Denver Broncos Thread

poldebruin

spiralism wrote: »

Have you seen "Everything in between", just out of interest?

@ 2:11ish I thought he was going to miss the tyre when he threw that (ugly) pass through it! I wonder how many takes were required?

Also, his demenour in the huddle seems a little manic - I know he's only 17 in the clips, but it's not something I can imagine Joe Montana doing. It's more the type of thing you would expect from a linebacker.

Talking of Joe Montana:

....His unflappable poise in the clutch frustrated opposing players and coaches, while amazing his legions of fans.

A humorous example of his poise under pressure occurred in Super Bowl XXIII against the Cincinnati Bengals. Trailing 16-13 with 3:20 left in the game, the 49ers had the ball on their own eight-yard line.

"Some of the guys seemed more than normally tense," Montana recalled, "especially Harris Barton, a great offensive tackle who has a tendency to get nervous." As usual, Montana was just focusing on the situation, how far they had to go and how much time was left. Just then he happened to spot the late actor John Candy in the stands. "Look" he said, 'isn't that John Candy." It was hardly what his teammates expected to hear in the huddle with the Super Bowl on the line. But it definitely broke the tension. "Everybody kind of smiled, and even Harris relaxed, and then we all concentrated on the job we had to do.

Jolly Red Giant

kmart6 wrote: »

Just confirmed

Adam Schefter wrote:

Now official: Oakland Raiders are hiring former Broncos defensive coordinator Dennis Allen as head coach. Deal done.

Sucks because the Broncos need some continuity at DC. Hopefully Fox can get Jack del Rio to replace him.

kmart6

Well there ya go...

Adam Schefter wrote:

Denver hired Jack Del Rio as its defensive coordinator.

spiralism

kmart6 wrote: »

Well there ya go...

Hoped for as much. ****ing. Delighted.

He's one of the best in the business regarding defences, him and Fox and another draft and this defence hopefully will take another huge leap. It's decent now, with Del Rio in charge it could be dominant.

VERY impressive move by Elway and co. to start the offseason and a show of intent imo. This team is on the rise and we mean business.

Jolly Red Giant

I am thrilled to bits with the hiring of Del Rio as Denver's DC.

The Broncos defence will have some continuity - Fox brings in a DC he knows well - and despite being a medicore HC, Del Rio has proven himself to be a damned good DC. Denver will be running an old-style in-your-face smash-mouth defence next year and if they can add a DT, a MLB and a S in the off-season then the Broncos defence could do some serious damage next year.

And I agree with spiralism - Elway has played things very smart since he took over the running of the Broncos - he is emphasising an experienced, methodical approach to rebuilding the Broncos - hiring an experienced HC with a solid track record and now a good DC who will work well with Fox - and without any of the taking of chances like with McDaniels.

Syferus

I'm yet to be convinced by Elway. He still seems very raw in the job, honestly.

Trading Lloyd for next to nothing rather than at least keeping him to the end of his contract smacked of him setting up Tebow to fail and his responses on that front have always come across as somewhat stroppy, as if he's trying to design a parachute excuse if it all goes wrong. That's not how you want any general manager (or whatever label you want to put on his job) to act about his players.

Jolly Red Giant

Syferus wrote: »

I'm yet to be convinced by Elway. He still seems very raw in the job, honestly.

Trading Lloyd for next to nothing rather than at least keeping him to the end of his contract smacked of him setting up Tebow to fail and his responses on that front have always come across as somewhat stroppy, as if he's trying to design a parachute excuse if it all goes wrong. That's not how you want any general manager to act about his players.

I disagree - Lloyd was all about 'me, me, me' and what stats he would have at the end of the season. Once Orton was benched Lloyd was a distraction and a disruption in the locker-room - he had to go.

As for Tebow - Elway didn't draft him and he is not beholding to him in any way. Tebow deserves a shot at starting next season because of what he achieved this season. But Elway has only guaranteed that he is starting QB going into training camp. Unless Tebow can become at least competent in passing from the pocket, improve his footwork and learn to read defences then he will not hold his job. The reality is that is is little available at QB in free-agency and - outside of Luck and Griffin - in the draft. So Tebow could well play next season. But Elway will cut and run if Tebow doesn't produce and point the finger at McDaniels.

Fox has a five year contract and the rebuilding programme for the Broncos is a five year programme. So far Elway has done things well. He reorganised the broncos backroom. He hired an experienced and consistantly good HC. He picked the right player at No.2 in the draft. He didn't over reach in free agency. When players didn't deliver or caused problems he supported them being benched (Orton) or traded (Lloyd). When necessary he brought in the top DC candidate in the league. He also replace a S&C coach that had been unable to prevent an end of season fade for the umpteenth time and replaced him with one of the leading candidates in modern conditioning.

If the Broncos can produce two or three starters from the upcoming draft and pick up two or three good free agents, then it will have been another good off-season. And as regards Tebow - we will find out next season if he can get the job done - and if not Elway will do what's needed to be done.

Syferus

Jolly Red Giant wrote: »

I disagree - Lloyd was all about 'me, me, me' and what stats he would have at the end of the season. Once Orton was benched Lloyd was a distraction and a disruption in the locker-room - he had to go.

As for Tebow - Elway didn't draft him and he is not beholding to him in any way. Tebow deserves a shot at starting next season because of what he achieved this season. But Elway has only guaranteed that he is starting QB going into training camp. Unless Tebow can become at least competent in passing from the pocket, improve his footwork and learn to read defences then he will not hold his job. The reality is that is is little available at QB in free-agency and - outside of Luck and Griffin - in the draft. So Tebow could well play next season. But Elway will cut and run if Tebow doesn't produce and point the finger at McDaniels.

Fox has a five year contract and the rebuilding programme for the Broncos is a five year programme. So far Elway has done things well. He reorganised the broncos backroom. He hired an experienced and consistantly good HC. He picked the right player at No.2 in the draft. He didn't over reach in free agency. When players didn't deliver or caused problems he supported them being benched (Orton) or traded (Lloyd). When necessary he brought in the top DC candidate in the league. He also replace a S&C coach that had been unable to prevent an end of season fade for the umpteenth time and replaced him with one of the leading candidates in modern conditioning.

If the Broncos can produce two or three starters from the upcoming draft and pick up two or three good free agents, then it will have been another good off-season. And as regards Tebow - we will find out next season if he can get the job done - and if not Elway will do what's needed to be done.

Most of that can be very clearly viewed as politics on Elways' part, which is not the sort of behaviour a general manger/top suit/whatever label the Broncos want to put on him should be engaging in.

How much of the choices that you've mentioned have been Xanders' or Ellis', though? Elway is a great fireguard for personnel decisions, and would never have got the position if he wasn't John Elway and the team wasn't the Broncos. I wouldn't rush to christen him anything at the moment.

Chucky the tree

Syferus wrote: »

I'm yet to be convinced by Elway. He still seems very raw in the job, honestly.

Trading Lloyd for next to nothing rather than at least keeping him to the end of his contract smacked of him setting up Tebow to fail and his responses on that front have always come across as somewhat stroppy, as if he's trying to design a parachute excuse if it all goes wrong. That's not how you want any general manager (or whatever label you want to put on his job) to act about his players.

His job is to improve the Broncos however he can, not pamper to some below average QB just because he is media popular.

Jolly Red Giant

Syferus wrote: »

Most of that can be very clearly viewed as politics on Elways' part, which is not the sort of behaviour a general manger/top suit/whatever label the Broncos want to put on him should be engaging in.

Elway didn't draft Tebow - the decision was all McDaniels. It has nothing to do with politics and everything to do with having a QB who can win games. Tebow has deserved his shot - but he has a lot of improving to do if he wants to stay as starter.

Syferus wrote: »

How much of the choices that you've mentioned have been Xanders' or Ellis', though? Elway is a great fireguard for personnel decisions, and would never have got the position if he wasn't John Elway and the team wasn't the Broncos. I wouldn't rush to christen him anything at the moment.

Ellis has little or no involvement in the football side of operations. The decisions are made by Elway, Xanders and Fox - and the buck stops with Elway. No one is christening him with anything - he has a difficult job and he knows it. But if you know anything about Elway you will know he will make tough decisions if they have to be made. As a person I don't actually like Elway, but he was a hell of a QB and - so far - he has done a decent job running football operations.

matthew8

Elway comes across as a very hard to like individual imo.

davyjose

poldebruin wrote: »

@ 2:11ish I thought he was going to miss the tyre when he threw that (ugly) pass through it! I wonder how many takes were required?

Also, his demenour in the huddle seems a little manic - I know he's only 17 in the clips, but it's not something I can imagine Joe Montana doing. It's more the type of thing you would expect from a linebacker.

Talking of Joe Montana:

....His unflappable poise in the clutch frustrated opposing players and coaches, while amazing his legions of fans.

A humorous example of his poise under pressure occurred in Super Bowl XXIII against the Cincinnati Bengals. Trailing 16-13 with 3:20 left in the game, the 49ers had the ball on their own eight-yard line.

"Some of the guys seemed more than normally tense," Montana recalled, "especially Harris Barton, a great offensive tackle who has a tendency to get nervous." As usual, Montana was just focusing on the situation, how far they had to go and how much time was left. Just then he happened to spot the late actor John Candy in the stands. "Look" he said, 'isn't that John Candy." It was hardly what his teammates expected to hear in the huddle with the Super Bowl on the line. But it definitely broke the tension. "Everybody kind of smiled, and even Harris relaxed, and then we all concentrated on the job we had to do.

Now that's clutch. Legend!

spiralism

Syferus wrote: »

I'm yet to be convinced by Elway. He still seems very raw in the job, honestly.

Trading Lloyd for next to nothing rather than at least keeping him to the end of his contract smacked of him setting up Tebow to fail and his responses on that front have always come across as somewhat stroppy, as if he's trying to design a parachute excuse if it all goes wrong. That's not how you want any general manager (or whatever label you want to put on his job) to act about his players.

Thing is, Elway is very green. Even still, he's largely been right in his decision making since taking the job, the worst he's done is make a couple of divisive moves like the lloyd trade, which was inevitable from the moment we switched to Tebow. Lloyd didn't want to be in Tebow's passing offence as he wanted to get a bumper new contract. On top of that he's stated since that he wants to be on the same sideline as McDaniels if at all possible because he always got the best out of him in his offence. Off topic but look for Lloyd to the Pats this offseason.

Apart from the Lloyd trade, all Elway's supposedly done wrong since is not committing overly to Tebow, but that's his job. I think Elway well believes he has it in him though but it's his duty to look at this from a level headed perspective, it's not like he dislikes him or anything. On the other hand, Elway's Front Office has so far hired Fox, drafted Miller and Franklin, (Carter too but he's no sure thing, the rest are complete unknowns), picked up McGahee in Free Agency, overseen the switch to Tebow and hired Jack Del Rio to take the defence to another level after ending the year with a playoff win. Not bad when you look at it. Compare that to the McDaniels regime where almost every decision without fail was at least divisive and often remarkably stupid.

Morrisseeee

To switch to Tebow (a QB who can't throw & is useless, according to some) when your team was at 1-4 should have been the 'management decision' of the year, ie. they end up winning the div and a playoff game, and I bet the balance sheet isn't looking too bad either. Of course you could debate the 'what if's', ie. what if he was a total failure, then you are going for a No. 1 draft pick, etc, but facts are facts, it turned out to be a roaring success.

As far as the draft goes, I think we need to turn our O line into a brick wall, to give Timmy all the time he needs to develop. I'm hopefull anyways, if next year is as half as exciting and we get to the playoffs again, I'll be a happy bucking bronco.

Morrisseeee

matthew8 wrote: »

Elway comes across as a very hard to like individual imo.

I'm not sure why you say this, he seems a very down to earth guy to me, a genuine football crazy fan, and he's learning the ropes in management, one thing he will learn (the hard way) is when to shut up and not speak your mind, the Media thrives on it.

matthew8

Morrisseeee wrote: »

I'm not sure why you say this, he seems a very down to earth guy to me, a genuine football crazy fan, and he's learning the ropes in management, one thing he will learn (the hard way) is when to shut up and not speak your mind, the Media thrives on it.

The reason I say this is that he had the audacity to refuse to play for the Colts. Who did he think he was?

Morrisseeee

^^ I've no problem wth that :pac::p

matthew8

matthew8 wrote: »

The reason I say this is that he had the audacity to refuse to play for the Colts. Who did he think he was?

well considering the way colts fans have jumped ship from manning i think he may have been right

bruschi

Tyson Crooked Lemon wrote: »

well considering the way colts fans have jumped ship from manning i think he may have been right

what? I think the very much vast majority of Colts fans want Manning to stay on if he is healthy and well enough to play.

bruschi

bruschi wrote: »

what? I think the very much vast majority of Colts fans want Manning to stay on if he is healthy and well enough to play.

fair enough could be the media making a big deal out of a moronity as an eagles fan i can appreciate that

kmart6

Tyson Crooked Lemon wrote: »

well considering the way colts fans have jumped ship from manning i think he may have been right

Oh explain this one to me?....should be hilarious!

spiralism

matthew8 wrote: »

The reason I say this is that he had the audacity to refuse to play for the Colts. Who did he think he was?

He was only a brash young lad at the time, the Colts were terrible and he disliked the coach. Within a year they'd upped sticks and f'd off to Indy and their reputation went in the gutter for years anyways. On the balance of things, a brash, arrogant decision at the time was the best he ever made.

kmart6

kmart6 wrote: »

Oh explain this one to me?....should be hilarious!

there has been quite a few colts fans seen wearing luck jerseys and a lot of them hav been hopin for a loosing season from game 5 or 6 so they could get him

kmart6

Tyson Crooked Lemon wrote: »

there has been quite a few colts fans seen wearing luck jerseys and a lot of them hav been hopin for a loosing season from game 5 or 6 so they could get him

And how exactly is that jumping ship?! We have the chance of getting what most people consider the most complete QB to come through the draft in years, obviously fans are going to want that! Most would prefer if Peyton could play a couple of seasons, and Luck could learn from him, step in and then have another decade of success!

The real 'Suck for Luck' didn't really get going till after week 9 and 10!

Jolly Red Giant

spiralism wrote: »

Thing is, Elway is very green.

Elway did run the Arena Football franchise in Denver for six years. Not the same as an NFL team - but he is hardly 'green' at operations decisions.

spiralism wrote: »

the worst he's done is make a couple of divisive moves like the lloyd trade,

I wouldn't agree that it was divisive - Lloyd had to go once Orton was benched - and I think the locker room were aware of that. The worst that Elway has done has been make a couple of dodgy tweets that he whouldn't have.

Morrisseeee wrote: »

As far as the draft goes, I think we need to turn our O line into a brick wall, to give Timmy all the time he needs to develop. I'm hopefull anyways, if next year is as half as exciting and we get to the playoffs again, I'll be a happy bucking bronco.

The OL will not be a priority in this years draft. The Broncos are hoping that Ryan Harris will come good after his injuries and take over at RT allowing Franklin to move to G. That would be an instant upgrade in both the pass protection (through Harris) and run blocking (through Franklin playing at G) Beadles would then be a floating back-up.

The priorities this off-season are down the spine of the defence - DT, MLB and S.

Warren could come back and play DT - he has had two seasons off and if he can stay injury free would be a significant upgrade over what we had this season just gone. Even with Warren another DT is needed and there are already stories that the Broncos are looking at Melvin Ingram out of S. Carolina

Mays has to be replaced - he is very limited and an upgrade is needed. A lot depends on how Nate Irving progresses. He is 18 months behind where he should be with his car crash and missing last off-season. But Fox likes to bring young LBs along slowly. If Fox thinks that Irving can carry the load then the Broncos will by-pass MLB in the draft.

Safety is an absolute priority - Dawkins is done - he is due to make nearly $8million so if he doesn't retire he will be cut. If he does retire I wouldn't be surprised to see him back with the Broncos as a secondary coach. Moore is looking like a bust. Everyone said he couldn't tackle out of college and so far he has proved them right. CB also needs an upgrade - although Goodman has suffered because our safeties were so bad.

On offence - look for the Broncos to bring in a RB, WR and TE - and Tebow needs to learn how to pass to the TE and dump the ball off to the RB. McGahee is good but he cannot carry the full load for a season. Ball is no more than servicable and Moreno will probably be cut. Johnson and Fannin offer potential but another is needed. Payton Hillis might make a comeback to the Broncos - Marshawn Lynch is another possibility, he has previously worked with Eric Studsville.

kmart6 wrote: »

The real 'Suck for Luck' didn't really get going till after week 9 and 10!

The Colts were sucking for Luck from day 1

kmart6

Jolly Red Giant wrote: »

The Colts were sucking for Luck from day 1

Oh yeah, that's it, your spot on, they went into training camp with the attitude that they'd throw away the winning spirit they've had for a decade in the hope of landing Luck, who could have got injured or anything during the season!:rolleyes:

"suck for luck" was not from week 1 to be honest i thought they'd do decent without him im surprised at just how bad they where maybe Peyton should have gotten mvp. it was well before week 9 though i just feel its a shame that he seems to have just been discarded i hope if he is traded its to a good team id like to see him win another sb before he retires.

kmart6

He will not be traded! How people don't understand this I don't get!

davyjose

Tyson Crooked Lemon wrote: »

there has been quite a few colts fans seen wearing luck jerseys and a lot of them hav been hopin for a loosing season from game 5 or 6 so they could get him

When you're 0-13, there's little point playing hard to get 2nd pick in the draft. I think most people appreciate that even if the Colts had absolutely no intention of picking Luck, they can still absolutely clean up by trading the first pick. We're talking multiple 1st & 2nd round picks here. So yeah, I didn't see much point in going all out against Houston or jacksonville (at no point did any fan I've met or read about want a 0-16 season).

As for buying Luck jerseys, I admit that's a little bit idiotic before it's been decided where he'll go, but do you really think because we have Manning, we shouldn't want the brightest QB prospect since Manning - a kid 14 years his junior on the roster too? Let's be honest, the Colts aren't going anywhere near a Super Bowl for at least 4 or 5 years, so having an ultra-talented QB, under the apprenticeship one of the greatest players the game has ever seen for some of that time, is about as good as it gets for a fan. Just look at Green Bay.

Finally, it seems almost certain Manning will leave, and I doubt there is one person in the state of Indiana, or beyond who doesn't wish the guy well, and who isn't grateful for what the guy has done there. I'd love to see Manning win another ring, even if (somehow) he were to end up in New England (ok maybe not there :pac:). But I'm a Colts fan, and when he goes (even if it's 5 years from now), I'll still be a Colts fan. And there could be much worse ways to lose your superstar QB, than following him with a kid of Luck's calibre.

But seriously, you have no clue what you're talking about if you believe the post you made about Colts fans jumping ship. Trust me, the guy is so ****ing revered in Indy it's surreal. I daresay, he'll even take a few fans with him, wherever he goes (But they're the kind of fan you don't want rooting for your team - not the guys wearing Luck jerseys).

davyjose

Jolly Red Giant wrote: »

The Colts were sucking for Luck from day 1

So guys like Robert Mathis and Reggie Wayne had no problem tarnishing their own legacies and reputation, and chance of a shiny new contract, for a kid they might never get to play with? And of course Jim Caldwell and the Polians wanted to trade their jobs for eternal ridicule.

Yeah buddy, nice logic ya got there.