What is the point of books,literature?

paglynn

Earlier this week i was hit with a healthy dose of existentialism and realism.:)
On this little ball of rock were we unfortunately die and rot and were we are animals with a more cerebral flair....
what do you think is the point/relevance of art and to be more specific literature or creative writing in our lives?

im invisible

ah shur, its something to pass the time..

Slow Show

What's the point of anything?

I love books more than I could love any other material object (well, it's hard to pick between books and music but still). When I'm in a bad mood and things feel horrible, they transport me to a different world. I experience situations I never would have otherwise, and some I find myself able to relate to in ways I could never imagine (The Bell Jar is the most quotable book ever). I love the smell of different books, the feel of them, being cosy in bed when it's raining inside with one. And I have a stack of books beside my bed right now and this summer is going to be incredible, if it would ever hurry up and come.

Sure if we're going to spend time on 'this little ball of rock' we might as well spend it being happy.

And for the sake of it, I'm going to quote Sylvia Plath:


"I can never read all the books I want; I can never be all the people I want and live all the lives I want. I can never train myself in all the skills I want. And why do I want? I want to live and feel all the shades, tones and variations of mental and physical experience possible in life. And I am horribly limited."

Only a little bit of that is relevant but I use it at any chance I get. :pac:

Da Shins Kelly

Teaches people to form opinions, learn about other parts of the world (reading world literature), it's good for the imagination, learning history (so we don't make the same mistakes).

I think the main thing is that it opens people's minds to other ways of life, other cultures, and opinions. It makes people more informed. There's a reason books are the first things the fascists burn. The power of the written word is very potent. It gives people ideas.

kickarykee

To me the answer is the same as to the question "What's the point of everything?", that's been mentioned as well...

I believe that life isn't all we have, it's just one part of our existence. We might be reborn to another human life, we might transform into something else, who knows, but I'm sure that we're not just going to vanish into nothingness once we die and that every part of existence should be used to learn things. Not only facts, but also how to handle and even feel emotions, what they mean, what they give us, to learn things about ourselves, our reactions...
Books and literature are just some of the means used for doing exactly that. I for my part read books I feel "give" me something. I might not be sure what it is by the time I read them, but I know they do - and often I realise later on.

DangerMouse27

i think you might need to go and play with some kittens or eat some ice cream and enjoy things.

Its prob the most stupid thing ive seen from somone writing intelligently in a while. Your 'realism' is mere negativity. Is a bowl of fruit,a load of worthless discarded items that are dying and have no meaning and therefore should be worthless or are they something to eat and enjoy,or even draw and play with.
Can the colours be recreated or the textures reproduced by you?
If not, has the piece of fruit more meaning than you?

why ground yourself?

Hellsing

I believe literature is important because it allows us to view the world through a different lens than we normally would. A well written story has the ability to perfectly encapsulate a certain theme, a place or an emotion and communicate it to us in away we can understand and by doing this it helps to broaden our minds. If we can look at the world from different perspectives then we can see it more clearly. I think literature helps us to do this

Elle Collins

paglynn wrote: »

Earlier this week i was hit with a healthy dose of existentialism and realism.:)

Nothing healthy about it. If you feel that way why bother visiting the creative writing board in the first place?

kickarykee

DangerMouse27 wrote: »

i think you might need to go and play with some kittens or eat some ice cream and enjoy things.

Its prob the most stupid thing ive seen from somone writing intelligently in a while. Your 'realism' is mere negativity. Is a bowl of fruit,a load of worthless discarded items that are dying and have no meaning and therefore should be worthless or are they something to eat and enjoy,or even draw and play with.
Can the colours be recreated or the textures reproduced by you?
If not, has the piece of fruit more meaning than you?

why ground yourself?

Was that in reply to what I said or the original post?

Marguerite Tonery

It brings hope to despair, light to darkness. it adds joy to moments of grief. It brings people to places where they are in touch with their emotions, where their imagination runs free. A good story can touch you on all levels of your being and bring some richness to your life in a way that other mediums cannot.

Antilles

Real life is dull as hell and a book is cheaper, more entertaining and lasts longer than a comparable film.

DangerMouse27

Def the original post kickarykee.


You seem to like fluffy kittens

johnayo

Dont you just love the way the OP just throws this out there and then disappears.

Antilles

A pretty good answer:

http://images.piccsy.com/cache/images/books---that-is-exactly-how-they-work-85007-530-871.jpg

niceview

Bit of an odd one! In simple terms, it makes us (readers) happy and it is enjoyable.

My friend put it perfectly. While watching a game of rugby and drinking a beer in a Communist built stadium in Latvia, one of my other friends noticed he had two crowns on his head and asked him why.

My short friend just turned to him and said, "Why the f**k does anyone have anything?" and went on supping his beer in the sunshine. Fair point!

Denerick

To remind us what it is like to be human, because too often we forget and suffer from hubris.

Antilles

Denerick wrote: »

To remind us what it is like to be human, because too often we forget and suffer from hubris.

Or to remind us how great human beings can be, because living in the modern world, it can be easy to forget.

St._Andalou

"The point of literature is to comfort the disturbed and disturb the comforted." (I think that's it. I may have paraphrased a little, but I got the basics.)

I guess I read a lot because I find it comforting. I mean, is there really a point to anything we do? Unless you're religious, you probably don't think so. We're here for awhile, and we pass the time the best way we can.

Denerick

Science teaches us our insignificance and basic irrelevance (hence, hubris) in the broader cosmic ordering; art distracts us from that. I think.

PurpleBee

Broadening the mind and enlightening it seem the same terms to me in that they are both fluffy nothings, trying to validate literature in one sentence only serves to undermine it in my opinion

Kinski

I don't think the OP is coming back.

agcainte

PurpleBee wrote: »

Broadening the mind and enlightening it seem the same terms to me in that they are both fluffy nothings, trying to validate literature in one sentence only serves to undermine it in my opinion

PurpleBee, You are so right so I deleted my rubbish. Thanks for pointing out my failings in the post. I have learnt a lot from your points. Very grateful.

pog it

The world needs enterpreneurs and 'change-makers' more than writers right now.

Kinski

pog it wrote: »

The world needs enterpreneurs and 'change-makers' more than writers right now.

JK Rowling has an estimated net worth of £620m. Amazon's Kindle generated revenues totaling about $5.5bn in 2011. One estimate valued the global publishing industry at roughly $80bn, larger than the music publishing, video game, and DVD/BluRay industries combined. So what was it you were saying about the world not needing writers?

pog it

Kinski wrote: »

JK Rowling has an estimated net worth of £620m. Amazon's Kindle generated revenues totaling about $5.5bn in 2011. One estimate valued the global publishing industry at roughly $80bn, larger than the music publishing, video game, and DVD/BluRay industries combined. So what was it you were saying about the world not needing writers?

How many JK Rowlings are there?

If writers were to create a business, employing local Irish people, etc. that would be more of a contribution than publishing a book we didn't really need. The business they created would probably make more money than their book anyway (for the vast majority of writers) so it's not like you'd lose the revenue, or that having them means 100m and not having them 0m.

*Be careful of the sentence style 'so what was it you were saying'. Not only because you can quickly be disproved, but it sounds arrogant.

Kinski

pog it wrote: »

How many JK Rowlings are there?

Writers? About $80bn worth globally.

If writers were to create a business, employing local Irish people, etc. that would be more of a contribution than publishing a book we didn't really need. The business they created would probably make more money than their book anyway (for the vast majority of writers) so it's not like you'd lose the revenue, or that having them means 100m and not having them 0m.

First off, I reject the idea that a question about the "point" of literature, or any other artistic or creative cultural activity, can be answered adequately by asking how many jobs it provides. But taking your point on its own terms, publishing is clearly of immense economic importance, given the massive revenues it generates.

*Be careful of the sentence style 'so what was it you were saying'. Not only because you can quickly be disproved, but it sounds arrogant.

I sound arrogant? Anyway, I'm not after posting tips, cheers.

hcass

Christ - some of yis know how to jump down other people's throats round here...

Anyways, to quote Oscar Wilde "All art is quite useless" But sure what did he know?

pog it

Kinski wrote: »

Anyway, I'm not after posting tips, cheers.

I imagine so. Nor are you probably 'after' learning how to speak to people or reading what someone actually wrote before you respond..

The word 'change-maker' passed you by did it?

PurpleBee

pog it wrote: »

How many JK Rowlings are there?

If writers were to create a business, employing local Irish people, etc. that would be more of a contribution than publishing a book we didn't really need. The business they created would probably make more money than their book anyway (for the vast majority of writers) so it's not like you'd lose the revenue, or that having them means 100m and not having them 0m.

*Be careful of the sentence style 'so what was it you were saying'. Not only because you can quickly be disproved, but it sounds arrogant.

When a society becomes obsessed by economic advancement it ends up in a situation like the one we find ourselves in now. It is our "business leaders" and our broken job making machine, the building industry, that have gotten us where we are now.

Your logic would have us ignore what we have greatest reason to be proud of, if you must think of it economically, our greatest exports (though many exported themselves because of the petty mindset displayed by yourself), the incredible writers we have produced and continue to produce.

indough

a world without art and full of even more businesses sounds great doesn't it?

Hrududu

paglynn wrote: »

Earlier this week i was hit with a healthy dose of existentialism and realism.:)
On this little ball of rock were we unfortunately die and rot and were we are animals with a more cerebral flair....
what do you think is the point/relevance of art and to be more specific literature or creative writing in our lives?

Surely the one of the best things about being alive is the ability to fill your life with stuff you love. For a lot of people, art and literature is what they love.

Kinski

pog it wrote: »

The word 'change-maker' passed you by did it?

"Change-maker" is not a word; it's not a very specific phrase, so I ignored it.

I imagine so. Nor are you probably 'after' learning how to speak to people or reading what someone actually wrote before you respond...

I just think what you've posted is pretty silly. You've come onto a creative writing forum, into a thread asking what the "point" of literature is, and spouted "We don't need writers, we need entrepreneurs, dammit!!!"

Very few people pursue creative writing as their sole occupation, or rely on it as their main source of income. Even most published novelists will have day-jobs as doctors, teachers, librarians, binmen, lawyers...you name it. Some will even be entrepreneurs. For the vast majority of these people writing fiction, drama, or poetry will be very much a part-time activity. So what's the point in telling them they should be doing something else? In all probability, they are doing something else.

pog it

Kinski wrote: »

"Change-maker" is not a word; it's not a very specific phrase, so I ignored it.



I just think what you've posted is pretty silly. You've come onto a creative writing forum, into a thread asking what the "point" of literature is, and spouted "We don't need writers, we need entrepreneurs, dammit!!!"

Very few people pursue creative writing as their sole occupation, or rely on it as their main source of income. Even most published novelists will have day-jobs as doctors, teachers, librarians, binmen, lawyers...you name it. Some will even be entrepreneurs. For the vast majority of these people writing fiction, drama, or poetry will be very much a part-time activity. So what's the point in telling them they should be doing something else? In all probability, they are doing something else.

Actually, it seems Joseph O'Connor wondered the same thing- would it have been more useful to start a business and create direct employment in the locality.

Change-maker is a perfectly good word to me. I'm not worried if you don't like
it. I'd take on board the opinion of someone like John Banville on whether a word is legitimate or not over someone random online I don't trust in the first place and whose writing ability I know nothing about.

Bottomline: We don't need any more mediocre writers in the world. We need entrepreneurs and change-makers far more desperately.

Kinski

pog it wrote: »

Change-maker is a perfectly good word to me. I'm not worried if you don't like. I'd take on board the opinion of someone like John Banville on whether a word is legitimate or not over someone random online I don't trust in the first place and whose writing ability I know nothing about.

It's not about liking or disliking it. It's not a word; you won't find it defined in the OED (I consulted the 20 volume edition btw, so you can trust me on that :pac:) It's a hyphenated phrase, which I presume means, in this context, someone who effects changes, but that doesn't say a whole lot. Entrepreneur has a specific definition - we all know what they are. But "change-makers"? Osama bin Laden made change happen, so we need more bin Ladens, maybe? You see the problem with using a phrase that's so vague, and then complaining when someone ignores it?

Bottomline: We don't need any more mediocre writers in the world. We need entrepreneurs and change-makers far more desperately.

We don't need any more mediocre entrepreneurs either...

...and I'm done with this nonsense.

pog it

Kinski wrote: »

...and I'm done with this nonsense.

I think we're all happy about that!

Remember to read between the lines and try to interpret what someone writes - an important part of the reading process. When I used the word change-maker do you think I had bin Laden type change in my mind? Hardly. Now grow up and learn how to pick your fights.

indough

pog it wrote: »

Now grow up and learn how to pick your fights.

that is a bit rich coming from someone who comes into a creative writing forum and states that the world doesn't need writers

pog it

Kinski wrote: »

Just because I'm done debating the topic doesn't mean I'm going to leave you free to snipe, and since you went there...



No, I don't think you had much of anything in mind, which is exactly the problem.



Right, if you're persuaded by credentials, I received a grade of first-class honours for my English degree, and another first for my Masters thesis. I may not be John Banville, but I'd wager that my track record in the study and practice of writing is far more distinguished than yours. So keep your advice about reading to yourself.

But then you don't want to write, nor do you see much value in writing. So how about your dreams of succeeding in business? Well, let's have a look:





So you have no qualifications, and you're a failed trader. Inspiring stuff.

For your own sake, I can tell you now that if you approach business with the same pig-headed ignorance - and dismiss criticism with the same arrogance - you've displayed here, then you'll fail miserably. And deservedly.



Sound advice.

I'm afraid you got to my post on another forum too late, after I took out my qualifications as to retain some privacy, but before you jump to conclusions about qualifications I too have first class honours at postgrad level- and it's not really that big a deal! I wouldn't really use it to boast to be honest. Academia is the easiest thing in the world to do. And yes, the trading didn't work out, but mainly because I left it too late. I never actually worked as a trader so, 'failed', no. I just didn't find it out in time. So what?
You sound bitter and like a nasty piece of work but I'll leave that for others to adjudicate also.

P.S tune in to Primetime- discussion about emigration.

pog it

indough wrote: »

that is a bit rich coming from someone who comes into a creative writing forum and states that the world doesn't need writers

Like I said, ask Joseph O'Connor who wondered the same thing as me- and he said this after achieving writing success.

Anyway, a lot of bitterness on this forum, which thank goodness I don't have!

If any more personal comments are made about me, and quotes of mine taken from past threads, I will be reporting Kinski or anyone else. Thankfully I was brought up to know better.

dominiquecruz

pog it wrote: »

The world needs enterpreneurs and 'change-makers' more than writers right now.

The world needs both.

Antilles

dominiquecruz wrote: »

The world needs both.

That's why I became a changepreniter.

dominiquecruz

Jack of all trades, master of none

Kinski

pog it wrote: »

I'm afraid you got to my post on another forum too late, after I took out my qualifications as to retain some privacy, but before you jump to conclusions about qualifications I too have first class honours at postgrad level- and it's not really that big a deal! I wouldn't really use it to boast to be honest

Who's bragging? I merely mentioned it since you were aiming insulting and patronising comments at me, so I pointed out that I do have qualifications in this area.

Academia is the easiest thing in the world to do.

Harvard beckons, so...

And yes, the trading didn't work out, but mainly because I left it too late. I never actually worked as a trader so, 'failed', no. I just didn't find it out in time. So what?
You sound bitter and like a nasty piece of work but I'll leave that for others to adjudicate also.

Not at all. I always aim to be civil on Boards, and while I occasionally give sarcastic or otherwise smart-alecy responses to points I don't agree with, it's all directed at the content of the post, never at the poster. That's all part of the rough and tumble of online debate. But when someone starts insulting me (e.g. "grow up") I'll usually respond in kind (perhaps inadvisedly), just to give them a taste of their own medicine. And that's been your strategy here: wade in with a glib and provocative comment, fail to offer any substantive defence when challenged, and finally resort to insulting the other poster.

P.S tune in to Primetime- discussion about emigration.

????????????????

If any more personal comments are made about me, and quotes of mine taken from past threads, I will be reporting Kinski or anyone else. Thankfully I was brought up to know better.

*Sigh* So it's ok for you to dish it out, but if anyone returns fire you'll report them? And while I know it's not the done thing to discuss moderation on thread, I don't think there's ever been any rule about quoting old posts from another's history. But if you want to let the mod decide...

indough

pog it wrote: »

Like I said, ask Joseph O'Connor who wondered the same thing as me- and he said this after achieving writing success.

why would i ask him? he's hardly the most prolific writer ever and there is nothing that qualifies him as some expert on the way the world should work and what other people should do with their lives

your statement is nothing more than an appeal to authority, and there would be countless people who have achieved writing success (even businessmen and entrepreneurs who never wrote a thing) who would disagree entirely with him. but conveniently you don't mention those because they don't suit your frankly ridiculous argument

this is not bitterness it's just common sense

pog it

Kinski- you can have the last word. I'm not responding anymore.

Dominique, your Jack of all trades comment, be careful not to make hasty impressions of a person's entire work history just because you have been told they are changing career.



Kindness + empathy = wisdom. What great writers have

dominiquecruz

pog it wrote: »

Dominique, your Jack of all trades comment, be careful not to make hasty impressions of a person's entire work history just because you have been told they are changing career.

Yep. That's exactly what I was doing alright :rolleyes:

Park Royal

To answer the question , there's no point if you want to stay in the gutter...!