Online sellers:AIB to do away with Laser Cards, replace them with Visa Debit Cards...

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan

AIB merchant services is a completely separate company to AIB bank and have nothing to do with bailout money as far as I know.

Also it's not a price issue with the credit card companies. Visa and mastercard don't set the rates, the Merchant banks do. UK retailers are being charged 12p per Visa Debit transaction. Elavon want €7.75 (based on a €500 transaction at 1.55%). How are Irish businesses supposed to compete in export when the deck is stacked against us?

I'm making progress though. The Indepentent, RTE business and Newstalk picked up the story from my blog and we were on TV3 News tonight highlighting it.

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/surviving-the-recession/customers-to-suffer-as-shops-pass-on-hike-in-card-fees-2846487.html

Also the Senad are having a discussion about it with a view to tighter regulations of the whole Merchant sector.

10000maniacs

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan wrote: »

AIB merchant services is a completely separate company to AIB bank and have nothing to do with bailout money as far as I know.

Also it's not a price issue with the credit card companies. Visa and mastercard don't set the rates, the Merchant banks do. UK retailers are being charged 12p per Visa Debit transaction. Elavon want €7.75 (based on a €500 transaction at 1.55%). How are Irish businesses supposed to compete in export when the deck is stacked against us?

I'm making progress though. The Indepentent, RTE business and Newstalk picked up the story from my blog and we were on TV3 News tonight highlighting it.

http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/surviving-the-recession/customers-to-suffer-as-shops-pass-on-hike-in-card-fees-2846487.html

Also the Senad are having a discussion about it with a view to tighter regulations of the whole Merchant sector.

AIB and AIB Merchant Services are two sides of the same coin. AIB Merchant Services are a joint venture betwen AIB (we the taxpayer) and First Data.
Also it is not the merchant banks who set the policies on cards, ie Laser vs Visa Debit. Laser cards are classed as debit cards while Visa Debits are classed as credit cards.

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan

10000maniacs wrote: »

Also it is not the merchant banks who set the policies on cards, ie Laser vs Visa Debit. Laser cards are classed as debit cards while Visa Debits are classed as credit cards.

What do you mean by "policies" exactly? And why are Uk retailers being charged 12p a transaction for Visa Debit Cards and the Irish being charged 55c or 1.55%+ ?

Also Visa did make a statement that it's up to the merchants to set the rates not them.

10000maniacs

I sincerely hope for your sake you got your facts right when you talked to the Indo.:)
Packages are agreed on an individual basis between the retailer and the acquirer. I'm sure Elavon will not have been happy at being singled out there today.

Biffo The Bare

10000maniacs wrote: »

I sincerely hope for your sake you got your facts right when you talked to the Indo.:)
Packages are agreed on an individual basis between the retailer and the acquirer. I'm sure Elavon will not have been happy at being singled out there today.

Yup.:D
I actually find it disgusting that AIB are still allowed to agressively compete like that against honest independent companies like Elavon by using taxpayers bailout money as a lever.

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan

Biffo The Bare wrote: »

Yup.:D
I actually find it disgusting that AIB are still allowed to agressively compete like that against honest independent companies like Elavon by using taxpayers bailout money as a lever.

:rolleyes: Definate "Compete" (and "honest" for that matter ). One of the posters on my article said that she gets a fixed rate with AIB for Visa Debits of 30c (Not Bad compared to Elavons 55c), however they charge 2.68% for the Credit Cards - 1.13% higher than I pay. I get that some businesses might have to pay more but this much of their pre-vat income is a huge amount.

This then gets passed on to customers, who complain that Irish retailers rip them off and lets face it the public can't handle any more price increases.

Basically I feel they need to either explain why it costs such a multiple to be Irish, drop their prices or regulators need to step in. We're talking 24Million euro extra in fee's which as far as anyones been able to explain to me is pure bankers profit.

10000maniacs

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan wrote: »

:rolleyes: Definate "Compete" (and "honest" for that matter ).

Like when they say their balance sheet is sound, and its not actually €15 Billion in the red.:D
Those small "keeping it real" kinds of scenarios make all the difference. as a consumer.:D

CCTV_Ireland

I have been running around like a headless chicken trying to find a cheaper alternative to my 8 month old AIB/Realex combination. My average online transaction is circa €500 and not that many transactions PM really, but some months my fees are around €400. My main bank is UB, but I tried for months, and many phone calls, to get UB merchant services to ring me in connection with setting up a Merchant ID, but despite many promises, they never did. Eventually Realex, (very nice and efficient people), suggested AIB, and, hey presto, a week later I was taking online and over-the-phone transactions. But it has proved expensive and I have been trying to find a cheaper provider. I contacted UB again and was very surprised when they got back to me this morning. However, I do consider 2.5% on credit cards too steep, but they state 30 cents on all debit card transactions besides Laser, (25 cents), which seems reasonable enough. I also think the €250 "setup" fee is ridiculous. Either they want my business or they don't. Why do they deliberately make it so difficult for small businesses?

I fully support a concerted pressure group to help lower costs for small businesses.

Update: I meant to say: it's currently taking AIB five to six days to put the transactions into my account, it started off being 3-4 days. Does anybody have any idea why it should take soooooo long?

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan

CCTV_Ireland wrote: »

Update: I meant to say: it's currently taking AIB five to six days to put the transactions into my account, it started off being 3-4 days. Does anybody have any idea why it should take soooooo long?

Sounds like your on delayed funding and they just notched it up a bit. Every extra day they have your money means big interest for them as if the do it to enough merchants it is a substantial profit. I'd talk to your rep about that.

maxer68

First Rule for late July & August. DO NOT BELIEVE WHAT IS IN NEWSPAPERS! - Its silly season. They want headlines and they will work the story to make the headline.

1. Elavon may have a percentage charge - if they do. Change to aib or streamline (ulster bank) Elavon will soon change.

2. Not everyone is charged 2% or 30c or whatever. It all open to negotiation. I'm charged 1.25% on all CREDIT cards, (offline & online) 15c on Laser and 21c on Visa Debit cards. - I'm in the €1m+ bracket for online sales and similar offline, so I have a bit more clout than a smaller operator.

3. Laser is not gong away due to any other reason except that its technology is obsolete and the cost of upgrading is huge and as its the banks themselevs that own laser, they simply don't have the funds to upgrade when there's a perfectly workable solution already in the market.

So instead of complaining, switch merchant providers and negotiate.

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan

maxer68 wrote: »

So instead of complaining, switch merchant providers and negotiate.

Well actually I'm doing a lot more than complaining, we're pushing for change in legislation and creating a buying group which can use their combined power to negotiate with banks.

It's interesting that your rate is 1.25%, that's seriously better than my organisation which has a higher through put. You must be an experienced negotiator. Which merchant bank are you with?

Saying that I'm hearing a lot of retailers who are on 2.5 - 2.68% and they just didn't know there was any better on the market. The point is really to high light the issue for all businesses to know that they need to negotiate and shop around, after all the biggest merchants in the business were effectively screwing their customers.

10000maniacs

maxer68 wrote: »

First Rule for late July & August. DO NOT BELIEVE WHAT IS IN NEWSPAPERS! - Its silly season. They want headlines and they will work the story to make the headline.

1. Elavon may have a percentage charge - if they do. Change to aib or streamline (ulster bank) Elavon will soon change.
.

Yes they do, but thats because the banks in conjunction with the credit card companies charge a % fee for Visa Debit cards( As opposed to laser cards). So unless AIB Merchant Services and Ulster Bank Merchant Services take the % hit themselves for a Visa Debit transaction, they pass it on to the retailer. I don't think that AIB Merchant Services are waiving the % fee for Visa Debit transactions to the retailers, but if they are, its a cost that is being subsidised by taxpayers bailout money. i.e using bailout money to eliminate the competition.

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan

10000maniacs wrote: »

Yes they do, but thats because the banks in conjunction with the credit card companies charge a % fee for Visa Debit cards( As opposed to laser cards). So unless AIB Merchant Services and Ulster Bank Merchant Services take the % hit themselves for a Visa Debit transaction, they pass it on to the retailer. I don't think that AIB Merchant Services are waiving the % fee for Visa Debit transactions to the retailers, but if they are, its a cost that is being subsidised by taxpayers bailout money. i.e using bailout money to eliminate the competition.

Where are you getting your information from? Seems unlikely UK merchant banks are taking any hit at the 12p transaction charge they have for Visa Debits.

maxer68

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan wrote: »

It's interesting that your rate is 1.25%, that's seriously better than my organisation which has a higher through put. You must be an experienced negotiator. Which merchant bank are you with?

.

I with Ulster Bank - but I used to be involved with a company that had serius turnover €10m+ and managed to carry the rate over:D. AIB will offer 1.4% quite easily to most reasonably sized retailers.

Anything over 1.6% is too much considering how automated everything si these days.

Bandara

just had a meeting with UB Streamline :

Visa Debit cards (the Laser replacement) the rate I am getting is 12c per trans
Visa Credit cards .69%

Mastercard Credit Cards .93%
Mastercard Debit 11c per trans

Commerical Cards all 1.48% (which is actually very competitive, even better than the blended rate used to be)

cfeeneyinterior

Hammertime wrote: »

just had a meeting with UB Streamline :

Visa Debit cards (the Laser replacement) the rate I am getting is 12c per trans
Visa Credit cards .69%

Mastercard Credit Cards .93%
Mastercard Debit 11c per trans

Commerical Cards all 1.48% (which is actually very competitive, even better than the blended rate used to be)

Had a call with them too. Id say our companys turnover is alot less than you guys. they would do Visa debit 21c, 1.6% others. Laser 16c.
Elavon came down a little to 1.5%, 17 c Laser and Visa Debit now 25c instead of 1.5% (a good saving there for us).

I'd like to get involved in the buying group?

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan

Hammertime wrote: »

just had a meeting with UB Streamline :

Visa Debit cards (the Laser replacement) the rate I am getting is 12c per trans
Visa Credit cards .69%

Mastercard Credit Cards .93%
Mastercard Debit 11c per trans

Commerical Cards all 1.48% (which is actually very competitive, even better than the blended rate used to be)

That is awesome!

cfeeneyinterior

Hammertime wrote: »

just had a meeting with UB Streamline :

Visa Debit cards (the Laser replacement) the rate I am getting is 12c per trans
Visa Credit cards .69%

Mastercard Credit Cards .93%
Mastercard Debit 11c per trans

Commerical Cards all 1.48% (which is actually very competitive, even better than the blended rate used to be)

Savage rates Hamertime. I realise that must be for a large turnover, but it just shows how they screw smaller retailers. Everyone should pull out their end of month statements and post up their rates here so we can all see where we all stand and who is offering the best rates.

I meant to say I mentioned the rates of a "friend " to STreamline and she wasn't interested in coming down at all on the rates they gave me. Take it or leave it kinda thing. Those rates are for a group she said. So I suppose as you were saying Ronan, setting up a group is the way tgo go.

TheCostumeShop.ie: Ronan

cfeeneyinterior wrote: »

I'd like to get involved in the buying group?

Just comment here to get in the buying group.

cfeeneyinterior

Also,
These are bricks and mortar rates we are quoting right? Or are these online sellers?

cfeeneyinterior

They just mentioned it on Matt Cooper TodayFM. "Retailers are slowly waking up to the new charges......" . Looks like there is a few of us here.

HellFireClub

OP here, I'm glad to see this topic is still being discussed, seems like the reality of the situation is only dawning on a lot of retailers now.

johnmck

A friend told me AIB are also charging him €40 per month merchant account fees on top of their % , plus the realex fee - is this right?

zagro

johnmck wrote: »

A friend told me AIB are also charging him €40 per month merchant account fees on top of their % , plus the realex fee - is this right?

It may be a truth. There is also set up fee of more than 100e.

MOH

Probably. There's been additional PCI related fees creeping in since early this year.

cfeeneyinterior

An old thread but I remembered it when I saw this article. http://m.rte.ie/news/business/2014/1218/667715-credit-card-fee/

Hope it cones in soon!

jimmii

cfeeneyinterior wrote: »

An old thread but I remembered it when I saw this article. http://m.rte.ie/news/business/2014/1218/667715-credit-card-fee/

Hope it cones in soon!

That last paragraph is quite surprising! Surely Britain couldn't have 70% of Europe's credit cards? I doubt consumers will get passes on the savings when this happens I guess less places will charge a card fee but not like many retailers do that right now.

cfeeneyinterior

More interested though in reduced charges for retailers..http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/eu-plans-to-cap-credit-card-charges-264249.html. .