Track style/Alleycat races in Waterford

JasonG

Hello,
Is their anybody interested in the likes of late night bike races around waterford city? I know a few places with smooth tarmac in a 750m loop and then of course you have the new stretch of road from Superquin leading out to Tramore, which would be perfect for 1k sprints.

I'm asking this due to the lack of a velodrome in Waterford. Would there be much point in lobbying for one or is the interest just not there?
Jason.

Beasty

Would these be UCI sanctioned races?

Seriously though, you must have insurance cover before arranging any such races, which means you would probably need a local club to run them. In the absence of any official sanctioning, you can't "promote" any open-type racing (on open roads) here

JasonG

All I meant was for a few people join in a car park and have some unoffical fun, no paperwork at all.
I was just asking out of curiosity and I don't mind if it never happens.
Thanks for your reply,
Jason.

Beasty

Understood, but it would essentially be illegal, which is why we cannot allow you to "promote" anything like that here

On the velodrome point, unfortunately there are only 2 currently in Ireland - Sundrive and Kanturk, with another in Belfast

There are plans for an indoor one in Dublin, and an outdoor one in Dundalk. I've not heard of any plans for Waterford.

It may be worth contacting the local clubs to check what they may be able to offer you and your friends. There may already be racing locally that you could get involved in (or they may be prepared to put something on if there's sufficient interest), and doing it via a club keeps it relatively safe as well as legal

bikelover

theres a crit on every thursday night run by rolf of the carrick tri club - on closed road; each lap being 800m

Beasty

bikelover wrote: »

theres a crit on every thursday night run by rolf of the carrick tri club - on closed road; each lap being 800m

@JasonG
That sounds about perfect for you;)

Lumen

Beasty wrote: »

Understood, but it would essentially be illegal

Which law makes racing bicycles on the public road illegal?

Beasty

Lumen wrote: »

Which law makes racing bicycles on the public road illegal?

Good question!

I tried to caveat it a little by using the word "essentially". I was thinking along the lines that non-organised and uninsured racing would almost certainly fall foul of any dangerous cycling rules, unless you actually stopped racing every time you came to a junction, and stopped anyone riding more than 3 abreast when overtaking (and 2 abreast at other times)!

I guess the question is if you went to the Guards and asked them if you could put on such a race (without any official club/Cycling Ireland backing and insurance that covers racing), would they permit it. I've never tried but I'm guessing they would say no

I would contrast it with the Boards TTs we have had, which we have always said constitutes a group of individuals riding at their own risk, observing the traffic laws and rules of the road, against the clock rather than in a mass start. Again though I think there would be a question of insurance cover (although many of us could argue it is training in the context of our CI or IVCA cover)

Chips Lovell

Lumen wrote: »

Which law makes racing bicycles on the public road illegal?

Any mass start race would be probably be illegal if it were to be a proper race. You don't stop at lights, stop signs or yield signs in a race. Certainly the cops have appeared to show an interest in stopping such races in Dublin.

Lumen

Beasty wrote: »

I was thinking along the lines that non-organised and uninsured racing would almost certainly fall foul of any dangerous cycling rules, unless you actually stopped racing every time you came to a junction, and stopped anyone riding more than 3 abreast when overtaking (and 2 abreast at other times)!

I guess the question is if you went to the Guards and asked them if you could put on such a race (without any official club/Cycling Ireland backing and insurance that covers racing), would they permit it. I've never tried but I'm guessing they would say no

I would contrast it with the Boards TTs we have had, which we have always said constitutes a group of individuals riding at their own risk, observing the traffic laws and rules of the road, against the clock rather than in a mass start. Again though I think there would be a question of insurance cover (although many of us could argue it is training in the context of our CI or IVCA cover)

el tonto wrote: »

Any mass start race would be probably be illegal if it were to be a proper race. You don't stop at lights, stop signs or yield signs in a race. Certainly the cops have appeared to show an interest in stopping such races in Dublin.

Right, but I can see no reason why an uninsured race unaffiliated with CI run to the same standards as any club league or open race would be more illegal than those.

The OP suggested 1K sprints on an open section road with no junctions. Doesn't sound any more dangerous than a boards TT to me.

CramCycle

Treasure hunt anyone?

kumate_champ07

if you build it they will come

Chips Lovell

Lumen wrote: »

Right, but I can see no reason why an uninsured race unaffiliated with CI run to the same standards as any club league or open race would be more illegal than those.

The OP suggested 1K sprints on an open section road with no junctions. Doesn't sound any more dangerous than a boards TT to me.

I still reckon the Guards would object to it being some sort of organised event held without permission.

Lumen

el tonto wrote: »

I still reckon the Guards would object to it being some sort of organised event held without permission.

That's why every race should include at least one Guard.

Vizzy

[QUOTE=Beasty;73506629On the velodrome point, unfortunately there are only 2 currently in Ireland - Sundrive and Kanturk, with another in Belfast[/QUOTE]

So thats 3 then !

JasonG

bikelover wrote: »

theres a crit on every thursday night run by rolf of the carrick tri club - on closed road; each lap being 800m

Could you please give me his number as that sounds great. Thanks for telling me.

Thanks for all the help, I don't want to do anything illegal but I can't see what would be wrong (and i'm not trying to be difficult) with a few people messing around on bicycles in an empty closed car park.

And what is a 'crit'? I have never head this term before.

Thanks once again,
Jason.

blorg

Crit = Criterium. It is a type of circuit race. Note you would want to have a fair bit of group riding experience before taking part (and you couldn't do it on a fixed gear.)

dayshah

JasonG wrote: »

I'm asking this due to the lack of a velodrome in Waterford. Would there be much point in lobbying for one or is the interest just not there?
Jason.

There is the Gough cycle track in the People's Park, which the council made a complete feck of. You could lobby to have it returned to its original use.

JasonG

blorg wrote: »

Crit = Criterium. It is a type of circuit race. Note you would want to have a fair bit of group riding experience before taking part (and you couldn't do it on a fixed gear.)

I have a road bike also but I don't have the group experience at all, I always spin on my own. But the feel for group riding can only come with cycling with others, aswell I suppose .

dayshah wrote: »

There is the Gough cycle track in the People's Park, which the council made a complete feck of. You could lobby to have it returned to its original use.

Where abouts is it in the park? That sounds like the best possible option of getting a veledrome in the city. Would there be much interest in getting restored do you think? I suppose if you never ask you will never recieve!
Jason.

blorg

JasonG wrote: »

I have a road bike also but I don't have the group experience at all, I always spin on my own. But the feel for group riding can only come with cycling with others, aswell I suppose .

Racing is great but if you want to do it safely you need to work up to it. Join a club and start by going out with them on weekend spins- they will teach you the essentials of group riding. Then if they have a club league or training races, start there, and get familiar with handling your bike in a racing bunch, before moving up to an open race.

Jumping straight into an open crit having never ridden in a group before, never mind raced, would be very foolish. Crits are fast and have lots of cornering, they are one of the most dangerous types of race for a beginner. You put others at risk from your inexperience, it is not just yourself... if you crash you will almost certainly take out several other riders with you.

Junior

JasonG wrote: »

Where abouts is it in the park? That sounds like the best possible option of getting a veledrome in the city. Would there be much interest in getting restored do you think? I suppose if you never ask you will never recieve!
Jason.

It's long gone now really..

Quigs Snr

Bad idea to start with a crit. Especially one where the standard is high. Although on the plus side you won't be in the group long enough to kill anyone. The track in the park was shut down, insurance claim as I understand it. Scared the corporation away despite previously having given an undertaking to renovate. Long story that one.

Bad idea to do any kind of racing, other than time trialling unless you have plenty of group experience.

JasonG

Fair enuf. The only problem I have is my working hours are completely opposite to everybody elses (working 6 days a weeks as a chef) but once the winter comes around i'll have plenty of spare time.

I learned more than I thought I would have when I first posted my question , about cycling in groups and so onl

Could I have Rolfs number anyway as i'm off next thursday and I would love to watch one of these races, or where is it held and what time?

With enough encouragement and logistics planning (stuff my civil engineering and mechanical engineering freinds/lecturers could help with) we could make it happen, if you don't ask you won't recieve

Thanks a mil for all the advice,
Jason.