was just signed also.

Bloodyelbow.com wrote:

The UFC's dismantling of Strikeforce looks to have continued with Tim Kennedy. Kennedy recently added the Ultimate Fighting Championship to his employers on Facebook:

Kennedy could be referencing the fact that the UFC owns Strikeforce, and, by proxy, he's employed by the UFC. But, then again, it seems like a random thing to do seven months after Strikeforce was purchased, no?

So, the UFC's come after the heavyweights and the light heavyweights and the welterweights and the lightweights and now it appears as if they're coming after the middleweights. UFC President Dana White will never say it, but I don't think there's much ambiguity with what they WANT Showtime to choose in 2012.

Bloody Elbow has reached out to sources close to Kennedy. We've yet to hear confirmation back, but we will update this post once we receive word.

Kennedy defeated Robbie Lawler by decision in his last fight in July at the "Fedor vs. Henderson" event.

[Update] The UFC's UK website has a profile for Kennedy. (Thanks to Bloody Elbow member MattParker17.)

[Update #2] UFC.com now has Kennedy's profile as well. I think you can just about wrap this one up.

DrPhilG

Bisping - I'm the top contender.



So please...
Kennedy - I'd fight Bisping for free.

Oh_Noes

Thought that was p1ss poor last night, it has been a very poor season so far. I didn't think Mayhem would be 4-0 at this stage judging from the preliminary fights on the first show of the season. It looks like he wins next week as well from the flare-up shown on the preview.

I think that guy from Miller's team is fairly vulgar with all his Jesus stuff too. I wouldn't be in the least bit anti-Christian or anti-religious in any way but that guy seems like he's three jesuses away from the loony bin. I hope someone on the show has good submissions and eventually knocks him off the show by finishing him with a crucafix, it's the only thing that can save this season for me at this stage.

I could never understand why so many people took a disliking to Bisping either in the past but he just seems like such an annoying twat on this season.

MrStuffins

Oh_Noes wrote: »

Thought that was p1ss poor last night, it has been a very poor season so far.

I disagree, I think it's been really good. The second fight last night was a cracker IMO.

MrStuffins

MrStuffins wrote: »

I disagree, I think it's been really good. The second fight last night was a cracker IMO.

Yeah I thought it was good. More fights less drama.

Kent Brockman

Just about to watch 2nd half of episode. That guy took some hammering in the first fight.....

loremolis

Kent Brockman wrote: »

Just about to watch 2nd half of episode. That guy took some hammering in the first fight.....

....and the second.

El Guapo!

I actually really enjoyed that episode. Great 2nd fight. I agree he's a bit over the top with the "Praise Jesus" thing, but its his beliefs so leave him to it I say.
Bisping is a shíte coach. From not turning up at the fight announcment to his shouting terrible instructions in his corner - he hasn't got a patch on Mayhem.
Mayhems corner instructions are, for the most part, calm, clear, and good instructions. And all of his fighters seem to respect him more than Bispings team does.
I think this season has been great so far. Much better than the last few anyway. Lookin forward to next weeks episode now.

Oh_Noes

MrStuffins wrote: »

I disagree, I think it's been really good. The second fight last night was a cracker IMO.

Thought it was a one-sided beatdown like the first tbh. The green haired guy did show some good technique but as soon as the jesus freak connected his knee, he had the fight sewn up. I am glad there was less in the way of "misleading" build up by the editors but still I think it's been poor so far compared to the last(?) one with Lesnar and Dos Santos.

MrStuffins

Oh_Noes wrote: »

Thought it was a one-sided beatdown like the first tbh. The green haired guy did show some good technique but as soon as the jesus freak connected his knee, he had the fight sewn up. I am glad there was less in the way of "misleading" build up by the editors but still I think it's been poor so far compared to the last(?) one with Lesnar and Dos Santos.

Well a onesded beat down can still be a great fight. Thought the Diaz v Gomi fight was awesome last time out and they don't come more one-sided!

loremolis

Dean09 wrote: »

I actually really enjoyed that episode. Great 2nd fight. I agree he's a bit over the top with the "Praise Jesus" thing, but its his beliefs so leave him to it I say.
Bisping is a shíte coach. From not turning up at the fight announcment to his shouting terrible instructions in his corner - he hasn't got a patch on Mayhem.
Mayhems corner instructions are, for the most part, calm, clear, and good instructions. And all of his fighters seem to respect him more than Bispings team does.
I think this season has been great so far. Much better than the last few anyway. Lookin forward to next weeks episode now.

Not only is Bisping a sh1te coach, he's a complete asshole.

I don't just think Mayhem with beat him, I think that he'll destroy him.

I always liked Mayhem and he's coming across very well in this season.

He did a podcast with Joe rogan a few weeks ago and he sounds like a really nice and genuine guy ( even though he's nuts).

reganreggie

Just shouting stand the f**k up does not constitue coaching. He was a dick when he was a contestant and is a dick as a coach.

pauldoo

That was shocking coaching, its come up on another thread, but the tactics of the wolfslair are questionable. Bisping is shown to be a terrible coach here, Rampage was terrible in his TUF, Rampages corners advice against jones was awful, Kongos tactics have been iffy, my favourite was Bisping circling towards Hendos right hand.

I know Bisping won a previous TUF, but his team were far stronger than hendos

scudzilla

I'm getting the feeling that Bisping would happily lose the series 8-0 if he was gauranteed to beat Miller. That's just the kind of guy he is

Ush1

pauldoo wrote: »

That was shocking coaching, its come up on another thread, but the tactics of the wolfslair are questionable. Bisping is shown to be a terrible coach here, Rampage was terrible in his TUF, Rampages corners advice against jones was awful, Kongos tactics have been iffy, my favourite was Bisping circling towards Hendos right hand.

I know Bisping won a previous TUF, but his team were far stronger than hendos

I agree. Always dubious of coaches who just shout slogans at fighters rather than giving actual technical advice.

Best bit was in one of the fights where Mayhem says "He's got Bisping coaching him grappling right now". :pac:

MrStuffins

reganreggie wrote: »

Just shouting stand the f**k up does not constitue coaching. He was a dick when he was a contestant and is a dick as a coach.

Someone tell me if i'm wrong please, but do I remember correctly in thinking that when round 2 started, it went at least 2 minutes without Bisping coaching him at all?

"STAND UP!!!"

Give that man an award!

RoboRat

Someone tell me if i'm wrong please, but do I remember correctly in thinking that when round 2 started, it went at least 2 minutes without Bisping coaching him at all?

In fairness he was trying to coach in the first round (badly IMO), and I even got pissed off when Bass wasn't doing anything that Bisping was telling him even though it was bloody obvious that he needed to stand up. I think Bisping got especially pissed off when he was stuck against the cage and tried to tie Bermudez up rather than push against the cage and stand up, which is what Bisping was telling him to do. As Bisping said, he was eating punches on the ground so he may as well try and get off the ground and at least give himself a chance - something that Louis at least tried to do!

Ush1

Didn't like the public scape goating of Bass either after he came to Bisping in private to talk.

El Guapo!

Ush1 wrote: »

Didn't like the public scape goating of Bass either after he came to Bisping in private to talk.

Yeah that annoyed me too. On one hand Bass only had himself to blame for losing the fight and he couldn't blame the coaching really. But on the other hand he was right to stand up to Bisping and basically say that his coaching was awful. And then the rest of the team licked Bispings arse. I remember one of them shouting "We're with ya coach" :rolleyes:
Fair enough I know they don't really wanna rock the boat or anything but at least show some balls and tell the truth.

MrStuffins

I think there was a bit of sillyness in both camps. Bisping's coaching was awful so i'm sure the fighter was annoyed, but that wasn't why he lost. I mean, IIRC didnt he throw up his legs in some sort of stupid pulling guard technique at one point whle being pressed againt the cage? Clown!

And Bisping should never have pulled it public like that! i can't imagine any other coach doing this. They'd have had a man to man. What Bisping was doing was trying to embarrass him and get the fighters on his side! Clown #2!

scudzilla

Watching Episode 5 live, 16 minutes in and already well into the 2nd commercial break :(

Minstrel27

My dislike for Michael Bisping wont be going away anytime soon. That's for sure.

MrStuffins

PRE FX BROADCAST SPOILERS BELOW!!!!







Great episode! Really enjoying this season.

What I didn't get was why a guy who called himself "the cream of the crop of grapplers" and had horrible stand up technique during the fight wouldn't be shooting for takedowns and looking to control the fight on top and looking for subs.

As far as the tap goes, it looked like he wanted to tap, the message went from his brain to his hand to tap..... and he changed his mind. Tough one!

And as for Bisping, he's not covering himself in glory here. Especially turning up late for the weigh-ins seemingly to get lunch (or whatever it was in the bag).

Oh_Noes

That prank with the parking space was gas. I can't believe how Miller just threw his car into it without looking in the first place. I like Miller though and I agree with the poster who said he's coming across well. The same can't be said for Ryan Parsons who was taunting Bisping after breaking up the weigh in fight and then sprayed him with water. Surprising as well how Keith Kiser got in the ring and gave Bisping's fighter a warning like that. I thought these were classed as exhibition bouts?

The fight itself was ok, I think both of those fighters were capable of more though and looked a bit nervous. It's been the same all season since the first show. I thought they were all a lot more exciting in the qualifying show. The best so far in my opinion was the green haired guy from last week even though he lost.

scudzilla

Oh_Noes wrote: »

That prank with the parking space was gas. I can't believe how Miller just threw his car into it without looking in the first place. I like Miller though and I agree with the poster who said he's coming across well. The same can't be said for Ryan Parsons who was taunting Bisping after breaking up the weigh in fight and then sprayed him with water. Surprising as well how Keith Kiser got in the ring and gave Bisping's fighter a warning like that. I thought these were classed as exhibition bouts?

The fight itself was ok, I think both of those fighters were capable of more though and looked a bit nervous. It's been the same all season since the first show. I thought they were all a lot more exciting in the qualifying show. The best so far in my opinion was the green haired guy from last week even though he lost.

Even though they may be classed as exhibition bouts they still come under control of the NSAC, hence Kiser's involvement in this.

IMO he was spot on and nipped any further trouble right in the bud

Minstrel27

Do the qualifying fights qualify for the fight of the season because they were far better.

Kent Brockman

Thought he tapped myself. It certainly messed with the other guys head, feeling that he has already won the fight but had to continue.

If the other guy did tap and then pretended he didn't, he deserves to get something snapped the next time he taps and is a disgrace to the sport imo.

Something similar happened with CB Dollaway wher he tapped but then tried to withdraw it after the guy released a bit of pressure on the arm. Ref called it though.
Also saw something in pride where a guy tapped and the other guy released the hold there was a big pow-wow about it and the fight was restarted. The original winner then put on the same submission hold and did some damage before the ref forced him to release. (thats what I was hoping for here)

Ian Whelan

That was a tap, no question about it. I could be said that Herb Dean was perhaps under instruction to give Bisping's fighter the benefit of the doubt in any situation which might arise in order to avoid this series becoming an absolute walkover. If anybody watched Nelson v Kimbo in TUF previously Herb Dean was obviously under instruction not to stop Kimbo if it was at all avoidable. Kimbo was the big draw for the fans and even though Nelson had landed about 19 unanswered strikes Herb Dean still wouldn't stop the fight and allowed Kimbo to fail to defend himself until the round ended.

Bisping's an absolute idiot with the IQ and attitude of a 12 year old and Akira is not far behind him.

MrStuffins

Ian Whelan wrote: »

That was a tap, no question about it. I could be said that Herb Dean was perhaps under instruction to give Bisping's fighter the benefit of the doubt in any situation which might arise in order to avoid this series becoming an absolute walkover. If anybody watched Nelson v Kimbo in TUF previously Herb Dean was obviously under instruction not to stop Kimbo if it was at all avoidable. Kimbo was the big draw for the fans and even though Nelson had landed about 19 unanswered strikes Herb Dean still wouldn't stop the fight and allowed Kimbo to fail to defend himself until the round ended.

Sigh.................

El Guapo!

I have to admit I thought it was a tap, but if the ref doesnt call it then it doesnt count. He shouldn't have released the submission until the ref stepped in.
As for Herb Dean being under instruction to favour Bispings team.......I really don't believe that at all. Either he didn't see the tap, or he didn't think it was a tap. Either way, to think he didn't call the tap on purpose is a bit much I think.

I enjoyed that episode even though the fight wasn't the best so far. Millers guy was supposed to be a great grappler yet he hardly shot for a takedown and when he did it wasn't very good. Akira is heavy handed and could be a decent fighter if he calms down a bit. He's a bit too hot-headed and lets that interfere with his fight.

Miller is a class act and again in this episode he came off much better than Bisping.

Minstrel27

Ian Whelan wrote: »

That was a tap, no question about it. I could be said that Herb Dean was perhaps under instruction to give Bisping's fighter the benefit of the doubt in any situation which might arise in order to avoid this series becoming an absolute walkover. If anybody watched Nelson v Kimbo in TUF previously Herb Dean was obviously under instruction not to stop Kimbo if it was at all avoidable. Kimbo was the big draw for the fans and even though Nelson had landed about 19 unanswered strikes Herb Dean still wouldn't stop the fight and allowed Kimbo to fail to defend himself until the round ended.

Herb Dean was under instruction from who? He isn't a UFC employee so who? Can you provide evidence for your claim?

MrStuffins

Minstrel27 wrote: »

Herb Dean was under instruction from who? He isn't a UFC employee so who? Can you provide evidence for your claim?

All of the information is right here

Mellor

Ian Whelan wrote: »

That was a tap, no question about it. I could be said that Herb Dean was perhaps under instruction to give Bisping's fighter the benefit of the doubt in any situation which might arise in order to avoid this series becoming an absolute walkover. If anybody watched Nelson v Kimbo in TUF previously Herb Dean was obviously under instruction not to stop Kimbo if it was at all avoidable. Kimbo was the big draw for the fans and even though Nelson had landed about 19 unanswered strikes Herb Dean still wouldn't stop the fight and allowed Kimbo to fail to defend himself until the round ended.

Bisping's an absolute idiot with the IQ and attitude of a 12 year old and Akira is not far behind him.

Dear lord.

JoeyJJ

Listen Herb isn't going to risk his career for something this small. I get the feeling Herb doesn't really get excited about riches, he isn't going to take backhanders and get marked off Nevada commission list. Does a lot of work for charity.

Listen to the man himself here
http://video.aol.com/aolvideo/aol-sports/mma-hour-episode-no-93-herb-dean/1090207601001

Also a good interview into the insight of how hard it can be to be the man in the middle.

loremolis

Miller tweeted this:

mayhemmiller Jason Mayhem Miller

Just so everyone knows, they edited Michael to look like a nicer guy, if you can believe that.

I hope Bisping gets KTFO. Arrogant assh*le.

Kent Brockman

loremolis wrote: »

I hope Bisping gets KTFO. Arrogant assh*le.

I hope you are right but unfortunately I reckon Bisping will win. Who has Miller beaten ( worthwhile or even recently)?

MrStuffins

Kent Brockman wrote: »

I hope you are right but unfortunately I reckon Bisping will win. Who has Miller beaten ( worthwhile or even recently)?

Well.............. who has Bisping ever beaten?

Mellor

Miller beat Sakuraba, being 42 kinda deminishes the scalp.

Bisping has Leben, Miller, Akiyama

MrStuffins

Mellor wrote: »

Miller beat Sakuraba, being 42 kinda deminishes the scalp.

Bisping has Leben, Miller, Akiyama

Leben, Miller and Akiyama are not scalps. Leben's a tough guy yeah, but those 3 lads have NEVER been anywhere near championship level!

It shows when you put all 3 lads' records together and see that THEY have never beaten anyone either! (Closest is Leben beating a shot Wand)

Oh_Noes

Miller beat Robbie Lawlor, Tim Kennedy, had a NC with Jacare and was a few seconds away from tapping Jake Shieilds. It's not world-beating but it's decent enough, his record doesn't really do him justice IMO. He is a much better fighter based on performances than the record reflects.

If anything I would say the opposite of Bisping, his only win that looked impressive or even convincing was against Jorge Rivera.

I still think Bisping takes him though, so long as it stays up. Probably will outpoint him with jabs in a decision.

Ush1

Oh_Noes wrote: »

Miller beat Robbie Lawlor, Tim Kennedy, had a NC with Jacare and was a few seconds away from tapping Jake Shieilds. It's not world-beating but it's decent enough, his record doesn't really do him justice IMO. He is a much better fighter based on performances than the record reflects.

If anything I would say the opposite of Bisping, his only win that looked impressive or even convincing was against Jorge Rivera.

I still think Bisping takes him though, so long as it stays up. Probably will outpoint him with jabs in a decision.

The most impressive part was how he got away with that premeditated illegal knee.:pac:

Mellor

MrStuffins wrote: »

Leben, Miller and Akiyama are not scalps. Leben's a tough guy yeah, but those 3 lads have NEVER been anywhere near championship level!

It shows when you put all 3 lads' records together and see that THEY have never beaten anyone either! (Closest is Leben beating a shot Wand)

That was my point, neither of them have beaten anyone. They consistantly beat the 2nd tier fighters but would get owned by the top 3 in the div.

Oh_Noes wrote: »

Miller beat Robbie Lawlor, Tim Kennedy, had a NC with Jacare and was a few seconds away from tapping Jake Shieilds. It's not world-beating but it's decent enough, his record doesn't really do him justice IMO. He is a much better fighter based on performances than the record reflects.

Robbie Lawlor is overated. One or two wins but everyone has beaten him.
Kennedy is a solid fighter and has beaten some good guys. So i'll give him that. But would be a simialr level to 2nd tier Bisping beats.
Jacare, he soccer kicked him and it was Rules a NC? That's nothing talk about. Should of been DQ imo.

I'm not trying to get a Bisping support camp going, I don't really like or dislike him. Ditto for Miller. I don't think either has a shot at a MW belt.
But I do think they are enjotable to watch.

Ush1 wrote: »

The most impressive part was how he got away with that premeditated illegal knee.:pac:

Premeditated?
Either you don't know what that means or you are so biased that your opinion doesn't matter.

Ush1

Mellor wrote: »

Premeditated?
Either you don't know what that means or you are so biased that your opinion doesn't matter.

Quick at jumping to conclusions aren't you?

pre·med·i·tat·ed(pr-md-ttd)
adj. Characterized by deliberate purpose, previous consideration, and some degree of planning: a premeditated crime.

Biased in what way exactly?



Speaks for itself.

MrStuffins

I'd have used the word "Deliberate" myself.

Bisping has shown time and again he lacks class.

Ush1

MrStuffins wrote: »

I'd have used the word "Deliberate" myself.

Bisping has shown time and again he lacks class.

I used the word premeditated deliberately.:)

I believe he knew if he threw the knee it was illegal and Rivera wouldn't be defending it but threw it anyway.

Minstrel27

If Mayhem does not beat Bisping then I will cry. This show is doing nothing but making Bisping look like a dick. He has a really ****ty attitude.