leaving cert medicine

Tomas18

Hi all,
Firstly I would like to stress I am not interested in medicine for the money, I genuinely find it a good profession full of different areas to explore and to make an impact on peoples lives.
Ok so basically I would really love to do medicine in university. I'm going into 5th year and I plan to do English,Irish,Maths,Biology,History,French, LCVP and chemistry(outside of school due to lack of numbers to form a class) All higher level. Would you consider these to be good subjects? I was thinking of swapping history for geography but unsure because of its low A grade rate (I enjoy bot subjects equally) My problem is that I am worried that I would not get good enough marks in my Leaving cert:( teachers say I am a top student (maybe i am) but i find it hard to get motivated for study [hardly any done for the JC but got a good result: 2A's ; 6Bs 3C's. However I still worry that I wouldn't get good enough marks, I know there is still ages before the LC but still I would appreciate tips. Also to make total marks for medicine ie. the Hpat would you suggest that i do it in 5th year and then again in 6th year if it wasn't decent enough (ps. any tips on how to do good on these tests because i always pick the wrong answer even though it seems wright)
Thanks for reading I really appreciate this!

CokeyBear

I would definitely recommend Geography instead of History. Although the figures say different, I find Geography a much easier course than History and found it much easier to score in. I could be wrong and generalizing here, but the reason I found the difference in the amount of A's awarded is that a lot of "idiots" and people who do no work pick Geography because they're told it's an easy subject, while History is known for being a harder subject and as such only attracts people who feel they will do well, generally "smarter" students with a good work ethic.

If you're willing to do the work and you're "smart", I'd say choose Geography over History and don't ever take the mentality that Geography is easy, otherwise you'll halfass you're way through and scrape a low B when you could potentially get an A.

jumpguy

If you like history more than geography, do history, and vice versa.

Out of curiosity, how are you planning on doing chemistry outside school? Just a word of warning, doing chemistry yourself without any sort of tutor/grinds whatsoever would be very difficult. Chemistry's a great subject, but it really requires a lot of understanding of various concepts, rather than learning a load of stuff off. Hence it really requires a teacher to explain these things, nevermind the practicals and stuff (you don't need to write-up the practicals and all like for JC Science, but there's a section in the exam where they're examined).

I wouldn't really worry about the HPAT until 6th year tbh. In 5th year, just focus on keeping on top of your subjects. Don't stress about anything, just do your homework every night, study for any tests, and listen in your classes, and believe me, that'll be enough!

Opinion is divided on HPAT preparation courses, but once again, I wouldn't be worrying about the HPAT until 6th year.

I got 2 As, 6Bs, a C and a D in the JC. In the summer before 5th year, I felt I could do much better than that and decided I wanted to study medicine. In 5th year I studied hard for my Christmas tests and I did quite well in them, and then I knew I could do it with hard work. In the summer tests of 5th year and Christmas tests of 6th year, and again in the mocks of 6th year, I got 540, which was very annoying. :P But I didn't worry about it much, everything came together for the LC (of which results I'm waiting for in August...).

One of my As in JC was Science, which then became 3 subjects in LC (physics, chemistry and biology) so that was very handy. Play to your strenghts and do subjects you like as much as you can! Biology and chemistry would probably be recommended for medicine, but you can get in with either biology or chemistry (but you'll have to do the 6 year course).

Anyway, this has turned into a bit of an essay. Try to get some work experience in a hospital shadowing doctors if you can, always a good idea to see what medicine is like! Don't let the idea scare you. :P It'd also be handy if you want to apply to the UK for medicine (personal statement for UCAS).

Try to do as well as possible in the LC. Don't fall for the trap of aiming for 550 (like I did), 550 should be regarded as the minimum standard needed to get into medicine.

Best of luck, enjoy your summer!

fleeflyfloflum

Hey there!

I'm just going into 6th year, and am interested in doing medicine too and I do all of the subjects you mention, except LCVP, so I felt I could be of some help. I would advise you to do History if you have a real interest in it, otherwise, it can be pure torture. I know that for me I could never do Geography because I always despised it at J.C. level, even if it was supposed to be easy. Now, most of the people who do Geog. at my school (and there are a lot - it is v. popular!) say it isn't really all that easy after all.

In order to do well at History you need to be able to retain large amounts of informaiton (which you also need for geography and many other subjects!), have a good grasp of english (it is all about essay writing - you write 3 essays in the exam worth 20% of the overall mark each, plus 20% from your Research topic, the bulk of which is an essay) and be pretty fast at writing. It really is an exam where you are against the clock and I find the biggest challenge to be getting everything you know down in a structured, comprehensive way within the time limits.

You said you like both of them equally, so you probably won't go wrong no matter which one you choose at the end of the day. If they are on at the same time in school you could probably swap over without too much hassle in the first 3 weeks anyway.

Good luck!

angela1711

Chemistry outside a school may be too hard unless you have a teacher.
LCVP is great for points as it is easy subject to get the points in it but u can get max 70 points for it. Without a study you had excellent results in JC ! But for medicine you have to motivate yourself ! LC is not JC and is much harder you will find it that the JC was baby-easy 1st day of your 5th year ;P I will advise you to start work in 5th year but don't overload yourself. Now English, Irish and Maths all HL might be a hard trio to cope with. Are you good at Maths ? HL maths is very hard even for people who are maths geniuses :P I'm not doing biology but i heard it is easy enough. For history you have to be good with writing essays etc and HL english may be a help here. I think geography is way easier to get marks than history unless you like a lot of reading, facts, dates, writing etc. Franch... I'm doing German myself but to get an A1 in any language is hard. If you have the ability to learn languages and u like french than you may aiming for an A

Bbbbolger

As far as I know you're not allowed sit the HPAT in 5th year. Has to be 6th year so forget about it until a few months beforehand. Theres a lot to be said for prep courses but I didn't take one and I got a good result. It's all up to personal preference. If you always pick the wrong answer you need to keep doing the practice papers. If you correct it and realise you got something wrong read over it and focus on trying to understand why the correct answer is correct. Once yo start doing that you will begin thinking more along the lines required of you.

Also I dont think you should worry about subjects "being good for Medicine." Just make sure you satisfy the entrance requirements for Medicine and you'll be fine. Forget about A rates. If you genuinely enjoy a subject you'll do better in it, regardless of whether there is a high percentage of A's or not.

Tomas18

WOW thanks for all the replies guys! They are all really helpful. Thanks so much.
Anyone doing medicine have any advice for me and was maybe in a similar situation?

IrishKnight

Just a side point, be sure you have a look at graduate entry into med as well. Think of it as a back door into med in the event you don't get the points from the LC...

Also it is important to say again, subjects that are good for med many not be good for gaining points! Despite how much I hate it, the LC is all about the points more or less.

Tomas18

yeah that's a good point! but the thing I'm afraid of is the price :O and in this day and age education should be key and not an emphasis on money! would you consider doing any degree or a science degree like human health an disease in TCD. the science degree would seem obvious but the dean of medicine in UCD said the best scoring students had a law background

IrishKnight

Well with graduate entry, you can have any degree. Now the reason why law students are "best scoring" is perhaps they tend to get higher points than others or perhaps they are in the right mind set. Regardless the most important thing is that you pick something you like and not something you think there is a job at the end. If you don't have an interest in law, why is the point in doing it?

I think science would would be a good idea, but being a scientist I might be bias :P I would recommend you pick omnibus science rather than a specific science. The reasoning being that with omnibus you can sample a few things, see what you like. Might turn out you don't like what they teach in Human Health and perhaps prefer say genetics or pharm.

Tomas18

I think science would would be a good idea, but being a scientist I might be bias :P I would recommend you pick omnibus science rather than a specific science. The reasoning being that with omnibus you can sample a few things, see what you like. Might turn out you don't like what they teach in Human Health and perhaps prefer say genetics or pharm.[/QUOTE]

wow thanks for the advice! But there is something worrying me as people say omnibus science is bad because it is so basic? have you any insight on this

IrishKnight

Tomas18 wrote: »

wow thanks for the advice! But there is something worrying me as people say omnibus science is bad because it is so basic? have you any insight on this

Well I do have some insight, seeing as I just finished omnibus science in UCD. I can't see how people think it is "so basic." I would ask said people to show me how they know that! While one might think it is "basic" because you are not studying it from the outset or whatever. This is a somewhat blinkered view as no matter what science course you do, wither omnibus or denominated, you have to start with the basics. Now UCD have changed their system so no matter what science course you want to do, you have to do it via omnibus.

To me, one of the advantages of omnibus, aside from see what you like, is it allows you to do say chemistry and physics, if you so wish, for a year. For example, when I started I knew I wanted to do genetics, but in first year I studies chemistry and physics, dropping physics for second year and chemistry for third year. This allowed me to gain a basic understanding of both physics and chemistry. At times this allowed me a somewhat better grasp of certain aspects of biochemistry compared to my peers as I already had an understand of the basics behind certain topics...

Tomas18

kul thanks for that!

Tomas18

Hi there I really appreciate you reply. I hope you do great in your LC but i'm sure you will from your mock results! just out of curiosity are you applying to medicine and if so what order of preference in universities

P_mcgrath

Tomas18 wrote: »

Hi all,
Firstly I would like to stress I am not interested in medicine for the money, I genuinely find it a good profession full of different areas to explore and to make an impact on peoples lives.
Ok so basically I would really love to do medicine in university. I'm going into 5th year and I plan to do English,Irish,Maths,Biology,History,French, LCVP and chemistry(outside of school due to lack of numbers to form a class) All higher level. Would you consider these to be good subjects? I was thinking of swapping history for geography but unsure because of its low A grade rate (I enjoy bot subjects equally) My problem is that I am worried that I would not get good enough marks in my Leaving cert:( teachers say I am a top student (maybe i am) but i find it hard to get motivated for study [hardly any done for the JC but got a good result: 2A's ; 6Bs 3C's. However I still worry that I wouldn't get good enough marks, I know there is still ages before the LC but still I would appreciate tips. Also to make total marks for medicine ie. the Hpat would you suggest that i do it in 5th year and then again in 6th year if it wasn't decent enough (ps. any tips on how to do good on these tests because i always pick the wrong answer even though it seems wright)
Thanks for reading I really appreciate this!

Hi here, when picking subjects, firstly analyse your strengths. What were your a subjects on junior cert (strengths) and your c subjects?

QueenOfLeon

IrishKnight wrote: »

Just a side point, be sure you have a look at graduate entry into med as well. Think of it as a back door into med in the event you don't get the points from the LC...

I wouldn't consider graduate entry med an easy back door into medicine. You need a 2.1 in the degree you do, and then sit the GAMSAT exam which people take months to study for. Its not an aptitude test, its an exam that tests various areas, not just science. The LC/HPAT route is a much easier, cheaper and less time consuming way to get in.

Tomas18, I did the same subjects that you are considering doing, except for History and LCVP. Do you need to do LCVP? I had to put up a fight not to do it, but I felt that 70 points were no good to me (no offence to anyone who did it, its very useful to replace an ordinary level subject, but when you need to aim for As/Bs in honours its not much good).

Besides that, you need to go for something that you could potentially get an A in. You haven't mentioned how you feel about your other subjects. Will you be doing honours in them all, including maths and irish? You need to be honest with yourself from the outset as to whether or not you're capable of them. If not, by all means drop down to pass and use honours history (etc) to replace it. If you intend on keeping them both at honours, are you stretching yourself too thin with 9 subjects?

As for study motivation, a lot of people (especially boys, it has been said?) don't seem as motivated in school until they get older. You'll know when you get into 5th year and the start of LC if you're capable of sitting down and studying consistently. You'll need to be able to for medicine.

P_mcgrath

QueenOfLeon wrote: »

IrishKnight wrote: »

Just a side point, be sure you have a look at graduate entry into med as well. Think of it as a back door into med in the event you don't get the points from the LC...

I wouldn't consider graduate entry med an easy back door into medicine. You need a 2.1 in the degree you do, and then sit the GAMSAT exam which people take months to study for. Its not an aptitude test, its an exam that tests various areas, not just science. The LC/HPAT route is a much easier, cheaper and less time consuming way to get in.

Tomas18, I did the same subjects that you are considering doing, except for History and LCVP. Do you need to do LCVP? I had to put up a fight not to do it, but I felt that 70 points were no good to me (no offence to anyone who did it, its very useful to replace an ordinary level subject, but when you need to aim for As/Bs in honours its not much good).

Besides that, you need to go for something that you could potentially get an A in. You haven't mentioned how you feel about your other subjects. Will you be doing honours in them all, including maths and irish? You need to be honest with yourself from the outset as to whether or not you're capable of them. If not, by all means drop down to pass and use honours history (etc) to replace it. If you intend on keeping them both at honours, are you stretching yourself too thin with 9 subjects?

As for study motivation, a lot of people (especially boys, it has been said?) don't seem as motivated in school until they get older. You'll know when you get into 5th year and the start of LC if you're capable of sitting down and studying consistently. You'll need to be able to for medicine.

There is so much sense in everything here, please read it all and take it in.

Firstly, graduate med is not as simple as it sounds. Having already completed a degree, it will be tough to go back to scratch again, especially when at this time, your friends may well be earning money and having fun. Also, the gamsat is a really tough exam, as unlike the hpat, there is a lot of study to be done and your degree may or may not be a good base. Plus, a very important consideration is that if you pursue your degree, and don't get a 2.1 or get the gamsat, that is what you have and must work with. I try to advise students considering the graduate entry route to choose a plan b that they would be happy to continue with, should graduate med not be a runner.

Also re lcvp, for the purpose of entry to med, it isn't worth your while as most students don't get 70 points anyway, more like 50. This is great for those students who have two or more pass subjects, but not for 500 points or over.

Med is tough and the leaving cert system is only the start of it. My advice is to try and really think about whether it is for you or not. I know many many students who are now qualified and working as doctors, some are happy, some are not, but all are working just as hard, if not harder than when I taught them in 6th year. Make sure it is for you!

Good luck!

Tomas18

Well for junior cert it was A's:Science and CSPE B's:woodwork, art, geography,religion,history, C's: English Irish and Maths:L (did NOTHING for English so paper2 was crap and media studies poop sort of expected a c, was capable of at least a B, TYsummer I got ) maths isn't my favorite but was surprised with my result and Irish well I just go by:L
AH thanks for that 'QueenOfLeon',I was always considering undergraduate anyway but just in-case i didn't get iti was looking at postgraduate entry. Btw i would be doing 8 subjects not 9:L

just a quick question how does everybody feel about 'mind maps' any personal experiences? I used them for English poetry and seemed to be ok.

yournerd

Is there any other course except medecine that you can do to become a doctor?

QueenOfLeon

yournerd wrote: »

Is there any other course except medecine that you can do to become a doctor?

No.

partyatmygaff

yournerd wrote: »

Is there any other course except medecine that you can do to become a doctor?

No.

It's in the name... "Doctor of Medicine".

Tomas18

so does anybody either in medicine or hoping to go into it or even know somebody who is in medicine, how is it and how did you prepare for the leaving cert. Any tips? study techniques for LC or even in University and also in your opinion should people consider going abroad to study undergraduate medicine? or generally what is a good medicine course in Ireland:D

randylonghorn

You'll find lots and lots of information and discussion in this thread.