Cork GAA Discussion Thread

ShamoBuc

I see we are definitely going to appeal the red card - no harm I suppose. We could certainly do with him , for frees alone. If he does play he should certainly be a bit fired up and with a point to prove, no harm for him with his up and down displays recently.

Thinkstoomuch

By Michael Moynihan
Horgan was red-carded for a stroke to the head of Limerick’s Paudie O’Brien late in the first half on Sunday, and the Shannonsiders ran out comfortable winners, 0-24 to 0-15 in the second half to collect a first Munster title since 1996.
However, Horgan’s sending off was the major talking point of the game, with many feeling the proceedings tilted decisively in Limerick’s favour when facing 14 men in the second half in very hot conditions.

Kingston also revealed that O’Brien contacted Horgan yesterday to sympathise, adding that he had gone down from the impact of the sliotar hitting him in the face, not from Horgan’s stroke.

“It’s important for us to congratulate Limerick,” said Kingston. “They were deserved winners, they played very well and it’s great for hurling, and for Limerick, that they won a provincial title.

“You could see what it meant to the Limerick supporters to win, and congratulations to them — and to John Allen, who prepared them very well for the game.

“We’d also acknowledge that we should have done better on the scoreboard ourselves in the first half. We had a lot of opportunities which we didn’t take, we’ve plenty of work to do ourselves which has nothing to do with other events in the game.

“We’re not hiding from our own responsibilities as a management team in that regard.

“But I thought the decision to send Patrick off was absolutely extraordinary.”

Kingston added: “I don’t think any of the players, supporters or people watching on television thought it was a red card.

“One Limerick player pushed Patrick away after the incident, but if players see a bad stroke they’re not slow to come in and retaliate as a rule.

“Paudie O’Brien himself told Patrick on the phone he went down with a blow to the face from the sliotar, not from the impact of the hurley, and fair dues to Paudie for doing so.

“We’re not in the business of criticising referees. It’s a very tough job, and you’ve to be strong to be man enough to handle a game in front of over 40,000 people, there’s a lot of pressure that goes with that.

“In that regard I’d just like to think that James [McGrath, the match referee] would be man enough to admit that he didn’t have one of his best days at the office on Sunday, that’s all.”

Kingston said Cork will seek to have Horgan cleared to play in the All-Ireland quarter-final the weekend after next against Kilkenny.

“The referee’s report goes in and we can appeal, and we will certainly be doing that.

“It’s very unfortunate that it’s now on Patrick’s record that he was sent off in a Munster final. I know people always say it about players, but he’s certainly not the kind of individual who collects red cards.

“Last Sunday it was clear: he was going for the ball to knock it down to himself, not trying to strike Paudie down on the head.

“When he was sent off he came over to the sideline and said to myself and Jimmy Barry-Murphy, ‘can you tell me what that was for?’ He was hugely upset by it, obviously enough.”

Referee McGrath was at the centre of another red card controversy earlier this year when he sent off Limerick’s Declan Hannon in the Fitzgibbon Cup semi-final; Hannon was cleared on appeal to play in the decider of the universities’ championship the following day.

Meanwhile, Croke Park chiefs have confirmed that Cork’s All-Ireland SHC quarter-final against Kilkenny will be played at Semple Stadium on Sunday, July 28, throwing it at 2pm.

The game will be followed at 4pm by the clash of Clare and Galway

Thinkstoomuch

That clearly rubbishes all the talk horgan had intent.
James mcgrath like mountain lad posted after waterford offaly is truly awful referee.

Hes mistakes are becoming a norm now..He needs to be taken off the panel as soon as possible otherwise the best ever championship will be rememberd for all the wrong reasons.

Freejin

anybody know if the shc round 2 match Douglas v barrs is going ahead on Thursday??

Indie.

Freejin wrote: »

anybody know if the shc round 2 match Douglas v barrs is going ahead on Thursday??

Yeah still going ahead afaik. Cloughduv @ 7:30

Strange one bringing two city teams out to Cloughduv

keane2097

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

with all due respect the hurling has nothing to do with cork v armagh.

Its stupid to compare both.
This armagh team as results have shown over the last few years bar jamie clarke and Aron kerernan etc are a poor team.
Forget about ten goals against a dismal leitrim team.

The cork team even with a clueless manager has too much talent and even if CC goes with brawn over brains Cork are simply play at a different level to armagh.Our players would just walk through them.

This armagh team is not a patch on the 2002 team.To dress a defeat to them as anything other than a new low is nonense.

If armagh beat Cork Couinhan should be sacked.

lol, get the boat.

Jamie Clarke and Aaron Kernan might be Armagh's only All Star class players but they are far from Armagh's only good players.

The current Cork side have a couple of excellent players, but also have a lot of duds and are nowhere near the standard you'd have to be to call losing to them a new low.

On average, at a neutral venue, Cork are probably 2-3 points better than Armagh. If that match up comes to pass, Cork will probably be around 1/2 or 4/7 and correctly so, which means they lose to Armagh between 30 & 40% of the time.

Calling a loss against this Armagh team "a new low" just means you probably vastly overrate your team, and are probably also blaming the manager way too much. I'm not a huge fan of Counihan myself, but you've jumped the shark baby.

Freejin

Indie. wrote: »

Yeah still going ahead afaik. Cloughduv @ 7:30

Strange one bringing two city teams out to Cloughduv

Bruce playing in the park!!!

Thinkstoomuch

Freejin wrote: »

anybody know if the shc round 2 match Douglas v barrs is going ahead on Thursday??

Yeah it is .it is very hard on cahalane and cadogan.its no wonder players get injured.

Thinkstoomuch

keane2097 wrote: »

lol, get the boat.

Jamie Clarke and Aaron Kernan might be Armagh's only All Star class players but they are far from Armagh's only good players.

The current Cork side have a couple of excellent players, but also have a lot of duds and are nowhere near the standard you'd have to be to call losing to them a new low.

On average, at a neutral venue, Cork are probably 2-3 points better than Armagh. If that match up comes to pass, Cork will probably be around 1/2 or 4/7 and correctly so, which means they lose to Armagh between 30 & 40% of the time.

Calling a loss against this Armagh team "a new low" just means you probably vastly overrate your team, and are probably also blaming the manager way too much. I'm not a huge fan of Counihan myself, but you've jumped the shark baby.

you clearly honey have being get far too much sun to say i overrate cork and blame the manager too much.
CC Is a poor poor manager that guys like kelly collins and sheehan cant get a game.
I know for a fact sheehan was fully fit to start the last day.Not to start a player of sheehans athleticism,pace,creativity and vision and point scoring over Gould was criminal and shows in a nutshell all thats wrong with CC.

Cork in the last 8 years or so have only been beaten by the all ireland champions in kerry and donegal bar when an injury ridden cork were beaten by mayo in 2011.

The fact is we always have been a top 4 manager even with CC.
These are the best players cork have ever had.What have armagh done to say their a top four team?Nothing at all.

These games Cc always win as he doesnt have to think on hes feet.To say cork beaten by armagh is not a new low by hes own poor standards is just wrong.
Anyone that says otherwise has clearly missed the boat.

keane2097

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

you clearly honey have being get far too much sun to say i overrate cork and blame the manager too much.
CC Is a poor poor manager that guys like kelly collins and sheehan cant get a game.
I know for a fact sheehan was fully fit to start the last day.Not to start a player of sheehans athleticism,pace,creativity and vision and point scoring over Gould was criminal and shows in a nutshell all thats wrong with CC.

Cork in the last 8 years or so have only been beaten by the all ireland champions in kerry and donegal bar when an injury ridden cork were beaten by mayo in 2011.

The fact is we always have been a top 4 manager even with CC.
These are the best players cork have ever had.What have armagh done to say their a top four team?Nothing at all.

These games Cc always win as he doesnt have to think on hes feet.To say cork beaten by armagh is not a new low by hes own poor standards is just wrong.
Anyone that says otherwise has clearly missed the boat.

Never said anything approaching Armagh are a top four team. They're probably 10th. Losing a 65-35 game is not a new low, it's not a low full stop.

Thinkstoomuch

keane2097 wrote: »

Never said anything approaching Armagh are a top four team. They're probably 10th. Losing a 65-35 game is not a new low, it's not a low full stop.

So a top 4 team,div1 team loosing to a team below them ranked 10th as you put it is hardly a high either so in your eyes what exactly is it,if it aint a low?

keane2097

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

So a top 4 team,div1 team loosing to a team below them ranked 10th as you put it is hardly a high either so in your eyes what exactly is it,if it aint a low?

Part and parcel?

Thinkstoomuch

keane2097 wrote: »

Part and parcel?

You cant give it a simple straight answer,if it is not a low as you strongly argued,what is it exactly.that alone answers it for me.

A top 4 team loosing to a team ranked 10th is a low.Fact.

I'll agree to dissagree.

keane2097

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

You cant give it a simple straight answer,if it is not a low as you strongly argued,what is it exactly.that alone answers it for me.

A top 4 team loosing to a team ranked 10th is a low.Fact.

I'll agree to dissagree.

I've found all the best false dichotomies tend to be "yes or no" questions.

premierstone

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

You cant give it a simple straight answer,if it is not a low as you strongly argued,what is it exactly.that alone answers it for me.

A top 4 team loosing to a team ranked 10th is a low.Fact.

I'll agree to dissagree.

But you said it would be an all time low, do you now admit you were been over the top?

ShamoBuc

Listen, Cork are going to do the double, a - near - All Time High...:)

Think happy thoughts..:pac:

Thinkstoomuch

premierstone wrote: »

But you said it would be an all time low, do you now admit you were been over the top?

part and parcel is my answer.
I asked a simple question and failed to get an answer.
It turned in to more a like a game of scrabble in the end.

keane2097

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

part and parcel is my answer.
I asked a simple question and failed to get an answer.
It turned in to more a like a game of scrabble in the end.

You're similarly failing to answer premierstone's question.

See, it's no fun when someone tries to force you to answer a question that doesn't actually address the issue. It's a ****ty way to try an argument.

False Dilemma or Dichotomy
A false dichotomy or false dilemma occurs when an argument presents two options and ignores, either purposefully or out of ignorance, other alternatives.

In general, a false dichotomy gives the impression that the two oppositie options are mutually exclusive (that is, only one of them may be the case, never both) and that at least one of them is true, that is, they represent all of the possible options.

False dichotomy examples

For example, the claim that “you’re either with me, or you’re against me” is an example of a false dichotomy. This form of rhetoric is used to persuade or even threaten, but it ignores the fact that the individual or group addressed may have a neutral opinion towards the speaker. It is logically possible for someone to be neither with nor against an individual.

A more obvious example would be the claim ‘All animals are either mammals or fish.’ We could use that, with the premise ‘my pet parrot is not a mammal’ to conclude that ‘my pet parrot is a fish’. Clearly, something went wrong. The problem here is not a failure of logic in the argument form, but that the first premise is a false dichotomy. That premise is false — there are also birds, for one, as well as other groups of animals.

Falsum in uno, falsum in omnibus

A special version of this fallacy is known as falsum in uno, falsum in omnibus, essentially “false in something, false in everything”. This is a combination of a false dichotomy and an ad hominem attack, because it attempts to disregard everything the person is saying by the claim that they’re either presenting the truth or presenting falsehoods. It ignores the possibility that the individual is wrong about one thing but right about others. The fact that someone has been proven wrong about claims they made is a potential reason to suspect other claims they make, but not a logical reason to disregard them entirely.

EDIT: In case further clarification is needed, Townes van Zandt should be clear enough

Thinkstoomuch

keane2097 wrote: »

You're similarly failing to answer premierstone's question.

See, it's no fun when someone tries to force you to answer a question that doesn't actually address the issue. It's a ****ty way to try an argument.



EDIT: In case further clarification is needed, Townes van Zandt should be clear enough

Part and parcel is my answer.

keane2097

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

Part and parcel is my answer.

Listen, this isn't a blog site. If you want to discuss a topic, you don't introduce false yes/no scenarios in order to try and shut someone who is disagreeing with you up. If you want to own the conversation and refuse to engage properly, I recommend wordpress, blogger or a million other places where you can write away to your heart's content and turn off comments. Here on boards.ie you don't get to ask a question and tell someone what their answers are allowed to be. If that makes you want to take your ball and go home grand, come back when you enter your teens.

Hope this helps.

Thinkstoomuch

Cork intermediate team more than likely named tommorrow night for tippereary on friday night.

premierstone

Tipp team for Friday night named -


1. Darragh Egan (Kildangan)
2. Seán O'Brien (Newport)
3. Micheál Butler (Drom and Inch)
4. Tom Treacy (Cappawhite)
5. Willie Ryan (Clonakenny)
6. David Young (Toomevara) Captain
7. Padraig Heffernan (Clonoulty Rossmore)
8. Joey McLoughney (Toomevara)
9. Seán McCormack (Borris-Ileigh)
10. Orrie Quirke (Silvermines)
11. Timmy Hammersley (Clonoulty Rossmore)
12. Danny O'Hanlon (Carrick Swans)
13. Ruairi Gleeson (Kildangan)
14. Thomas Butler (Clonoulty Rossmore)
15. Paudie Greene (Upperchurch Drombane)

Thinkstoomuch

keane2097 wrote: »

Listen, this isn't a blog site. If you want to discuss a topic, you don't introduce false yes/no scenarios in order to try and shut someone who is disagreeing with you up. If you want to own the conversation and refuse to engage properly, I recommend wordpress, blogger or a million other places where you can write away to your heart's content and turn off comments. Here on boards.ie you don't get to ask a question and tell someone what their answers are allowed to be. If that makes you want to take your ball and go home grand, come back when you enter your teens.

Hope this helps.

first and foremost im only going to say one final point,as were going around in circles and gone completely off topic and im not going to entertain you with your words of wisdom from the english dictonary.

I did not ask a yes or no question.i simply asked as you strongly,disagreed with my view,if loosing to armagh was not a low for cork,what exactly was it.

I had hoped you would have entered reasonable debate.
When it was clear you woudnt i left it at that and agreed to disagree.

Im not going to stop posting just cause you order me to.If a moderator or a majoirity of posters,do not want me to post them i wont and will out of common courtsey close my account.

Im not going to engage with you in relation to this again as like i said before will agree to to disagree with you.

Connorzee

Is that Darragh Egan in goals the same Darragh Egan who used play outfield with tipp and has the AI medal?

Thinkstoomuch

Connorzee wrote: »

Is that Darragh Egan in goals the same Darragh Egan who used play outfield with tipp and has the AI medal?

I think so,he played well when tipp beat us by a point in a qualifer in thurles.

D'Agger

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

with all due respect the hurling has nothing to do with cork v armagh.

It does if I'm speaking in relation to supporters of a team and their opinions on the outcome of a match.

I felt that before the Limerick game, whilst not being dismissive of Limerick, you in particular seemed to think that the game was Corks to win, the talk of the challenge games in Cloughduv where Cork dominated them springs to mind. I feel you've expressed the same type of attitude towards Armagh here so I'd have it as being relevant.

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

You are off the mark in to say cork were over confident against limerick.Allen said the same.
Cork knew this would be close and with all our injuries to say we just thought we would win handy is completely rubbish.

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

you clearly honey have being get far too much sun to say i overrate cork and blame the manager too much.

The cork team even with a clueless manager has too much talent and even if CC goes with brawn over brains Cork are simply play at a different level to armagh.Our players would just walk through them.

The fact is we always have been a top 4 manager even with CC.
These are the best players cork have ever had

Yeah....it's all that sun

To say cork beaten by armagh is not a new low by hes own poor standards is just wrong.
Anyone that says otherwise has clearly missed the boat.

This armagh team is not a patch on the 2002 team.To dress a defeat to them as anything other than a new low is nonense.

Had Dublin lost to Meath I doubt it would have been a 'new low' for Dublin football and Meath are a division 3 side, so for me leagues mean the sum total of jack shít come championship time.

If Cork lose to Armagh then it's a loss...that's it, but it certainly isn't a new low for football in this county, seriously get a grip.

premierstone wrote: »

But you said it would be an all time low, do you now admit you were been over the top?

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

part and parcel is my answer.
I asked a simple question and failed to get an answer.
It turned in to more a like a game of scrabble in the end.

He was being way over the top Premierstone and now, evasive it would seem.

Thinkstoomuch

To be fair i never saw the cork game as ours to win.I had in fairness on both the limerick and Cork threads said the game would be close and go down to the wire.

I had felt Cork had weak aera's but so too did cork.Yes I felt it was a game we could win ,but I had feared limerick.
I had felt that we could make inroads in certain aeras,but we were weak at full back and also at half back.

I had stated,that i felt their was more improvement in Cork,due to the fact that we were panel wise,in a much better place than we were for the Clare game and I was of the view,we had a better management.

A lot of Limerick fans,had felt the game was theirs to win and i can see why they thought that.
I had like many Llmerick fans when i saw their team,felt it was to our advantage,
but never felt it was 'ours to win'.In fact,i had stated Limerick may well win.

I posted an article in relation to christy o connor's view on page 265 here,where he did mention the challenge game,against Limerick in Kilworth.He felt,limerick would win this game.

I did not base any assumptions myself on that game,as i was not at it,but the u21 football final in the Gaelic grounds the same night.

In relation to a challenge game at Cloughduv,that would be the Cork and tipp challenge game,in which i did attend,but i did state after that game back as far back as May ,I would not read too much in to Cussen getting two goals or Corks win,as Tippereary did not seem up for the game,and understandably so,as it was a week after the league final.I did not use this game at Cloughduv,as any reference to the Limerick game,in fairness or the challenge game against Limerick in Kilworth,to say Cork would win or the fact Cork dominated them.
In all my posts,i do not read too much in to challenge games where possible,and judge them on face value.

The article i posted by COC,had in fact used that game to say Limerick would win.

Thinkstoomuch

Donal O'Sullivan,Castletownbere is Corks new minor football manager.

Horse84

Barry Kelly reffing cork v Kilkenny. We can't catch a break it seems lol. Ah well at least it's not the no.2 ref in Westmeath this time...;)

Connorzee

Thinkstoomuch wrote: »

I think so,he played well when tipp beat us by a point in a qualifer in thurles.

I saw him play with NUIG in the fitz in the mardyke about 7/8 years ago before they won the senior all Ireland and he was simply awesome at half forward. With Sheedy in the crowd looking on. Looks to have put on the weight over the years though