* Honours Maths paper 1 * AFTERMATH

dontaskme

The project maths stuff looks interesting. To be honest, maths students have had it sort of easy for a long time in that the problem is given to them to solve and they just have to start applying the stuff they've learned off. However, formulating the problem is sometimes just as tricky and it's something that has been on the American SATs for years.

Catacomb wrote: »

fine by me but then they should at least say that it's "unpredictable" in advance instead of making people belive its predictable.

well then it wouldn't be quite so unpredictable, if they had predicted it, like...

PJelly wrote: »

A little different, mix things up a little, sure, bring it on. Fosters critical thinking and the like.
However, our paper wasn't "A little bit unpredictable". It was a complete deviation from anything we've ever seen before.

It's almost as if they just gave us a paper from a completely different maths course all together.

Don't worry too much, people always think they did badly right after an exam. And everybody seems to have found it hard so they'll probably bump up the scores so that similar percentages get As and Bs as previous years.

PJelly

dontaskme wrote: »

Don't worry too much, people always think they did badly right after an exam. And everybody seems to have found it hard so they'll probably bump up the scores so that similar percentages get As and Bs as previous years.

My part A's were awful. I read questions wrong. And made stupid mistakes. I got the simple stuff wrong, let alone the tough stuff.
Bell curve won't help me much.

Why do I keep looking at this thread! I told myself I wouldn't!

Catacomb

PJelly wrote: »

My part A's were awful. I read questions wrong. And made stupid mistakes. I got the simple stuff wrong, let alone the tough stuff.
Bell curve won't help me much.

Why do I keep looking at this thread! I told myself I wouldn't!

That could have been written by me, exactly how I feel.

TheNuttyBrowny

Im sorry but anyone out there who thinks the project maths people got it easy you must be joking!!! im in one of the school who were picked for the project maths and i have to say its a complete joke!!!

They tell us nothing about whats on the exam! one minute one section is on the exam so we do it in class then all of a sudden its taken off! we have had no exam papers to work off so a few weeks ago they released a sample paper of what the exam will look like....

Yesterday was a joke! the sample paper was completely different!!! the questions werent even maths it was more like business and english combined as a subject! Ye cant complain about the hard questions ye got cause we got the exact same differentiation and integration questions as ye did and we were told the last question on the integration question was definitely off the course for us! also we got this crazy financial maths question - and this really odd question about rings where there was about 10 different scenarios in the question so you had to read it over and over and over again just to get it!!!

No matter whether you were doing project maths or the ordinary course yesterday it was a joke!!

KoolAidRelic

PJelly wrote: »

A little different, mix things up a little, sure, bring it on. Fosters critical thinking and the like.
However, our paper wasn't "A little bit unpredictable". It was a complete deviation from anything we've ever seen before.

It's almost as if they just gave us a paper from a completely different maths course all together.

Really now, ignoring the second part of 1b, 2c, and 7c(ii) everything was fine. Normal algebra in the rest of one and two; a simple Q3 and a very simple Q4 (there was no knowledge of difference equations needed to solve it, just normal recurrence methods and a simple geometrical sum).
Q5 was a beaut, completely normal, as was Q6.

Q7 was nice, the b(ii) part needed some thinking, but was manageable for anyone - working out the c part took most people I've talked to no time at all.
Q8 was nice, albeit badly worded. It wasn't "a complete deviation", it just relied on your ability to apply the concepts.

what.to.do

TheNuttyBrowny wrote: »

we have had no exam papers to work off so a few weeks ago they released a sample paper of what the exam will look like....

Our "sample papers" ARE the past papers.

Yesterday was a joke! the sample paper was completely different!!!

That's exactly what our problem was...



It's come to the stage where anger has been vented, what's done is done, lets by-gones be by-gones and prepare for the next paper.

TheNuttyBrowny

i know what.to.do and dont get me wrong i think the old course got it awful aswell i just think people are blaiming the project maths when we got it just as bad!!!

I love maths !! and this new project maths has ruined my love for maths because its not real maths its pure bull****!!

beargrylls93

i was goina read all the above comments but ......... too long......... iv done all the maths papers for the last 16 years and smashed them , was in shock when i went into this ! lad in my year got 98 percent in the mocks came outta this not knowing what to say ?? in the independent today the board comments sayin it was well within our scope but they know we're not fukn germans and wouldn have a hope with some a the questions given.......................................

akbar

I'm a repeating student sitting physics and maths again, having originally sat my Leaving Cert in 2009. I've spent the past few months studying moderately with the past few weeks being quite intensive, and I believed I had brought myself to an A standard for the exam.

Now, as I enjoy maths, I love taking the time to get my head around the concepts that are taught in the course, but at times this has to be compromised because of the amount of applications we have to learn by rote for the style of the exam. So with the amount of knowledge of methods we need absorb for the course, it seems to fall in line in the exams that it's mostly that knowledge that's tested, with theory-testing questions thrown in intermittently.

Yesterday's exam however was a fúcking STRIKING change from testing learned methods, to testing an understanding of the concepts of each area of the course. Now, anybody saying "ah well guise i checked the paper just now, you dont have much to complain about there were plenty of grand parts, except blah blah and blah" is doing so from the tranquility of their dark and lonely bedroom. Sitting in an exam centre and seeing a marked difference on the page, to what you not only were expecting but were LED to expect, is completely throwing and has fúcked a lot of people over.

I'm expecting a grade of around a B1, only needing a B3 for my college course. I did however work hard out of principle, wanting the A1 considering I'm RE-sitting the exams. For anybody who is banking their points and, more importantly, their hours and hours of fúcking EFFORT over the past few months or years on the maths results, I really sympathise. I'm equally as outraged at the blatant lateral step they took in writing the exam. I don't think it was necessarily a more difficult exam or a BAD exam by any means, like I say the style suits me and I would personally rather if theory was the emphasis in the maths courses, but even for me with my preferences the exam was different enough from the established standard to throw me when I opened the paper. I was sweating my sack off for the whole 150 minutes, and normally I finish every question well under the two hours mark. I only completed 6 and a half questions, of which I hopefully scraped something close enough to the A that when this inevitably fúcked Bell curve is pressed on the grading, it'll get up there.

/rant

Daniel S

LilMissCiara wrote: »

You really think that the SEC will or will not change a marking scheme depending on the results of an anonymous poll on an independent website?

Let's all delete our answers and change them to Ds and Es so. Then the marking scheme will have to change..! :rolleyes:

It's not anonymous, I made it :pac:

PJelly

I should really stop doing this to myself.
I just re-did most of the parts I got wrong at home. I ended up getting basically every one right. Two full B's, two A's and a part of a C.
I could have gotten a B3.
I didn't realise what effect this so called "Exam pressure" does to you on the day.
I wanted to show off what I learned the past two years to the examiner, but it's just going to look like I know jack ****.
So much for me being "over paper one"

spazzy

They correct a sample of papers and change the marking scheme accordingly
lets live in hope for paper 2

madmax92

The funniest thing in Maths Leaving Cert is that we are marked on our methods not our answers. They teach us how to solve questions by certain methods, otherwise no marks. My friend from Ghana had some nice tricks in Algebra(I think), but he couldn't use them as we had to use SEC's way LOL. Maths is not same every time, we suppose to know billions of ways to solve questions and problems instead of knowing one way.

Also TY should be used to start teaching LC HL Maths, 2 years is just enough to do everything and then we have a little time for revise.

btw. I'm still fighting with that tan-1 question and can't solve it

eoins23456

PJelly wrote: »

I should really stop doing this to myself.
I just re-did most of the parts I got wrong at home. I ended up getting basically every one right. Two full B's, two A's and a part of a C.
I could have gotten a B3.
I didn't realise what effect this so called "Exam pressure" does to you on the day.
I wanted to show off what I learned the past two years to the examiner, but it's just going to look like I know jack ****.
So much for me being "over paper one"

Just concentrate on paper 2 now and concentrate on what you can do instead of what you should have done.

Daniel S

PJelly wrote: »

Same thing happened to me. After a quick read through the paper, I was for lack of a better phrase, s****ing bricks. I didn't get 1 (a) right even. 1 A!
But what's done is done.

Did you get 4 + 4x all over X^2 - 1 also?

How did I miss the difference of two squares....

eoins23456

madmax92 wrote: »

The funniest thing in Maths Leaving Cert is that we are marked on our methods not our answers. They teach us how to solve questions by certain methods, otherwise no marks. My friend from Ghana had some nice tricks in Algebra(I think), but he couldn't use them as we had to use SEC's way LOL. Maths is not same every time, we suppose to know billions of ways to solve questions and problems instead of knowing one way.

Also TY should be used to start teaching LC HL Maths, 2 years is just enough to do everything and then we have a little time for revise.

btw. I'm still fighting with that tan-1 question and can't solve it

The marking scheme is open to alternative methods for questions.If the method is correct and not in the marking schemes, it still may be a valid approach.

madmax92

eoins23456 wrote: »

The marking scheme is open to alternative methods for questions.If the method is correct and not in the marking schemes, it still may be a valid approach.

But if the method is not in marking schemes, there is NO marks. Words of my teacher. So it's kind of cruel as maths is subject where you have to think and make your life easier using all tricks you know.

eoins23456

madmax92 wrote: »

But if the method is not in marking schemes, there is NO marks. Words of my teacher. So it's kind of cruel as maths is subject where you have to think and make your life easier using all tricks you know.

The marking schemes give the most common approaches by candidates.Your teacher is wrong on that account.Last year I emailed the chief examinations commission with two different method for solving an algebra part c that were not in the marking schemes or in standard textbooks.They emailed back that in that instance they were both perfectly acceptable.It even says in the marking schemes that there may be other valid approaches. The more tricks you know in Maths the better you will do in the exam.

cocopopsxx

PJelly wrote: »

I should really stop doing this to myself.
I just re-did most of the parts I got wrong at home. I ended up getting basically every one right. Two full B's, two A's and a part of a C.
I could have gotten a B3.
I didn't realise what effect this so called "Exam pressure" does to you on the day.
I wanted to show off what I learned the past two years to the examiner, but it's just going to look like I know jack ****.
So much for me being "over paper one"

Same. I tried doing some of the questions again too (even though I shouldn't have) and there are so many questions that I'm getting right now, but only beacause I'm not under exam conditions.
Exam pressure really puts one off. Just one difficult question, and I was thrown off balance. I was nearly crying during the exam at 3:30 when I couldn't figure out some questions as I was really banking for an A in Maths..now I'll have to do really well in all other subjects to get medicine. I will defo have to repeat.
But what's gone is gone, can't change it, we must concentrate on paper 2 and the other ones, even though it's hard to do.

mtb_kng wrote: »

Did you get 4 + 4x all over X^2 - 1 also?

How did I miss the difference of two squares....

Omg! I just realised I missed the difference of two squares too!...Damn! Didn't even get the (a) part right! argh!!:mad:

beargrylls93

akbar wrote: »

I'm a repeating student sitting physics and maths again, having originally sat my Leaving Cert in 2009. I've spent the past few months studying moderately with the past few weeks being quite intensive, and I believed I had brought myself to an A standard for the exam.

Now, as I enjoy maths, I love taking the time to get my head around the concepts that are taught in the course, but at times this has to be compromised because of the amount of applications we have to learn by rote for the style of the exam. So with the amount of knowledge of methods we need absorb for the course, it seems to fall in line in the exams that it's mostly that knowledge that's tested, with theory-testing questions thrown in intermittently.

Yesterday's exam however was a fúcking STRIKING change from testing learned methods, to testing an understanding of the concepts of each area of the course. Now, anybody saying "ah well guise i checked the paper just now, you dont have much to complain about there were plenty of grand parts, except blah blah and blah" is doing so from the tranquility of their dark and lonely bedroom. Sitting in an exam centre and seeing a marked difference on the page, to what you not only were expecting but were LED to expect, is completely throwing and has fúcked a lot of people over.

I'm expecting a grade of around a B1, only needing a B3 for my college course. I did however work hard out of principle, wanting the A1 considering I'm RE-sitting the exams. For anybody who is banking their points and, more importantly, their hours and hours of fúcking EFFORT over the past few months or years on the maths results, I really sympathise. I'm equally as outraged at the blatant lateral step they took in writing the exam. I don't think it was necessarily a more difficult exam or a BAD exam by any means, like I say the style suits me and I would personally rather if theory was the emphasis in the maths courses, but even for me with my preferences the exam was different enough from the established standard to throw me when I opened the paper. I was sweating my sack off for the whole 150 minutes, and normally I finish every question well under the two hours mark. I only completed 6 and a half questions, of which I hopefully scraped something close enough to the A that when this inevitably fúcked Bell curve is pressed on the grading, it'll get up there.

/rant

thought this was worth reposting, best one so far

Daniel S

PseudoFamous wrote: »

Lets pretend I somehow magically get 100 marks on paper one. That still leaves me with a normally attainable 230 marks to get a C3, that I MUST get, or miss out on college. This has already put a gigantic amount of pressure on me. Even worse is the fact that I was going in looking for a mid to high B, and _passing_ this exam is now looking unlikely. If I do not get 230 marks, I completely miss out on college.
Note that I did not pull this aim for a B out of my arse, and that I studied hard for maths and physics, as I want to be an engineer. In the mocks, I got a B1 in maths, and an A2 in physics. Physics, hopefully will not have changed, but even if I scrape a C in maths, I've fallen 25 marks, also potentially lost my course.
My worst case scenario leaves me with 60 marks. That leaves me with 270 marks to get. That would have been hard normally, but now in the fear that I may get another hard question, more than likely in further calculus, I don't think I can possibly do that.
While people may say "it was a difficult but doable paper", note that this wasn't being done in leisure. We were given 150 minutes to do questions I had never seen before, despite doing every exam paper between 2010 and 1997 regularly. Even questions I would normally do fine in seemed bloody impossible, as I was in a state of panic.

Now, it looks like I'm going to have to waste a year of my life in order to get my course, a course I was nearly certain of getting. I'm not angry at the SEC, I'm disgusted by them. I can only wonder how people who were going to barely scrape a pass in normal conditions would have fared.

I'm certainly not the only one who is in this position, as the vast majority of my class are pissed off, as well as my friends from other schools.

You know, if your going to NUIG, UL, or DIT, you can do a "Special Entrance Exam". I'm going to UL (Mechanical Engineering hopefully), and just to put some nerves at ease, I asked a lecturer if I could still do it if I failed, he said I could. So eventhough this paper was a complete balls, I don't have to repeat.

Daniel S

beargrylls93 wrote: »

thought this was worth reposting, best one so far

Lies! You just wanted the #700 post

Mr. Maths

I did Q8(c) by integrating the circumference of the cirlce (2(pi)r) to get pi r squared, as that was the only way i could see of arriving at the correct answer at the time. Initially I dismissed this method as being purely based on coincidence, but I since noticed that a similar relationship exists between the surface area and volume of a sphere (if you integrate the formula for the surface area with respect to r you end up with the formula for the volume). Does anyone know if there's ant actual mathematical basis for this and if so, whether i might get some marks for it?

Daniel S

cocopopsxx wrote: »

Omg! I just realised I missed the difference of two squares too!...Damn! Ddin't even get the (a) part right! argh!!:mad:

I think a good few people missed it...

LilMissCiara

mtb_kng wrote: »

It's not anonymous, I made it :pac:

That's the millionth time you've said that..! :P

It's anonymous so far as we don't know who voted for what and even if they
were actually Leaving Cert Higher Level Maths students!

cocopopsxx

mtb_kng wrote: »

I think a good few people missed it...

That was such an easy part. How many marks do you think we'll lose for that?

Daniel S

cocopopsxx wrote: »

That was such an easy part. How many marks do you think we'll lose for that?

Either -1 for a slip or -3 for a blunder, I don't know which it is.

delta_bravo

BallerinaBabe wrote: »

I took one look through it, then switched to ordinary! I didn't need honours and there's noooo way I'm repeating..

I haven't read all fortysonethibg pages of this thread but you are not to view a paper and then switch levels. Once it's on your desk you can't change, your superintendent made a mistake doing that by allowing you to drop. You were lucky but just to let everyone else know you won't be allowed to change levels after viewing a paper

cocopopsxx

mtb_kng wrote: »

Either -1 for a slip or -3 for a blunder, I don't know which it is.

I hope it's a slip, don't wanna lose 3 marks in a part (a), considering the rest of the paper was ****e too.

Mr. Maths

cocopopsxx wrote: »

I hope it's a slip, don't wanna lose 3 marks in a part (a), considering the rest paper was ****e too.

Nah that'd definately be a blunder mate, considering that it told you to express it in its simplest form. Slips are only for simple things like if you drop a sign or something, but if it looks like you didn't fully know what you were meant to do then thats a blunder.