Price of Hay

theaceofspies

Hi folks,
Just wondering what is the going rate for well saved hay (round bales)?

barryoc1

20-25 in my area. Limerick. Thats off the field.

reilig

Today's journal said €18 to €25 off the field depending on quality.

Bought 65 bales of last year's silage last night for €10 per bale. Will cut each one to check for quality before drawing them and then rewrap them when I get them home. Should be fine stuff for feeding to dry cows. It was baled dry and chopped.

maidhc

reilig wrote: »

Bought 65 bales of last year's silage last night for €10 per bale. Will cut each one to check for quality before drawing them and then rewrap them when I get them home. Should be fine stuff for feeding to dry cows. It was baled dry and chopped.

Sounds OTT? Re-wrapping last years bales is going to end in tears I suspect. No way would our wrapper manage anything other than a good round fresh bale, a saggy one will just get stuck.

vanderbadger

reilig wrote: »

Today's journal said €18 to €25 off the field depending on quality.

Bought 65 bales of last year's silage last night for €10 per bale. Will cut each one to check for quality before drawing them and then rewrap them when I get them home. Should be fine stuff for feeding to dry cows. It was baled dry and chopped.

that was for nothing wasnt it, chap selling must have a good bit of stuff again this year? I have about 100 bales left over and I expect them to still be in good shape this winter

bogman_bass

reilig wrote: »

Today's journal said €18 to €25 off the field depending on quality.

Bought 65 bales of last year's silage last night for €10 per bale. Will cut each one to check for quality before drawing them and then rewrap them when I get them home. Should be fine stuff for feeding to dry cows. It was baled dry and chopped.

when you are getting them that cheap is it not a bit coastly to re-wrap them? would you not be better off cutting 10 at random to check quality? if the samples are ok then even if there is one or 2 rotten ones it would be cheaper to lose them then to wrap the lot would it not?

reilig

maidhc wrote: »

Sounds OTT? Re-wrapping last years bales is going to end in tears I suspect. No way would our wrapper manage anything other than a good round fresh bale, a saggy one will just get stuck.

Why? The bales are stacked on their ends. They are in perfect shape. The wrapper will have no problem with them. It has belts anyway so it has no problem handling out of shape bales. Wrapping them with an extra 2 layers will seal up any damage caused from handling and ensure that they remain good quality - they will be used first anyway.

reilig

Yea, they are quite cheap. They guy that has them wasn't able to sell them last year and he is afraid that he will be left with them now. He has 100 bales from this year in the yard now too.

Indeed, when I can get them for €10 and have my own wrapper, it is cheap to rewrap them as it will ensure that none of them rot - I'll be moving them about 6 miles in the next week or 2, back to my own yard as they owner wants them cleared for more bales.

2 layers of wrap on each bale will only cost €1 per bale.

I'm not expecting really high quality - just something to keep the dry cows going.

just do it

reilig wrote: »

Yea, they are quite cheap. They guy that has them wasn't able to sell them last year and he is afraid that he will be left with them now. He has 100 bales from this year in the yard now too.

Indeed, when I can get them for €10 and have my own wrapper, it is cheap to rewrap them as it will ensure that none of them rot - I'll be moving them about 6 miles in the next week or 2, back to my own yard as they owner wants them cleared for more bales.

2 layers of wrap on each bale will only cost €1 per bale.

I'm not expecting really high quality - just something to keep the dry cows going.

Can you leave then there till you need them? Save on rewrap and damaging then in the first place

leg wax

the price of hay a very good question ,the value of the hay as feed is only worth ?. as far as i am concerned is only worth 12-13 euros a round bale,so why are farmers paying so much for it,the horse man is not a big customer as he was,all horses dumped and killed, the old bale of hay is like the property in this country it has to fall in price to its real value,i know that everything that goes into makeing hay from fert to the baler has gone thru the roof but the bale is still only doing the same job as it did years ago it wont make the farmer any more money.

pakalasa

What do you reckon with baled silage this year. Is the country going to be full of it again this winter. It seems to be that way.
It's nearly as cheap to buy it in, than make your own.

pakalasa

leg wax wrote: »

the price of hay a very good question ,the value of the hay as feed is only worth ?. as far as i am concerned is only worth 12-13 euros a round bale,so why are farmers paying so much for it,the horse man is not a big customer as he was,all horses dumped and killed, the old bale of hay is like the property in this country it has to fall in price to its real value,i know that everything that goes into makeing hay from fert to the baler has gone thru the roof but the bale is still only doing the same job as it did years ago it wont make the farmer any more money.

It's a lot easier sell hay. You can load, unload it without any hassle. A lot of suckler farmers buying it too, to feed pre-calving.
You're right about the feed value, it's a long way back from silage. I'd rather feed restricted silage than hay.

reilig

just do it wrote: »

Can you leave then there till you need them? Save on rewrap and damaging then in the first place

I can't. Its part of the deal that I have them gone out of his yard in the next week so that he can stack this year's bales in there.

irishh_bob

pakalasa wrote: »

What do you reckon with baled silage this year. Is the country going to be full of it again this winter. It seems to be that way.
It's nearly as cheap to buy it in, than make your own.

i dont see silage being expensive next winter , thier is plenty of it and was plenty left over this spring

sh1tstirrer

Hard to imagine how hay could be put in round bales this year as we got no real weather to get hay fit for round baling.

futurefarmer

We got six great Hay days that only broke last friday in West Clare, lots of Hay made €20 off the field no shortage

babybrian

sh1tstirrer wrote: »

Hard to imagine how hay could be put in round bales this year as we got no real weather to get hay fit for round baling.

Plenty of great hay got in the midlands in two different dry spells in July, we got a few acres of great stuff, stacked in the shed the day of baling and not one of them heating or sweating....I suppose you can get lucky in this country of ours, and as my dad always say's 'it wont save standing'

sh1tstirrer

babybrian wrote: »

Plenty of great hay got in the midlands in two different dry spells in July, we got a few acres of great stuff, stacked in the shed the day of baling and not one of them heating or sweating....I suppose you can get lucky in this country of ours, and as my dad always say's 'it wont save standing'

It won't save lying down in cloudy weather either. Round bales stacked in the shed on the day they were baled without heating or maybe you are talking about square bales.

red bull

the country 3 will be full of hay for sale if the weather stays good for the next few days Never saw so much meadows cut for hay, serious lack of livestock all over the country no wonder cattle prices are crazy lots of farmers looking for cattle just to qualify for S F P

barryoc1

leg wax wrote: »

the price of hay a very good question ,the value of the hay as feed is only worth ?. as far as i am concerned is only worth 12-13 euros a round bale,so why are farmers paying so much for it,the horse man is not a big customer as he was,all horses dumped and killed, the old bale of hay is like the property in this country it has to fall in price to its real value,i know that everything that goes into makeing hay from fert to the baler has gone thru the roof but the bale is still only doing the same job as it did years ago it wont make the farmer any more money.

I agree with you Leg Wax. But i wanted the hay for young calves for next Spring so wanted good stuff and wanted it in from the weather as soon as possible. Prefer to put it in on the slats for a month than see it going brown/black out in the field. So i didnt mind paying 25 a bale for it. I know i probably could have sat it out and waited for the price to drop, but there aint too many farmers near me willing to draw in the hay if they intend selling it. Instead they tend to leave it out and hold tough on the price.

Pharaoh1

A neighbour has bought 90 silage bales off me - I sold them off the field and they were surplus on the grazing paddocks
He paid the contractor for the cutting/baling wrapping (10.50 per bale I think)
We didn't really agree a price but he's the sort of guy who just asks me to name my price.
The grass was all top quality all reseeded in the last 4-5 years no weeds not too stemmy.
Last year we agreed 7.50 per bale and I was thinking of the same this year.

That would leave them at 18 euro each to him.
Is this a fair price for a neighbour or should I ask for less or more? He collected them so I had no work with them at all.

reilig

Pharaoh1 wrote: »

A neighbour has bought 90 silage bales off me - I sold them off the field and they were surplus on the grazing paddocks
He paid the contractor for the cutting/baling wrapping (10.50 per bale I think)
We didn't really agree a price but he's the sort of guy who just asks me to name my price.
The grass was all top quality all reseeded in the last 4-5 years no weeds not too stemmy.
Last year we agreed 7.50 per bale and I was thinking of the same this year.

That would leave them at 18 euro each to him.
Is this a fair price for a neighbour or should I ask for less or more? He collected them so I had no work with them at all.

We bought round bale silage from a neighbour a few weeks back. He cut and baled it. We drew it and wrapped it. Paid him €8.50 per bale - good solid welger chopped bales!!

JohnBoy

Do the maths.

how many bales to the acre?

rental value of the land?

cost of fert and spreading.

(round figures from thin air)


Rental value 150/ac lets say 25% of that 37.50

2 bags of cut sward + spreading €55/ac


so costs of 92.5/ac

just some paddocks closed off with 2 bags so lets say 9 bales an acre

92.5/9= 10.30/bale

add on some factoring of reseeding and lime costs assuming you're doing every X years and dare I say a little margin and you've potentially sold yourself short, depending on how those numbers match up to your reality.


That said if you've no use for the grass then it has to go somewhere, but I did the maths in the spring and I cant see how anyone can make money selling silage bales.


Seems to be more possible to make money selling pit silage off the ground, but even at that if fully/properly costed I'd say I'm still losing money, just not as much as on bales.

sh1tstirrer

JohnBoy wrote: »

Do the maths.

how many bales to the acre?

rental value of the land?

cost of fert and spreading.

(round figures from thin air)


Rental value 150/ac lets say 25% of that 37.50

2 bags of cut sward + spreading €55/ac


so costs of 92.5/ac

just some paddocks closed off with 2 bags so lets say 9 bales an acre

92.5/9= 10.30/bale

add on some factoring of reseeding and lime costs assuming you're doing every X years and dare I say a little margin and you've potentially sold yourself short, depending on how those numbers match up to your reality.


That said if you've no use for the grass then it has to go somewhere, but I did the maths in the spring and I cant see how anyone can make money selling silage bales.


Seems to be more possible to make money selling pit silage off the ground, but even at that if fully/properly costed I'd say I'm still losing money, just not as much as on bales.

Why are you putting a rental cost?

leg wax

you have to get something for the use of the ground.

JohnBoy

because the ground is tied up for a period of time growing the grass. silage doesn't materialise out of thin air.


Take it out of the equation for a second so.

costs are fertiliser only. so 55 an acre.

now lets say we get 4 crops of bales in the year and sell them all.

55*4 crops = €220 in costs.

9 bales x 4 crops = 36 bales @7.50 = 270

subtract the costs and that leaves a margin of €50 per acre. (but still ignores the cost of reseeding and lime which should be spread over the number of years it's repeated)

as the rental value of that land is €150 we've just lost €100 per acre.


Like I say, these are round numbers which may or may not apply, and I know it's not 100% as simple as I'm making out, but it's a good starting point.

but in costing the sale of any crop, if you ignore the potential rental value of the land you're selling yourself short.

JohnBoy

Just to say I'm not a farmer, still working on that, but in my day job in IT everything I price starts with the costs and works up from there, too many farmers start from the selling price, and often never even work the whole way back


And for reference our own silage growing enterprise is showing a loss of €4 per acre so far this year for two cuts ignoring the costs of reseeding and lime.

Pharaoh1

I tend to agree with johnboy and as someone running a small business (farming part-time) i'm not inclined to either work for nothing or sell stuff at a loss.
If I get 7.50 x 90 bales it is 675 euro.
I paid a contractor 420 to spread 1500 gals/acre of pig slurry on the cut paddocks - probably enough to replace the p and k given that they were light cuts. The paddocks were not heavily fertilised in the spring and to include this would probably be a form of double counting.
I still think 7.50 is hardly enough to cover land charge and all the other costs such as weed control, ph maintenance, eventual reseeding etc.. and really all these should be counted.

20silkcut

Have 13 acres of silage for sale which should be ready to cut in the middle of August. Was thinking of hiring a contractor and baling it and wrapping it and storing it in the yard. It's already cost me 550 euro on fertiliser. Would I be better off selling it as a standing crop? Would you get a hundred an acre for that ?
A neighbour was saying I could get 35 euro a bale next spring but Reading the above posts that seems like fantasy stuff.

JohnBoy

complete fantasy, unless we have a really long hard winter and lads are stuck for fodder, then it might happen.

but if you can find a buyer right now then go for it.

a tenner today is worth more than twenty that you might get next spring.

5live

red bull wrote: »

the country 3 will be full of hay for sale if the weather stays good for the next few days Never saw so much meadows cut for hay, serious lack of livestock all over the country no wonder cattle prices are crazy lots of farmers looking for cattle just to qualify for S F P

You dont need cattle to qualify for SFP, just keep the land in good condition. You do need animals for the DAS however

JohnBoy

I think he's referring to the notion that some lads are buying up cattle on the basis that we're in a reference year for a new single farm payment scheme.

sh1tstirrer

leg wax wrote: »

you have to get something for the use of the ground.

Wouldn't agree with you there unless you were renting the land in the first place. If you had a calf to beef enterprise would you put in a rental cost for owned land? Same applies to dairy farming. Putting in a cost for rental of owned land is like using a rental cost of your owned car and adding it to the cost of running your car.

maidhc

sh1tstirrer wrote: »

Wouldn't agree with you there unless you were renting the land in the first place. If you had a calf to beef enterprise would you put in a rental cost for owned land? Same applies to dairy farming. Putting in a cost for rental of owned land is like using a rental cost of your owned car and adding it to the cost of running your car.

Well if your farming enterprise is generating less per acre than its rental value you would need to seriously question what you are doing. If your income from the farm is less than what you could earn in an off farm job + land rental, then you also need to consider your options.

You can't compare land to cars, but you should always take depreciation into account when calculating the running cost of a car. If it looses 4k per annum, then that car has cost you 4k per annum before you start with diesel/tax/insc.

Muckit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHpVYKmGhbA&feature=related

interesting machine :rolleyes:

bogman_bass

Anybody else stack small bales in the same way as the video. We used to always use that method (although with anouther couple of layers) I've never seen anybody else do it that way

sh1tstirrer

maidhc wrote: »

Well if your farming enterprise is generating less per acre than its rental value you would need to seriously question what you are doing. If your income from the farm is less than what you could earn in an off farm job + land rental, then you also need to consider your options.

You can't compare land to cars, but you should always take depreciation into account when calculating the running cost of a car. If it looses 4k per annum, then that car has cost you 4k per annum before you start with diesel/tax/insc.

Ok forget about the car. You still wouldn't put in a rental charge for owned land no matter what enterprise you have

Did I see your name on some US farm machinery website? It was a comment written in 2004 about changing from 540 speed PTO to 1000 speed PTO on a 7610? Oh wait here it is http://www.todaystractors.com/ttforum/messages/9987.html

red bull

5live wrote: »

You dont need cattle to qualify for SFP, just keep the land in good condition. You do need animals for the DAS however

Ok, still a lot of farmers out there with no stock paying crazy prices for cattle at the moment to qualify. hay freely available €18 this weekend

JohnBoy

sh1tstirrer wrote: »

Ok forget about the car. You still wouldn't put in a rental charge for owned land no matter what enterprise you have

The point is that when trying to value your product you should factor in the rental value of the land.

It's called an oppurtunity cost in accounting terms I think.

yesman2000

Accountants don't include opportunity costs, but rather economists. Remember accountants do your accounts and budgets, therefore it's not good practice to include opportunity costs.

JohnBoy

not in your accounts no.

but in valuing something produced off owned land then yes it should be included.

5live

bogman_bass wrote: »

Anybody else stack small bales in the same way as the video. We used to always use that method (although with anouther couple of layers) I've never seen anybody else do it that way

We wouldnt have much left to bring in if we stooked that way:eek:. They dont get much rain there before bringing it in.

Bales standing, knots down and out;) as the father used always tell us when stooking when we were little. Every bale 'knots down and out, knots down and out'. I found myself saying it last year to myself when i was helping a neighbour stook a small bit of hay

Username John

5live wrote: »

We wouldnt have much left to bring in if we stooked that way:eek:. They dont get much rain there before bringing it in.

Bales standing, knots down and out;) as the father used always tell us when stooking when we were little. Every bale 'knots down and out, knots down and out'. I found myself saying it last year to myself when i was helping a neighbour stook a small bit of hay

Yep - we were always "down and out" as well

Does it make that much difference, whether the knots are down and out or not?
I always though that if the bales got rain, they were kinda fecked anyways, regardless of how they were stooked?

bogman_bass

the "ramp method" as I call it is actually better if there is rain coming if you add another 2 layers on the right hand side as it is in the video so its 5 bales high. much less surface area exposed to the rain so you end up with more dry hay

red bull

what price are square bales of hay making now, my neighbour has 1000 of them looking for€3, good hay but what you think

sh1tstirrer

red bull wrote: »

what price are square bales of hay making now, my neighbour has 1000 of them looking for€3, good hay but what you think

I know of a fella that sells bale silage every year, this year he decided to make round bales of hay instead. It all heated in the field and has gone mouldy :eek: Now he's got a brainwave, he is going to wrap the bales and try to pass it off as haylage :rolleyes:

To be honest there is a lot of hay in this category down south anyway. The only advantage is that it will take a lot of bad feeding out of the system and make room for better quality wrapped stuff. I would imagine that a lot of farmers with excess feeding this year decided to try hay instead so they could save on costly wrap.

leg wax

red bull wrote: »

what price are square bales of hay making now, my neighbour has 1000 of them looking for€3, good hay but what you think

way over priced a world of hay and fodder down our way, round bales at 12- 15 euros off the field and not selling,and its good hay, not ex ,but good.

jay gatsby

leg wax wrote: »

way over priced a world of hay and fodder down our way, round bales at 12- 15 euros off the field and not selling,and its good hay, not ex ,but good.

I wouldn't say it was overpriced - I hope not anyway we have a few ourselves - We have been selling them in small numbers for €4 per bale for the past 3 years.

Of course getting rid of them all in one go you wouldn't get that but I wouldn't be letting them go much less than €3. There is always a market for small squares if you can store them in my opinion.

Box09

That doesn't seem over priced. There is a good market for small bales and i sell all mine for 4 euro out of the shed.