substitution and supervision in secondary schools

ethical

Can some one enlighten me as regards the S & S scheme in Irish Second Level Schools?
In my view ,it is farcical that the scheme was not scrapped and the individual teachers were given an extra class period to their time table without pay! Remember everyone must do their bit in these times of austerity..and I know about wage cuts and pension cuts and levies and so on.Talking to a number of teachers this proposal of mine would be acceptable to most.I am led to believe that the amount of money received by teachers that part take in the present scheme get around 300 euro after tax twice a year.It was also pointed out that this is not a lot of money considering the responsibilities attached to the position.It is a voluntary scheme,opt in -opt out on an annual basis as far as I know.This is leading to a major problem.One man remarked to me that 'some 'teachers sign up to do supervision and do not bother actually doing it yet receive remuneration for same!I do not have the figures for what it cost for the year but if the minister has an ounce of 'cop-on' my advise would be to get every teacher to do an extra class period per their timetable and not receive any pay for it.We would then have a level playing field with the whole teaching team looking after the student body the whole time and not the piecemeal project we have at the moment. Presently as it stands there will be less and less signing up to the S & S scheme for the coming school year and chaos will not be far away in the school yard.:eek:

jonseyblub

ethical wrote: »

Can some one enlighten me as regards the S & S scheme in Irish Second Level Schools?
In my view ,it is farcical that the scheme was not scrapped and the individual teachers were given an extra class period to their time table without pay! Remember everyone must do their bit in these times of austerity..and I know about wage cuts and pension cuts and levies and so on.Talking to a number of teachers this proposal of mine would be acceptable to most.I am led to believe that the amount of money received by teachers that part take in the present scheme get around 300 euro after tax twice a year.It was also pointed out that this is not a lot of money considering the responsibilities attached to the position.It is a voluntary scheme,opt in -opt out on an annual basis as far as I know.This is leading to a major problem.One man remarked to me that 'some 'teachers sign up to do supervision and do not bother actually doing it yet receive remuneration for same!I do not have the figures for what it cost for the year but if the minister has an ounce of 'cop-on' my advise would be to get every teacher to do an extra class period per their timetable and not receive any pay for it.We would then have a level playing field with the whole teaching team looking after the student body the whole time and not the piecemeal project we have at the moment. Presently as it stands there will be less and less signing up to the S & S scheme for the coming school year and chaos will not be far away in the school yard.:eek:

Fine lets do that. Then lets also insist that every worker in the country gives up 1.5 hours a week from their lunch break for no money too.
Give me a break. Your first sentence asks people here to enlighten you on the S&S scheme. Then the rest of your post is written as if you're an authority on it. 'One man remarked' This man represents the many thousands of teachers in the country then :rolleyes: Presently as it stands there will be less and less signing up to the S & S scheme for the coming school year and chaos will not be far away in the school yard. Stats for this?

Really getting annoyed with people coming in here not having a clue what they are talking about but quoting friends and friends of friends etc. Get the facts straight and then lets have a debate.

implausible

The OP has a point. Rather than this extra 100 hours, why not timetable us all for an hour of s/s per week? It would be far handier than being in school for evenings nearly every 2nd week, which we all know is a PR exercise, so Joe Public can drive past schools and see teachers' cars outside them at 5:30:rolleyes:

The s/s scheme is doomed anyway as far as I can see. People are so p*ssed off at these extra hours, no-one is going to volunteer for extra in school time. I can see the system collapsing.

jonseyblub

deemark wrote: »

The OP has a point. Rather than this extra 100 hours, why not timetable us all for an hour of s/s per week? It would be far handier than being in school for evenings nearly every 2nd week, which we all know is a PR exercise, so Joe Public can drive past schools and see teachers' cars outside them at 5:30:rolleyes:

.

Yes if he/she had said this I would agree (and have actually made this suggestion before ) but I doubt he/she meant that.

implausible

jonseyblub wrote: »

Yes if he/she had said this I would agree (and have actually made this suggestion before ) but I doubt he/she meant that.

You're right, didn't read it carefully enough - s/he is suggesting we do this on top of Croke Park hours:eek:

doc_17

I was just asking my co-workers about the S&S and several are thinking of opting out. it's taxed at something like 62%. It's not for financial gain that we do it anyway.

ulysses32

OP is another one of these blackguards who sees the only answer to economic woes lying in cutting the salaries and increasing the workloads of teachers. Teachers work hard enough and long enough as it is. Holidays are better than most, daily work conditions are more difficult than most and that is the reality.

Teachers are contributing the same as everybody else, as they should, no more and no less.

I agree with doing supervision in lieu of the Croke Park hours not on top of them. This would be insane as I'm sure the OP would agree.

Teachers, as all other workers ,do work in their own time without being compensated. However, no workers agree to tying themselves into contracted extra work without pay. This leaves the door open to all sorts of difficulties for workers far beyond the teaching profession.

Boober Fraggle

this suggestion might work for the substitution element of s and s, but what about the supervision?

Fair enough if teachers choose to give up a lunch time per week, that is their prerogative, but as far as I know, we can not (no more than any other workers) be forced to work without a lunch break.

With having to give up 3 class periods for s and s this year, I will think long and hard before signing up to it.

Delphi91

Boober Fraggle wrote: »

...With having to give up 3 class periods for s and s this year, I will think long and hard before signing up to it.

You're not giving up three class periods. You're making yourself available for three, but still only being called for one, if required - same as before.

Boober Fraggle

Delphi91 wrote: »

You're not giving up three class periods. You're making yourself available for three, but still only being called for one, if required - same as before.

But if you are not called for the first 2, you still have to be there and available for the 3rd. In our school you could get called at any stage for the class, you don't necessarily get notice of it.

_Pearly_

Just a few things to consider.

1. The country has no money. Not our fault, but doesnt change the fact.
2. What will the government do if they dont cut S&S? Higher the pupil teacher ratio? Cut learning support hours? This two scenarios have a negative effect on the education of the young people we teach. It also will affect the number of teachers employed next year.

For both those reasons, I have absolutely no problem doing S&S without pay or doing the croke park hours.

vamos!

Maybe it depends on your school. 2 breaks and up to 2 class periods of total hassle and chaos is not worth any amount of money to me. I have my own classes under control but havent a hope of keeping unknown students calm.