Unions call to not pay mortgages

sellerbarry

Here's the scenario if i can't pay my mortgage.
Bank repossesses house.
Bank sells house.
Bank chases me for shortfall.
I am on welfare..
Govt gives me all my entitlements (ie: med card,job allowance, fuel allowance, childrens allowance, rent allowance, back to school etc.)
Bank brings me to court.
I get free legal aid.
Judge awards Bank 10euro/wk for the rest of my days.
I do cash jobs here and there.;)

baaaa

sellerbarry wrote: »

Here's the scenario if i can't pay my mortgage.
Bank repossesses house.
Bank sells house.
Bank chases me for shortfall.
I am on welfare..
Govt gives me all my entitlements (ie: med card,job allowance, fuel allowance, childrens allowance, rent allowance, back to school etc.)
Bank brings me to court.
I get free legal aid.
Judge awards Bank 10euro/wk for the rest of my days.
I do cash jobs here and there.;)

Yes,but you will be dishonoured for ever.

sellerbarry

I would rather do that than service a 300k loan for a house worth 150k and let my kids go without to keep the fat bankers happy. Lets be honest here and let the bankers take some of the pain. After all, they gave out money they really didn't have in the first place. From where i'm sitting, the bankers are still laughing at the rest of us, getting bonuses left right and centre with money from the IMF.

d'Oracle

This is the dumbest idea anybody has had to date.
Like the stupidest bloody nonsense I have heard in weeks.
Except maybe OP's populist garbage response.

If people collectively don't pay their mortgages then the banks are put under.
As most of the banks are in state ownership, this means that in order to have anything like a functioning banking system (and before anybody uses the word Zombie to describe our functioning banks bear in mind that you probably have an ATM and/or credit card and you probably bought something today or yesterday from a business which banks ergo we have a functioning bank system) the government has to pay MORE money.

The government gets it money from us (the taxpayers) or from credit facilities (currently the EU/IMF) which further burdens the state, probably to an irreparable point.

Ergo when Johnny Don't et al decide to collectively fail to honour their contractual agreement it will cause further stress to themselves.

Whats more these are nurses. Now, I understand nurses plight. They work a tough, tough job. Many of them are in debt (mortgage) and go to work in increasingly poor conditions due to resource depletion in the appallingly run health services. They also quite often bear the brunt of the public dissatisfaction at the state of said health services.

The screaming irony is that if the economy is to suffer the effects of this madcap scheme, their working conditions will further deteriorate.

Thankfully I think this is just a foolish, ill-advised and irresponsible attempt to drum up support. I don't think they mean it.

maggy_thatcher

sellerbarry wrote: »

I would rather do that than service a 300k loan for a house worth 150k and let my kids go without to keep the fat bankers happy.

If you feel the house is only 150k, why did you agree to pay 300k for it? You are responsible for your own actions -- you made this choice.

d'Oracle

sellerbarry wrote: »

Here's the scenario if i can't pay my mortgage.
Bank repossesses house.
Bank sells house.
Bank chases me for shortfall.
I am on welfare..
Govt gives me all my entitlements (ie: med card,job allowance, fuel allowance, childrens allowance, rent allowance, back to school etc.)
Bank brings me to court.
I get free legal aid.
Judge awards Bank 10euro/wk for the rest of my days.
I do cash jobs here and there.;)

Fell at the third.

baaaa

sellerbarry wrote: »

I would rather do that than service a 300k loan for a house worth 150k and let my kids go without to keep the fat bankers happy.

No,no.You made a deal.

Scofflaw

baaaa wrote: »

This attitude of "I made a deal with the bank so I must honour it" is so delightfully naive and irish.
Keep paying suckers,you're paying so that others don't have to.

Yes - paying the mortgage on your house so the taxpayer doesn't have to.

amused,
Scofflaw

denlaw

baaaa wrote: »

Yes,but you will be dishonoured for ever.

people dont give a ****e about that anymore .

Crazy Horse 6

Feck that. So all the greedy feckers who bought houses they could'nt afford deserve a pass!! They paid over the odds gambled and lost, hard luck imo.

JustAddWater

Diceicle wrote: »

I think its a case of we play the waiting game

The waiting game sucks...

Let's play hungry hungry hippos!

Uriel.

Uriel. wrote: »

Do you expect anything more from a union?

Useless shower of gobsh1tes. Grasping at straws trying to seem somehow relevant to their dwindling me membership............

Numpties for the most part, thugs (wannabe) in suits.

baaaa

d'Oracle wrote: »

This is the dumbest idea anybody has had to date.
Like the stupidest bloody nonsense I have heard in weeks.
Except maybe OP's populist garbage response.

If people collectively don't pay their mortgages then the banks are put under.
As most of the banks are in state ownership, this means that in order to have anything like a functioning banking system (and before anybody uses the word Zombie to describe our functioning banks bear in mind that you probably have an ATM and/or credit card and you probably bought something today or yesterday from a business which banks ergo we have a functioning bank system) the government has to pay MORE money.

The government gets it money from us (the taxpayers) or from credit facilities (currently the EU/IMF) which further burdens the state, probably to an irreparable point.

Ergo when Johnny Don't et al decide to collectively fail to honour their contractual agreement it will cause further stress to themselves.

Whats more these are nurses. Now, I understand nurses plight. They work a tough, tough job. Many of them are in debt (mortgage) and go to work in increasingly poor conditions due to resource depletion in the appallingly run health services. They also quite often bear the brunt of the public dissatisfaction at the state of said health services.

The screaming irony is that if the economy is to suffer the effects of this madcap scheme, their working conditions will further deteriorate.

Thankfully I think this is just a foolish, ill-advised and irresponsible attempt to drum up support. I don't think they mean it.

Most of this is true except saying that it is foolish and dumb.
What is foolish and dumb is to keep doing the same thing when it clearly doesn't work.
There will be a new reality for us and we can shape it ourselves or let the bankers continue to shape it.

Will I Amnt

The Rook wrote: »

Fcuk me, so the union guy wants us to forget the facts That we signed an agreement with a bank that if they gave us a certain amount of money we'd pay that same amount of money back.

Where was I when they were giving out these interest free mortgages?????

COYW

baaaa wrote: »

Really?You think I'd be better off paying 300k to the bank for a gaff worth a third of that because why again?

Do you apply that logic to all purchases or just houses? The car I bought 3 years ago was worth €25,000 then but due to usage and natural depreciation it's value is a good bit less now. Should I turn to the credit union and tell them that I am not willing to pay the full amount anymore?

careca11

Jocker wrote: »

At last! The Irish people are waking up to their Governments corruption and are calling for action for people to stop paying their mortgages and in return cause the banks to crash bringing the power back to the people.

This has taken too long to happen but come on people carry this out and teach these elitist gangsters a lesson for once and for all. Claim your country back and let Mr. Kenny know he is not a leader of the Irish but a servant who better listen before the **** really hits the fan in Ireland.

The Irish have had many chances to turn this all around but have had their heads in the sand for far too long to their own detriment. .To be able to stick your head in the sand you must be on your knees. Now lets all get these currupt IMF slaves on their knees and bring the banks also to their knees. They are thrwing people out of their homes and couldn't care less about the faith of the people or their families they are evicting.

What goes around certainly comes back around but this has taken too long to come back around. Start action NOW people and claim your sovereignty back. This could be your last chance to make a stand to protect your own interests and those of your kids for the future.

thy should be talking about not paying themselves and there PS member's so much fcuking money( €21bn out of our yearly budget is simply not sustainable)
instead of this bullshyte about "not paying your mortgage"

Nody

Salmon wrote: »

While I agree that a loan taken out must be honored in full I do believe there is some merit In this suggestion. I think it might be more appropriate to promote a reduction of the payment to the banks rather than a full withholding of the mortgage! For example if all these new taxes, charges and pay reductions happen in December end up costing me an extra 400 per month I wouldn't have a problem reducing my mortgage by the same amount each month. If this was done en masse it might focus the govts minds on tackling the bankers without loading it onto already struggling householders.
Just my 2c!

Sure thing, then I hope you don't mind those of us who looked at the house market, laughed at the prices and did not take out a mortage for a overpriced shoe box pay in 400 EUR less in taxes as well to the state; fair is fair after all.

jackiebaron

Caoimhín wrote: »

Jesus wept. What bollix, people borrowed money to buy expensive houses and now want the rest of us to let them off the hook. Write off the mortgage but keep the house? Over my dead body buddy.

You seem to have no problem sacrificing your pension, your taxes or the future prospects of your children letting the banks "off the hook".

Strange how people always pay the debts of a scumbag if he wears a shirt and tie and blame the victim if he wears a t-shirt and jeans.

baaaa

COYW wrote: »

Do you apply that logic to all purchases or just houses? The car I bought 3 years ago was worth €25,000 then but due to usage and natural depreciation it's value is a good bit less now. Should I turn to the credit union and tell them that I am not willing to pay the full amount anymore?

I dunno,do you have means?Or did your lender destroy your means also like the banks have to many

Dyr

As someone who didnt buy during the boom (because I thought the prices were insane) I can say this:

I see where the union that floated this is coming from. to a degree. People who bought during the boom were by and large not feckless, the truth is that the only way to have some standard of living and security in this country is to buy your own home. Tenants have f**k all real rights and the ridiculous prices of rents during the boom made it prohibitive for a family to rent. House buyers didn't choose to take out massive mortgages they had no credible alternatives given the overheated property market.

The general consensus from the people who know best at the time (some of whom are on here now, their previous positions long forgotten, no doubt) was that the good times were going to roll forever.

jackiebaron

Caoimhín wrote: »

That is fair, reasonable and mature of you.

While I have some sympathy for those who are out of work, especially families who are struggling with large loans, it is astonishing the amount of people who want the banks/tax payers to reduce the mortgage to what the house is currently valued at. This is regardless of their ability to pay.

Why do you think it's OK for bankers to just fcuk off and walk away from their debts leaving the taxpayer to foot the bill at the behest of our "elected representatives" yet it's morally reprehensible for mortgage payers to simply say "fcuk you bank" and quit paying?

Why ? Please explain .

coffee_cake

Bambi wrote: »

Tenants have f**k all real rights

Tenants have quite a number of real rights; look at all the landlord problems with troublesome tenants on our very own accommodation forum for an example.

House buyers didn't choose to take out massive mortgages they had no credible alternatives given the overheated property market.

Of course they chose to.
People really need to step up and take some personal responsibility here.

baaaa

bluewolf wrote: »

People really need to step up and take some personal responsibility here.

They are,it's just not the type of responsibility you envisioned.

Nody

jackiebaron wrote: »

Why do you think it's OK for bankers to just fcuk off and walk away from their debts leaving the taxpayer to foot the bill at the behest of our "elected representatives" yet it's morally reprehensible for mortgage payers to simply say "fcuk you bank" and quit paying?

Why ? Please explain .

Why do you think it is ok for someone to gamble that house prices would continue going up for ever and when losing the gamble get to not only keep their house, not pay of even the current value and have all debt written off when those who decided not to gamble gets nothing?

They took a chance, they signed the paper and yes, they may have made a mistake, that does not somehow mean they should get a free house out of the deal.

jackiebaron

Uriel. wrote: »

WTF? Where does Personal responsibilty come into this? Should the state provide a free house to every citizen?

Ps contract law is neither naive or exclusively Irish

FCUK the law! If banks and the LEADER of the country can play fast and loose with the rules in order to get rich then why should anyone else honour your sacrosanct law in order to not wind up in a life of penury.

Law...my bollocks!

Frank Black

• Government introduces low tax policies that stimulate economy.
• Cheap credit floods Irish banking system leading to house price boom
• Government rakes in even more money due to stamp duty, VAT etc.
• Unions negotiate massive increases in salary for and numbers of Public Sector workers over a number of years under promise of reform (not delivered) and social stability.
• Workers in Public and Private sector take out huge mortgages to but shoddy apartments and houses in new estates in the arse end of nowhere.
• Economy collapses,– Huge gap between tax take and outgoings on Public service pay and social welfare.
• Private sector workers laid off in droves.
• Unions encourage their members who are still among the best paid public servants in the EU to stop paying the mortgages they took out.
• ??????????????????
• Profit.

coffee_cake

baaaa wrote: »

They are,it's just not the type of responsibility you envisioned.

sticking your head in the sand and refusing to pay your debts in some kind of misguided juvenile rebellion is not "responsibility"

baaaa

Nody wrote: »

Why do you think it is ok for someone to gamble that house prices would continue going up for ever and when losing the gamble get to not only keep their house, not pay of even the current value and have all debt written off when those who decided not to gamble gets nothing?

They took a chance, they signed the paper and yes, they may have made a mistake, that does not somehow mean they should get a free house out of the deal.

False argument is false.
Homeowners=gamblers?Explain please,these are usually people that work and save to pay for a roof over their families heads.Not gamblers.

jackiebaron

Nody wrote: »

Why do you think it is ok for someone to gamble that house prices would continue going up for ever and when losing the gamble get to not only keep their house, not pay of even the current value and have all debt written off when those who decided not to gamble gets nothing?

They took a chance, they signed the paper and yes, they may have made a mistake, that does not somehow mean they should get a free house out of the deal.

I'm not suggesting that they get a free house. I'm not suggesting that at all. The government and the banks are responsible for this mess yet they are not the ones who are taking any hit for it. I'd walk off the mortgage in a second and recommend anyone else to do so and let the banks piss and moan about a massive inventory of real estate that they can't shift. FCUK 'em. They gambled with mortgage backed securities and passed the debts onto the taxpayer...well the taxpayer gambled with house prices rising forever...pass the debt back to the banks.

What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. Or do you just want to find a scapegoat.

Grow a pair FFS!

um7y1h83ge06nx

If certain elements had their way in this country we'd be all living in caves and throwing sh*t at one another.

The Unions are like Fianna Fáil, they both love spouting populist bull**** in order to further their own objectives.

Threads like this is why I'll always support the centre-right, stop our country turning into anarchy.