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Green Bay Packers Thread
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I would have been incredibly unhappy a few days ago if someone said we had not picked up an edge rusher or WR in the first three rounds but... it's kind of hard to argue with what we've got. Sorry by the way, kind of lost the run of myself with this post!
First is Alexander, who a lot of people had quite close to Ward and who was the #1 CB in the entire draft as far as Mayock was concerned. He was injured a lot last year but had he kept (which for GB is a worry in itself!) but if he had kept fit and repeated his 2016 year there's a solid chance he would have been hyped up as a top 5 guy and been ahead of Fitzpatrick and Ward. And we've only a few snippets but the guys attitude seems incredible, kind of reminds me of Donald Driver in that sense. We'll see if he keeps it up deep into the year or if we're having a terrible game etc, but it's a huge bonus to me if he does.
Second is Johnson. I think we were looking more at Harold Landry before the Titans came up and stole him 2-3 picks before us, so if we were not enamoured with any other OLBs it's hard not to agree with this pick. Capers preferred nippy, quick CBs while Pettine's system (Browns HC 2014-15, Bills DC 2013, Jets DC 2009-12) is much more physical and bump-and-run, more like when we had Woodson and Al Harris as our CBs early in/before Capers' time. This guy has got a lot of comparisons to Richard Sherman and Josh Norman in that sense, is big, physical and a quality tackler with great coverage skills. His combine 40 time of 4.49 hurt him and is likely the reason he dropped though those are often deceptive and can be "played around" especially for a bump-and-run type - by comparison Sherman ran a 4.56 and Norman a 4.64 (while Alexander's 4.38 was the fourth quickest of this years DBs). This guy was WalterFootball.com (great website for draft player analysis) and PFF's top rated CB for the entire draft, as well as their #11 and #10 overall players full stop. With the 45th pick, it's pretty much impossible to argue with that value. Also makes it a bit of a shame we didn't get Edmunds or Davenport with the initial #14 pick but the secondary it gives us could be insane and nobody would have predicted Jackson being there in the second.
Our secondary is now looking extremely deep - if the rookies hit the ground running we've got Johnson's physical style to go with 6'3 freak athlete Kevin King on the boundaries, Alexander in the slot could be lethal with all the positives Randall gave there for ball hawking but also an excellent attitude, infectious and high energy guy which I've got a huge bias towards (Matthews, Martinez being our current best examples of that), who is a good tackler that relishes the physical aspect, though one knock is he apparently isn't great getting off blocks (not a big one to me, as bad as our pass defense has been we've been decent against the run the last two years so no major need there, and if we blitz him the odd time you always want your DBs to get clean through on those plays anyway). If Dix can get back to his 2016 form (the "secret" is just playing him to his strengths - keep his role simple in deep coverage over the middle with the occasional play coming closer on running downs or for an unexpected blitz) and Josh Jones slots in to Burnett's role well the safeties should be as good as they were for 2015-16 which was very good, and if we can build on Jones' first half to last season we've frankly got serious playmakers and ball hawks at every DB position.
Then for depth we've got Tramon as insurance for this year if either rookie takes a while to adjust who while 35 he was still NFL starter quality last season, and House for depth, more experience, and by all accounts since he returned last year is also an A+ locker room kind of guy. I like Kendrell Brice as a backup safety - nothing special but he has never looked a liability when filling in and Marwin Evans as a backup SS also looked OK last year. That leaves 1-2 DB spots open for Hawkins, Pipkins, Waters, Rollins (who might be moved to safety), Donatello Brown and maybe 1-2 UDFAs or 'value' picks in the 6th-7th rounds to fight for, all quite young and all very cheap to have on the roster.
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I'm not that familiar with Oren Burks but one thing that has been pointed out is the buy's athleticism is insane - going by his combine numbers he is going to be one of the more athletic ILBs in the entire league from his first day in the league, though obviously there is a tonne more to the position than just that. At 6'3, 233lbs I'd be almost certain we are not using him on the edge though he might fit alongside Martinez like a glove - one of the main reasons I was sad to see Burnett go was that it meant Josh Jones moving to SS rather than ILB where we all know too well how badly we've needed a coverage guy for those 7-15 yard over the middle passes on third downs and this might cover it, and at 6'3 he's also going to be hard to throw the ball over/in and behind.
If he doesn't slot in as an immediate start that's OK as Jake Ryan is nothing special but not bad and we can always sub him in on 3rd and long plays if we like. Some comparisons have been Ryan Shazier and Anthony Barr of the Vikings, extremely fast sideline-to-sideline guys who can get all over the field. Martinez (and our defensive line, even before Mo Wilkerson) helped making running up the middle or off the side of the tackles against us a bit of a nightmare for opponents last year and he's good in coverage too, but hopefully Burks can be the real coverage specialist in our unit moving forward.
If he can clog up the 'easy option' against us for the last half decade or so, coupled with big, physical CBs jamming the line WRs at the LOS, Josh Jones and Alexander being extremely opportunist guys with great athleticism in the slot/SS spots as well as Dix just back doing his thing deeper down the field, that alone could help our pass rush. I still want to see something added at OLB from us (Biegel returning will help a bit here but I hope we can find a big, physical monster at some point today, even if it means a raw and developmental guy... let's go high risk/high reward, we've got two first rounders next year if it doesn't work out) but we've likely helped our ability to get to the QB with all the other pieces. And of course Mo/Clark/Daniels could be pretty terrifying collapsing things inside.
He also comes over as well spoken, is reportedly a very smart guy on and off the field, was a team captain and was involved in charity work and activism through college.
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Wishlist for today:
- Deep threat WR. I think we can afford someone a little more raw here if the trade off for athleticism is worth it, but playing with Rodgers one thing that is extremely important is intelligence, so no 'flat track bully' stereotypes please. Good hands, intelligence, speed and length are what I want from our pick here, things like route precision or physical strength can be worked on even if it means them not hitting the ground running.
- OLB. Physical freaks please, again I am OK going with raw players and possibly even a guy who's intelligence is not one of his biggest strengths - even getting a guy who literally knows how to do nothing but run directly for the CB (with some block shedding moves) is worth it if we can find him, e.g. even if he struggles against the run and/or in coverage.
- Developmental TE. Kendricks has shown in the past he can be a 40-50 catch TE which is nice to have as #2 to Graham but he was brutal last year (though it's impossible to judge anyone Hundley passes the ball to) and while Jimmy is a great addition he is also 32, so someone to build up to challenge Kendricks this year, maybe take his spot next year, and be able to either be a handy squad guy like Richard Rodgers was or in a perfect world take over for Graham in about three years would be a big benefit.
- Maybe 2+ defensive linemen, just for the depth and to develop. We've got a great starting trio, Lowry impressed me as an 'unsung dirty work' kind of guy last season and Montravius Adams as a 3rd rounder barely played partly due to injuries (no worry, DL men often do nothing as rookies - Kenny Clark being one other example - so hopefully he can get in the mix this year). But beyond that we literally have nothing, not a guy on the roster. So picking up two here, another 2-3 UDFAs to fight for spots on the team or practice squad, and maybe an experienced journeyman FA on over the summer would help flesh things out a bit. Guys who can contribute as depth in year one over guys with higher upside might be preferred here.
- BPA. We've got a huge number of picks today (10, if I recall) and I'd be all for using some of them to trade up if we want to pounce on someone, but otherwise just use the rest on guys to develop over time at whatever position. A 3rd string/PS QB maybe, it never hurts to get late round offensive linemen, perhaps a RB if there's great value, maybe a long snapper? I like Trevor Davis as a returner, Jaire Alexander apparently excels at it too and we've got guys like Monty or Cobb there for depth in case we get a bunch of injuries while Vogel looks like a good young punter and Crosby is Crosby so it's hard to really even pick out random special teams needs. Gunner might be one with Janis (one of the very best in the league) gone and Goodson likely leaving too but obviously that's late 7th round/UDFA type of stuff.0 -
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If anyone uses podcast programs like 'Pocket Casts' (I think it costs €2-3 but I've had it for years and it's just a one-off charge, brilliant if you want to find podcasts on your phone and keep them all really easy to find and accessible) I recently subscribed to a bunch of Packers podcasts as I've missed Packers Transplants a lot since it wrapped up 2-3 years back. Anyway as expected most were unimpressive, but I can't recommend 'Packernet' enough. It does cover a small bit of other Wisconsin teams like the Milwaukee Bucks and Brewers but around 90% of it is Packers.
I can't quite tell if it is it's own podcast or just a composite of a bunch of other ones put together, but it seems to be updated almost daily and has some great stuff on there. This one in particular I found excellent with a breakdown of our roster post-draft and how we might look come preseason - https://player.fm/series/custom-green-bay-packers-talk-radio-podcast/ep-5918-otas-position-preview
Quick notes off that and a few other podcasts on there I've been listening to in the last few weeks:
- There is a lot of excitement about Montravius Addams on the defensive line despite him missing so much of his rookie year last season. Apparently he can pop off the LOS to create pressure in a way very few guys can. I'm interested to see between him, Daniels (good for 5-7 sacks a year), Clark (got about 5 last year from the nose) and Wilkerson (putting up double digits with the Jets before he slipped up a bit), what Pettine who is known to get the best of his players and to generate pressure in unorthodox ways as he did with the Jets during Wilkerson's best seasons, can do with them.
- If anything, there might be more excitement about Reggie Gilbert than Vince Biegel who also missed rookie time after being taken top of the 4th round last year. Gilbert was a practice squad UDFA in 2016, got onto special teams last year and got to play the last two games getting a sack and some pressures. He's apparently been a solid, steady riser who the coaches absolutely love in terms of attitude and commitment to improving.
- They really, really want to see 7th round OLB pick Kendall Donnerson against our WRs and DBs
. He's obviously insanely raw and a long term project but ran a 4.48 40 which was second only to Shaquiem Griffin among all LBs and the same speed as St. Brown.
- Some concerns on J'Mon Moore are that he has some dropping problems though they cna be worked out, but more importantly 'body catches' which can cause issues in the NFL where you need to reach out and attack the ball more (think Jordy's quick hook routes where he would dive back and pounce on the ball like a soccer goalkeeper saving a penalty). For St. Brown his on the field work has been solid, but concerns are more over attitude and if he is a bit of a primadonna. At least small town GB could help here compared to having his head swollen in NY or LA or whatnot, comparisons were made to Julio Jones, TO and Dez Bryant so not so much 'lacking effort' and potentially a bit 'me, me, me'. MVS is apparently incredibly raw but that was expected, and a lot of Janis comparisons though if the others work out at WR, it has to be said that Janis has probably been a top 5 special teams player in the entire league since he was drafted.
- The punter JK Scott is an absolute weapon with Lechler/Johnny Hekker potential, he can boom it 70+ yards, keep it in the air forever, and it really good at directional punts to get the ball out of bounds inside the 10 yard line. At Alabama he was a game-changer and one excellent point was he played on TV with the pressure of the national championship being an expectation and not aspiration at that school. That put me a bit more at ease with the pick, though you just never know when it comes to punters.
- Jackson at CB has been doing fine but might need a small bit more time as last season was his first ever at CB which I never knew, though Jaire Alexander is looking pretty obscene by most accounts and just looks like an all-around football player rather than someone who specialises in one role, or even one position (with the caveat that the QBs throwing have been awful, can't wait to see how he looks defending Rodgers or even Kizer's passes).
- Arron Jones has the potential to be our best RB since Ahman Green. Apparently he needs a small bit of bulking up in the legs and that is why he didn't get more carries last year which I was confused about at the time, because I definitely agree with the 'best since Green' sentiment. Because of this, don't be shocked to see Monty at WR more than RB particularly early in the season.0 -
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