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Wiring up an immersion switch

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    #32
    seosamh
    Registered Users Posts: 183 ✭✭seosamh


    I don't have my camera at the moment but I did see the sticker on the side of the timer which indicated:
    1 Live out
    2 Live in
    3 Neutal
    E Earth

    I connected it as above but did not connect the earth to the box as they were twisted together (from each wire)
    The light of the timer box still lit up even though it was in the off position.
    I noted that the wheel of the ESB meter was spinning faster which suggested the immersion was on. Also with a phase tester confirmed that current was getting to the 'Sink' terminal of the immersion switch.
    Then I switched from Sink to Bath and that's when the burning smell happened. The timer started emitting smoke so I immediately turned it off at the fuebox.
    The timer now is not responsive and I think will need replacing.
    I wonder did I get something wrong in wiring the immersion box. The cylinder flex at the cylinder clearly showed the brown wire attached to a big N terminal and the ohm readings confirmed this as neutral.
    Not sure where I have gone wrong, was the timer knackered anyway since it was showing on and was on despite being in the off position.
    I will try get the camera in action.
    Thanks.


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    #33
    seosamh
    Registered Users Posts: 183 ✭✭seosamh


    After the smoking incident I went and bought a new timer and I haven't looked back.And it has 15 minute interval pins which is an improvement.
    Just wondering though, if there is a stat on my cyinder, where would that be. Can I use this to regulate the temp of the water as I am concerned not to supply too hot water to the pump (for sending water to the attic bathroom)s which only likes water not exceeding 60 degrees.


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    #34
    .G.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,415 ✭✭✭.G.


    seosamh wrote: »
    After the smoking incident I went and bought a new timer and I haven't looked back.And it has 15 minute interval pins which is an improvement.
    Just wondering though, if there is a stat on my cyinder, where would that be. Can I use this to regulate the temp of the water as I am concerned not to supply too hot water to the pump (for sending water to the attic bathroom)s which only likes water not exceeding 60 degrees.

    The stat is in the immersion group on your cylinder.If the brown wire coming from your immersion switch is neutral in your setup then that wire would be going into the stat in your immersion group.there will be a small dial on it for setting the temp.They are typically set to 60c already


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    #35
    seosamh
    Registered Users Posts: 183 ✭✭seosamh


    Thanks superg, very helpful
    Can I bother you to ask a question about the neon indicator light as has been discussed above. I purchased a light with switch combination (rated 20amp) but also a fused neon light with no switch(rated 13 amp)
    Since the switch is not needed I would prefer to use the 'light only' one but do I need to be concerned about its lower amp rating. Is it a rule of thumb that all immersion/central heating switches should be 20amp ir is that not relevant here in operating the light?
    Also the use of the term 'spur' - does that refer to connecting the light wire Brown to Lout and Blue to Nout of the immersion switch?
    Thanks


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    #36
    .G.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,415 ✭✭✭.G.


    You still need the immersion switch in order to pick which element you want to come on when the timer powers it up.If you get rid of the the selector switch you would have to wire both the sink and the bath elements to come on together.This would typically mean a load of 5kw's which is way above what a 13 amp switch can handle.I would advise you to leave the immersion switch in situ,indeed its probably against the wiring regs not to have one.

    Re reading above regarding your earth connection.A good connection on earth is every bit as essential as it is on Live and Neutral so even if they are twisted together you should terminate the pair in the earth connection provided on the switch


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    #37
    seosamh
    Registered Users Posts: 183 ✭✭seosamh


    sorry, I think I may have caused some confusion with my last post.

    The set-up I was trying to describe involved:

    the analog timer box,
    the conventional sink/bath, ON/OFF box
    and the neon light box

    The neon light box came in two varieties: one with a simple light and the other with a light and a switch. I bought both.
    Since I only need the light to indicate what is going on at the sink/bath box I don't need a controlling switch on the neon light box. What use could it possibly have?
    The question then is over the amp rating of these boxes. is the Light only box sufficient at 13 amp or is the Light&switch box at 20 amps necessary.
    Would 2.5 wire be sufficient, 3 core?
    Thanks.


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    #38
    .G.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,415 ✭✭✭.G.


    seosamh wrote: »
    sorry, I think I may have caused some confusion with my last post.

    The set-up I was trying to describe involved:

    the analog timer box,
    the conventional sink/bath, ON/OFF box
    and the neon light box

    The neon light box came in two varieties: one with a simple light and the other with a light and a switch. I bought both.
    Since I only need the light to indicate what is going on at the sink/bath box I don't need a controlling switch on the neon light box. What use could it possibly have?
    The question then is over the amp rating of these boxes. is the Light only box sufficient at 13 amp or is the Light&switch box at 20 amps necessary.
    Would 2.5 wire be sufficient, 3 core?
    Thanks.


    You dont need the second switch or light at all,dont know why you have it.The Immersion switch should have a light on it as will the timer

    the setup should be as follows.

    Fuseboard feeds Timer,Timer feeds Immersion switch,Immersion switch feeds Immersion group

    is your timer being fed from an existing circuit,eg sockets,and is this why you bought a spur?

    It should have its own dedicated circuit


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    #39
    seosamh
    Registered Users Posts: 183 ✭✭seosamh


    The reason for this arrangement is because the immersion, timer, etc. are under the stairs and the idea of the light outside was to indicate whether the immersion is on or not without having to open the door and see. This could prevent leaving the immersion on inadvertently.
    The immersion has its own line back to the fuse board.


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    #40
    .G.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,415 ✭✭✭.G.


    I see.

    If you wired it in the same size cable as the rest of the circuit then there shouldnt be a problem as long as its wired correctly.

    I would wire the indicating neon in 2.5 sq cable direct from the output of the timer,ie L out and N out. When the timer switches on it will power the immersion switch and also the neon indicator


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    #41
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    From the L out N out of the immersion on/off switch would be better, then the neon will only light when either element is actually on, i.e. when both timer and immersion switch are on.


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    #42
    .G.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,415 ✭✭✭.G.


    robbie7730 wrote: »
    From the L out N out of the immersion on/off switch would be better, then the neon will only light when either element is actually on, i.e. when both timer and immersion switch are on.

    Indeed it would but since he almost had a fire earlier I reckoned it would be easier to steer clear and go out the timer:D


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    #43
    seosamh
    Registered Users Posts: 183 ✭✭seosamh


    Thanks guys, I think I will go with safety first and wire it from the timer. I'll let you know how I get on.


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    #44
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    Well it will be an indicator to show the timer is on. If thats what you want, then well and good. But if simply connecting it to the timer instead of the switch, which would show the actual immersion is on is being avoided because the timer is deemed easier to connect to, then someone should be got in to do it.

    How connecting it to the timer rather than the switch would be safer i am not sure. It seems only the safer option for a diy person, but in reality it is no safer that i can see anyway.


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    #45
    .G.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,415 ✭✭✭.G.


    Not suggesting its a safer setup really.

    I suggested the timer as easier cos there are less connection points on it so less places for him to wrongly put the cables into.On the immersion switch there are a lot more places he might end up putting the cables which may just confuse things hence why I suggested the timer.

    For me and you there's no issue wring it from the switch,for the lad asking,there may or may not be,especially since the configuration of each switch can differ.

    Seosamh,it is just as easy to do as Robbie suggest as long as you put the cable's in the terminals that he suggested and nowhere else


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