Public sector going backwards again.

ShamoBuc

TheZohan wrote: »

Maybe you shouldn't make statements that you can't back up, you'll never win an argument with hearsay.

I could just as easily say that teachers have had a 30% pay increase over the last year.

Source.

LOL - afraid of going on one of those sites in case you are wrong??


You could say teachers had a 30% pay increase over the last year.... but the same websites as I outlined for you, would prove you wrong....if you looked at them of course;)

TheZohanS

ShamoBuc wrote: »

LOL - afraid of going on one of those sites in case you are wrong??


You could say teachers had a 30% pay increase over the last year.... but the same websites as I outlined for you, would prove you wrong....if you looked at them of course;)

I checked the sites, they have actually stated that teachers have had no paycuts and that they don't care about the welfare of the students as long as they get paid.

One teacher wrote "I didn't spend 3 years studying an Arts degree and get a 3rd class honour followed by a year doing a HDip for nothing you know, I have rights, I'm a real person".

tayto lover

Some people on here have lost the run of themselves demanding that P.S. workers supply them with details of their pay. Who do they think they are ? Thank God i retired out of the rat-race a few years ago and i didn't even work in the P.S. except for a few years in the 1970's. The P.S. workers are earning exactly and no more than what they signed up to with the cuts and pension levies. I left because the money was far better in the private Sector and there was nobody cribbing then. They also contribute in taxes the same as any other worker.
Honest to God the cheek of some. The P.S. workers are worse to even entertain them with answers.

ShamoBuc

TheZohan wrote: »

I checked the sites

Stopped reading there;)

ShamoBuc

tayto lover wrote: »

Some people on here have lost the run of themselves demanding that P.S. workers supply them with details of their pay. Who do they think they are ? Thank God i retired out of the rat-race a few years ago and i didn't even work in the P.S. except for a few years in the 1970's. The P.S. workers are earning exactly and no more than what they signed up to with the cuts and pension levies. I left because the money was far better in the private Sector and there was nobody cribbing then. They also contribute in taxes the same as any other worker.
Honest to God the cheek of some. The P.S. workers are worse to even entertain them with answers.

Agreed, but there's not much on TV:D

gigino

tayto lover wrote: »

Some people on here have lost the run of themselves demanding that P.S. workers supply them with details of their pay.

Its already known the public service is way overpaid still. We all have partners, lovers, brothers, mothers or children, etc who work in sectors other than our own....

Shirleysrumbler

salonfire wrote: »

sigh.

Hundreds and hundreds of people who worked in the Private Sector worked in shops, cafes, pubs 'back in the day'

Do you think these people were 'Skiing, shopping to NY or on an early break for Easter'. In fact, think about how many of those are now on the dole...

There are now 470,000 people on the dole today.
Think about the number of factories/shops/cafes/businesses that have closed in just 4 years to reach that number.
Think of the 1000s of young people who have left Ireland.

It is an economic meltdown in a relatively short period of time.

For those that did live the high life, 'Skiing, shopping to NY or on an early break for Easter'...how many years do you think they enjoyed this for?
Maybe from 2002 - 2007? 5 years?

Now those that have lost their jobs in Ireland now, what hope do they have? What future can they look forward to?

You say the Public Service has taken a 20% pay cut. So what?
Why to you remind us of this so regularly?
Is it not enough?
Is it too much?

In 2014, you will still have a job.

1000s more won't.

A few facts for you. I like a minority of my contemporaries went into the public service because we had a pretty strong cultural link to voluntary sector. ie trade unions, amateur sports bodies etc. During the boom I certainally became sick of my peers in the Private sector talking of a "salary package equivelant to X or Y" .You had a guy with a salary of say 70k in banking with a tax free perks package of about 25K PA. He in turn doubled his 25K to give him an equivelant 120k. What a sod I was in the Public Service with my 10y ear old Toyota, changing the oil on Saturdays/Saving a few bob to pay for my children's future. Also the Banker had family holidays paid for as a perk etc.
At the other end of the scale was the painter who sat beside me in Primary School who worked on average two days per week on the books. He then took €1000 cash for day three to five, wrote off as an expense the two lads he had on the books five days PW and cleared his mortgage. He later let the workers go, and now signs, works for cash and has every perk you like paid for by the state.
Remember there are public servants who would be better off on the dole but due to pride etc in their work or organisation actually want to make a difference. Want to serve the unappreciative masses.

As I said, just remember how you all turned your noses up at public sarvice jobs a decade ago. Those of us who didn't chose security over risk. When I signed the Green form two decades back, society accepted they employed me for life/I gave up my right to perks and comforts in return for this same job security.

Shirleysrumbler

gigino wrote: »

Its already known the public service is way overpaid still. ...

Would that be over their entire careers or just while the "Genuine creators of wealth" have their ability to screw the rest of us curtailed during this glitch of a recession.

araic88

BEASTERLY wrote: »

Actually I got 570 in my leaving. I considered it but i really didnt feel comfortable with the money they pull, i wouldnt feel right, takin that much money off the taxpayer for doing **** all really.

Nearly spat out my tea laughing at this. Good one.

I went into primary teaching straight from school, which was at the height of the boom. A lot of others at school looked down their noses at teaching then. Now, 5 years later, so many of them are busy either trying to get into teaching or just giving out about us :rolleyes:
I don't feel the slightest bit guilty about my pay or conditions because I know how much effort I put into teaching and how difficult and draining it can be. Colleagues who have been teaching much longer than I say that in the last 5-10 years it has gotten a lot harder than before. Certainly there are "bad teachers" who put in little effort and their pupils suffer. I do actually think it should be easier to get rid of bad teachers, and I know in secondary school I had some awful ones, but some were fantastic and I think the majority are hard working.
A teacher who started in my school at the same time as me had given up a managerial job in a shop as he'd always wanted to go to college and become a teacher. He was surprised by how much of a pay cut he took doing so!

Anyway, I don't think this increase in pupil/teacher ratio is good at all. It doesn't mean one extra child per mainstream class teacher, it includes all teachers who don't teach mainstream - walking principals, learning support teachers, HSLO, resource teachers etc. so it can mean quite a few extra per class, if not having to join classes or split them awkwardly. Considering the massive cuts already made to RTT, language support, SNA numbers etc and the fact that many classes already have 30+ pupils, teachers' jobs are going to get harder but much more importantly the children are the ones who'll really suffer. Seeing as they're our future it's not great news!

Tehachapi

araic88 wrote: »

Nearly spat out my tea laughing at this. Good one.

I went into primary teaching straight from school, which was at the height of the boom. A lot of others at school looked down their noses at teaching then. Now, 5 years later, so many of them are busy either trying to get into teaching or just giving out about us :rolleyes:
I don't feel the slightest bit guilty about my pay or conditions because I know how much effort I put into teaching and how difficult and draining it can be. Colleagues who have been teaching much longer than I say that in the last 5-10 years it has gotten a lot harder than before. Certainly there are "bad teachers" who put in little effort and their pupils suffer. I do actually think it should be easier to get rid of bad teachers, and I know in secondary school I had some awful ones, but some were fantastic and I think the majority are hard working.

You realise none of that actually matters, whether teachers deserve 10k/year or 100k/year, they will only be paid what the country can afford to pay you from our (private sector workers) taxes. All these IMF/ECB loans to fund high public sector wages and social welfare are completely unsustainable.

I'm not talking about now, but in 2-3 years time from then and onwards until you retire.

All these debates about if public sector workers deserve high wages are really really pointless. When you are employed by the state, you ultimately get paid what the state can afford. The state is heading for a €200 billion deficit in the near future - This will decide what you earn, not arguments on the internet/news/media/etc.

tayto lover

gigino wrote: »

Its already known the public service is way overpaid still. We all have partners, lovers, brothers, mothers or children, etc who work in sectors other than our own....

Still trolling ?

ShamoBuc

Tehachapi wrote: »

You realise none of that actually matters, whether teachers deserve 10k/year or 100k/year, they will only be paid what the country can afford to pay you from our (private sector workers) taxes. All these IMF/ECB loans to fund high public sector wages and social welfare are completely unsustainable.

I'm not talking about now, but in 2-3 years time from then and onwards until you retire.

All these debates about if public sector workers deserve high wages are really really pointless. When you are employed by the state, you ultimately get paid what the state can afford. The state is heading for a €200 billion deficit in the near future - This will decide what you earn, not arguments on the internet/news/media/etc.

I could have sworn Public Sector workers are taxed aswell.....I wonder where that goes?

donalg1

Romeo Hot Ware wrote: »

Problem with our system is there's so many contracts and conditions going back for years which worked out in favour for anyone retiring or have been in the system for last 40 years,i assume if we ran the system like aer lingus/ryanair there be alot of people given the boot.

Problem with the Irish system is people were allowed borrow more money for mortgages than they could ever repay, and when they realised they couldnt repay them they simply say oh well and walk away from it without recrimination, then they turn to the government and get paid an exorbitantly high Social Welfare Rate that they can stay on for ten or twenty years and never have anything done or any questions asked, then they get huge amounts of Rent Allowance to top up their Social Welfare Payments. This idea of cutting the Public Sector alone is bull, the Private Sector needs it too, as does Social Welfare, its about time everyone was made to take responsibility and finally do something to help the country out of the mess its in.

ShamoBuc

ShamoBuc wrote: »

I could have sworn Public Sector workers are taxed aswell.....I wonder where that goes?

Some people are so blinded by their (wrong) opinion they miss major details like that.

Also if a private sector worker and public worker earn the same gross wage, the private sector worker will have a higher net pay due to the additional levies etc which the public sector have to pay.

wild_cat

gbee wrote: »

An unfair comment.

I really don't think so.

I think you'll find that the teachers that manage to keep better control of their classes get better results.

You can have the exact same class with two different teachers. One teacher can handle them the other can't. In the school I went to myself the teacher that could handle the class didn't have any scum bag parents trotting in as no rows were ever started as the teenager knew not to even kick off in the class. The behaviour was never given any leeway at the start.

The latter is obviously cut out for teaching the other isn't. There's a lot more than just knowing your stuff that comes along with teaching and in some cases this isn't even there. Some people just lack the presence that's needed to control a group of teenagers with out screaming or idle threats.


You might not think its a fair comment but its the truth. The most hard line teachers in my school never had any problems with scum bag parents or scum bag students. They had a reputation for taking no crap that went back for generations. They didn't belittle, jeer or scream at their students they just had the right skills to do things properly.

This is what happens when you have a career that people join (or previously thought things would be like) for the job security, the pay and holidays. These people should be rooted out and replaced with people who actually have the correct vocation.

In any private sector job (that is regulated correctly... leave out the banks) if you are not up to the standard you'll find someone else will be brought in to do your job properly.

The youth of this country have been failed especially in Maths and the Science subjects (not so much in science but most certainly in maths) for years by teachers that never seem to be inspected or have their low grade results for years followed up on.

I'm not tarring all teachers here. Some teachers I had were amazing but some of them should never have been allowed near a class room.

I had one teacher that would have made a very good stand up comedian. She was as hard as nails herself. She had a problem with one little rat getting her Dad up to the school the whole time. Her humour and whit were so dry I'm pretty sure she made the situation worse for herself by basically crushing the child's parent with funny one liners. The rat would then repeat these in class and any other student with the intelligence to get the joke would piss themselves with laughter, it was pretty easy to notice that the rat's family we're lacking in the "getting the joke skills". The rat finally stopped shouting that her dad was coming up to the school when she seen that she'd basically turned herself and her family into a joke. That was the completely wrong way to handle that situation but it worked much to my humour anyway.

cosmicfart

ShamoBuc wrote: »

I could have sworn Public Sector workers are taxed aswell.....I wonder where that goes?

Goes to the people on the dole / the non working PS workers

mackg

wild_cat wrote: »

I really don't think so.

I think you'll find that the teachers that manage to keep better control of their classes get better results....

.....I'm not tarring all teachers here. Some teachers I had were amazing but some of them should never have been allowed near a class room.

+1 There are a lot of teenagers working in the system that just cannot command any authority. Is there anyone here that can honestly say that in their school at least 40% of their teachers weren't considered a soft touch. Then there are the ones who are just terrible at the actual act of teaching. I'm not taking anything away from teaching, it's important and requires skill and knowledge but a fair whack of the profession are missing one or both.

I study pharma chem in college, I don't think it's a massive conincedince that by far the best teacher I had in secondary taught me science at junior cert and chemistry at leaving cert. Maybe some kids might take an interest in school if their teachers were half as good as him. Mr O hanlon in Mercy Mounthawk if I ever see that man again I'm going to thank him.

7sr2z3fely84g5

Another example-
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/no-exit-package-for-workers-who-wont-move-jobs-2840567.html

PUBLIC sector workers will not be given a special "exit package" if they refuse to move to another job in the state sector as part of the Croke Park Agreement.
The Labour Court has also recommended that workers who resist redeployment should not be given the option of staying within their current organisation or seeking an alternative transfer to the one offered.
This will have major repercussions for the Government's redeployment plan, which is one of the major reforms promised in the Croke Park deal.
The agreement says public servants must co-operate with redeployment to avoid compulsory redundancies.
Trade union IMPACT took a case to the Labour Court on behalf of clerical and administrative workers in the Community Welfare Service (CWS) division of the Health Service Executive (HSE) who are being transferred to the Department of Social Protection.
It argued that workers should be given the option of remaining within the HSE, be offered alternative redeployment outside of the department or else an "exit" scheme.
Some 1,000 workers have already moved from the HSE to the department to help with the extra workload due to rising unemployment.
However, thousands more could be on the move as the Government has signalled there will be "significant redeployment" and this case will act as a precedent.
In its recommendation, seen by the Irish Independent, the Labour Court said workers being transferred should neither benefit nor lose out from the move, with all terms and conditions such as pay, pensions and sick leave entitlements remaining the same.
It also said that workers who don't want to be redeployed cannot be offered an exit package, saying it does not consider it a "viable option at this time".
It also rejected making transfers "optional" as this would not be consistent with the Croke Park terms or intent.
Issues
The HSE had said the provisions of the agreement do not allow for staff who didn't want to be redeployed to be given other options. It also said the CWS division will cease to exist once all staff are transferred.
The court also recommended that discussions between the two sides should begin immediately and must conclude by mid-September. It said it will continue to be available to the parties to resolve any outstanding issues after that date.
Several hundred workers have already been moved from FAS to the Department of Social Protection while the staff at UCD have been warned that they will face mandatory redeployment if they do not voluntarily move to other jobs within the university.

So the agreement is actually useless.

MysticalRain

Shirleysrumbler wrote: »

As I said, just remember how you all turned your noses up at public sarvice jobs a decade ago. Those of us who didn't chose security over risk. When I signed the Green form two decades back, society accepted they employed me for life/I gave up my right to perks and comforts in return for this same job security.

Not true at all. As anyone who did the entrance exams in the RDS, or Croke Park could tell you, PS jobs were always in demand, even during the boom times.

Both my parents work in the PS, and from what I can see, very few jobs in the private sector can match the perks and comforts of the PS. My parents spent most of the last decade telling me I was wasting my time in the private sector.

donalg1

MysticalRain wrote: »

Not true at all. As anyone who did the entrance exams in the RDS, or Croke Park could tell you, PS jobs were always in demand, even during the boom times.

Both my parents work in the PS, and from what I can see, very few jobs in the private sector can match the perks and comforts of the PS. My parents spent most of the last decade telling me I was wasting my time in the private sector.

What are the Perks?

MysticalRain

donalg1 wrote: »

What are the Perks?

Higher wages and easier working conditions than the private sector.

donalg1

MysticalRain wrote: »

Higher wages and easier working conditions than the private sector.

I dont think you can say higher wages now in fairness, its a bit of a general statement really, most of my friends in the Private Sector are actually earning more than my friends in the Public Sector so i dont think i would agree with that now

MysticalRain

donalg1 wrote: »

I dont think you can say higher wages now in fairness, its a bit of a general statement really, most of my friends in the Private Sector are actually earning more than my friends in the Public Sector so i dont think i would agree with that now

If I recall correctly, the latest stats show that wages are still higher in the public sector, despite the cuts. So you are probably wrong about that. Then of course you have pensions to consider as well, which puts the PS well ahead of most people in the private sector.

tayto lover

donalg1 wrote: »

I dont think you can say higher wages now in fairness, its a bit of a general statement really, most of my friends in the Private Sector are actually earning more than my friends in the Public Sector so i dont think i would agree with that now

I found that out years ago and left the Public Sector.
Its amazing how many read the Indo though and are codded.

donalg1

MysticalRain wrote: »

If I recall correctly, the latest stats show that wages are still higher in the public sector, despite the cuts. So you are probably wrong about that. Then of course you have pensions to consider as well, which puts the PS well ahead of most people in the private sector.

Ha Pensions!!! They pay for their pensions in the Public Sector, if a private sector worker wants an equivalent pension they can pay for it too instead of moaning about it

ShamoBuc

MysticalRain wrote: »

Not true at all. As anyone who did the entrance exams in the RDS, or Croke Park could tell you, PS jobs were always in demand, even during the boom times.

Both my parents work in the PS, and from what I can see, very few jobs in the private sector can match the perks and comforts of the PS. My parents spent most of the last decade telling me I was wasting my time in the private sector.

Should have listened to your parents so.

arybvtcw0eolkf

BEASTERLY wrote: »

Actually I got 570 in my leaving. I considered it but i really didnt feel comfortable with the money they pull, i wouldnt feel right, takin that much money off the taxpayer for doing **** all really.

I'll hazard a guess and say creative writing was more your thing?.

srsly78

donalg1 wrote: »

Ha Pensions!!! They pay for their pensions in the Public Sector, if a private sector worker wants an equivalent pension they can pay for it too instead of moaning about it

Public sector only pay for a small part of their pensions, government tops it up for them. And yes this is even after the levy.

Odysseus

donalg1 wrote: »

I dont think you can say higher wages now in fairness, its a bit of a general statement really, most of my friends in the Private Sector are actually earning more than my friends in the Public Sector so i dont think i would agree with that now

Always being the case in my profession, I was told I was mad working for the HSE when I could be racking it in through private practice at times that suit me. My mates still earn more, but I like working with my clients who could not afford to see me privately, the work is harder, but it had made me a better therapist, and given me much more experience.

RichieC

BEASTERLY wrote: »

Actually I got 570 in my leaving. I considered it but i really didnt feel comfortable with the money they pull, i wouldnt feel right, takin that much money off the taxpayer for doing **** all really.

hahahahaha...someone post this to the greatest BS you've ever heard thread...

donalg1

srsly78 wrote: »

Public sector only pay for a small part of their pensions, government tops it up for them. And yes this is even after the levy.

And who pays the Pension of Private Sector workers?

tayto lover

srsly78 wrote: »

Public sector only pay for a small part of their pensions, government tops it up for them. And yes this is even after the levy.

Yes and that was one of the attractions to get them to join in the first place as it was hard to entice people into sections of it then.

MysticalRain

MysticalRain wrote: »

Higher wages and easier working conditions than the private sector.

Thats a stupid statement on both counts.

Most skilled positions will have higer wages in the private sector than the public sector and even if the gross pay is similar the public sector wage has more deductions.

Also how can you compare working conditions. Does a Nurse struggling to cover an over crowded ward getting three 15 minute brakes in a 13 hour shift have better working conditions than your average private sector worker.

It amazing how blinded people are by their own insanely stupid opinions.

donalg1

Samir Scrawny Shelf wrote: »

Thats a stupid statement on both counts.

Most skilled positions will have higer wages in the private sector than the public sector and even if the gross pay is similar the public sector wage has more deductions.

Also how can you compare working conditions. Does a Nurse struggling to cover an over crowded ward getting three 15 minute brakes in a 13 hour shift have better working conditions than your average private sector worker.

It amazing how blinded people are by their own insanely stupid opinions.

But sure MysticalRains parents both work in the Public Sector so MR must be set up for life, ferrari for the 18th and a new house for the 21st im sure!!!!!

FetchTheGin

If they eliminated a good few of the pointless sections of the Public Sector and poured the money from them into the services that are needed such as the HSE or Gardai then we might have big improvements on both counts.

I like David Camerons ideas of reform in the U.K. public sector, which are highly unlikely to happen here anytime soon.

srsly78

donalg1 wrote: »

And who pays the Pension of Private Sector workers?

They pay for it themselves.

donalg1

srsly78 wrote: »

donalg1 wrote: »

And who pays the Pension of Private Sector workers?

They pay for it themselves.

Oh right I thought they get the state pension. Sorry must be mistaken

7sr2z3fely84g5

Many private pensions are worthless now,i remember during the ahern era there where adverts encouraging the public to take out pensions,now if we look at a judge in the public sector-
http://www.finfacts.ie/irishfinancenews/article_1015198.shtml

The Sunday Independent said last month that one of many beneficiaries of the generous public sector wage and pension structure is the current Chief Justice, John L Murray. As Chief Justice, he receives an annual salary of €295,915 a year -- which is now greater than that paid to the Taoiseach. On retirement he will also be entitled to a defined benefit pension which will be worth up to 60% of his salary a year and a lump sum of one-and-a-half times his final salary.

However, he is also currently paid a pension for his two stints as Attorney-General. Because that pension is linked to the current pay level for the position, €219,000, he received €69,042 in 2007 from the State as a pension. He also receives a pension entitlement from his time on the European Court of Justice.

It was estimated that it would cost as much as €9.5m to fund Murray's pension if he was in the private sector.[/QUOTE]

srsly78

donalg1 wrote: »

Oh right I thought they get the state pension. Sorry must be mistaken

You realise we are not talking about the state pension that everyone gets right?

StephenHendry

i think when it comes to people saying wages are higher in the PS than the private , people too often look to what top civil servants get paid when the average public sector wage is relatively similar to that in the private sector.

Originally Posted by donalg1
Oh right I thought they get the state pension. Sorry must be mistaken


everyone gets the state pension, public sector workers contribute to their pension , while the 'pension levy' is not pension related if you know what i mean

donalg1

The Public Sector workers get the state pension and a little more (maybe €50per week if that), the reason they get the extra is because they spend 40years contributing to a pension. So in theory a Private Sector worker could take €30 - €40 per week from their wages and put it in a bank acocunt then when they retire they could use this to supplement their state pension couldn't they? Surely this would be better than moaning that someone that has worked in the Public Service their whole life now gets a higher pension, seeing as a bit of foresight would enable them to have an equivalent pension.

byhookorbycrook

*sigh*. It's not just one extra child per class. If a primary has 4 teachers and loses one,those 30 kids have to be divided between the remaining three teachers.

The 29/30 ratio is rubbbish anyhow. Special schools (where there might be 8 to one teacher,)learning support, resource,admin principals are all used to calculate the 29/1 ratio.

MysticalRain

Samir Scrawny Shelf wrote: »

Thats a stupid statement on both counts.

Most skilled positions will have higer wages in the private sector than the public sector and even if the gross pay is similar the public sector wage has more deductions.

Also how can you compare working conditions. Does a Nurse struggling to cover an over crowded ward getting three 15 minute brakes in a 13 hour shift have better working conditions than your average private sector worker.

It amazing how blinded people are by their own insanely stupid opinions.

First, nice job quoting selective examples here. We are talking about averages, not individual professions. Also, I am not even talking about the higher paid fat cats in the upper levels of the PS either. Second, if the nurse in question has a problem with her working conditions, then she should take that up with her union. It also goes without saying, that she earns significantly more than her counterparts working in other countries. I myself have worked similar hours in the private sector on a lower salary than a nurse currently earns.

Further more, nice job calling someone "stupid" and "insane" because they happen to disagree with you. That's a great way to win sympathy from the average private sector taxpayer. I could make the point that increasing taxes on an economically depressed private sector to pay for a bloated public service is also insane and stupid. I spent 2+ years unemployed, and now face the looming prospect of yet more unemployment. You must be utterly deluded if you believe people like myself are in a position to keep an overpaid public sector in the lifestyle that they have become accustomed to. Good luck with that.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Odysseus wrote: »

Always being the case in my profession, I was told I was mad working for the HSE when I could be racking it in through private practice at times that suit me. My mates still earn more, but I like working with my clients who could not afford to see me privately, the work is harder, but it had made me a better therapist, and given me much more experience.

I got the same over the years...

"Jesus Martin your mad staying in the army"

"Martin your a f*cking idiot staying there, look what you'd get outside"

And more along those lines.

Yes I was considered a fool for staying in a job I actually love to do, for a sh*t wage.

The same ex-army lads who wouldn't get out of bed for less than a grand a week now begrudge me my wage - which I might add is pittance now. I've always had to supplement it but I thought the older I got that I could settled back and work just one job, now if I can get it I'll work two or three or we're f*cked.

So I find it a little insulting when I read the bullsh*t about the 'over paid PS worker'.. Esp when I read some of the people's posts here and they're still living off mammy's tit, in college or barely out of school.

I know we all have cringe worthy moments if we look over out contributions to internet discussion forum's over the years, but this gem (posted in this thread) take's the F'ing biscuit;

Actually I got 570 in my leaving. I considered it but i really didnt feel comfortable with the money they pull, i wouldnt feel right, takin that much money off the taxpayer for doing **** all really.

Ffs gimme a God damned break from the bullsh*t.

Tehachapi

ShamoBuc wrote: »

I could have sworn Public Sector workers are taxed aswell.....I wonder where that goes?

ROFL!

Samir Scrawny Shelf wrote: »

Some people are so blinded by their (wrong) opinion they miss major details like that.

Also if a private sector worker and public worker earn the same gross wage, the private sector worker will have a higher net pay due to the additional levies etc which the public sector have to pay.

Double ROFL!

The ironic thing is you calling my opinion "wrong" , when it is the two of you talking complete sh1te.

Public sector "tax" is not a contributor to the state's finance, like private sector tax is. If you can't even grasp a simple concept like this, you shouldn't even have a job.

Paying someone in the public sector €800/week, and taxing them €100/week, is EXACTLY the same to the state's finances as just paying them €700/week with no tax.

Public Sector Pay: €800/week - €100 tax = Net Loss of €700 to the state
Public Sector Pay: €700/week - €0 tax = Net Loss of €700 to the state

Private sector and corporation tax however actually CONTRIBUTE to the state's finances and PAY your wages! I'll do another example because you probably still don't understand:

Private Sector Pay: €800/week - €100 tax = Net Gain of €100 to the state

mikemac

It's not long ago that young lads were quitting school, labouring on sites and pulling around 700 a week.
My brother did this while my ****ty minimum wage job put me through college.

It's also not long ago that tradesmen wouldn't bother coming out or quoting for small jobs.
Washing machine bust and I was let down so often I learned how to do it myself, internet is amazing eh?
Wanted a room tiled and again I was getting let down. Probably in bed unless they get 1k a week. Tiling is not hard and can be learned even by a hack like me. I was slow but it got done

Turn on Joe Duffy and I'm hearing crying and moaning from these laborers and tradesmen who can't get work and hearing about the greedy public sector

Good luck to the public sector, they took their jobs, signed their contracts and served their time until they got made permanent. And the jobs were publicly advertised, open for all.

I did apply for EO but my aptitude test wasn't enough to get on a panel

Monty Burnz

Gophur wrote: »

80% of the costs of education, in Ireland, is spent on staff salaries.

What's the breakdown in other comparable countries?

Tehachapi

Tehachapi wrote: »

ROFL!



Double ROFL!

The ironic thing is you calling my opinion "wrong" , when it is the two of you talking complete sh1te.

Public sector "tax" is not a contributor to the state's finance, like private sector tax is. If you can't even grasp a simple concept like this, you shouldn't even have a job.

Paying someone in the public sector €800/week, and taxing them €100/week, is EXACTLY the same to the state's finances as just paying them €700/week with no tax.

Public Sector Pay: €800/week - €100 tax = Net Loss of €700 to the state
Public Sector Pay: €700/week - €0 tax = Net Loss of €700 to the state

Private sector and corporation tax however actually CONTRIBUTE to the state's finances and PAY your wages! I'll do another example because you probably still don't understand:

Private Sector Pay: €800/week - €100 tax = Net Gain of €100 to the state

The point isn't its contribution to the state its about how much money the person gets into their pocket and as I said before for skilled jobs private sector pay is higher in most cases from what I can see.

Its difficult to find direct comparisons as what do you compare a nurse or teacher to in the private sector. But for instance a person newly graduated with their PhD getting a scientific research position in a University would be looking at starting on 35 to 40k gross. Same person would be looking at 60k+ in the right R&D company and have no pension levy deducted etc. That's probably one of the more direct comparisons.

arybvtcw0eolkf

mikemac wrote: »

It's not long ago that young lads were quitting school, labouring on sites and pulling around 700 a week.
My brother did this while my ****ty minimum wage job put me through college.

It's also not long ago that tradesmen wouldn't bother coming out or quoting for small jobs.
Washing machine bust and I was let down so often I learned how to do it myself, internet is amazing eh?
Wanted a room tiled and again I was getting let down. Probably in bed unless they get 1k a week. Tiling is not hard and can be learned even by a hack like me. I was slow but it got done

Turn on Joe Duffy and I'm hearing crying and moaning from these laborers and tradesmen who can't get work and hearing about the greedy public sector

I posted something like that over a year ago.

During the boom I learned to tile, lay floors and a small bit of plastering when I replaced a patio door with double doors opening out onto a patio I laid myself..

Had I been able to get tradesmen are the time I'd have saved taking annual leave.

My gate broke, do you think I could get a welder to fix it? - could I f*ck, so I bought a little welding plant & hey presto the job was done.

Mechanic's, lol.. I don't drive anything great - a Skoda Octavia 1.9 Tdi.. During the boom it was costing me almost €400 for a service, I see garages advertising services now from €80 and they're still going under - tough sh*t buster, I learned how to service my own car when you were throwing a saddle on my back.

Now, as you said I hear 'em on Joe Duffy whinging and moaning that they can't earn a crust - Boo Hoo.

Worse of all I hate the 'them & us' little war which those FF bastards generated to sully the name of the public sector worker.

I don't like arguing with mates and defending my position just because I'm lucky enough to still have a job, but I'll be f*cked if I'll sit back and be a punch bag for anyone either.

Dionysus

DrumSteve wrote: »

Lets just kill them all now... to hell with the public sector. :pac:

One extra kid in a class is not a big deal.

It can be a very big deal if:

1) the extra child is disruptive to the extent of undermining the education of others;

2) the sum of all the extra children results in a reduction in the number of teachers to the extent that students have much less subject choice, if any choice at all, in their Leaving Cert subjects.