so who's not passing on the new VAT rate benefits to the customer?

muckish

Was in Costa coffee yesterday Letterkenny, and the new 9% VAT rate was applied to the bill, but it was still €2.50 a coffee. This is pure ripoff and will do nothing to attract customers. The government have warned that if the benefit is not passed onto the customer then they will revoke the 9% VAT rate and go back to the 13.5% rate.
Has anyone seen any other businesses at the same caryy on.
Link here to FAQ on new VAT rate.

Redsoxfan

Not trying to be smart, but did you ask the manager about it?

If my maths are right, the VAT reduction 'should' mean that the cup of coffee should now be €2.40. Every little helps etc.

muckish

No management available unfortunately.

danniemcq

does it affect the cost of cinema too? or was that a dream i had

muffler

danniemcq wrote: »

does it affect the cost of cinema too? or was that a dream i had

I hope Im not in your dreams Dannie but yes, cinema admissions are subject to the reduced VAT rate.

But its a worthless piece of political football. They reduced VAT rates on certain items/services but the powers that be wouldn't take it a step further and introduce legislation to make it compulsory for the savings to be passed on to the consumer.

Any business that does not pass on the savings isn't breaking any law.

danniemcq

muffler wrote: »

I hope Im not in your dreams Dannie but yes, cinema admissions are subject to the reduced VAT rate.

But its a worthless piece of political football. They reduced VAT rates on certain items/services but the powers that be wouldn't take it a step further and introduce legislation to make it compulsory for the savings to be passed on to the consumer.

Any business that does not pass on the savings isn't breaking any law.

nah they'd be more nightmare than dreams...

hmmm must have a look anyway next time i'm down, thats fecking stupid alhough i suppose if they don't reduce the price it means they are more profitable and therefore not as likely to close...

although then again any reduction for joe public would surely encourage more repeat business....

Bob Cratchet

muffler wrote: »

I hope Im not in your dreams Dannie but yes, cinema admissions are subject to the reduced VAT rate.

But its a worthless piece of political football. They reduced VAT rates on certain items/services but the powers that be wouldn't take it a step further and introduce legislation to make it compulsory for the savings to be passed on to the consumer.

Any business that does not pass on the savings isn't breaking any law.

They may not be breaking the law, but there is no reason not to mention it as a paying customer and then take your custom elsewhere. The whole idea of it was to increase their trade and encourage spending/tourism with lower prices.

This is a good thread folks. Keep up the good work.

Mint Sauce

Nothing at all to stop the shops rounding up again to the nearest 10c, or back up to the orriginal price. Which is what allot of them will probably do.

danniemcq

What about a change to this thread or the creation of a new one. One that simply states which local businesses that are covered by this new VAT rate are passing it onto the consumer and who are just pocketing the difference?

At least that way it might give local business a kick in the arse to wake them up! No chit chat or maybe have the first post edited with businesses that are mentioned in the thread?

Centuary Cinemas still 8.50 for a movie. gonna give them a call later

stargazer 68

danniemcq wrote: »

What about a change to this thread or the creation of a new one.

Probably because this is the 4th thread on the subject.

danniemcq

In Donegal?

i know there has been threads in AH and other forums but there wouldn't be much use in a country wide thread as there would be just to much info to be useful. If it was broken down by area people could see the area that affects them. I don't really care if some hairdressers in cork has a reduced rate but i would care about ones in Letterkenny (while on Topic it seems all P. Gildeas are reduced)

mcbeal

I was in Costa Coffee in the Crescent shopping centre in Limerick on Saturday. On examining my bill I noticed it referred to the VAT rate as 9% but I also noticed the prcies had not been reduced. I spoke to the manager who said she know nothing about it. I showed her the receipt and pointed out that the tills had been altered to relfect new vat rate. ABSOLUTE RIP OFF. The majority are going to use the reduction to line their pockets. Whats worse about the likes of Costa Coffee is the majoirity of all their food is produced in UK. Have a look at the packaging.

Ayla

I went to one cafe in Sligo yesterday & they still had the VAT itemized & charged at 13.5%. How's that work - I though the VAT was a government mandated thing & a store couldn't charge more than legislation required?

I've also been to a cafe in Donegal; they didn't itemize the VAT but the price of the meal I got had not reduced any. They did offer 10% off coffees/teas (b/c of the VAT reduction). None of that makes any sense to me.

danniemcq

as muffler pointed out the reduction isn't law. so a name and shame effort show who are greedy pr*cks and who are nice to customers

Ayla

No, but see, this is what I don't get. There are 2 situations here:

1. Where a business will charge a fixed fee for a product. They don't itemize the VAT, and they pocket the difference. They will therefore make more money (and be the real scoundrels). This is the grey area, b/c how can you argue that you're getting ripped off if the company can just say their recently raised business expenses have offset the reduction of VAT. This is really the only reason why one item pre & post VAT change would still be charging the same.

2. Where businesses do itemize the VAT. This is the only way to concretely be sure that the product charge pre & post VAT reduction has actually changed.

For those businesses who fall under the new VAT rate, they cannot still be charging 13.5%. VAT is charged by the companies, but then passed on directly to the government. A business cannot charge more for VAT than they're paying to the government, or the company accountants will be in a heap of trouble. There is really no advantage to a company remaining on the 13.5% VAT rate if they are not supposed to be there.

For situation 1 (above) I can understand if the company is just pocketing the difference that the VAT would have been, but a company can't do that in situation 2.

In my original post, the Sligo cafe would fall under situation 2 (above) while the Donegal cafe would fall under situation 1 (above).

danniemcq

Quiet moment has the discount!

Bob Cratchet

You can hardly expect business not to screw you with the new VAT change if everyone is paying it without even passing a comment, they think they've got away with it, and they have because the sheep will still keep going back. Baaa

Don't be a sheep, ask for the manager/boss, tell them at the counter, and take your custom elsewhere for good and tell them you're doing so. At least their dishonesty is out in the open then and not swept under the carpet with just a shrug.

The VAT decrease was also brought in to give ordinary people a bit of a break, it's your 4% don't hand it away.

No wonder ordinary people in this country are taking it up the rear from the Golden Circle.

homer simpson

Bob Cratchet wrote: »

You can hardly expect business not to screw you with the new VAT change if everyone is paying it without even passing a comment, they think they've got away with it, and they have because the sheep will still keep going back. Baaa

Don't be a sheep, take your custom elsewhere for good.

Its kinda hard when preety much every business is not passing on the VAT changes. In the grand scheme of things a few cent here or there will make no real difference, its the powers that be who didn't go about this the right way, by making sure that this change had to be passed on to the joe soap by law, that the anger should be directed at, most businness are against the ropes too don't forget!

danniemcq

clears throat...

AHEM CENTURY CINEMAS ARE NOT REDUCING THEIR PRICES AND HAVE NO PLANS TO DO IT IN THE FUTURE

oh i'm a bit hoarse now so still 8.50 for a ticket and 10.50 for their attempt at 3D.

rip off

complete rip off

Bob Cratchet

danniemcq wrote: »

Quiet moment has the discount!

Fair play to them, I know where I'll being going the next time for tea and food in Letterkenny then so.

Bob Cratchet

homer_simpson wrote: »

its the powers that be who didn't go about this the right way, by making sure that this change had to be passed on to the joe soap by law

You cannot do it by law, that's the point.

The industry lobbied for this VAT reduction and are now screwing us double, charging us all 4% more, with 4% less going to public services like hospitals etc.

The thieves want you to blame politicians instead of taking your custom elsewhere.

As for the "poor" businesses, if they were in business before the VAT reduction, they'll still be in business after it. 4% is massive additional cream off in anyone's profit margin, the banks don't even pay you 4% for leaving your money with them for a year. Wake up sheeple.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGIY5Vyj4YM

Ayla

Ayla wrote: »

VAT is charged by the companies, but then passed on directly to the government. A business cannot charge more for VAT than they're paying to the government, or the company accountants will be in a heap of trouble. There is really no advantage to a company remaining on the 13.5% VAT rate if they are not supposed to be.

Can someone please confirm the above?

If a company earns €100 in VAT during their daily sales, that €100 goes to the gov't. It will be listed in their accounting books as VAT, and will be on their annual returns.

By this token, a company cannot charge €100 VAT to their customers but only pay the gov't €96.

What I was trying to say before is the companies who don't itemize what VAT they're charging will very easily be able to pocket the difference. Their books will read that they're charging the correct VAT, and the net price of their products has increased. This also means they don't have to reprint their marketing/signage/etc.

But you can't charge for VAT that you're not passing to the gov't. That's fraud.

muffler

Ayla wrote: »

But you can't charge for VAT that you're not passing to the gov't. That's fraud.

Correct. The problem is that they are making the correct, lower VAT returns but are increasing their profit margin by not passing the VAT reduction on to the customer.

Ayla

So technically the cafe I went to in Sligo yesterday was blatently doing wrong by listing & charging my meal at 13.5%?

muffler

Ayla wrote: »

So technically the cafe I went to in Sligo yesterday was blatently doing wrong by listing & charging my meal at 13.5%?

if the VAT showed up on a receipt at 13.5% then thats an offense. However if the overall price remained the same as it was last week for example than thats just greed.

Ayla

ah, thank you - that's what i've been floundering around trying to say all afternoon. that's what i was thinking.

god help the next shop who gives me a receipt with 13.5% on it! or the one who charges the same tomorrow as they did last week.

muffler

Ayla wrote: »

ah, thank you - that's what i've been floundering around trying to say all afternoon. that's what i was thinking.

god help the next shop who gives me a receipt with 13.5% on it! or the one who charges the same tomorrow as they did last week.

Just make sure you know which goods and services have been reduced

danniemcq

muffler wrote: »

Just make sure you know which goods and services have been reduced

Ireland's minister of finance announced that a new reduced 9% V.A.T. rate will be introduced from 1.7.2011 to 31.12.2013.
The reduced rate will apply, inter- alia, to restaurant and catering services, hotel accommodation, admission to cinemas, theatres and certain musical performances, museums and art galleries admission, amusement parks, hairdressing services and printed matters such as maps and leaflets.
The measure will be provided for in the forthcoming finance bill 2, 2011.

from http://www.worldwide-tax.com/ireland/ire_econonews.asp

and they say they get it from revenue.ie but its such a horrible site i'm going nowhere near it

muffler

We sorta have the ifs, buts and whys out of the way so if anyone wants to post up the names of any other establishments who aren't passing on the savings then please do so.

A word of caution though to everyone. Just make sure you have your facts right and can back up any comment posted as you are primarily responsible for your own comments in the event of a particular business claiming that they have been defamed.

Technique

The govt are making up the shortfall in VAT payments from the national pensions reserve fund.

So we, the citizens of this state, are paying for these businesses to be more competitive. Therefore the reduction in prices is our right, these businesses aren't doing it out of the goodness of their hearts.

danniemcq

hmmmmm ringing a few places around town and the ones i get through to are trying to fob me off to the manager who just happens never to be near at the time despite one (charlies cafe) specifically saying they'd get them for me before being told that he was usually in but couldn't be found.
The brewery got very defensive and told me to call in in person as they couldn't tell me over the phone (again manager not available till tomorrow).
Ard Ri was a bar man who apologised and said he just didn't know straight off the bat and said that the manager was in tomorrow straight away.

the yellow pepper seem to have implemented the change since June as they were doing a full menu overhaul at the time

the lemon tree has the reduction mentioned on their menus too

The silver tassie has a reduction on between 5 and 10% but she won't tell me if that has anything to do with the vat. my credit is now out but i'll email a few other places and see if i can find some more

and can i just make it clear that NONE of the businesses i've rang have said they aren't reducing the price bar century cinema who had no problem saying they hadn't and weren't going to.