Property Market in Waterford

jayboi

Spot the difference!

http://www.daft.ie/searchrental.daft?id=1146944

http://www.daft.ie/searchrental.daft?id=1146934

both uploaded on the same day

Dan133269

Haha that is ridiculous jayboi. I wonder if the owners were responsible for that or if the letting agents were doing their own thing.

Hang on, it must be the new trend. Different numbers but the photos are the same. This time it's the same letting agent.
http://www.daft.ie/searchrental.daft?id=1146932
http://www.daft.ie/searchrental.daft?id=1146920

beazee

http://www.adverts.ie/property-for-rent/wellington-court-wellington-square-barker-street-waterford-city/1115297

Some laugh: €2,730 rent

Professey Chin

beazee wrote: »

http://www.adverts.ie/property-for-rent/wellington-court-wellington-square-barker-street-waterford-city/1115297

Some laugh: €2,730 rent

Christ. Someone call them and offer a dropkick

Dan133269

beazee wrote: »

http://www.adverts.ie/property-for-rent/wellington-court-wellington-square-barker-street-waterford-city/1115297

Some laugh: €2,730 rent

That must be mistake I'd say. Either that or the renter is literally insane.

what recession?

Dan133269 wrote: »

That must be mistake I'd say. Either that or the renter is literally insane.

Either that or it's €2,730 a year! haha

reni10

Another nearly 8% has come off property prices nationally in the last 3 months of 2011 according to daft.ie:
http://www.daft.ie/report/?utm_source=daft.ie&utm_medium=strap_line&utm_campaign=strap_13_daft_house_price_report_q4_2011

The average Waterford City 3 bed price is now €121,000 which is pretty much in line with what I was predicating a number of months ago.

Some vendors in Waterford still in dreamland though with their stupid asking prices; about another 10%-15% to come off prices by next June I will state again!

Dan133269

Wait a minute Reni, I thought you said house prices were going to increase?

There seems to be some value coming into the market. These houses for example:

http://www.daft.ie/searchsale.daft?id=624447

http://www.daft.ie/searchsale.daft?id=622658

Take 10% off the asking price by next year, and another 10% as a possible final selling price and I would consider those houses good value. And I'm not selling any of them in case anyone asks.

There appears to be a lot of houses for sale in Grantstown Park, anyone know why this is? They all seem to be around the same asking price more or less.

wellboytoo

I am sure you will state it again, and again and again and again, salt into wounds spring to mind, leave it alone man, people are in enough doodoo without you grinding their noses into it!

reni10

wellboytoo wrote: »

I am sure you will state it again, and again and again and again, salt into wounds spring to mind, leave it alone man, people are in enough doodoo without you grinding their noses into it!

I am not trying to rub anyone's noses into anything!

I am stating my opinion and posting the facts to back it up in a thread about the property market in Waterford.

My hope is that my comments will actually help people not hinder them!

Siamsa Sessions

What's the best way to compare renting and buying?

It seems kinda mismatched given the following two cases, involving very similar houses which are less than 50 yards apart in the same cul-de-sac:

Rent for €675/month - http://www.daft.ie/searchrental.daft?id=1134239

Buy for €85,000 - http://www.daft.ie/searchsale.daft?id=619492

They're not identical houses, but they're comparable. If the houses here are this cheap, why is the rent relatively high?

beazee

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

They're not identical houses, but they're comparable.

How?

€675 Monthly - House to let - 4 Bedrooms - 2 Bathrooms - equipped
€85,000 - Terraced House - 2 Bedrooms - 1 Bathroom - unfurnished

Siamsa Sessions

beazee wrote: »

How?

€675 Monthly - House to let - 4 Bedrooms - 2 Bathrooms - equipped
€85,000 - Terraced House - 2 Bedrooms - 1 Bathroom - unfurnished

Identical location: they're part of the same block of terraced houses whose front doors are less than 50 yards apart. (You can look out the front door of one into the front room of the other)

They have the same exterior finish and very similar back gardens.

The 3+1 bedroom place is not twice the size of the 2 bedroom one. The 2nd bathroom in the one for rent is unlikely to be anything other than a downstairs toilet.

Granted one is furnished and I realise it's not comparing like with exact like, but given the above similarities it looks like a big difference between renting and buying.

beazee

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

it looks like a big difference between renting and buying.

Can't see it.

4 bed house is €675 of letting agency. Bet in time the landlord will go as low as €550 to have tenancy guaranteed. And if forced would probably sell for €160K on the market. 290 months rent to buy the house

2 bed house is listed at €85K (might look into buying at such price if fully furnished). Personally I would not rent it for more than €300 a month given location. And this leaves you with a result of 283 months rent (short of 24yrs) to buy the house.

Where's the big difference you talking?

EDIT:
4 bed seems to be 3 bed - landlord advert
Similar 3 bed let by an agent for €625. Still some room for negotiations left.

Siamsa Sessions

beazee wrote: »

Can't see it.

4 bed house is €675 of letting agency. Bet in time the landlord will go as low as €550 to have tenancy guaranteed. And if forced would probably sell for €160K on the market. 290 months rent to buy the house

2 bed house is listed at €85K (might look into buying at such price if fully furnished). Personally I would not rent it for more than €300 a month given location. And this leaves you with a result of 283 months rent (short of 24yrs) to buy the house.

Where's the big difference you talking?

Difference in bold above.

There's a few assumptions in the above prognosis as well, such as not including interest repayments for borrowing €85k and paying back over 283 months.

But look, thanks for the reply. I'm starting to see what you mean. Cheers.

beazee

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

There's a few assumptions in the above prognosis as well, such as not including interest repayments

I don't care about interest repayments - I'm a tenant.
Don't care about insurance, leaking roof, toilet cistern not in order, grass mowing, chimney sweep, property tax or drafty windows...

I am obliged to cover rent+bills and consult any internal/external changes with landlord; keeping property up to a standard is on landlord's side.

After 24 yrs and €85K put into landlords pocket I am left with nothing...
while you are with 24 yrs old building needing constant care and attention. And probably still owing to the bank if kept repayments at the same level with my rent.

And I am not sure in 24 years time your house sale price be higher than it is now. But certainly I'll be a higher earner than I am. And at some stage I'll have the house I built myself, an air tight passive house.

But back to the tenant situation:
Say my family grows bigger - I am moving into a bigger house.
Say I got a job 200 km away - I move there.
What you going to do with your 2 bed? Sale? Rent?

This is how I see this. For next few years.
Cheers.

EDIT:
Forgot to add https://www.householdcharge.ie/
"The Household Charge is an annual charge introduced by the Local Government (Household Charge) Act 2011 which is payable by owners of residential property"

Dan133269

A man after your own heart Reni.

http://cormaclucey.blogspot.com/2012/01/prospects-for-irish-residential.html

I'm not an economist by any means, but what he says seems plausible.
I wouldn't bet on 80-90% property price falls from the peak, but it wouldn't surprise me if the market still had 20% left to fall.

beazee

Thanks for the link.
"Price / Rent Multiple at avg level of 305 in 2011" only confirms my assumptions of 290 month rents to buy the property.
Working this back: €550 rent * 305 = €168K expected sale price on 3bed house.

Dan133269

Waterford house prices are now the most affordable in Ireland. That is to say, the price of houses relative to income.
http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/house-prices-now-at-affordable-level-for-average-earners-2997199.html

mrgardener

Dan133269 wrote: »

Waterford house prices are now the most affordable in Ireland. That is to say, the price of houses relative to income.
http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/house-prices-now-at-affordable-level-for-average-earners-2997199.html

Its just a pity that no-one can get a mortgage to buy them.

Dan133269

mrgardener wrote: »

Its just a pity that no-one can get a mortgage to buy them.

Yes, that is a big factor. Did you try yourself?

dark_shadow

Dan133269 wrote: »

Yes, that is a big factor. Did you try yourself?

I'm hoping to try again at the end of march sometime. Was in before Christmas and although I have a nice bit of savings I wasn't saving regularly eg weekly. So was told to save about €200 a week and go back in than at the end of march and hopefully I'll be able to get a mortgage then. So fingers crossed:)

dayshah

dark_shadow wrote: »

Dan133269 wrote: »

Yes, that is a big factor. Did you try yourself?

I'm hoping to try again at the end of march sometime. Was in before Christmas and although I have a nice bit of savings I wasn't saving regularly eg weekly. So was told to save about €200 a week and go back in than at the end of march and hopefully I'll be able to get a mortgage then. So fingers crossed:)

Which bank?

dark_shadow

dayshah wrote: »

Which bank?

Bank of Ireland. I tried a few others but either their rates where to high or they weren't lending. So BOI seems the best.

Dan133269

dark_shadow wrote: »

Bank of Ireland. I tried a few others but either their rates where to high or they weren't lending. So BOI seems the best.

Which banks told you they weren't lending?

reni10

I know this is for Waterford County but I wonder will these houses in Cappoquin sell today at Auction:

http://www.sherryfitz.ie/resi/buy/3-bed-Terraced-House-Auction-Cappoquin-2-Port-Na-HAbhann-Cappoquin-Co.Waterford-devpropdetail.aspx?id=311215&ST=6&pc=1

Reserve price is €50k and once it goes over that they will be sold, 11 up for grabs I believe....

beazee

reni10 wrote: »

Reserve price is €50k

They were only €365K in 2007:

Yet, just yards from the septic tank and its outflow pipe, eleven new houses have just been completed and - if you fancy a view of your own sewage flowing into the River Blackwater - are available to buy from EUR 365,000.

http://www.rte.ie/radio1/investigate/1137861.html

Nothing has changed since except for the sewer collection system.

Collection system complete since 31/1/2011. WWTP to be completed by mid 2014

http://www.epa.ie/licences/lic_eDMS/090151b2803eb81d.pdf

reni10

Looks like they all sold for between €64k to €82k.

Still people with money out there then!

Brianne

Isn't there some issue with them that being so near the river they could flood?

Finnbar01

reni10 wrote: »

Looks like they all sold for between €64k to €82k.

Still people with money out there then!

I've heard that during the height of the bubble those houses were marketed for €300,000.