Mayo GAA Discussion Thread

ultrapercy

Stoner wrote: »

It was a slap as far as I remember

It was a slap yes but a very very mild one, not one that wold bring you to your senses if you were crying hysterically like happens in movies. That said intent is there and red card should have stood. Referees are being undermined by this and I feel for them when all they get is abuse even from the bodies which should protect them. Keegan had his red overturned in the drawn semi last year and played poorly in the replay while the referee proceeded to give every decision to Kerry, even allowing a free to be taken via a fist at one stage. Hope history does not repeat but I'm not confident of that.

Loafing Oaf

keane2097 wrote: »

Anyone got a link to a video or gif of the Keane incident? .

Stoner

Peist2007 wrote:

If it was Diarmuid Connolly it would all be grand

If it was Aiden O'Shea it would all be grand too.:)

Let's be honest Mayo were not that concerned about losing him and the opposition are not that concerned about him.
There are about 16 mayo players you'd rather do without than Keane, Mayo are blessed with his type of player.
No point turning this into a Dubs are going mad issue just because MayoMick might like that.

It would be completely different if it was Mayos best player and we all know it deep down. Who's place would he take form the starting 15 against Donegal? Barry Moran was squeezed in to help handle Murphy, Dublin don't have a big man inside.

Anyway like this Dub said from the start I can see why he was cleared it was a very tense period of the game, he was just on, he was on the receiving end of some attention, heat of the moment slap and in my opinion there is consistency in how these situations are called and from what I can see they take everything into account. Was it an intention or a reaction ? It was a reaction imo.
If Murphy wasn't in his face grabbing at him it wouldn't have happened.
I know nothing I've said is in the rules book, it's just how I see these reviews working.
What he did was wrong, but mayo got no advantage from it, no score , nobody was hurt, no damage to the opposition he was made look like a fool he let himself down and management might question his temperament.
If he was suspended I'd understand but I see a consistency in how his case was addressed.

seligehgit

TBF that I think poster who mentioned that Dublin fans were going mad about the decision was on the wind up,tongue firmly in cheek remark.

I do feel for referees whose match decisions are been undermined by the CCC,however I can't understand how people believe it will get into the minds of the referee officiating at the appealing team's next contest.Seems like a cop out in case things don't go according to plan.Such conspiracy theory stuff is for different fora,the best team shall prevail Sunday week.

TBH I can't say that I'm not delighted that we won't have to deal with a big target man like Eoghan O Gara,he did some damage in 2013.

keane2097

Blackjack wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bl0c3rYILu8

check from 1.14 on the video.
To be fair when you see the lead up to the incident, a reduction to a Yellow is probably fair enough, although I did say as soon as I saw it at the game that he was getting a red for giving the Slap.

Yeah it was as I recalled. In rugby, the ref would look at that, tell both players to cop themselves on and play away. In soccer, Murphy would be booked and Keane banned for three matches.

That we appear to be taking our cue in writing rules from soccer rather than rugby is a really big, really obvious mistake.

Blackjack

keane2097 wrote: »

Yeah it was as I recalled. In rugby, the ref would look at that, tell both players to cop themselves on and play away. In soccer, Murphy would be booked and Keane banned for three matches.

That we appear to be taking our cue in writing rules from soccer rather than rugby is a really big, really obvious mistake.

Indeed. Unless the plan is to entirely remove physicality from the game, in which case we may as well give up now.

yop

Blackjack wrote: »

Indeed. Unless the plan is to entirely remove physicality from the game, in which case we may as well give up now.

Sometimes it feels like thats what they want to do

martyos121

yop wrote: »

Sometimes it feels like thats what they want to do

Would instantly kill the sport. Physicality is the one thing some of the less skilled teams have going for them. If you take away that, we're going to be seeing a lot of hurling scores in the championship.

A few punches does no harm to the sport.

Jippo

keane2097 wrote: »

Anyone got a link to a video or gif of the Keane incident? Was arguing that it was a non-event on Twitter and had a fair few people uncompromisingly calling it a punch. Wanted to check my recollection.

I saw your tweets. I am surprised that you held that view. I think it was a punch. Not a haymaker but a definite red for me... he punched him in the face.

Jippo

martyos121 wrote: »

Would instantly kill the sport. Physicality is the one thing some of the less skilled teams have going for them. If you take away that, we're going to be seeing a lot of hurling scores in the championship.

A few punches does no harm to the sport.

I would normally agree with you but you can definitely have physicality in sport.

Some violence is tolerated in rugby but imo Keane may have received a citing for his effort.

Regardless it was a stupid thing for him to do and why was he laughing on the way off the pitch I don't know.

happyoutscan

Jippo wrote: »

Why was he laughing on the way off the pitch I don't know.

He knew it would be rescinded? :pac:

keane2097

Jippo wrote: »

I saw your tweets. I am surprised that you held that view. I think it was a punch. Not a haymaker but a definite red for me... he punched him in the face.

Not a hope for me. As I mentioned, there was no intent or potential for damage in that little incident. If Keane deserves red, so does Murphy who if anything got away with a more forceful strike just because it was with the same hand that had a fistful of Murphy's jersey.

We're then at the point where we're forced to say that Donnacha O'Connor deserved a red card for striking, Lee Keegan deserved a red for his little leg spasm - does Hughes deserve the line for his hair ruffling??

The farther down the line you go with "zero tolerance" the more farcical your rules, and then your sport become. We see this laid out before us in soccer where rigid adherence to the rules is the only consideration for refs.

All these incidents are actually coming up because of the 'zero tolerance' idea rather than being cut out by it. Players now know that provoking the opposition to the smallest bit of reaction gets them sent off, so we have the likes of Murphy grabbing Keane and shaking him around then running to the umpire when he gets a little clip.

If the ref is empowered to call that as the pathetic little sideshow it is we can all get on with our lives, nobody will be in hospital, no late night cloak and dagger meetings of the CHC etc. We'd also have way less of this septic diving and a game we can be a bit prouder of IMO.

Stoner

100% agree.

Some sports do look at these things as a whole, like in formula one when going over the line was penalised if you gained an advantage and not if you just went over it.

Murphy played his part, nobody was hurt it stayed on the pitch and shouldn't carry over.

If they take the physicality out of the game then it's finished for me, it was the most enjoyable part of playing and one of the things I admire in players, like for example Murphy himself part of his appeal as a player is his ability to take abuse, he can give it as good as the rest of them too.

flasher0030

keane2097 wrote: »

Not a hope for me. As I mentioned, there was no intent or potential for damage in that little incident. If Keane deserves red, so does Murphy who if anything got away with a more forceful strike just because it was with the same hand that had a fistful of Murphy's jersey.

We're then at the point where we're forced to say that Donnacha O'Connor deserved a red card for striking, Lee Keegan deserved a red for his little leg spasm - does Hughes deserve the line for his hair ruffling??

The farther down the line you go with "zero tolerance" the more farcical your rules, and then your sport become. We see this laid out before us in soccer where rigid adherence to the rules is the only consideration for refs.

All these incidents are actually coming up because of the 'zero tolerance' idea rather than being cut out by it. Players now know that provoking the opposition to the smallest bit of reaction gets them sent off, so we have the likes of Murphy grabbing Keane and shaking him around then running to the umpire when he gets a little clip.

If the ref is empowered to call that as the pathetic little sideshow it is we can all get on with our lives, nobody will be in hospital, no late night cloak and dagger meetings of the CHC etc. We'd also have way less of this septic diving and a game we can be a bit prouder of IMO.

Excellent post.

As I was reading posts on the Keane issue, I had it implanted in my head that he deserved to go as he raised his hand and struck. But in reality, what has happened is that this mentality has arisen due to years of watching premiership soccer - where it doesn't matter if it's a tap or pinching someone's nose - it's a strike or deemed strike and therefore a sending off.

But that's not what GAA is about, or not what the rules were written for. The rules are obviously there to make sure there are boundaries in place. But not to make it a non-contact sport.

Wonder what the great Paidi would think, or what would the CCCCCCCCC make of this:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0h3QQIBH6Y

Loafing Oaf

flasher0030 wrote: »

But that's not what GAA is about, or not what the rules were written for. The rules are obviously there to make sure there are boundaries in place. But not to make it a non-contact sport.

Rugby seems to have got this right. Not sure if it's actually written into the rules, but they seem to have an 'if you provoke me I'm entitled to retaliate in kind' ethos that stops people getting sent off for a bit of 'argy-bargy'...

Ascii

flasher0030 wrote: »

Excellent post.


Wonder what the great Paidi would think, or what would the CCCCCCCCC make of this:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0h3QQIBH6Y

Haymaker and a half if I ever seen it

Seans_Username

It's strange how reading the last few posts I've almost completely changed my mind on the situation.

At the game I saw Keane raise his hand and slap murphy. My first thought was that it was a straight red - regardless of how hard he hit him. And as flasher said, watching too much soccer has put me in that mindset. But that kind of thinking leads to extreme gamesmanship where a few shoves will lead to someone crying for a red card. And that would absolutely destroy the game.

Odds are that Keane was going to be used at some point in the game, so I can't wait to see what sort of reception he gets if he does come on :pac: :pac:

keane2097

Just to point out that Kevin Keane is no relation :pac:

ultrapercy

Seans_Username wrote: »

It's strange how reading the last few posts I've almost completely changed my mind on the situation.

At the game I saw Keane raise his hand and slap murphy. My first thought was that it was a straight red - regardless of how hard he hit him. And as flasher said, watching too much soccer has put me in that mindset. But that kind of thinking leads to extreme gamesmanship where a few shoves will lead to someone crying for a red card. And that would absolutely destroy the game.

Odds are that Keane was going to be used at some point in the game, so I can't wait to see what sort of reception he gets if he does come on :pac: :pac:

Some of you gaa lads make me laugh. There is this superror attitude ye have towards soccer and other sports but then ye also have an inferiority complex. The Keane incident has nothing to do with soccer or a mindset it has to do with bad rules implemented badly. A strike is a strike regardless of the force, how could a rule be enforced that require an official to evaluate the force of a punch. I dare say a slap that would hurt Murphy would hospitalise me for example.Of course the onus should be on players not to react violently under any provocation and when they do the laws should punish them. This manliness thing is just meat head macho bull****. Keane act while understandable and harmless was also stupid and selfish and indisciplined he deserved the punishment he eventually didn't get. All that said I'm delighted he's available and hope he has learned to control himself better in a simular future situation.

Kalyke

keane2097 wrote: »

Just to point out that Kevin Keane is no relation :pac:

Theres 2097 of ye Keanes.....and yere all related:D:D

martyos121

keane2097 wrote: »

Just to point out that Kevin Keane is no relation :pac:

Just Roy and Robbie so? :pac:

Seans_Username

ultrapercy wrote: »

Some of you gaa lads make me laugh. There is this superror attitude ye have towards soccer and other sports but then ye also have an inferiority complex. The Keane incident has nothing to do with soccer or a mindset it has to do with bad rules implemented badly. A strike is a strike regardless of the force, how could a rule be enforced that require an official to evaluate the force of a punch. I dare say a slap that would hurt Murphy would hospitalise me for example.

Jesus. I wasn't trying to sound pretentious. And I'm by no means "a gaa lad", I spend most of my time following soccer.

The point is that physicality plays a big part in the GAA, in a different way to soccer. They're two very different games so I'm not even going to get into an argument about it.

And as for the whole "a slap that would hurt murphy would put me in hospital" thing: ridiculous. They're both inter county players in the middle of a game. He knows what he's doing - despite it being stupid and needless. Keane isn't going around looking to knock seven shades of shíte into you, so what the fúck has it got to do anything???

km79

keane2097 wrote: »

Just to point out that Kevin Keane is no relation :pac:

surprised you have not been accused of BEING Kevin Keane yet

Peist2007

I think its amusing watching posters come up with their own interpretation of the striking rule. He struck Murphy in the face. There was even a tv close up as he did it. Saying that you want incidents like this to stay in the game so as to keep the game a contact sport betrays a lack of understanding as to what "contact sport" actually means.

Peist2007

Seans_Username wrote: »

Jesus. I wasn't trying to sound pretentious. And I'm by no means "a gaa lad", I spend most of my time following soccer.

The point is that physicality plays a big part in the GAA, in a different way to soccer. They're two very different games so I'm not even going to get into an argument about it.

And as for the whole "a slap that would hurt murphy would put me in hospital" thing: ridiculous. They're both inter county players in the middle of a game. He knows what he's doing - despite it being stupid and needless. Keane isn't going around looking to knock seven shades of shíte into you, so what the fúck has it got to do anything???

Sure no need for rules at all! Let them at it!

yop

ultrapercy wrote: »

Some of you gaa lads make me laugh. There is this superror attitude ye have towards soccer and other sports but then ye also have an inferiority complex.

Your in a GAA forum as well yourself, so that means you are a "Gaa Lad" what ever that means.
So we can take it that what a man a said to me about runner "A runner is a lad who afraid to take a hit".

As someone who has taken part in a lot of sports both team and individual I certainly see no superiority or inferiority complexs going on. I'd say the one sport that might do that is rugby, but as someone who played that for year, I think that is only the minority.

MaroonAndGreen

km79 wrote:

surprised you have not been accused of BEING Kevin Keane yet

What you trying to say Kenny?

km79

MaroonAndGreen wrote: »

What you trying to say Kenny?

Ascii

For the crack let us look beyond Dublin….who would you rather face in the final. Kerry or Tyrone ?
For me its Kerry. Think there game style will suit us better...compared to the nordy "park the bus" style of football. I also feel the chances of doing back to back championship wins in this modern era in football is lesser than it was 10-20 years ago.
I think when the dubs could not back up 2013 by winning last year and them one of the most professional set-ups in my eyes then I don’t think anyone can. I also think we have a score to settle with Kerry from the semi-finals last year and IMO there is nothing to spur a team on more than revenge (Mayo v Donegal 2013 SF). Thoughts anyone ?

blinding

Ascii wrote: »

For the crack let us look beyond Dublin….who would you rather face in the final. Kerry or Tyrone ?
For me its Kerry. Think there game style will suit us better...compared to the nordy "park the bus" style of football. I also feel the chances of doing back to back championship wins in this modern era in football is lesser than it was 10-20 years ago.
I think when the dubs could not back up 2013 by winning last year and them one of the most professional set-ups in my eyes then I don’t think anyone can. I also think we have a score to settle with Kerry from the semi-finals last year and IMO there is nothing to spur a team on more than revenge (Mayo v Donegal 2013 SF). Thoughts anyone ?

Stop taking Crack !:P
Lets beat Dublin first and then if we do lets beat whoever is in the final.

Its not as if we win that many that we can be fussy about who we beat (if) in a final:P.

martyos121

Ascii wrote: »

For the crack let us look beyond Dublin….who would you rather face in the final. Kerry or Tyrone ?
For me its Kerry. Think there game style will suit us better...compared to the nordy "park the bus" style of football. I also feel the chances of doing back to back championship wins in this modern era in football is lesser than it was 10-20 years ago.
I think when the dubs could not back up 2013 by winning last year and them one of the most professional set-ups in my eyes then I don’t think anyone can. I also think we have a score to settle with Kerry from the semi-finals last year and IMO there is nothing to spur a team on more than revenge (Mayo v Donegal 2013 SF). Thoughts anyone ?

Only Kerry will do for me. Any All Ireland title is a huge one, particularly for us, but doing a job on Kerry in the final having failed to beat them in the championship since '96 IIRC, would be an incredible way to do it.

tacofries

My god, I know this isn't going to happen this year but jesus this gets you pumped. Cannot wait for it!!!!!!!!!!! Win or lose, either way there will be tears.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/player/809/338198/

seligehgit

tacofries wrote: »

My god, I know this isn't going to happen this year but jesus this gets you pumped. Cannot wait for it!!!!!!!!!!! Win or lose, either way there will be tears.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/player/809/338198/

Yes it's unlikely to happen this year,here's hoping it's tears of joy.I'll don't think I'll ever get over the sense of elation I felt coming out of Croker after the semi final in 2006.It was one we won very much against the head and the Dublin supporters were so sound out after it.

Fr Tod Umptious

seligehgit wrote: »

Yes it's unlikely to happen this year,here's hoping it's tears of joy.I'll don't think I'll ever get over the sense of elation I felt coming out of Croker after the semi final in 2006.It was one we won very much against the head and the Dublin supporters were so sound out after it.

2006 SF was the best sporting event I was ever at.

Robbie Keane's late equalizer v Germany in Japan was amazing.
Ciaran McDonald's late winner v Dublin topped it.

Stoner

Fr Tod Umptious wrote:

Robbie Keane's late equalizer v Germany in Japan was amazing. Ciaran McDonald's late winner v Dublin topped it.

It was something alright. One of those days when you are just beaten no excuses. I remember watching him in a club game that year in tng. Some player.

Jippo

Stoner wrote: »

It was something alright. One of those days when you are just beaten no excuses. I remember watching him in a club game that year in tng. Some player.

I recall the same feeling of 2013.

It is great leaving Croke Park with the knowledge that your team played its heart out, the only explanation for the loss is they came up against a better team and knowing that you attended a very, very special game.

Here's hoping for at least one classic in the last two games: if not two.

DDC1990

Jippo wrote: »

I recall the same feeling of 2013.

It is great leaving Croke Park with the knowledge that your team played its heart out, the only explanation for the loss is they came up against a better team and knowing that you attended a very, very special game.

Here's hoping for at least one classic in the last two games: if not two.

A draw and a replay down in Limerick.

km79

DDC1990 wrote: »

A draw and a replay down in Limerick.

sure why not
we are used to the venue now and the dubs aren't
was watching back highlights of the 2006 game
that is easily the most elated I've been after a game
what a day
countered with the utter utter depression of Limerick last year
that was worse than any of the finals ......

Fr Tod Umptious

DDC1990 wrote: »

A draw and a replay down in Limerick.

I congratulated the GAA on their choice of Limerick last year.

And I will congratulate them again this year when they make the obvious choice of Tullamore as a venue for a possible Mayo v Dublin replay

Padkir

tacofries wrote: »

My god, I know this isn't going to happen this year but jesus this gets you pumped. Cannot wait for it!!!!!!!!!!! Win or lose, either way there will be tears.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/player/809/338198/

Was off work today and ended up watching both this and the 2012 semi. I'm absolutely buzzing for this game!!

homewardbound11

Anyone thought about Mayo options for the 15 for 15.

Id go for
Higgens corner back .
If I were to squeeze in a second it would be McDonald .

seligehgit

Padkir wrote: »

Was off work today and ended up watching both this and the 2012 semi. I'm absolutely buzzing for this game!!

Absolutely buzzing,can't come soon enough.

Keith Higgins and Kieran McDonald are the two obvious candidates,tbh I think we'll be lucky to get one.Fierce competition!

Fr Tod Umptious

Ascii wrote: »

For the crack let us look beyond Dublin….who would you rather face in the final. Kerry or Tyrone ?
For me its Kerry. Think there game style will suit us better...compared to the nordy "park the bus" style of football. I also feel the chances of doing back to back championship wins in this modern era in football is lesser than it was 10-20 years ago.
I think when the dubs could not back up 2013 by winning last year and them one of the most professional set-ups in my eyes then I don’t think anyone can. I also think we have a score to settle with Kerry from the semi-finals last year and IMO there is nothing to spur a team on more than revenge (Mayo v Donegal 2013 SF). Thoughts anyone ?

Kerry definitely

As you say it's a game style that would suit us better, no frustrating 15 men behind the 21 year line.

And for the following other reasons in no particular order.

Since we last beat them they have beaten us in 3 finals, 2 semi finals and 1 quarter final.

We would be stopping a 2 in a row

And in winning it we would have beaten Donegal, Dublin and Kerry, which is about as tough a road as you can get, and throw in Galway away along with it.

That's getting way ahead of ourselves but sure what else are these days between games for, after Sunday we can concentrate on the Dublin game in earnest.

Fr Tod Umptious

seligehgit wrote: »

Absolutely buzzing,can't come soon enough.

Keith Higgins and Kieran McDonald are the two obvious candidates,tbh I think we'll be lucky to get one.Fierce competition!

Higgins definitely

Not sure about MCDonald, that forward 6 is fairly congested with all Ireland winners.

homewardbound11

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Higgins definitely

Not sure about MCDonald, that forward 6 is fairly congested with all Ireland winners.

Gone through it and Higgins would have it and possibly moving Thomas oshea to fit him in .
Thought this would be a doddle but the forwards are not at easy as you'd think . Trying to fit in 8 or 9 into 6 is proving difficult .

Peist2007

The lack of All Irelands will hurt Mayo lads' chances on that team. I love Higgins, a Mayo great but he'll be up against lads like Tom McCarthy etc who have All Irelands coming out their ears.

Considering who the Judges are, i expect All Ireland medals to play a big part in selection.

corny

keane2097 wrote: »

Not a hope for me. As I mentioned, there was no intent or potential for damage in that little incident. If Keane deserves red, so does Murphy who if anything got away with a more forceful strike just because it was with the same hand that had a fistful of Murphy's jersey.

We're then at the point where we're forced to say that Donnacha O'Connor deserved a red card for striking, Lee Keegan deserved a red for his little leg spasm - does Hughes deserve the line for his hair ruffling??

The farther down the line you go with "zero tolerance" the more farcical your rules, and then your sport become. We see this laid out before us in soccer where rigid adherence to the rules is the only consideration for refs.

All these incidents are actually coming up because of the 'zero tolerance' idea rather than being cut out by it. Players now know that provoking the opposition to the smallest bit of reaction gets them sent off, so we have the likes of Murphy grabbing Keane and shaking him around then running to the umpire when he gets a little clip.

If the ref is empowered to call that as the pathetic little sideshow it is we can all get on with our lives, nobody will be in hospital, no late night cloak and dagger meetings of the CHC etc. We'd also have way less of this septic diving and a game we can be a bit prouder of IMO.

Just reading that. Brilliant post.

Kalyke

Here we go......
http://hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=242910

Audioslaven

Kalyke wrote: »

Here we go......
http://hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=242910

I have never seen him talk as much about this side of the game that he can't touch and the opposition(O'Shea) as he always sprouts the line "we look at ourselves, improve on our performance etc.". I think he knows he is going to get a game and he is feeling the heat. He is looking to make an edge for themselves. This shows weakness imo

Fr Tod Umptious

Audioslaven wrote: »

I have never seen him talk as much about this side of the game that he can't touch and the opposition(O'Shea) as he always sprouts the line "we look at ourselves, improve on our performance etc.". I think he knows he is going to get a game and he is feeling the heat. He is looking to make an edge for themselves. This shows weakness imo

Gavin could be feeling the heat alright.

He has had to spend the year giving the " we look at ourselves, improve our performance etc" line because of who they have played.
He knows its BS but at the same time he cannot come out and say "we learned nothing from Longford because they were worse than useless"

But now he has a game on his hands, a game that Dublin ate automatic favourites for, and a championship that they have been favourites for since August 31st 2014.

He is under a lot of pressure to get it right after last year and he is trying hard to deflect the attention from him and his team.