institute of education good for repeating or waste of 10 grand?

jenny18

planning to repeat next year and wondering if leeson streets worth the money worked out with accommodation school etc about 15,000 and want to know if its worth it? planning to do medicine got 179 in hpat.

spurious

15000 :eek: of someone's money is a hell of a lot of motivation.

At the end of the day it's up to you to do the work.

partyatmygaff

You can go to the world's most expensive school if you want but it won't make a bit of difference if you don't do any work yourself. Just keep that in mind.

Sunny!!

partyatmygaff wrote: »

You can go to the world's most expensive school if you want but it won't make a bit of difference if you don't do any work yourself. Just keep that in mind.

this is probarly the the most important respnse youll get here.

._.

partyatmygaff wrote: »

You can go to the world's most expensive school if you want but it won't make a bit of difference if you don't do any work yourself. Just keep that in mind.

Obviously she's planning on doing the work if she's looking for medicine :rolleyes:

Having gone to a grind school myself (and from knowing people in IOE), I'd say that going there would be the best advantage you could give yourself. Great teachers, great notes, and the study hall is excellent. The free classes you get during the day make all the difference.

Sunny!!

._. wrote: »

Obviously she's planning on doing the work if she's looking for medicine :rolleyes:

Having gone to a grind school myself (and from knowing people in IOE), I'd say that going there would be the best advantage you could give yourself. Great teachers, great notes, and the study hall is excellent. The free classes you get during the day make all the difference.

oh damn haha didnt see she was applying for med:) id say go for it it will give you the best shot!!

randylonghorn

._. wrote: »

Obviously she's planning on doing the work if she's looking for medicine :rolleyes:

Not in any way aiming this at the OP, but you do meet people who think that because they go somewhere like the IoE and pay through the nose to do so, the knowledge will automagically filter into their brains without their having to exert themselves unduly.





That's a *hell* of a lot of money for your parents to find, OP, before they even tackle the costs of putting you through college.

Are there no good schools locally where you could repeat?

medsc

It was the best decision I ever made, I would highly recommend it! It is definately worth the money. I would even dare say that you're better off not repeating if you don't go there (but I might really get attacked for this comment :pac:)

LilMissCiara

To be honest, if you're able for medicine (ie. hardworking, dedicated etc.) then you should be capable of achieving the points anywhere. €15000 is a shocking amount of money and I would imagine that it would be much better spent on grinds, night study etc.

I know most cities/towns have places that offer evening and night study until around 9pm. (eg. The Galway Study Centre).

I would repeat locally if I were you, especially as you say you'd need accommodation. Another option is a grinds school nearer to you where you could commute daily (Yeats, Bruce etc.)

partyatmygaff

._. wrote: »

Obviously she's planning on doing the work if she's looking for medicine :rolleyes:

Why is it obvious? A lot of people seem to think that grind schools give their students magical notes that will somehow grant them effortless A1s across the board.

I had grinds this year in the IOE. The teachers are great and notes are indeed very good but it's a waste of both time and money if you don't work. You'd be surprised at the amount of people who went to the classes without their notes or just sat there and did nothing or played around with their phones e.t.c. I'd say it'd be a great place to repeat but paying €15,000 for it without being completely focused on your studies is a bad idea. I'm not saying the OP won't work hard but i'm warning them that simply paying €15,000 and going to a great school alone won't get them very far.

gaeilgegrinds1

My husband did medicine many years ago...in a community college...his brother got in last year...from a community college...I think sometimes people think they will automatically do better. 15000 will go along way once you start medicine as many students have huge loans at the end of it. I think, as a teacher, most students I've had who did medicine were well capable of getting those points on their own, teachers/notes/anything else don't really come into it as they're usually so driven.

gaeilgegrinds1

And obviously he didn't actually do medicine in the college, reads a bit like that, just got the points in one!

MagicMarker

Ridiculous amount of money and you'd be an absolute fool to piss away 10k.

If you don't have the intelligence, grit and determination to get enough points by going to a run of the mill school, then medicine isn't for you.

Sunny!!

id look around 2 10000 is a bit much. Other grind schools as im aware charge 3000 or 4000 less than that. You must be paying for the name of IOE.:P

Bbbbolger

I get that they have great teachers and notes etc. but I have a theory on the Institute. People that go there would tend to be driven. They're repeating and there's a lot of money being put into a year that they could have spent in a local school. Perhaps it's the fact that these students are so driven to succeed that they get such good results. Also take into account that a good amount of Institute students are already aiming for high points courses so they're probably naturally intelligent. I really dont think spending €15,000 is necessary. I didnt have a great Geography this year so I learned to work more independently and I'm now hoping for a good result. If you learn to work on your own you could do a brilliant Leaving Cert without having to spent thousands of your family's hard earned cash.

AdamD

Why are people ****ting on about effort? The OP never once said anything about not putting in the required effort.

The question is: putting the maximum amount of effort in, would the OP do better in the Institute and if so is it worth the 15000?

Naikon

AdamD wrote: »

Why are people ****ting on about effort? The OP never once said anything about not putting in the required effort.

The question is: putting the maximum amount of effort in, would the OP do better in the Institute and if so is it worth the 15000?

They aren't so much about "Education" as they are about teaching you shortcuts to sidehand the Leaving Cert. If you want an Education, go anywhere but there. VERY grey area imo.

Fad

Naikon wrote: »

They aren't so much about "Education" as they are about teaching you shortcuts to sidehand the Leaving Cert. If you want an Education, go anywhere but there. VERY grey area imo.

To be fair, if you're finished your leaving cert and you have to repeat, you're probably going to be done with "Education" and just want to play the game...

spurious

AdamD wrote: »

Why are people ****ting on about effort? The OP never once said anything about not putting in the required effort.

The question is: putting the maximum amount of effort in, would the OP do better in the Institute and if so is it worth the 15000?

If that is the question, the answer is no, she would be wasting the money.

There is nothing special about the IOE and its ilk, except perhaps that it has classes full of people whose families have paid large amounts of money for them to be there. This tends to concentrate the mind. If the mind can be concentrated that much, it can be concentrated from anywhere.

Naikon

Fad wrote: »

To be fair, if you're finished your leaving cert and you have to repeat, you're probably going to be done with "Education" and just want to play the game...

Oh, the irony:P

"Institute of short cuts" tbh. They don't exactly try to hide this. Maybe they chose that name for the lulz. I have far more respect for a teacher that helps disadvantaged kids, over the ones that teach only to gloat about how many A1 students they nabbed.

randylonghorn

Naikon wrote: »

Oh, the irony:P

"Institute of short cuts" tbh. They don't exactly try to hide this. Maybe they chose that name for the lulz. I have far more respect for a teacher that helps disadvantaged kids, over the ones that teach only to gloat about how many A1 students they nabbed.

In fairness, I think most teachers teach to earn a living primarily, and luckily, many of them are genuinely interested in and committed to the job they do.

Though personally, I do know where you're coming from ... I too have tremendous respect for those teachers who go the extra mile working with children and young people who don't enjoy all the advantages which some of their peers seem to take for granted these days.

However, this thread isn't about any of those issues; it's a simple request for advice from someone who intends to repeat her LC with a view to maximising her points as she wants to do medicine.

If you wish to start a more general thread to discuss the current culture of the points race, grind schools, etc., please do. You might find a fair few willing to discuss it with you.

Please remember though that this forum expects a calmer, more civil and discursive tone than some others you may be used to.

AdamD

spurious wrote: »

If that is the question, the answer is no, she would be wasting the money.

There is nothing special about the IOE and its ilk, except perhaps that it has classes full of people whose families have paid large amounts of money for them to be there. This tends to concentrate the mind. If the mind can be concentrated that much, it can be concentrated from anywhere.

Would you not agree that they have a better standard of teachers/notes etc than your standard school?

spurious

AdamD wrote: »

Would you not agree that they have a better standard of teachers/notes etc than your standard school?

No I would not.

partyatmygaff

AdamD wrote: »

The question is: putting the maximum amount of effort in, would the OP do better in the Institute and if so is it worth the 15000?

They may do better as the quality of teaching in the Institute is quite good but it's not €15,000 good.

Naikon wrote: »

They aren't so much about "Education" as they are about teaching you shortcuts to sidehand the Leaving Cert. If you want an Education, go anywhere but there. VERY grey area imo.

Have you ever actually been to the institute? I attended Saturday grinds there for French and Maths throughout the year and I found it to be excellent. I did have a look at the English and Chemistry notes though and at least for those two subjects i'd have to agree with you. The notes seemed to focus more on sample answers and worked exam questions rather than actual learning.

AdamD

spurious wrote: »

No I would not.

That is very surprising tbh, have you been there? Never have myself but all my mates who went there said it was brilliant

Sunny!!

spurious wrote: »

No I would not.

this is only my opinion but i believe the notes and teachers are alot better than your normal school. I wont go into it. Maybe must public school are great, but from my experience and the others i know its not the case unfortunately

randylonghorn

I think the core of the argument here may be about the word "better", and spurious and I may have a different opinion from you two on that one (that's permissible, btw! :P)

Grinds schools in general are focused solely on exams / results / points. And unfortunately these days you have been socialised into believing that that is the be all and end all of education. It's not. It's important ofc, but it's only part of what an education should be about.

That's one issue.

The other is this: yes, the IoE and so on have good teachers, at least from the point of view of exam results, no-one is denying that. But so do many other schools. My own old school a couple of years graduated the candidate with the highest-scoring points in the LC in the country, and it's a very good but a very *normal* rural secondary school ... no fees, no entrance policy, no PR or ads, *lots* of extra-curricular activities, and lots of students who struggle and who need extra attention from teachers.

And there are many schools which will never get a student into the top 5 or even the top 50 in the country, but where marvellous teachers work their backsides off in very tough conditions to get students though the LC with creditable results.

Are they "better" teachers than the teachers in the IoE, or vice versa?

Rather than get into a big argument about it, let's just agree to disagree! :P

UrbanSea

MagicMarker wrote: »

Ridiculous amount of money and you'd be an absolute fool to piss away 10k.

If you don't have the intelligence, grit and determination to get enough points by going to a run of the mill school, then medicine isn't for you.

This is a ridiculous comment.

AdamD wrote: »

Would you not agree that they have a better standard of teachers/notes etc than your standard school?

spurious wrote: »

No I would not.

Frommmy experience youre wrong spurious.
I went to Yeats in Galway having being in my local secondary school. I basically pissed the years away there. That wasn't just me either. The teachers in the school were far superior to my old school,and I knew every course inside out,both the structure and notes.
Put it this way,when I went in for my junior cert Irish,I hadn't a clue that there was even a poetry section on the course.

I'll probably get eaten for this,but every time one of these threads comesnup there's such a sense of almost jealousy towards the OP,criticising their choice to go to a grinds school and they won't necessarily do better there,which is no doubt true.
However,the figures don't lie. You are more likely to get what you want in a grinds school.

GoldFour4

Get your parents to keep the 15 grand in the bank. Make an agreement, if you get medicine, you get the money. If your not gonna do the work in a public school with 15 grand on the line then your not gonna do the work when your paying an over the top fee. Save your parents some money. The teaching may be slightly better but its not 15 grand better.

AdamD

[QUOTE=malachyscott;73067676]Get your parents to keep the 15 grand in the bank. Make an agreement, if you get medicine, you get the money. If your not gonna do the work in a public school with 15 grand on the line then your not gonna do the work when your paying an over the top fee. Save your parents some money. The teaching may be slightly better but its not 15 grand better.[/QUOTE]
@bold: Lets be realistic, that is never going to happen.

nicola09

I didn't go to the Institute and I don't personally know anyone who went there but my concern would be that the style of learning in these grinds schools isn't really compatible with how you learn in college. The leaving cert in general is nothing like third level and I wonder whether the IoE practice of giving you all these good notes and making predictions of what will be on the exam might be setting you up for a shock in a course like medicine, where you will have a lot of work to do on your own.

On the flipside, if you just want to play the leaving cert game and get all the A1s you need then the Institute can certainly help you with this, but you could achieve the same results in any school if you are determined, especially the second time round since you will have a knowledge of what the exams are like and where you think you went wrong. €10k plus is a lot of money these days so don't feel like you need to spend it to get high points, it's possible in any school, the institute just markets itself as the most hassle free way to do it I think!