BJJ WORLDS

TEAM RYANO

just seen chris leddy got a bronze at the worlds white belt adult
great stuff well done

Barry.Oglesby

Brilliant achievement from one of the internet's least likable posters .

Congrats Chris!

cowzerp

That has to be a mistake becuase he got his Blue belt of chris brennan in 2009, http://www.bjj.ie/beltlist.php

ps, Andys black belt needs updating on this forum also..

bjj-fighter

Yeah and he placed in last year's Irish open at Blue Belt. That'd be a great achievement to come 3rd at blue! The blue belt divisions are really tough!

EnjoyChoke

Well done Chris!

da-bres

Well done chris it is a truly amazing achievement, white belt worlds is basicly any ungraded jiu jitsu players and can often be as hard as Blue belt, i.e state wrestlers, MMA fighters..

Pretty Sure Riberio jiu jitsu policy is that a no gi blue belt is not accepted in their system and you generally start back at white, Or white with a few stripes. (This is repeated by most large BJJ teams BDW) and standards are ridiculously high over at the university.
Especially considering if you compete at worlds in the gi, with little to no gi experience you prob wont get through the first round.

Hopefully he will be promoted in the gi by saulo over the coming days!!:)

Best of luck to darragh today competing at purple belt

@BJJ Fighter, pretty sure there was only two guys in that division, and chris got triangled pretty quickly:P

Liam_B

Huge achievement to medal at Worlds in any division. Congratulations in Representing your Team & Country, Chris.

Middle Weight Blue Belt division was stacked, check out the brackets
http://www.ibjjf.org/cgi-bin/montachaves.asp

Great Achievement!

TEAM RYANO

Cowser I checked it was White belt
I don't now the guy ,but if Chris Brennan awarded
Him a blue belt that's disrespectful to change
But maybe his coach made the call
Any way well done

BJJRevSS

Dude what do u mean little or no GI ExPERIANCE he placed 3rd in the Irish open last year in the BLUE BELT division and in his GI ?????? Do u mean the standerd is lower here and we have to degrade ourself while were abroad??? Im a purple belt in the GI but does that make me a WHITE BELT r NOVICE in NOGI ???? GOOD Luck DARAGH HOPE U KILLEM BRO.

SDTimeout

Was Chris awarded his belt no gi ? I think if he was then what Joey said above is perfectly fine. Especially since it was placed in the hands of a big school over in the US.

da-bres

BJJRevSS wrote: »

Dude what do u mean little or no GI ExPERIANCE he placed 3rd in the Irish open last year in the BLUE BELT division and in his GI ?????? Do u mean the standerd is lower here and we have to degrade ourself while were abroad??? Im a purple belt in the GI but does that make me a WHITE BELT r NOVICE in NOGI ???? GOOD Luck DARAGH HOPE U KILLEM BRO.

Little to No gi experience was not directed at chris, it was a generalization on why no gi gades are not accepted in some of the major teams.

Yes the standard is lower here in comparison to major teams like Atos, Riberio etc (not all of us train 3 times a day every day)

No we don't have to degrade ourselves, I never said that. I was just explaining that in some of the larger teams they do not accept No Gi grades.

I mean no disrespect to any no gi graded folks and especially not Chris (one of my main training partners) just outlining the guide lines that 'Riberio Jiu Jitsu' follow.

Go Darragh!

OOSSS

Chris89

I had two matches at the irish open, won one and lost one!! I had to borrow my little brothers tae kwan do belt (at least i think its tkd, it was a blue one anyway).

I dont want any part of this **** storm, anyone who knows me knows im not a sandbagger, If my coaches think i should wear a white belt, I will wear a white belt.

Thanks for the messages everyone, it was some experience, Didnt stick to my game plan at all, nerves got the better of me big time and i had to scrap my way to a medal!!

Darraghs division is today at 3, were all rooting for him.

Chris89

BJJRevSS wrote: »

Dude what do u mean little or no GI ExPERIANCE he placed 3rd in the Irish open last year in the BLUE BELT division and in his GI ?????? Do u mean the standerd is lower here and we have to degrade ourself while were abroad??? Im a purple belt in the GI but does that make me a WHITE BELT r NOVICE in NOGI ???? GOOD Luck DARAGH HOPE U KILLEM BRO.

If your coach told you thats what it made you would you trust him? I would.

BJJRevSS

If my coach told me i he was demoting me from blue belt to white belt id say thanks very much it was nice to train with u, but im gonna bring my buissnes else were. Personal i wouldnt be able to handle the embaressment of it. Ibjjf says coulored rash guards are offical gradings in BJJ and are bothe EQUAL in GI&NOGI. Darragh wasnt demoted 2 white belt wen he went to saulos i also trainned there and i wasnt either ??? And does that mean Dave Jones is not a real brown belt after all the years hes put into pushing and supporting our sport in this countrty ????

SDTimeout

BJJRevSS wrote: »

If my coach told me i he was demoting me from blue belt to white belt id say thanks very much it was nice to train with u, but im gonna bring my buissnes else were. Personal i wouldnt be able to handle the embaressment of it. Ibjjf says coulored rash guards are offical gradings in BJJ and are bothe EQUAL in GI&NOGI. Darragh wasnt demoted 2 white belt wen he went to saulos i also trainned there and i wasnt either ??? And does that mean Dave Jones is not a real brown belt after all the years hes put into pushing and supporting our sport in this countrty ????

I think this should be nipped in the bud fairly quickly but two things.

Dave Jones pushing and supporting the sport in Ireland should not have any impact on his brown belt. So there's no point in even suggesting that it should. He didn't demote him.. he said his coach told him in Gi standards he was a white belt.

Second of all, Chris Leddy is the first guy to come on here and name and shame sandbaggers even if it's in small tournaments over here. Do you really think he would sand bag in an event as large as the worlds.

No.

cowzerp

SDTimeout wrote: »

I think this should be nipped in the bud fairly quickly but two things.

Dave Jones pushing and supporting the sport in Ireland should not have any impact on his brown belt. So there's no point in even suggesting that it should.

Second of all, Chris Leddy is the first guy to come on here and name and shame sandbaggers even if it's in small tournaments over here. Do you really think he would sand bag in an event as large as the worlds.

No.

The Dave jones point is used to explain how ridiculis it is, and if chris is the 1st to give out about sand bagging then more reason for him to own up he entered in easier division than he should have, a blue coming nowhere is better than a blue winning a medal in white belt categorary,

Basically by doing this you are saying that daves brown is not justified, that's how it looks anyway, if you good enough for blue 2 years ago then you should be a good blue now

Chris89

It doesnt embarass me to wear a white belts.
There is absolutely no intended disrespect to anyone.
I have been training full time since January, before that it was twice a week at most on and off.
I had some very hard matches yesterday, i won two by submission and on both occasions i was behind on points.
I dont care what anyone thinks of me but it frustrates me that people would doubt Darragh and Saulo Ribeiro, apparently some people on here think they know me better than my coach or training partners!

Lets nip this in the bud lads, it is what it is, as i said the people that are upset by this obviously dont know me and with that in mind they should probably keep their comments to themselves.

Chris89

cowzerp wrote: »

The Dave jones point is used to explain how ridiculis it is, and if chris is the 1st to give out about sand bagging then more reason for him to own up he entered in easier division than he should have, a blue coming nowhere is better than a blue winning a medal in white belt categorary,

Basically by doing this you are saying that daves brown is not justified, that's how it looks anyway, if you good enough for blue 2 years ago then you should be a good blue now

I've never met you let alone trained with you, dont pretend like you have any idea how good or bad i am at jiu jitsu.

cowzerp

Chris89 wrote: »

I've never met you let alone trained with you, dont pretend like you have any idea how good or bad i am at jiu jitsu.

Same here, but you where graded blue, by chris Brennan, he knows his stuff better than me and you, and we know the grades stand across the board, and the fact you entered blue division here means you feel your blue level-ps. Love the confidence that you only feel worthy of a white after all these years

SDTimeout

cowzerp wrote: »

The Dave jones point is used to explain how ridiculis it is, and if chris is the 1st to give out about sand bagging then more reason for him to own up he entered in easier division than he should have, a blue coming nowhere is better than a blue winning a medal in white belt categorary,

Basically by doing this you are saying that daves brown is not justified, that's how it looks anyway, if you good enough for blue 2 years ago then you should be a good blue now

I'm not trying to say daves brown isn't justified sorry if it came across like that,far from it! Infact my opinion does not hold up against most white belts let alone a higher rank

BJJRevSS

Its nothing to do with how good u are r knowning u or how tough your fights were chris im sure your a nice person, we'r discussing the fact that you are a blue belt and represented your team here in Ireland as a blue belt in the gi is that true ??? And its not embarresing to b a white belt every 1 starts at white , u were demoted from blue to white acording to u and your coachs thats whats embaressing pal !

Shane Fitz

Having seen Chris most recently, in the IP tournie, where he competed in the Advanced, against other experienced Blues and I think at least one Purple, I dont think anyone is questioning his skills or his awarding of a Blue belt by Brennan in 09, least of all Paul or Mick,

But if either Darragh, or Saulo asked him to compete as a White, having already competed as a Blue, all be it in a much smaller comp.. it raises an important question I feel.. and that is either our standards here in Ireland are not up to the international norms.. which i dont believe, given that for the most part, excluding JK, it is visiting Black belts awarding the grade, or that grades awarded in no-Gi are not equivelant as those awarded in the Gi.. which according to the IBJJF is not the case



All that being said, to win bronze, in that field, where Chris most likely would have faced wrestlers, or ungraded guys that should be blue, is a credit to him, his coach and his team. Well done!

dasmoose

Just wanted to voice my support (and congratulations) for Chris, he is not a sandbagger at all, he's a hardworking guy who loves BJJ and has started dedicating his life to it.

You guys can debate whether a no-gi belt is worth the same as a belt in the gi all you want but as you say Shane, Chris entered Advanced at the last IP no-gi tournament against several blues and myself as a purple.

He just wants to get as good at jits as possible and he went to the University of JiuJitsu to do that. If Saulo Ribeiro tells him "you're a white belt in the gi" then do you guys expect him to disagree?

da-bres

I don't mean to disrespect anyone but I reckon I could tie a no gi(only) purple belt in nots in the gi, Does that mean he is a purple belt in the gi because he graded no gi??? It is a valid question.. So if you wanted to represent 7 time world champion saulo riberio and he told you that he didn't care for your no gi grade then you would have no choice other than to quit or do what he says.

Seriously, how would a soully no gi practitioner even hope to compete in the mundials. It's ridiculous.

No disrespect to no gi grades but in gi jiu jitsu do they stand??????..

peteclarke

Gi and no gi are two different sports. Chris got his belt in no gi so he is not a blue in the gi ( yet ). He only started wearing a gi six months ago.
He's done nothing wrong by entering at white.
Well done Chris.

cowzerp

dasmoose wrote: »

. If Saulo Ribeiro tells him "you're a white belt in the gi" then do you guys expect him to disagree?

Translation-saulo wants to win a medal, let's win at gold rather than test ourselves at blue, gaining points for his team and a world champ if it had come true.

I'm not graded in no gi so might enter at white level in future.

Shane Fitz

da-bres wrote: »

No disrespect to no gi grades but in gi jiu jitsu do they stand??????..

I think thats the point Joey, the grade, as recognised by the IBJJF is accross the board, for Gi and no-Gi.. the awarding of the grade should stand up for both Gi and no-Gi

I take Marks point about respecting Saulos decision to ask Chris to compete as a white, but that then begs the question where do all the Blue belts,as awarded as no-Gi stand.
Do we now have to check, to see if they have been training in a Gi sufficiently long enough to enter Gi comps as Blues or Whites?
Are we now at the stage, where unless you graded in the Gi, you will not be acknowledged as that grade.

This debate is taking away from a great achievement by one of our own, so lets keep the thread for that.. so can Paul open another thread for anyone who wants to debate the Gi vs no-Gi grades

lawrencesummers

Few things to consider,

The belt was awarded in 2009, at least 18 months ago

Imagine you were one of the guys who put the effort into going to the worlds, was winning on points and got subbed by a guy who might well have fought at blue before, and did it appears fight in advanced categories before.

The belt linage in Bjj is one of it's best assets, this potentially takes away from it's strength.

If this bothers people so much then why not ask the ibjjf their opinion? it appears he only did what his coach told him to do

If he is a blue belt does it say more about the other whites that he didn't win the category and points to a much bigger problem.

winning a medal at such a large comp is a great achievement

Is saulo going to promote him?

arybvtcw0eolkf

Shane Fitz wrote: »

This debate is taking away from a great achievement by one of our own, so lets keep the thread for that.. so can Paul open another thread for anyone who wants to debate the Gi vs no-Gi grades

Actually I'm comfortable letting this discussion carry on here simply because people hsve been accused of 'sandbagging' in other threads without a call for a separate thread to be opened.

I don't know know the various personalities involved, but it appears as though there are legitimate concerns expressed and questions asked re. a competitor in this thread.

Lets carry on for now.

Shane Fitz

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Few things to consider,

The belt was awarded in 2009, at least 18 months ago


Is saulo going to promote him?

are you suggesting he be promted a second time??

and as an aside, if Saulo doesnt, will Chris compete as a white belt in Gi tournaments untill he is awarded a "gi" blue belt??..
the fact of the matter is, Chris was representing hinself, Darragh, and Saulo, his coaches asked him to compete as a White, which he did.. and successfully too.....

but an unfortunate side affect of that descision, is that all the no-Gi grades as awarded by Chris Brennan will be open to scrutiny, rightly or wrongly.

lawrencesummers

Shane Fitz wrote: »

are you suggesting he be promted a second time??

and as an aside, if Saulo doesnt, will Chris compete as a white belt in Gi tournaments untill he is awarded a "gi" blue belt??..
the fact of the matter is, Chris was representing hinself, Darragh, and Saulo, his coaches asked him to compete as a White, which he did.. and successfully too.....

but an unfortunate side affect of that descision, is that all the no-Gi grades as awarded by Chris Brennan will be open to scrutiny, rightly or wrongly.

I'm keeping my personal opinions on this to myself, except to say that between this and a thread on efn that the White belt mundials seem to be doing themselves no favours in terms of respectability, and afaik medals at White don't count towards team points, and rightly so by the looks of things.

slammer187

I think everyone needs to look at the bigger picture, Saulo Ribeiro decides at what belt Chris competes in, do you really think that Saulo who has won the Worlds 5 times would allow one of his students to sandbag in such a prestigious competition?

Anyway what's done is done and there's no point in being childish and arguing about it.

Kieran81

is it not a fairly blatant display of disrespect from saulo towards chris brennan saying you're not good enough to compete in blue under the ribeiro name, if nogi and gi grades are viewed as equal by the sports governing body

da-bres

I reckon its none of anyones business and the Mods should close the thread.

Its clear that people in this thread are merely speculating and bordering on accusing without full knowledge of Chris's situation.

to reply to shanes statement, I partially agree,Im sure a BJJ blue belt must be awarded when wearing the gi, IBJJF caters for BJJ athletes. Is a No Gi blue t-shirt a valid grade in BJJ?? or is it valid in Next generation jiujitsu/ same as tenth planet?

2 separate sports.

Valid Question.

By the way, An Irish man named Chris Leddy quit his job to pursue Brazilian Jiu Jitsu full time as a career, He traveled to america to learn from the best and train with world champions. As far as i'm concerned people are too busy hating.

Shane Fitz

i dont think anyone is being childish... or hating... well, I'm not
the facts are that a guy, who has competed in Gi at Blue belt, and no-Gi at advanced, was asked to compete as a White belt...

opinions have now been expressed that no-Gi grades dont hold up copmared to Gi grades....
...or the opposite, that the grade as reconised by the IBJJF applies to both.

the debate should now be how that decision affects us here in Ireland and the running of our own competitions.
As i said earlier.. where will no-Gi blues be competing now... we've already had this debate with regard to Gracie Garage Blue belts..

And just to clarify my own position, I am in no way suggesting sandbagging took place, Chris only did as his coach, Saulo asked. would any of us here have acted differently

BJJRevSS

dasmoose wrote: »

Just wanted to voice my support (and congratulations) for Chris, he is not a sandbagger at all, he's a hardworking guy who loves BJJ and has started dedicating his life to it.

You guys can debate whether a no-gi belt is worth the same as a belt in the gi all you want but as you say Shane, Chris entered Advanced at the last IP no-gi tournament against several blues and myself as a purple.

He just wants to get as good at jits as possible and he went to the University of JiuJitsu to do that. If Saulo Ribeiro tells him "you're a white belt in the gi" then do you guys expect him to disagree?

But your missing the point of the discussion he compets here in IRELAND in the BLUE BELT GI COMPS , did he or did he NOT ??? And also another black belt cant demote someone elses student, if there a bad blue belt they'll stay a blue belt for a very long time they dnt go bak 2 white. Its up to the student himself to go back, if he does its because he cant handle getting beaten by people who are actually better than him.

lawrencesummers

slammer187 wrote: »

I think everyone needs to look at the bigger picture, Saulo Ribeiro decides at what belt Chris competes in, do you really think that Saulo who has won the Worlds 5 times would allow one of his students to sandbag in such a prestigious competition?

Anyway what's done is done and there's no point in being childish and arguing about it.

Maybe, but is the bigger picture the fact that another person (who presumably has the right to decide) has previously decided otherwise? Can that be over-ridden? Leave aside the matter of personally wanting to or not, but can you even downgrade belt levels, that is if there is a question over the belt or not

EnjoyChoke

Chris Leddy has just won a gold at the Worlds competing at the belt level his coachs instructed him to compete at.

He's certainly one of the the most respectful players I've met. His (and his coaches) decision should not be taken as a slur on anyone. It's a personal thing, that both he and them took about his grade and is really none of our business. It does not in my opinion reflect on Irish BJJ, GI or NO-GI, it simply reflects on Chris.

By the way the winner of his division Eddie Ng was touted in some circles as a possible match up with Gunnar Nelson in a No-Gi grappling match and has been competing for longer than I have:
http://www.mmauniverse.com/fighters/SS14105

Some of you on here criticising him don't compete from one end of the year to the other, so give it a rest.

da-bres

Would just like to mention aswell on a side note, Chris has never once wore a blue belt training in the gi, always in his white belt, the only reason he competed in the blue belt category at the irish open was because of undue pressure from outsiders such as those on this forum,

I am genuinely annoyed how people are taking away from his achievement.

BJJRevSS

Shane Fitz wrote: »

i dont think anyone is being childish... or hating... well, I'm not
the facts are that a guy, who has competed in Gi at Blue belt, and no-Gi at advanced, was asked to compete as a White belt...

opinions have now been expressed that no-Gi grades dont hold up copmared to Gi grades....
...or the opposite, that the grade as reconised by the IBJJF applies to both.

the debate should now be how that decision affects us here in Ireland and the running of our own competitions.
As i said earlier.. where will no-Gi blues be competing now... we've already had this debate with regard to Gracie Garage Blue belts..

And just to clarify my own position, I am in no way suggesting sandbagging took place, Chris only did as his coach, Saulo asked. would any of us here have acted differently

I agree , but did Saulo know that Chris has been competeing in the blue belt gi comps ??? He only knows what hes been told ???

EnjoyChoke

da-bres wrote: »

I am genuinely annoyed how people are taking away from his achievement.

This. For sure.

Shane Fitz

I wasnt criticising Chris' achievement Tom,

But I do think it fair to ask about the decision to compete as a White belt, which was answered,
and also to postulate where that leaves any others who graded no-Gi in Gi comps etc..

lawrencesummers

da-bres wrote: »

I reckon its none of anyones business and the Mods should close the thread.....

Valid Question.

By the way, An Irish man named Chris Leddy quit his job to pursue Brazilian Jiu Jitsu full time ashttp://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=72574049#post72574049 a career, He traveled to america to learn from the best and train with world champions. As far as i'm concerned people are too busy hating.

I disagree, the strength of Bjj is largely down to linage, and self policing of belt levels, this is a valid discussion, how would you feel if you lost out at a major competition to someone who seems to be at a higher level?

Fair play to Chris for such huge effort, and it's a pity there is a cloud over the win.

Shane Fitz

BJJRevSS wrote: »

I agree , but did Saulo know that Chris has been competeing in the blue belt gi comps ??? He only knows what hes been told ???

I think that is a bit harsh.

slammer187

BJJRevSS wrote: »

I agree , but did Saulo know that Chris has been competeing in the blue belt gi comps ??? He only knows what hes been told ???

*He only knows what he's been told AND what he's seen from Chris' performance in training and rolling.

BJJRevSS

da-bres wrote: »

Would just like to mention aswell on a side note, Chris has never once wore a blue belt training in the gi, always in his white belt, the only reason he competed in the blue belt category at the irish open was because of undue pressure from outsiders such as those on this forum,

I am genuinely annoyed how people are taking away from his achievement.

What u mean under preasure from outsiders??? did some 1 put a gun to his head and force him to train, sign up and pay for the comp ??? The poor fella seems to like doing things to please other people even ones he doesnt know . He should make his own decisions in future hed be better of.

da-bres

lawrencesummers wrote: »

I disagree, the strength of Bjj is largely down to linage, and self policing of belt levels, this is a valid discussion, how would you feel if you lost out at a major competition to someone who seems to be at a higher level?

Fair play to Chris for such huge effort, and it's a pity there is a cloud over the win.

Em im pretty sure everyone i have ever lost too was at a higher level too me.

If ''the strength of BJJ is largely down to linage'' then im sure saulo had good reasons to not accept the no gi grade.

your argument is flawed as you have little understanding regarding the circumstances of this.

You should mind your own business and this thread should be closed.

da-bres

BJJRevSS wrote: »

What u mean under preasure from outsiders??? did some 1 put a gun to his head and force him to train, sign up and pay for the comp ??? The poor fella seems to like doing things to please other people even ones he doesnt know . He should make his own decisions in future hed be better of.

If your concerned go tell him, rather than talking about him on a forum.

Richy06

Well I remember reading about Chris's plans earlier this year to quit his job and dedicate his life to BJJ for the year. I wished him well and even envied him a little.

I'm not going to get into the argument about his belt credentials because there's far more knowledgable people already doing that.

Having said that I have to say a huge congrats to you Chris, I'm sure you and your coaches knew best. Placing in the worlds at any belt is a huge achievement and it validates your decision to make the sacrifice you did. Keep up the good work!!

lawrencesummers

da-bres wrote: »

Em im pretty sure everyone i have ever lost too was at a higher level too me.

If ''the strength of BJJ is largely down to linage'' then im sure saulo had good reasons to not accept the no gi grade.

your argument is flawed as you have little understanding regarding the circumstances of this.

You should mind your own business and this thread should be closed.

Wt I'm getting at is that it's fine to be beaten White by White, or blue by blue, but to compete at White and be beaten by not just someone who should be blue but possibly is a blue is not fair, and nobody would like that.

I'm not doubting saulo had his reasons, the questions is if those reasons were legitimate or not, and if the fighter should have accepted them or not.

You obviously know the guy personally and feel the need to defend him which is admirable, that's where your opinions are being formed from and I'm not disputing them, it's a pity that such an achievement is being overshadowed, but it seems when you read about the winner of the division that the White belt mundials are a sham, and that is probably the biggest loser here, if anyone has aspirations of competing in the white belt mundials it seems that you might be up against people that would survive at purple belt.

SDTimeout

Just on a side note, can people not agree and i think Joey mentioned it earlier. In theory if someone got to brown belt no gi. They would be mauled by every brown belt who got there in a gi. Assuming the guy isn't amazingly talented.