Internship scheme.

ninty9er

RichardAnd wrote: »

The basic idea of trying to get people into employment via internships is a good one but why should the state be paying these interns when it is the companies that will benefit?

If the companies in question had the money, they'd advertise the job and pay someone to do it.

What part of companies not having bottomless payroll pits is it difficult for people to understand.

ninty9er

ninty9er wrote: »

If the companies in question had the money, they'd advertise the job and pay someone to do it.

What part of companies not having bottomless payroll pits is it difficult for people to understand.

They can cut wages if they want the staff - giving someone experience isnt going to create a job


if the entire 450,000 on the dole had experience it wouldnt change the fundamental problems with the economy

all this internship scheme does is push the payroll costs onto the taxpayer
while companies make profits without having to pay some staff (up to 20% of staff can be under this scheme) then the competition must do the same in order to compete

we just ruined the jobs market for entry level positions while costing the taxpayer more

there are reasons these hair brained schemes dont work

RichardAnd

ninty9er wrote: »

If the companies in question had the money, they'd advertise the job and pay someone to do it.

What part of companies not having bottomless payroll pits is it difficult for people to understand.

If they don't have the money for staff, then they don't hire staff. Simple as. As blindjustice says, if they need staff then they must find the money from within the organisation or simply go without. If you want something, you should pay for it.

Nijmegen

The cost to employ someone on minimum wage is €19,296.14 per year, or €17,992 if you waive social insurance (10.75% employers pay in tax on top of your wage.)

If companies could afford to pay this left and right, there would be no jobs crises. Everyone presently unemployed, or many of them, would be hired on minimum wage to do the jobs they previously did and costs in the economy would magically fall.

Companies cannot justify this. For one, a good internship program - such as I've described having as a pup and which I now run and the likes of which beeftothehells describes - is one in which the intern gets a real education, and the company is investing more into them than they're getting out in the hopes of creating an ecosystem of trained employees in their wider market for the future.

That there are companies taking the piss in this internship program is likely true, but that is poor design and management by politicians and civil servants who ought to rectify that with stricter rules.

I think that with the manageable sum of 5,000 positions open a board of even mid level commercial managers could vet each internship position and find out what companies are up to.

I would, like I do with interns in my company, give freely of my own time to do so as a small service to this state. I daresay there are others like me who would do the same for nothing - just review the ads, and query the companies and the interns from time to time.

Internships should not add significantly to the bottom line of a company today, they are investments in tomorrows workforce.

Inverse to the power of one!

Nijmegen wrote: »

Internships should not add significantly to the bottom line of a company today, they are investments in tomorrows workforce.

I'm sure the rest of the OECD will thank us in time.

ninty9er

RichardAnd wrote: »

If they don't have the money for staff, then they don't hire staff. Simple as. As blindjustice says, if they need staff then they must find the money from within the organisation or simply go without. If you want something, you should pay for it.

Problem is, I need the person in place to justify the job. I don't have the setup cost. There are 13 full time staff on an average of €30k with nobody earning over €45k even when all performance targets are met.

It's a lean, flat organisation. I don't have the capacity to cut wages. Someone is already doing the work, but working in excess of a normal week to do it, and they're not getting paid for the excess time.

So I can cut it from someone else's job at a nominal €0 as we don't pay overtime, everyone is salaried, and if I don't pay someone, it's the same situation.

fat__tony

ninty9er wrote: »

If the companies in question had the money, they'd advertise the job and pay someone to do it.

What part of companies not having bottomless payroll pits is it difficult for people to understand.

What about a MNC who has made huge profits over the past few years?

There are plenty of them here in Ireland. Surely they can afford to pay a professional with a couple of years experience an honest salary in return for their skillset.

You sound like an employer who is actively involved in this 'work-for-free' scam.

ninty9er

ninty9er wrote: »

If the companies in question had the money, they'd advertise the job and pay someone to do it.
.

Why would they do that when they can get someone to do it for free? The goodness of their hearts?

Bens

Im going to bet that someone who is willing to work for nothing, is just doing so out of pure laziness to actually move away and find themselves an employer who will pay them for their work.

As I said in another thread. People should do themselves a favour and go somewhere they are appreciated, not abused.

Make all the excuses you want, but allowing someone to take you on as a slave is just not the action of a smart person.

tbh the suckers who allow themselves to be abused deserve to be rode up the arse. People bring it on themselves. Theres a whole world out there. Use it.

later12

Bens wrote: »

Im going to bet that someone who is willing to work for nothing, is just doing so out of pure laziness to actually move away and find themselves an employer who will pay them for their work.

Do you think there might be another reason for not being able to find work - especially work in a very specific field - beyond laziness? Anything to do with the 340,000 or so who are unemployed?

For example, say I am an architecture graduate and I want to move into a specific field, for example say I want to set up my own practice building eco-friendly igloo huts. Should I not take 6 months out to work as an intern with the leading company in this area, so that I might gain valuable skills and experience, whilst not necessarily being of much value to the industry leader itself?

This practice is well known among law, finance, architecture, veterinary, engineering and journalism students to name but a handful. It should be seen as an opportunity for learning new skills that one intends to make professional use for, just as how one ought to consider a university education.

Make all the excuses you want, but allowing someone to take you on as a slave is just not the action of a smart person.

Quite an interesting take on the slavery there. What is your understanding of slavery, working for free?

Bens

later10 wrote: »

Do you think there might be another reason for not being able to find work - especially work in a very specific field - beyond laziness? Anything to do with the 340,000 or so who are unemployed?

For example, say I am an architecture graduate and I want to move into a specific field, for example say I want to set up my own practice building eco-friendly igloo huts. Should I not take 6 months out to work as an intern with the leading company in this area, so that I might gain valuable skills and experience, whilst not necessarily being of much value to the industry leader itself?

This practice is well known among law, finance, architecture, veterinary, engineering and journalism students to name but a handful. It should be seen as an opportunity for learning new skills that one intends to make professional use for, just as how one ought to consider a university education.
Quite an interesting take on the slavery there. What is your understanding of slavery, working for free?

Well in that case, you might want to emigrate to somewhere where you will get better experience at building eco-friendly igloo huts. Somewhere that will pay you when you to work for them.
Or you could just stay in Ireland and apply to work for free to anywhere you can find that makes eco-friendly igloo huts. Good luck with that.
Like I said, excuses and laziness.
Go out, spread your wings. Or just work for free in Ireland - at the tax payers expense.

Im sure slaves got plenty of experience at building pyramids in Egypt.

The real reason you cant find work - You've limited your search to Ireland.
Let me do you a favour - www.jobserve.com

later12

Eh, I have a job... thanks. I'm not actually looking to build igloo huts like, it's an example. I think most people find the need for upskilling to be a reasonable one. Not sure why you are comparing this to slavery.

ninty9er

ninty9er wrote: »

There are 13 full time staff on an average of €30k with nobody earning over €45k even when all performance targets are met.

It's a lean, flat organisation. I don't have the capacity to cut wages.

again, cut wages if you want more staff

but you wont, sure why would you because you can now get staff for free

Nijmegen

It seems to me that minds are not for changing here.

Meanwhile, last week I hired an intern for a role that came up and a second intern still going will return to college for a final year with, at the end of it, a potential edge on his competitors for jobs.

They never made me tea, that I can recall.

ninty9er

Deleted User wrote: »

again, cut wages if you want more staff

but you wont, sure why would you because you can now get staff for free

To pay someone the same as myself I need to come up with €24k to cover PRSI etc... I'm not really looking to give someone a career on anything less than that.

fat__tony wrote: »

You sound like an employer who is actively involved in this 'work-for-free' scam.

Not yet I'm not, but i have someone looking in to it for me. You seem to think all employers are out to screw people, you need to get over yourself. I've 2 students on 6 month placements for free working on commission on sales which is a minor part of what they do. They've both gotten good experience, neither is too familiar with a photocopier or the kettle, in fact I'd be more likely to have made them more tea.

It doesn't really matter what you think anyway, if I get someone it makes no odds to you, as your attitude seems to suggest you'd prefer to sit idle on the dole than take an internship.

new jobs up on the website today

General Operatives (Civil, Ground & Concrete Works)
Description

Successful applicants will gain experience within our Civil Pipe work, all Ground Works and Concrete Works. Applicants must be willing to learn and be good time keepers.

Skills Requirements

Applicants must have a minimum of a Junior Certificate or equivalent qualification.

Department

On Site Labour

Number of Positions

2


Employer

Ellsport Ltd
Derrybeg
Tullamore
Co Offaly

depressing that employers can dress unskilled labour up as an internship in order to get free staff

http://intern.jobbridge.ie/Default.aspx?q=B+fomdowzS8kaDnSlUDk1yW26DjUJdnNZmJvk4EsxDKnmmsSN00TwUIJOs0F/iTwkUVADFishQy3b9XKbMpeHSzgO2XBklydQVl4uchpM0eoTTsMHQikEMk3RDdc4f+5bw3qypUPCjTfIw4CPe7gX/4QEFAKeaj9gSHe/IPpO+ZIhBrAkWGVjLswzxDHw+cpRGteO5hDLI8JVyPrwAtr7QL01tWY0iLJnWvX5M+7iMMRk2wyC0uCHMbGJCNsHKr2azK5oWSYN/4/CDS03FTzEN70M3LBQG+NCsZ29o2z80HqL2uo7O/cS/sFuxBIKRN5KN1bsWmh/iP5Z2gQdfAAnGdExSHMp46yJd2cykrlKXFCTolhoyUWflPvnWWRAuOqHfUHZ7x/G5KTefZWEFFAGMsrFu1H4O4A93TIHLRbrZPsbMXWV0tIqpyctTbhvGknMGp+fbdFe4Y3kqvnxCd1ZWyQ9Vi97Jiw


first eamonn o ciuv
http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/1125/economy_unemployed.html

Minister for Social Protection Éamon Ó Cuív has warned that unemployed people who fail to participate in welfare-to-work programmes will lose their dole payments.

now burton with the same
http://www.herald.ie/national-news/burton-slashes-dole-for-jobless-who-wont-work-2629338.html

RichardAnd

Deleted User wrote: »

new jobs up on the website today




depressing that employers can dress unskilled labour up as an internship in order to get free staff

http://intern.jobbridge.ie/Default.aspx?q=B+fomdowzS8kaDnSlUDk1yW26DjUJdnNZmJvk4EsxDKnmmsSN00TwUIJOs0F/iTwkUVADFishQy3b9XKbMpeHSzgO2XBklydQVl4uchpM0eoTTsMHQikEMk3RDdc4f+5bw3qypUPCjTfIw4CPe7gX/4QEFAKeaj9gSHe/IPpO+ZIhBrAkWGVjLswzxDHw+cpRGteO5hDLI8JVyPrwAtr7QL01tWY0iLJnWvX5M+7iMMRk2wyC0uCHMbGJCNsHKr2azK5oWSYN/4/CDS03FTzEN70M3LBQG+NCsZ29o2z80HqL2uo7O/cS/sFuxBIKRN5KN1bsWmh/iP5Z2gQdfAAnGdExSHMp46yJd2cykrlKXFCTolhoyUWflPvnWWRAuOqHfUHZ7x/G5KTefZWEFFAGMsrFu1H4O4A93TIHLRbrZPsbMXWV0tIqpyctTbhvGknMGp+fbdFe4Y3kqvnxCd1ZWyQ9Vi97Jiw


first eamonn o ciuv
http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/1125/economy_unemployed.html


now burton with the same
http://www.herald.ie/national-news/burton-slashes-dole-for-jobless-who-wont-work-2629338.html

I saw that, less than a week and the abuse has already kicked off. I don't suppose "washroom technician" has shown up yet?

The comments from the ministers are worrying but then, they have been saying things like that for a few years now.

ninty9er

Just to clear up I'm not defending that crap. They position I have in mind is as an advertising sales exectuive with a marketing qualification. I don't expect that the relevant person would be be given too much direction. It would be a self directed position and a desk job where one-on-one unsupervised client meetings would sometimes be required.

You can call that unskilled all you like, but the hiring of unskilled people for jobs they're not interested in is not to my organisation's benefit, nor that of an individual looking to gain experience.

Bens

Dear god, i just looked at the website again. Its even worse than I thought.
Surely this cant be allowed.

Unreal.

Tehachapi

RichardAnd wrote: »

I saw that, less than a week and the abuse has already kicked off. I don't suppose "washroom technician" has shown up yet?

It will probably show up as "washroom technician INTERN" soon, complete the internship, impress the management and who knows - you could be fastracked into a lucrative washroom technician CAREER ! The system works !

ninty9er

ninty9er wrote: »

Just to clear up I'm not defending that crap. They position I have in mind is as an advertising sales exectuive with a marketing qualification. I don't expect that the relevant person would be be given too much direction. It would be a self directed position and a desk job where one-on-one unsupervised client meetings would sometimes be required.

You can call that unskilled all you like, but the hiring of unskilled people for jobs they're not interested in is not to my organisation's benefit, nor that of an individual looking to gain experience.

look i always thought there should be an option for people to work for their dole but working not for private business only for the government

if businesses want to take people on thats fine too but it should only be as part of a college course - that covers skilled work

unskilled workers need feck all training, a few days maybe, and most businesses do orientation

http://intern.jobbridge.ie/Default.aspx?q=B+fomdowzS8kaDnSlUDk1yW26DjUJdnNZmJvk4EsxDKnmmsSN00TwdctP/N+2EKFeF/JvUvaPKOEeQw2rlJPNCMhikjE5jS0W5eIRiVbQLeDwAbURRhhvHst+jKTVNTo5MCJZ3z0qJD+ZyYywaoWiMbQDp6T4CvwKj6+DEwQBB6eFvS9S45WTjv/vLutTcICEyzX6ItdihrdSg1k9NObqtlG64+QFsaaZ4ocV9TOx7zxwqfbxQsXJYxrDDSrybgwHz+sH/wlpUeuWuTMvo9gEdbVqdtBLFQNNuQSyVL42b8MiE8HFm9gNpidjleX3lV7gJmODf8uV4CPokW85312GmXbFHrRlXQRFEq90ZiTEL3Gn6PwjXNHwU/6PPs1BtUoHqz7uiWASceOCKAUCP/scG4viJdma2W3YP5jAryVBjVHym4ENFRd5C3JFdwBgOssXs0Xnw9Cl08NmAtKCcFpXDDCKc+Rz44i

General Groundworker ( Internship)

Description

Enhance and/or update skills. Enhance communication skills and increase work prospects.
Skills Requirements

This position is best suited to a person with good timekeeper, who is enthusiastic to work and is also a team player. The work involves general groundwork to include (but not limited to) pipelaying, concrete work and general labour.

Please contact Orla on 087 2700099

I dont like the way this company isnt named (and shamed)

http://intern.jobbridge.ie/Default.aspx?q=B+fomdowzS8kaDnSlUDk1yW26DjUJdnNZmJvk4EsxDKnmmsSN00TwXTrph6kJpP6KxUIFIQyQKzIuCsHkyxaahFgxDadWKi99sc+4OO/V2XSX/bq3B8/wSK4IoSOK5d2BYNhNaf5qSLqq5wr27qrAhZ3ydfMMj3srZaUprrhVwnnS7axt9Yx0496v6T2lX8hIZ0CaVdXELmFw4EjCsCK/CMB24bUCyKaUxGBpWObj+zkRxmENGLQgDPqB7aWyTji8u3jeIQJYtCoRBUC4Dg2E+MYcP4fSG5mwaiMKt1qHamPtFLz2lxWGTZDhZ5gCmLABOEX2tA5IeOKhishfOZKLf8IjvvV4mPSZ57j8bWAgk+LRpaxA3afOqqdDWW2B+0rc1L64jak+PDIiNTJpCe9zgk4dyjj7YqhMYt9dvdYWLyh0RDQXK4iqnCRg6thYFVReAZ3J1j0YoKICCTwNxVNLm9ZI9fCWO7e

Care Assistant - Internship
Opportunity to gain experience with qualified professionals in a care setting under the structured mentoring of and experienced Care Professional The successful candidate will gain experience in supporting people with Intellectual disability. They will also receive the opportunity to engage with different sections of the services and to learn best practice approaches to care.

Number of Positions
20

:eek:

Please post CV with cover letter and character references to General Manager, St Patrick s Centre, Kells Road, Kilkenny.

ninty9er

Well it is an area where professional experience is required and difficult to get, but 20 is definitely taking the piss. Send in HIQA!:eek:

ok well here is one that requires you to have experience already

http://intern.jobbridge.ie/Default.aspx?q=B+fomdowzS8kaDnSlUDk1zaMUPiFEeNrNWjviinu490thmC2C0u+DI4BGMFoVKYEcvJo7RiJzQGfPMsilks4XLgDVTZL9Hn+ikjggFG9AKKXmGzUoRaJ7/kH9lOFdEkeEb/FzmuM8aqtZJ13hgiH0b62DwNGRiMG0/5VBMiRax0SJ41nr1+pG8pddXfhtnwgHCPTJh94wFcqHwAiPJMmAZScMX6LE5TUvG0QAtZYFeqvGW9574VrzOyEAYAmq0NNAVZrKSjJaqJhNxt2ihiOXcDYxJG4cGnbWoFr6Zw49Rz6l****01rkJc+SHSUTStAdODMaiUS6v+cvpJqdqQcHPAXr8zsCPeQa7zck6A+qYFqidZ1pK2R/zTspbOWLdSYWNWlWW6K0WIPX37IyHIVTRC6fHURsHW2NlAOckNuOWM5TTFUIWaMg/LkWxtkuCO4imRt9VWqFV17tvt0LEe/0Q==

Description

The intern will gain experience in our After-school and Summer Camp services, working with children aged 4-13 years old.The will assist the room leader in providing a quality childcare service and be invloved in planning and carrying out activities and trips. Experience will also be offered in our other rooms including Highscope Pre-school and Creche.


Skills Requirements

Childcare Qualification is desirable for this post, along with experience in a similar role. The candidate must be kind and caring and have a flexiable and approachable nature.

CoolGirl101

Better than WPP in my opinion, but still not amazing.

CoolGirl101

CoolGirl101 wrote: »

Better than WPP in my opinion, but still not amazing.

what you prefer the name or something? The jobs advertised show there is no difference

tvnutz

Deleted User wrote: »

what you prefer the name or something? The jobs advertised show there is no difference

The extra 50 quid is the only difference I can see.

road_high

Ah jesus that labourer job in Offaly is feckin' pisstake, has to be. You would be working your ass off in a tough environment in all weathers for nothing. This country gets better....

Warehouse Operative

Number of Positions

3

EMail your completed short application to the address: hayley@embellish.ie

this is some sick stuff