Ulster - the Famine Experience and other Stories

CDfm

When I think of the Famine I do not think of Ulster as that is not what I learnt in school. I found an anomaly in family history research that where one ancestor was living the population growth.

I didn't know that Dublin and Cork as well as the Larne Valley had population growth.

So a famine monument in Dublin has lost its potency for me.


So digging deeper I see that Ulster was also affected -which I did not know even though the info was in front of me.

The country left behind by the emigrants was transformed by the famine. The map [1] shows the drop in population islandwide between 1841 and 1851. Only three areas (the metropolitan areas of Belfast, Dublin and Cork) managed to increase their population. This was partly due to an influx of famine victims from rural areas and the fact that the famine had comparatively little effect in urban areas. Elsewhere, the coastal counties of Ulster and Munster suffered the smallest falls, with the inland, southern and western areas suffering the greatest falls.

It must be pointed out that the map does not show the 'final' state of the famine years; the decline it depicts continued until after the mid 20th century.


http://www.wesleyjohnston.com/users/ireland/past/famine/demographics_post.html

So with this thread , I am not interested in the politics because you can't eat politics.

I am interested in the facts of what happened and how the province recovered and coped.

To put the era in context,Patrick Bronte , father of the Bronte Sisters was an Ulsterman and when he left Ireland

To be fair the sisters were born in West Yorkshire, England where you can still visit Brontë Country. However, their family originated in beautiful county Down in Northern Ireland, the Bronte Homeland. Their father Patrick Brontë had been a preacher and a teacher at the tiny village of Drumballyroney and you can still visit the Bronte Home.

What's in a Name?
Patrick Brontë was born Patrick Brunty in 1777. He later moved to England and changed his name to Brontë.
No one knows for sure why. Some suggest that he might have wanted to hide his humble origins while others point out that, being a man of letters, he might have chosen the name because of classical Greek influence, since in Greek mythology Brontes means “thunder” and was the name of one of the cyclops.
Patrick spelled his name with a dieresis over the “e” (Brontë) to stress that two syllables are pronounced (and highlight the second syllable as the one accented as in the Greek?).

Brontë Homeland Tour - DrumballyroneyA tour of the Brontë Homeland best begins at the tiny village of Drumballyroney a mere 10 miles from Banbridge. The road leading to the Brontë Homeland is well signposted is usually very quiet. The school where Patrick taught still stands and has been restored and functions as a little museum. Next to it the old Church of Ireland church where his family attended and where he later preached. From the church grounds you have a beautiful view over the surrounding green rolling hills of Co Down, though on in winter it can be very cold and windy up there.

KnockiveaghFrom Drumballyroney, drive to Knockiveagh, a hilltop and excellent picnic area from where you get spectacular views of the area where Patrick Brontë grew up. In the picnic area there once stood a shebeen, an illicit drinking house.

http://www.my-secret-northern-ireland.com/bronte-homeland.html

The last of Patrick's daughters married his curate Arthur Bell Nicolls again from the North and Chatlotte had a very positive experoence of Ireland on her honeymoon , while Patrick(a Cambridge graduate) buried his Irish past.

So where to start ???

owenc

Yes i am interested in how the famine affected us up here. My mother always tells us that it effected her side of the family quite badly as they lived up in mud huts in the middle of nowhere, but it did not effect my fathers family because they had stone houses and lived at the coast. (which is interesting because you state that your proximity to the coast affected it). But by analysing data it doesn't seem that it affected us as badly as yous (probably because we did not relay on potatoes as much) and when we were doing family trees i was surprised to find that in most of my family everyone survived the famine. If i was to be honest i would say that the population did drop but i don't think it was to do with the famine i think it was to do with immigrants as from what i remember 200,000 left ulster in the 1700s so there would've been a popualtion drop. But i do think a small % of that decline was to do with famine and also others dieseases which my such as tp (apparently very bad where i live). What i think helped us recover quicker than yous was 1. we had less reliabilty on potatoes if we did not have potatoes we had cabbage, bread, butter etc.. 2. and also the introduction of industry into belfast and all the ports etc, this impacted us greatly and i think this is the one that brought us ahead of yous more than anything because it brought in food and money to the area that yous were not getting. Onto the family trees every tree i have done has had people live to at least 80, when i look at families down south and in donegal at the same time period i see people dying at 35 etc we were obviously relying on different foods to you like bread etc and this proves this.

P. Breathnach

If you dig into this link you posted yourself in another thread, you can find more detailed data on population changes during the decade 1841-1851. It looks as if very many towns maintained their population levels, and larger centres actually increased in population (e.g. Galway City grew from about 28,000 to about 30,000) while the general pattern in rural areas was population fall.

It seems reasonably obvious to me that one part of the explanation was starving peasants heading into towns seeking charity, or employment, or the workhouse.

owenc

P. Breathnach wrote: »

If you dig into this link you posted yourself in another thread, you can find more detailed data on population changes during the decade 1841-1851. It looks as if very many towns maintained their population levels, and larger centres actually increased in population (e.g. Galway City grew from about 28,000 to about 30,000) while the general pattern in rural areas was population fall.

It seems reasonably obvious to me that one part of the explanation was starving peasants heading into towns seeking charity, or employment, or the workhouse.

thank you very much for them graphs they are very good i didn't know a such thing exsisted. Anyway by looking at that and comparing the north coast with the south coast it seems that your population drop was between 1841 and 1851 and ours was between 1851 and 1861 it must've taken time for it to spread. Where the famine occur? Also most areas near me only fell a small part and if i was really honest i think that is to do with immigration if we look at bannbrook (where i live) for example the population only drops about 300 people in the famine period and then starts to rise again after 1930 and then after 1970 it falls dramatically and i am thinking that this is to do with people immigrating and moving into the town in the industrialised era because this is certainly the only other reason. If we compare my area with somewhere in galway like that portnuma place the population drops dramatically from 5000 to 3000 in twenty
years now that is were we see the effects of famine we didn't have that big drop up here and that is the difference. I really do think the famine didn't effect us anywhere as badly as you lot and this proves that.

owenc

This is hard not to say so i'll bring it in. But i think another reason is the whole presbyterian thing. Presbyterians used to take farming VERY seriously i mean everyone in the family farmed including the girls it was the way money and food was made as far as i'm aware it was not like this in catholic households i don't think they had as much dedication as we did aswell as that presbyterians were very conservative so the farming had to be done it was beat into everyone and if you didn't farm you were punished.

P. Breathnach

The potato blight affected the whole of the island of Ireland, but the the impact of the blight was related to how dependent people were on the potato as their staple food.

In some parts of the island, including the north-east, people had a more varied diet, so while the loss of the potato crop had an effect, it was less severe than in those places where people depended more heavily on potatoes.

In towns and cities, many people made their living from industry or commerce, and used their incomes to purchase food. Townspeople, even the poorer ones, were less directly dependent on potato crops than their rural counterparts, as they bought rather than grew their own food. To the extent that their meagre incomes allowed, they could switch to other foodstuffs.

jonniebgood1

owenc wrote: »

This is hard not to say so i'll bring it in. But i think another reason is the whole presbyterian thing. Presbyterians used to take farming VERY seriously i mean everyone in the family farmed including the girls it was the way money and food was made as far as i'm aware it was not like this in catholic households i don't think they had as much dedication as we did aswell as that presbyterians were very conservative so the farming had to be done.

Are you proposing that taking farming 'VERY seriously' was a means to avoide potatoe blight? I dont see any sense in this point. There were large protestant communities in other areas of Ireland also that were not spared in the famine. You should substantiate the point with meaningful evidence/ source if you think it is true although I don't think there is any. There were reasons why the north-east was not the worst effected region in the famine but this is not one of them IMO.

owenc

jonniebgood1 wrote: »

Are you proposing that taking farming 'VERY seriously' was a means to avoide potatoe blight? I dont see any sense in this point. There were large protestant communities in other areas of Ireland also that were not spared in the famine. You should substantiate the point with meaningful evidence/ source if you think it is true although I don't think there is any. There were reasons why the north-east was not the worst effected region in the famine but this is not one of them IMO.

Well i think it is. In every presbyterian family EVERY single person farmed even the auld ones it was very important to presbyterians it is just in them i think. It is all to do with the conservatism its very hard to explain but basically it was beat into everyone and it had to be done if you aren't from a presbyterian family you won't understand its confusing. And the protestants down south are totally different to presbyterians up here they do not have conservative morals and they were not really interested in farming as they were rich etc. Presbyterians also had different methods of farming to others on the island which i believe also effected it.

P. Breathnach

owenc wrote: »

This is hard not to say so i'll bring it in. But i think another reason is the whole presbyterian thing. Presbyterians used to take farming VERY seriously i mean everyone in the family farmed including the girls it was the way money and food was made as far as i'm aware it was not like this in catholic households i don't think they had as much dedication as we did aswell as that presbyterians were very conservative so the farming had to be done it was beat into everyone and if you didn't farm you were punished.

I think that you are mistaken. Most farming in Ireland in the years leading up to the Great Famine was intensive, with people aiming for the maximum that the land could produce. You can still see potato ridges on mountainsides in many parts of the country, which reveal that people were engaged in tillage on land which nobody in the past 100 years would have taken a plough or a spade to.

Catholic tenant farmers generally had very small holdings and it was that, rather than indolence, that left them so heavily dependent on the potato and vulnerable to the loss of the crop. Huge numbers were true subsistence farmers, where everything they produced was for their own consumption, and there was no surplus to sell. They couldn't have worked harder, because all their land was exploited to the maximum.

The different survival prospects of various groups were strongly linked to the land tenure system.

jonniebgood1

owenc wrote: »

Well i think it is. In every presbyterian family EVERY single person farmed even the auld ones it was very important to presbyterians it is just in them i think. It is all to do with the conservatism its very hard to explain but basically it was beat into everyone and it had to be done if you aren't from a presbyterian family you won't understand its confusing.

If a whole family spent 24 hours a day tending their crops it would not have prevented the blight so I don't understand how you think this premise would make any difference? The reason people of all religons in the north-east did not suffer as badly was that they had better means (money) to buy alternative food from the merchants.

Do you seriously propose that potatoes grew for presbyterians (due to their hard work) whilst in a neighbouring field the crops of a catholic farmer were dying with blight?

CDfm

I did not mean for this to be a thread discussing anecdotes as the only way a thread like this can work is to produce links and sources.

And, there may have been different types of farming practised by "presbyterians" , like growing flax for linen, and we wont know unless someone verifies it.

It is true that some parts of Leinster were the same as Ulster and people were less affected by the famine in both.

So farming practices varied or did they ?

CDfm

P. Breathnach wrote: »

Catholic tenant farmers generally had very small holdings and it was that, rather than indolence, that left them so heavily dependent on the potato and vulnerable to the loss of the crop. Huge numbers were true subsistence farmers, where everything they produced was for their own consumption, and there was no surplus to sell. They couldn't have worked harder, because all their land was exploited to the maximum.

The different survival prospects of various groups were strongly linked to the land tenure system.

But what was the Ulster experience ???

R.Dub.Fusilier

owenc wrote: »

This is hard not to say so i'll bring it in. But i think another reason is the whole presbyterian thing. Presbyterians used to take farming VERY seriously i mean everyone in the family farmed including the girls it was the way money and food was made as far as i'm aware it was not like this in catholic households i don't think they had as much dedication as we did aswell as that presbyterians were very conservative so the farming had to be done it was beat into everyone and if you didn't farm you were punished.

another anti-Catholic sweeping statement from our loyalist poster. if any other poster was making as many anti Protestant or anti Jewish comments as you make anti catholic they would be banned.

MarchDub

P. Breathnach wrote: »

It looks as if very many towns maintained their population levels, and larger centres actually increased in population (e.g. Galway City grew from about 28,000 to about 30,000) while the general pattern in rural areas was population fall.

It seems reasonably obvious to me that one part of the explanation was starving peasants heading into towns seeking charity, or employment, or the workhouse.

Yes, that's exactly what happened. Letters and newspapers reports of the day refer to droves of starving people arriving in towns and cities. The Dublin tenements filled with people. There are many sources for this but one interesting source is Jane Francesca Wilde [Oscar's mother] who wrote about this in letters and even wrote a poem reportedly inspired by the sight of Famine victims arriving in Dublin. Here is part of it:

We are wretches, famished, scorned, human tools to build your pride,
But God will yet take vengeance for the souls for whom Christ died.
Now is your hour of pleasure - bask ye in the world's caress;
But our whitening bones against ye will rise as witnesses,

From the cabins and the ditches, in their charred, uncoffin'd masses,
For the Angel of the Trumpet will know them as he passes.
A ghastly, spectral army, before the great God we'll stand,
And arraign ye as our murderers, the spoilers of our land.

CDfm

A quick history of NI presbyterians

The Scotch-Irish descend from 200,000 Scottish Lowland Presbyterians who were encouraged by the English government to migrate to Ulster in the seventeenth century. Trying to strengthen its control of Ireland, England tried to establish a Protestant population in Ulster. Surrounded by native hostility, though, the group maintained its cultural distinction. The same economic pressures, including steadily increasing rents on their land, frequent crop failures, and the collapse of the linen trade, coupled with the belief in greater opportunity abroad, caused many Scotch-Irish to leave for the American colonies during the eighteenth century. It is estimated that nearly two million descendants of the Scotch-Irish eventually migrated to the American colonies.
IMMIGRATION

From 1763 to 1775, 55,000 Scotch-Irish from Ulster and 40,000 Scots arrived in America. Since Scotland was able to pursue its own colonies in the New World, several small colonies were established in the early seventeenth century in East Jersey and South Carolina. These colonies were primarily for Quakers and Presbyterians who were experiencing religious persecution by the then Episcopalian Church of Scotland. Although some Scots were transported to America as prisoners or criminals and were forced into labor as punishment, many voluntarily settled in America as traders or tobacco workers in Virginia. However, the political persecution of the Jacobite sympathizers, combined with economic hard times, forced many Scots to emigrate. Unlike the Scotch-Irish, who emigrated individually, the Scots emigrated in groups, which reflects their early organization in clans. They became a significant presence in the New World, settling in the original colonies with a particularly strong presence in the Southeast.
Many Scotch-Irish joined the mass migrations


Read more: Scottish and Scotch-Irish Americans - History, The scotch-irish, Immigration, Settlement patterns, Acculturation and assimilation http://www.everyculture.com/multi/Pa-Sp/Scottish-and-Scotch-Irish-Americans.html#ixzz1UIfZbcZJ

And the Great Famine was not the only one.

1740-41

1815

and 1879

owenc

That is my thoughts exactly I honestly believe that the decrease in numbers was due immigration and not famine the numbers were too small and if it was a famine it wouldVe shrank more.. Look at it this way if the famine ended in ni in the late 1800s why did the population continue to decrease? Obviously immigration. It has to be why do you think nearly everyone has cousins in pennsyvania etc

CDfm

ok - i dont know what the figures are but on a population table to arrive at the figure in 1841 to 1851 you would have to take births etc into account

So for a 10 % drop in population and if the population had been growing at say 10% every 10 years to get a 10% drop you would need a 20 % to die or emigrate as a result of the famine

It is generally accepted that 1 in 9 died during the famine .

So there was a double whammy affect.

I am going to look for regional figures for Ulster and I am sure I have seen some.

CDfm

Episode 1 · Fleeing The Famine

In the first episode of Death or Canada the audience gets an overview of what caused the Great Famine of 1847 in Ireland and through the personal experience of one family what happened to those forced to leave. It is also the story of the heroism of the Canadians who went to their rescue and the role played by the City of Toronto.
Episode 1 follows the story of the doomed Willis family, who in early 1847 were forced to depart their home in the southwest of Ireland and undertake a nightmare journey from Limerick, Ireland to Canada on the cargo ship the Jesse. Tragedy and disaster stalked them every step of the way. Forced to leave a sick child on the quayside in Ireland, they lose two more of their children during the voyage.
This is one of the untold stories of the Famine, as the Willis family was Protestant. Despite traditional perceptions, the Catholic population of Ireland were not the sole victims of the catastrophe. According to one of the expert contributors to the series, Professor Peter Gray of Queen’s University Belfast, “People think that Irish Catholics have the monopoly on famine suffering, when in fact it crossed the religious divide. 30 per cent of those who went to Canada were Protestant.”


http://tilefilms.ie/productions/death-or-canada/episodes/

The idea that Catholics were the only famine victims appears to be erronious.

Here is another snippet from the GAA Board

President Mary McAleese has described the story of Toronto's reception of more than 38,000 Irish immigrants in 1847 as an important glimpse into the forgotten story of Protestants who suffered in the Famine and a challenge to prosperous countries today.

The President yesterday opened Ireland Park, a memorial to the 1,100 people who died during the arrival of Irish immigrants at a time when Toronto's population was only 20,000.

"You had a tiny city, a small city, overwhelmed in a very short period of time, utterly and absolutely overwhelmed and their response was the most remarkable, loving Christian response you could have imagined. They opened their hearts, they sacrificed themselves, they helped many of those 38,000 to recover from illness, to go on to live good lives," she said.

Earlier, Mrs McAleese attended an open-air concert at St Paul's Catholic School, in a disadvantaged district once dominated by Irish immigrants and now home to children from more than 40 countries. The children, few of whom had any Irish roots, played the tin whistle and fiddle and a steel band played Amhrán na bFhiann.

The President went on to St James' Cemetery, where more than 300 Irish Protestant Famine victims are buried in a common grave. The register records their names and ages, including Ann Smith (20), Elizabeth Ward (16), William Graham (4) and Jane Henry (5 months).

The link also goes thru issues such as the cottage industries and migration between Ulster and other counties.

http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=3351.15

It strikes me that we are a long way from the truth.

And there is more

Check out this link and there is a map which gives a lot of detail.

If you scroll down you will see a table you will see proper estimates for the decrease in population including Ulster counties .

http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~irlkik/ihm/ire1841.htm

Sources: 1831, 1841 and 1851 Census of Ireland
Notes:
"Forecasted 1851 Census" = extrapolated 1851 population based on population growth from 1831 to 1841.
"Estimated Population Decrease due to Famine & Emigration" = difference between forecasted and actual 1851 census.
(estimated decrease due to emigration and starvation-related disease and death)
It is almost certain that, owing to geographical difficulties and the unwillingness of the people to be registered, the census of 1841 gave a total smaller than the population in fact was. Officers engaged in relief work put the population as much as 25 percent higher. Perhaps similar comments may be applied to the 1851 census.
The Census Commissioners in 1851 stated that, had the Famine not occurred, the population would have been 9,018,799. The commissioners calculated that, as a percentage of the 1841 population, mortality from 1845 to 1850 was as follows:
1845 : 6.4%
1846 : 9.1%
1847 : 18.5%
1848 : 15.4%
1849 : 17.9%
1850 : 12.2%

The table is broken down by county and Northern Ireland did not escape the famine.

owenc

CDfm wrote: »

The idea that Catholics were the only famine victims appears to be erronious.

Here is another snippet from the GAA Board



The link also goes thru issues such as the cottage industries and migration between Ulster and other counties.

http://gaaboard.com/board/index.php?topic=3351.15

It strikes me that we are a long way from the truth.

And there is more

Check out this link and there is a map which gives a lot of detail.

If you scroll down you will see a table you will see proper estimates for the decrease in population including Ulster counties .

http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~irlkik/ihm/ire1841.htm



The table is broken down by county and Northern Ireland did not escape the famine.

But ni was not as bad as yous and thats obvious on the table.
Interesting it seems that the areas that received the most deaths were in the far south coast of this island and it seems that they were the areas that had the poorest population due to poor trading etc. So that must've had an effect on it. Also the protestants you talk about were anglican they are not the same as us i'm sick and tired of this they are english we are scottish and we would've had a totally different way of life, farming, accents etc its totally different. Also to the fact that they absorbed into irish society so they would've had the same farming methods as yous, most of them would've been too stuck up to farm anyway.

Fratton Fred

A couple of my own thoughts. Not sure how they link in though.

I've always (rightly or wrongly) associated Presbytarian farmers as farmers of sheep.

I've always thought calling it The famine was wrong. It was a potato famine as all other crops were unaffected, unlike the famine 100 years earlier. Therefore, if people had money they could buy food, although this would have been at greatly inflated prices thanks to the middlemen and speculators exploiting the situation.

Would it be fair to say that in NI, being more industrialised (if indeed it was at the time) people could get jobs and feed their families?

Another thought, if there were hundreds of people coming to the cities looking for work, this would have resulted in a decrease in wages and opportunities for people, so would it not have made sense for even those unaffected by the famine to emigrate and seek their fortune elsewhere?

dubhthach

Concentration of industry would definetly have helped, as other posters have pointed out it wasn't due to collaspe of all crops (like the Famine of the 1740's) but the destruction of the potato crop. Obviously those in society most dependent on potatoes were heaviest affected. Regarding percentage working in industrial jobs I found the following, comparing 1831 and 1851





Obviously if you are working in manufacturing you aren't dependent on subsistence farming and earn money to buy food. Thus I wouldn't be surprised due to better economical conditions that diets were more varied.

I came aross the following tidbit

Belfast was Ireland's main industrial centre and attracted many people from the adjacent counties and from Ulster in general. Between 1841 and 1851 the population of Belfast increased by one third to c.103,000. The urban population suffered severely from fever with over 2,500 dying during the cholera epidemic of 1847/1848

One of outcomes of the Famine of course was a mass surge in the urban poor population of Dublin. this resulted in the urban middle classes moving out to new townships (Rathmines/Pembroke etc.) and the former Georgian mansions of the 18th century elite becoming mass tenements.

CDfm

A good point from OwenC about the Scottish Presbyterians not being English .

I went looking for some local histories to get a feel for the area and found a website that hit a few spots. Now it is from a geneology website but it seems well researched. I have edited off some political issues as a bit superfluos to this discussion.

http://www.smccartan.utvinternet.com/INDEX.HTML

http://www.smccartan.utvinternet.com/lifestyle.htm..htm

In 1876 only 804 owners held almost 80% of Ulster. There were 190,973 occupiers of land of whom only 18 % had leases

Changes that occurred in the Lifestyle of Ulster's Rural population
between 1820 and 1914
by Sean McCartan
Introduction
Lifestyle is 'a person's way of life'. In modern times wage earners can usually determine their own lifestyle. Through living in comfortable accommodation, buying nice clothes, going on holidays and driving a modern car, one could be considered to have a good lifestyle. Obviously income is the main factor in all of these. This was not the case in early nineteenth century Ulster. At that time 90% of the population lived on the land. Landlordism, religion, famine, market forces or politics determined lifestyle for everyone.
The period 1820-1914 was a time of deprivation and then economic growth in rural Ulster. Firstly, poor government structure, a weak economy, unjust laws, and the failure of the potato crop caused much hardship. This was followed by a major upturn in the economy. To explore the lifestyles of these times, I have examined how the small farmer, the farm labourer and the cottier existed. Furthermore, to uncover evidence, I decided to examine and discuss three questions: 'What factors influenced lifestyle in rural Ulster 1820-1914'; 'What were conditions really like in rural Ulster 1820-1914'; followed by 'How did the population cope in rural Ulster 1820-1914'? It is hoped this procedure will give an insight into lifestyle in rural Ulster during a crucial period.

The economy of Ulster and some underlying issues

What factors influenced lifestyle in rural Ulster 1820 - 1914?
In short, landlords monopolised the political and economic power of Ulster since the plantations and colonisation of the seventeenth century. Later, they safeguarded their position by voting for the Act of Union in 1801. This measure ensured their dominance for another 50 years. During this time the rural population had a inadequate incomes, yet everyone no matter what their religious persuasion were compelled to pay tithes to the Church of Ireland. Such impositions had a devastating effect on rural lifestyle. Also despite harvest failures in 1835 and 1837, tenants had to continue paying exorbitant rents with no security of tenure. By 1842 over £6 million from rents left Ireland to absentee landlords. Non payment in many cases meant eviction. No economy could have survived such restrictions.
Down through the years war seems to have helped the Ulster economy and peacetime brought recession. This was the case after Waterloo (1815), when prices for farm produce plummeted. This caused great concern in the farming community. Not only that, but much civil unrest had spilled over from the 1798 rebellion. More tension ensued when in 1823 Daniel O'Connell formed the Catholic Association. This was the first time Catholics became properly organised and commenced agitating for reforms. Catholic Emancipation (1829) was the outcome. Around the same time the Orange Order increased its membership rapidly and had around 20,000 yeomen in its ranks. Inflammatory speeches by Protestant clergymen led to many confrontations. The most serious were during Orange demonstrations in Garvagh (1813), Maghera (1823), and Augher (1828). Ulster was on its knees. Life was one of hardship and hopelessness for most. People felt safer in their own neighbourhoods. An acceptable lifestyle was non-existent.
Then in 1830 the linen industry collapsed. For generations, small farmers, labourers and cottiers supplemented their incomes by working looms from home. The raw material was supplied to homes and weavers got paid for the finished product. However mechanisation put a sudden end to this income. In short, new factory looms were invented. Each loom could do the work of 100 hand weavers. The result was tens of thousands in rural Ulster lost a valuable source of income. Any weavers that lived on uneconomical farms of 12 acres, or less, suffered most.
As we have seen, the rural population of Ulster was already in the depths of despair in 1845 when the famine struck. By tradition families depended greatly on the potato for food. Not only was the complete failure of the potato crop suffered, but epidemics of cholera, dysentery, typhus and smallpox appeared. Survival during these dark days received more emphasis than lifestyle.
With a constant increase in rents during and after the famine, organised land agitation commenced. In 1876 only 804 owners held almost 80% of Ulster. There were 190,973 occupiers of land of whom only 18 % had leases. Evidently evictions increased. Most notable of these were the Derryveagh evictions when in 1861 John George Adair evicted 244 people from 46 households in three days. Rural Ulster was certainly in deep distress

The linen industry and mechanisation etc

Between 1830 and 1865 the flax spinning mill began to dominate the textile industry throughout Ulster. Comber, Seapatrick, Darkley and Bessbrook became major centres of employment. In 1850 there were only 50 power looms in Ulster. These figures rose swiftly: by 1862 there were 4108; and by 1871 there were14074. Then the steam engine began to occupy a prominent position in Ulster's industry. Previously the linen industry was confined mainly to the banks of the rivers Callan, Bann, Lagan and Sixmilewater, where there was constant water supplies to drive wheels. The invention of the steam engine opened new opportunities for the mill owners. Being no longer dependent solely on water they often relocated to the larger towns and Belfast. This increased the trend of urbanisation.

The Local Government and Relief Structure

What were conditions really like in rural Ulster 1820 - 1914?
As previously mentioned, Ulster in the eighteenth century had a very poor government infrastructure. In reality there were few preventative measures or plans to cope with emergencies. When disaster struck the folly of this policy became apparent.
In 1838 the English Poor Law system was introduced to Ireland. The entire country was divided into Unions. Each of these areas was under the control of Poor Law Guardians . Each Union had a workhouse. These institutions were present in Ulster when the famine began. On entry families were separated and work was hard. Formerly avoided, the famine drove many to them as a last resort. This led to massive overcrowding. Then in 1847 the government openly admitted that this policy had failed and relief in future would be through the free distribution of soup. The cost of this was to be borne by the ratepayer.
Previously, in 1846 the Temporary Fever Act authorised Commissioners of Health to encourage Poor Law Boards of Guardians to set up temporary hospitals. For some unknown reason this was allowed to lapse. Instead fever patients were treated in workhouses. Shortly afterwards the government made a further series of decisions which greatly increased the suffering. The Poor Law Act was amended to exclude from relief cottiers and their families who rented or owned one quarter of an acre or more. Many thousands had no choice but to abandon their holdings, which were often tossed by their landlord. This is one reason why cottiers and labourers suffered most

Workhouses and famine relief - what exactly is known ?

Surprisingly 1847 provided a good grain harvest. Unbelievably, this crop was mostly exported to England. Despite starvation it became government policy not to purchase grain for relief purposes. Not only this but the government stopped the supply of soup to most districts in September 1847. These decisions meant relief was available only through the workhouse. These actions cost hundreds if not thousands of lives in rural Ulster. See figure 1 for percentage decline in Ulster Counties between 1841 and 1851.

Population and Urbanisation



.

PERCENTAGE DECLINE
ULSTER COUNTIES 1841-1851
Antrim 11% Armagh 16% Cavan 28% Derry 14% Donegal 14% Down 11% Fermanagh 26% Monaghan 29% Tyrone 18% CENSUS NUMBERS
GALBOLLY Co. Antrim
1841 58 1851 57 1861 41 1871 36 1881 19 1891 18 1901 24 1911 25 From around 1850 urbanisation commenced in Ulster. See figure 2 for urbanisation's effect on the small hamlet of Galbolly on the Antrim Coast. The rural population declined steadily whereas Belfast and Derry saw massive increases. With this decrease in urban population, many farms became bigger and more economical. This led to prosperity for some. With the increased income for most small farmers, local suppliers were encouraged to open shops. Seeds, flour, paraffin oil, tea and sugar could be bought locally for the first time. With the farmer's income being seasonal, shopkeepers gave credit for supplies during lean times and received payment at harvest time or on fair days - see appendix 1. Railways enabled livestock and heavy goods to be easily transported. Thus a farming industry developed and the small farmer played an increasingly important role in society. All this stressed the importance of farm size for viability. Farms were no longer divided amongst the family but usually left to one son. Other members of the family were therefore compelled to emigrate leading to a further decline in the rural population. The lifestyle of the small farmer improved immensely in the last forty years of the nineteenth century.

Health & Medical Care

Late nineteenth century Ulster was an unhealthy place to live, despite the rise in living standards. Diseases such as typhus, smallpox, typhoid and diphtheria paid regular visits. Archbishop Crolly of Armagh died a victim of typhus in 1849. In 1851 an Irish dispensary service was established under the control of the Poor Law Commission. It was available to all who could not afford medical attention. There were 180 dispensaries in Ulster, each with one or more medical officers. A new class within the medical profession emerged, the general practitioner. Nevertheless there were never sufficient sick beds. Sharing of beds was practised in workhouses which helped spread these diseases. Inevitably thousands perished unnecessarily due to ignorance and neglect.
As one might expect, poor conditions and tenant grievances led to an increase in crime. Shortly after the famine there were over 50 cases of agrarian outrage in the barony of Dufferyn alone. These attacks were also prevalent throughout the rest of Ulster. Landlord gamekeepers were often busy keeping hungry poachers out. Near Seaforde, Rev W.B. Forde's gamekeeper, a Mr Noctor, was murdered while protecting game. Conditions were hopelessly bad for most of rural Ulster, although the small farmer could see a decent future ahead.

Though there is a lack of seperate history books for Ulster there are other sources

How did the population cope in rural Ulster 1820 - 1914?
As we have seen, farmers, cottiers and farm labourers had no control over their destiny before the famine. With no income most were severely restricted in a hopeless situation. Fortunately, thanks to the works of three Ulster writers, we can see how people coped in rural Ulster. William Carleton, Seamus MacManus and Patrick MacGill produced autobiographical works that give a realistic insight into their everyday life.
William Carleton (1794-1869) was a native of the Clogher Valley, Co. Tyrone. He spent his first 24 years there and then made his fame as a writer in Dublin. In his works the stories were based on real people who were his contemporaries in Co. Tyrone. He was the youngest of fourteen children of a flax dresser and small farmer. His parents spoke Irish and English equally well. In 1830 he produced a selection of essays entitled 'Traits and Stories of the Irish Peasantry'. In 1834 he brought out 'Tales of Ireland' which depicted his days at 'hedge' schools. In 1847 he made his only return to the Clogher Valley. Many of the locals recognised themselves in his works.
Seamus MacManus (1869-1960) was born in Mountcharles, Co. Donegal, the son of a small farmer. He qualified as a 'pupil' teacher at the age of sixteen. He taught at Enniskillen Model School and Kinawley National School, Co. Fermanagh and became principal at Glencoe about 1888. He resigned his teaching post in 1898 to seek his fortune in America. There he found almost overnight success with leading magazines of the day. His masterpiece 'The Rocky Road to Dublin' is autobiographical and gives a broad insight into life in both counties.

Patrick MacGill (1889-1951) was a native of Glenties, Co. Donegal and was the first of eleven children. After just three years schooling and at the age of twelve he set out for the hiring fair in Strabane. His book 'Children of the Dead End' describes life in Donegal, his life 'hired out' and his encounters as a migrant worker in Scotland.
Their descriptions are of a tough hard life for themselves and neighbours. All three reckoned the farm labourers got a raw deal with rough conditions and poor pay. See figure 3.
Average wage for farm labourers
in shillings
Year Average weekly wage in shillings 1850 5. 1854 6. 1860 7. 1866 8. 1878 8.6 1881 9. 1893 10.6 1896 10.8 1899 11.3 1902 11.5 From them we learn also about a way of life, now forgotten. These works describe characters, disputes, customs, sport and pastimes in rural Ulster. Survival and sanity needed courage and humour. Nevertheless their works recall the ancient culture of music, dancing and storytelling. Often the 'half' door would be taken off and laid on the clay floor. Locals would gather for hoolies with pipers and fiddlers displaying their skills. Through these people many of the beautiful ancient Irish musical laments, such as those of O'Hampsey and O'Carolan have survived.

And along with some good distilleries there was competition for temperence.

During this time people could not afford to buy spirits and relied mainly on poteen. This drink was very potent and used by many in rural Ulster for medicinal purposes and also to 'drown their sorrows'. Commencing in 1840, Father Theobald Matthew held massive crusades throughout Ulster to curb the increasing addiction to alcohol. Every parish in Ulster was visited: Warrenpoint in 1840; Larne in 1842; and Castlewellan in 1844. Through these many joined his Pioneer Total Abstinence Association. His campaign met with great success and led to an improved lifestyle for many.
Church going increased immediately after the famine. Large subscriptions from Irish immigrants were sent from America to build churches and church halls. Clergy formed societies to help the less fortunate and organised social events. This encouraged communities to work together with numerous beneficial effects.

Ulster led the way in education

Schooling provided help in creating conditions whereby children could plan a better lifestyle. In 1811 the Kildare Place Society was founded to organise non-denominational schools. This in fact entrusted the education of the poor to agencies of the Established Church. By 1830 the society was instructing some 137,639 pupils in 1,621 schools throughout Ireland and was in receipt of an annual grant of £30,000. There was much evidence of proselytising and an uneven spread of funds. See appendix 2 Areas of poor housing had high illiteracy rates. Due to this Catholics preferred to attend 'hedge' or 'pay' schools. Catholic bishops eventually organised education on a parochial basis with the help of religious orders. Christian Brothers (1820), Loretto nuns (1822), Mercy nuns (1831) and others helped found schools in many Ulster towns. However, this was found to be inadequate. Eventually the bishops negotiated with the government, which led to the formation of the National School System. These new schools were originally to be inter-denominational which led to much controversy. Disputes ensued between the churches for control in various schools. Eventually the National Schools were inter-denominational only in name. At this stage almost half of Ireland's school population was in Ulster. This played a vital role in the development of the Ulster economy. Literacy and communication skills were an important ingredient for industrial expansion.

Now Sean McCartan lists his sources so anyone with an interest on Ulster History will have a lot of reading material .

CDfm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

A couple of my own thoughts. Not sure how they link in though.

I've always (rightly or wrongly) associated Presbytarian farmers as farmers of sheep.

You make a few good points and you should look them up.

Ulster history is normally not dealt with as a seperate topic and there is very little to go on but speculation unless you look it up.

The most famous shepherd who worked in that area was St Patrick -so the locals had been rearing sheep for at least 1400 years.

I've always thought calling it The famine was wrong. It was a potato famine as all other crops were unaffected, unlike the famine 100 years earlier. Therefore, if people had money they could buy food, although this would have been at greatly inflated prices thanks to the middlemen and speculators exploiting the situation.

'Cept the crops got sold to pay rent .......................

Would it be fair to say that in NI, being more industrialised (if indeed it was at the time) people could get jobs and feed their families?

No.

Another thought, if there were hundreds of people coming to the cities looking for work, this would have resulted in a decrease in wages and opportunities for people, so would it not have made sense for even those unaffected by the famine to emigrate and seek their fortune elsewhere?

It was not like the modern labour market - pop in your CV- what you are talking about is unskilled labour.

owenc

CDfm wrote: »

You make a few good points and you should look them up.

Ulster history is normally not dealt with as a seperate topic and there is very little to go on but speculation unless you look it up.

The most famous shepherd who worked in that area was St Patrick -so the locals had been rearing sheep for at least 1400 years.



'Cept the crops got sold to pay rent .......................




No.



It was not like the modern labour market - pop in your CV- what you are talking about is unskilled labour.

No he is correct alot of people immigrated. I think 200,000 Presbyterians left northern ireland for north america in the 1700-1800s. That many left that ni that nearly everyone in ni has at least some ancestors in america. Mostly Pennsylvania. Thats why i believe there was such a large decline in population, not due to famine. I think the main reason for leaving was the penal laws and the promise of more land for cheaper money. As for farming no actually presbyterians do not farm sheep they farm cows i see far more cows around here and elsewhere than sheep sorry. :P Cows bring in more money anyway.

owenc

CDfm wrote: »

A good point from OwenC about the Scottish Presbyterians not being English .

I went looking for some local histories to get a feel for the area and found a website that hit a few spots. Now it is from a geneology website but it seems well researched. I have edited off some political issues as a bit superfluos to this discussion.

http://www.smccartan.utvinternet.com/INDEX.HTML

http://www.smccartan.utvinternet.com/lifestyle.htm..htm

In 1876 only 804 owners held almost 80% of Ulster. There were 190,973 occupiers of land of whom only 18 % had leases



The economy of Ulster and some underlying issues





The linen industry and mechanisation etc





The Local Government and Relief Structure




Workhouses and famine relief - what exactly is known ?







Population and Urbanisation



.

Health & Medical Care





Though there is a lack of seperate history books for Ulster there are other sources



And along with some good distilleries there was competition for temperence.




Ulster led the way in education



Now Sean McCartan lists his sources so anyone with an interest on Ulster History will have a lot of reading material .

Some very interesting points there especially the working age it was normal to leave at 12 most of my g grandparents and grandparents did so they worked in the forestry industry and the local farms. As for the education system well its still se-grated and the exact same way too protestants get state education and catholics get paid by the church. The workhouses are still about they all seem to have the same design i have been in limavady and coleraine workhouses they are very old fashioned,and they are both hospitals now although the coleraine one is in despair now. Here is some pictures:

Limavady : http://www.flickr.com/photos/steeveegee/2457270621/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/steeveegee/2457249249/

Coleraine:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/katie_russell/5281091248/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/matthew878/5388398147/

Very rotten.

CDfm

Fratton Fred wrote: »

I've always (rightly or wrongly) associated Presbytarian farmers as farmers of sheep.

owenc wrote: »

As for farming no actually presbyterians do not farm sheep they farm cows i see far more cows around here and elsewhere than sheep sorry. :P Cows bring in more money anyway.

owenc wrote: »

Also the protestants you talk about were anglican they are not the same as us i'm sick and tired of this they are english we are scottish and we would've had a totally different way of life, farming, accents etc its totally different. .

Definately Scottish.

Fred, thats you told. Can I ask if you are English

owenc

CDfm wrote: »

Definately Scottish.

Fred, thats you told. Can I ask if you are English

Hes church of ireland i think. So english ancestry yes. Funny thing is i thought you were protestant as-well. :P

Monty Burnz

owenc wrote: »

Well i think it is. In every presbyterian family EVERY single person farmed even the auld ones it was very important to presbyterians it is just in them i think. It is all to do with the conservatism its very hard to explain but basically it was beat into everyone and it had to be done if you aren't from a presbyterian family you won't understand its confusing. And the protestants down south are totally different to presbyterians up here they do not have conservative morals and they were not really interested in farming as they were rich etc. Presbyterians also had different methods of farming to others on the island which i believe also effected it.

I like the way that this suggests that the Irish Catholic peasant types of 200 years ago were very liberal and progressive and trendy compared to the Prebysterians. And of course they didn't take the farming very seriously at all, it was just a hobby really - most of their time was spent on smoking pot and discussing LGBT rights...

owenc

Monty Burnz wrote: »

I like the way that this suggests that the Irish Catholic peasant types of 200 years ago were very liberal and progressive and trendy compared to the Prebysterians. And of course they didn't take the farming very seriously at all, it was just a hobby really - most of their time was spent on smoking pot and discussing LGBT rights...

No i don't think that i just know that catholics had different farming methods. Protestants farmed with chickens, cows etc and catholics were more in potatoes as already stated but whatever we were doing great a minute ago.

Monty Burnz

owenc wrote: »

No i don't think that i just know that catholics had different farming methods. Protestants farmed with chickens, cows etc and catholics were more in potatoes as already stated but whatever we were doing great a minute ago.

Do you have good information on the farming methods of the Prebysterians versus those of the older Irish folks? If you are right about the chickens etc., perhaps in those days, as in Africa today, only the wealthier people could afford animals?

owenc

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Do you have good information on the farming methods of the Prebysterians versus those of the older Irish folks? If you are right about the chickens etc., perhaps in those days, as in Africa today, only the wealthier people could afford animals?

No i do not know much about farming because i'm not a farmer.. i'm just basing it on what my ancestors did and local observations and i'm told that on my dads side they farmed chickens and cows and they are the presbyterians. I do know that catholics farmed potatoes but i'm not sure at all really because i'm not a farmer.