Greenways [greenway map of Ireland in post 1]

riddlinrussell

Grassey wrote: »

Completely, it defies logic really. You'd never have a road stop a few hundred meters from it's intended destination and say, sure that's grand, well done lads. Wrap it up now, we can always revisit it in the future.

It suggests the Council 'ran out of money' but that would suggest to me that we should see an unfinished section of the route leading towards the estate, maybe with them not having work for tarmac-hardcore-whatever, this looks like they planned it to end there because they couldn't afford it at an early stage... really stupid to not make any arrangement to ensure safe access to the estate, means you'll get zero use of the route for its intended purpose

Grassey

From the local political spam in the letterbox

riddlinrussell

Grassey wrote: »

From the local political spam in the letterbox
*snip*

Saw that myself! Good to see, hoping the various Sallins projects will all tie in well with the greenway, the community park, the plans for making the town centre more pedestrian friendly after the bypass is completed etc...

serfboard

riddlinrussell wrote: »

Good to see, hoping the various Sallins projects will all tie in well with the greenway, the community park, the plans for making the town centre more pedestrian friendly after the bypass is completed

If all that comes to fruition after the bypass is complete, Sallins has the potential to be a great place to live. Combine all the above with a train station with regular services to Dublin, and handy access to the M7 (and onwards to the M8 & M9) and not too far from the M4 (& M6) via the Kilcock junction.

riddlinrussell

serfboard wrote: »

If all that comes to fruition after the bypass is complete, Sallins has the potential to be a great place to live. Combine all the above with a train station with regular services to Dublin, and handy access to the M7 (and onwards to the M8 & M9) and not too far from the M4 (& M6) via the Kilcock junction.

I'd argue that Sallins overall is already a great place to live, albeit far from ideal traffic volumes and amenities, if their plan comes to fruition I think It might be the most desirable commuter town in Ireland!

Grassey

riddlinrussell

https://www.westmeathindependent.ie/news/roundup/articles/2019/09/12/4179564-consultants-appointed-to-bring-greenway-across-shannon/

According to this the Royal Canal greenway is now fully open from Athlone to Maynooth, can anyone confirm the sections under construction are fully completed?

mr spuckler

riddlinrussell wrote: »

https://www.westmeathindependent.ie/news/roundup/articles/2019/09/12/4179564-consultants-appointed-to-bring-greenway-across-shannon/

According to this the Royal Canal greenway is now fully open from Athlone to Maynooth, can anyone confirm the sections under construction are fully completed?

Seems so from here in the cycling forum.

Zebra3

There’s a stretch of about 300 meters west of Fern’s Lock (Lock 17) that was still closed off on Sunday.

marno21

Cork County Council have tendered for clearance and fencing of the line between Midleton and Youghal stations for the Midleton-Youghal greenway.

https://irl.eu-supply.com/ctm/Supplier/PublicPurchase/154321/0/0?returnUrl=ctm/Supplier/publictenders&b=ETENDERS_SIMPLE

djam17

Nice Flyover of the Baldoyle to Portmarnock on Atkins website. Sorry cant post link, new to this

Zebra3

Zebra3 wrote: »

There’s a stretch of about 300 meters west of Fern’s Lock (Lock 17) that was still closed off on Sunday.

Was jogging by there on Tuesday and there seems to be work ongoing to finish that little stretch.

Further up closer to (west of) Enfield though it’s not really a greenway (to me).

There’s fair stretches that are accessible for cars.

Corca Baiscinn

Zebra3 wrote: »

Was jogging by there on Tuesday and there seems to be work ongoing to finish that little stretch.

Further up closer to (west of) Enfield though it’s not really a greenway (to me).

There’s fair stretches that are accessible for cars.

Did you notice any speed limit posted?

Zebra3

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

Did you notice any speed limit posted?

No, not that that would be particularly relevant.

Pete_Cavan

There are numerous stretches along the canals which are open to cars as they provide access to houses, others are essentially local roads.

Zebra3

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

There are numerous stretches along the canals which are open to cars as they provide access to houses, others are essentially local roads.

Which should mean that those stretches shouldn't be designated as a greenway.

riddlinrussell

Zebra3 wrote: »

Which should mean that those stretches shouldn't be designated as a greenway.

I'd say they can, but perhaps not in their current form, how is this handled anywhere with better cycling provision and lots of canals (dare I say...the Netherlands?) I would say with appropriate signage, perhaps some form of gating etc it could be managed alright, those roads should be local access only or made inconvenient as a shortcut. It may never reach the '100% full segregation' of something like the Waterford greenway, but I would say it would do far more harm to the numbers if a very quiet, perfectly safe to cycle for all comers road section was marked on the maps as 'not greenway' and appearing to segment the route.

I'd say first step would be ensure cyclist/ped priority on all those routes, with a view to winding down all traffic over an extended period (alternate routes, closing accesses etc)

Found a bicycledutch article about a canal greenway, this one involves a much busier road section than a lot of the canalside roads on the Grand canal, and it highlights an on road cyclepath (the painted style) and how it would only be appropriate for a quiet route.

https://bicycledutch.wordpress.com/2018/10/16/cycling-alongside-two-canals/

So possibly a case where painted lines would actually be fine, as there roads tend to be plenty wide enough for a single car and cyclist to safely pass. Ideally either closure of the road or a kerbed cycleway along it (Making the road explicitly single lane/tidal which would actively discourage car users)

Grassey

Passage Railway Greenway gets the go-ahead; route needs to be protected for walkers and cyclists

PLANS for a greenway linking the Marina to Mahon have been rubberstamped by City Hall.

The local authority received 268 submissions on the project which will see a revamp of the Passage Railway Greenway route from Páirc Uí Chaoimh all the way to Mahon and onto Passage

controversial-south-kerry-greenway-planning-hearing-to-take-almost-two-weeks-954022.html

An oral hearing into the controversial South Kerry Greenway is expected to take almost two weeks.

As well as an application for planning, Kerry County Council is also seeking the go-ahead to compulsorily purchase lands from the almost 200 landowners on the 32km route which is largely - though not exclusively - along the former railway line between Glenbeigh and Renard outside Cahersiveen.

The hearing into both the planning and CPO applications, is to take place in Tralee at the Manor West Hotel and it is scheduled to begin on October 8 and run until October 18

riddlinrussell

Grassey wrote: »

controversial-south-kerry-greenway-planning-hearing-to-take-almost-two-weeks-954022.html

The CPO is huge, this is definitely going to go to court and it will be interesting to see if the declaration of a climate emergency is used as an argument, could have far reaching impacts on transport infra if it does

Tigerandahalf

Is it 1 or 2 farmers against it or a big push against it?

riddlinrussell

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

Is it 1 or 2 farmers against it or a big push against it?

It is about 3 of the hundred or so farmers on the route that were being stubborn, everyone else was happy with it, but those 3 forced KCC to seek a CPO along the entire route.

The IFA and the majority of the farmers are opposed to that because if a precedent is set that CPO can be used for greenways then that can be used all over the country.
This was already tested before when they tried to build the route from Athlone to Galway, but that was a good few years ago and the mood may be swinging the other way by now, this greenway is predicted to be an absolute goldmine for Kerry

Tigerandahalf

I think you will always get one or two - some being stubborn and perhaps others hoping for a better payout. That area could certainly do with a tourism push. There is a lot of potential there.
Hopefully a solution will be found. I would have no problem with farmers getting an extra CAP payment for allowing this type of infrastructure through their land.

riddlinrussell

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

I think you will always get one or two - some being stubborn and perhaps others hoping for a better payout. That area could certainly do with a tourism push. There is a lot of potential there.
Hopefully a solution will be found. I would have no problem with farmers getting an extra CAP payment for allowing this type of infrastructure through their land.

Well the CAP desperately needs a rework IMO, needs to incentivise biodiversity, sustainable native tree planting, sustainable crops over meat production etc... agree that green friendly initiatives like this should be incorporated into that rework (if it ever happens...)

Tigerandahalf

It is the future for small farmers on marginal land. Pay them under CAP to plant native trees, wildflowers etc. A lot of that type of land needs to go back to nature - no artifical fertiliser or sprays. Farmers could still have small numbers of cattle and sheep and possibly be organic.

MJohnston

Agree with the above - the likes of the Healy-Raes like to present themselves as defenders of farmers but realistically they’re way way too shortsighted to do anything other than leave farmers completely unprepared for the way society is moving.

whisky_galore

riddlinrussell wrote: »

The CPO is huge, this is definitely going to go to court and it will be interesting to see if the declaration of a climate emergency is used as an argument, could have far reaching impacts on transport infra if it does

How green is a Greenway, given the numbers of people that use one use motor transport to get to it? It's a leisure facility, not a piece of commuter transport infrastructure.

loyatemu

whisky_galore wrote: »

How green is a Greenway, given the numbers of people that use one use motor transport to get to it? It's a leisure facility, not a piece of commuter transport infrastructure.

it's a good question, but a lot of them might otherwise drive down to Caherciveen.

Zebra3

whisky_galore wrote: »

How green is a Greenway, given the numbers of people that use one use motor transport to get to it? It's a leisure facility, not a piece of commuter transport infrastructure.

It can be both.

And in a lot cases, is.

riddlinrussell

whisky_galore wrote: »

How green is a Greenway, given the numbers of people that use one use motor transport to get to it? It's a leisure facility, not a piece of commuter transport infrastructure.

This is definitely a major consideration, and should be an eco factor considered in the development of a route, in an ideal world a lot of the greenways would be reached by people arriving on public transport, but that again will require a sea change, not least of which would be a full cycle carriage on trains to Killarney, Waterford, Westport etc to access them.

Regarding using the environment as a wedge issue to get CPO powers for greenway building I think its a fairly muddy area, better chance of going through than last time but really a better argument would be around commuter routes in a city, problem being there its much rarer for it to need to get to the CPO stage for something like a commuter cycle route, and where it does its parcelled into a road improvement which can be CPO'd regardless

riddlinrussell

https://www.kildarestreet.com/debate/?id=2019-10-03a.194

Comment from a Cavan TD regarding the Kingscourt line, in certain cases I'd agree with the sentiment but it really would be pie in the sky to argue for reinstating this line when Navan to Dublin isn't even under consideration at present, as ever I would argue that the greenway be set up in such a way as to be relatively trivial to reverse to rail if needed, and if you want to get serious about rail build new lines to modern standards instead of trying to keep things to the old outdated Victorian routes which will constantly hamper your ability to run an efficient, fast modern train system