Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2011-2012

deiseach

KevIRL wrote: »

Just a small note. A loss to Galway and one of the other games ending in a draw could see us in the relegation play off.

A smaller note. Our points difference is -3, Galway's is -10 (according to the GAA's website). So assuming a clutch of teams finish on five points and head-to-heads don't count, we could afford to lose to Galway by three points. This would mean we would finish ahead of them (-6 for us, -7 for them) and the team that lost in the scenario you mention above who would only have four points. Right?

Mountainlad

deiseach wrote: »

A smaller note. Our points difference is -3, Galway's is -10 (according to the GAA's website). So assuming a clutch of teams finish on five points and head-to-heads don't count, we could afford to lose to Galway by three points. This would mean we would finish ahead of them (-6 for us, -7 for them) and the team that lost in the scenario you mention above who would only have four points. Right?

We finished ahead of Galway on head-to-head last year, so I assume it's still that way now.

solarith

We never lose to Galway when it matters.

deiseach

Mountainlad wrote: »

We finished ahead of Galway on head-to-head last year, so I assume it's still that way now.

But if it comes down to head-to-head, we've beaten both Clare and Tipp. If that match ends in a draw, we have to finish ahead of both of them.

KevIRL

deiseach wrote: »

A smaller note. Our points difference is -3, Galway's is -10 (according to the GAA's website). So assuming a clutch of teams finish on five points and head-to-heads don't count, we could afford to lose to Galway by three points. This would mean we would finish ahead of them (-6 for us, -7 for them) and the team that lost in the scenario you mention above who would only have four points. Right?

You are right. If for exa,ple we lose to Galway by 2 pts, kk beat cork but tipp and Clare draw. That would see cork last with 4 points, Galway, tipp Clare and ourselves on 5pts and kk on 6pts.

As its more than 2 teams level it goes to scoring diff and not head to head. Our 2 point defeat would see Galway finish 5th and in the relegation play off, us in 4th and finished spring hurling in march for the second year in a row and Clare and tipp into the semi finals.

Of course let's hope we just beat Galway to qualify and failing that hope there are no draws to avoid headache type situations

KevIRL

deiseach wrote: »

But if it comes down to head-to-head, we've beaten both Clare and Tipp. If that match ends in a draw, we have to finish ahead of both of them.

If more than 2 teams finish level it's scoring diff.

Mountainlad

deiseach wrote: »

But if it comes down to head-to-head, we've beaten both Clare and Tipp. If that match ends in a draw, we have to finish ahead of both of them.

Sorry I thought you were talking purely between ourselves and Galway if they beat us. Galway can't actually finish ahead of us based on head to head in a way that would see us in the relegation final, so head-to-head is basically irrelevant in the context of relegation.

So yeah it's -3 or better for us to avoid the relegation final, cos I can't see both the other games being draws. In reality, I don't think either will be draws. Would be nice to win the match and be in a semi final against the winners of 1B, not that that would be an easy game.

IanVW

Anyone explain to me how this head to head works?:D

Fireball07

IanVW wrote: »

Anyone explain to me how this head to head works?:D

Head-to-head just means whoever won the match between the 2 teams gets the higher position.


If it was a draw, it goes to points difference.

IanVW

Fireball07 wrote: »

Head-to-head just means whoever won the match between the 2 teams gets the higher position.


If it was a draw, it goes to points difference.

Thanks for that lol:D

redlead

there's a lot of talk about avoiding relegation and no talk about us having a great chance of finishing top of the league. It's in our own hands. Hopefully this time next week we'll be talking about a match with Limerick or Dublin (which we will be massive underdogs for of course).

KevIRL

redlead wrote: »

there's a lot of talk about avoiding relegation and no talk about us having a great chance of finishing top of the league. It's in our own hands. Hopefully this time next week we'll be talking about a match with Limerick or Dublin (which we will be massive underdogs for of course).

KevIRL wrote: »

To be honest the team have done enough so far this season to deserve more confidence from us. Galway really havent impressed too much and seem to have gone back to fully relying on Joe Canning, if we can minimise his scoring next week then we've every reason to hope to be in a league semi final

Was mentioned yesterday pretty shortly after the match.

The situation which see us in a relegation play off is more complicated so natural enough there are more posts as people try to figure it out. At least what needs to be done to make a semi final doesnt need much explaining...win or draw v Galway

PTH2009

take back all i said about Relagation. Hopefully we can get something out of the Galway game and have a semi final day out in Thurles on the 21st April

Psychedelic

Highlights from the game on TG4 website (click Sport, then GAA 2013):
http://www.tg4.ie/en/player/tg4-player.html

Mountainlad

PTH2009 wrote: »

take back all i said about Relagation. Hopefully we can get something out of the Galway game and have a semi final day out in Thurles on the 21st April

I hope you don't jinx it now

Straight Talker

solarith wrote: »

We never lose to Galway when it matters.

Well done to Waterford on a brilliant win and well done to Michael Ryan for sticking it up to the critics by keeping the team in the division.Hopefully we'll see ye in the summer and hopefully our lad's might pop that bubble.:D As for the comment above they said before that Down never lost an all ireland football final.All i heard on the week of that match was that Cork won't win Down don't lose all ireland finals.They reality was that Down didn't play enough all ireland finals to lose just like how Waterford haven't played Galway that often.So i would be careful with that sort of arrogant talk.There was Down fans probably saying the same thing as yourself until Cork beat them in the 2010 all ireland final!

Mountainlad

Straight Talker wrote: »

Well done to Waterford on a brilliant win and well done to Michael Ryan for sticking it up to the critics by keeping the team in the division.Hopefully we'll see ye in the summer and hopefully our lad's might pop that bubble.:D As for the comment above they said before that Down never lost an all ireland football final.All i heard on the week of that match was that Cork won't win Down don't lose all ireland finals.They reality was that Down didn't play enough all ireland finals to lose just like how Waterford haven't played Galway that often.So i would be careful with that sort of arrogant talk.There was Down fans probably saying the same thing as yourself until Cork beat them in the 2010 all ireland final!

While I'd be wary, we play Galway a lot more than Down play Cork and Cork were still favourites.

I'd say you had one ear closed that week if you get me. We tend to hear the naysayers much louder than those we agree with. There was no shortage of people tipping Cork, far more than Down I would be willing to bet. And I'd say there'll be no shortage of people tipping Galway, Paddy Power for one.

Straight Talker

Mountainlad wrote: »

While I'd be wary, we play Galway a lot more than Down play Cork and Cork were still favourites.

I'd say you had one ear closed that week if you get me. We tend to hear the naysayers much louder than those we agree with. There was no shortage of people tipping Cork, far more than Down I would be willing to bet. And I'd say there'll be no shortage of people tipping Galway, Paddy Power for one.

Well last year for example i think Galway would have beaten Waterford but that was last year.If anyone think's that Galway are certainties to beat Waterford the next day then they can think again.Waterford have traditionally been bad favourites but excellent underdogs.

Morte

Prendergast continues to show how important he is to the team and is a massive asset to all the young forwards that are around him. Did anyone else seem to think things improved when he went to FF though? Before most balls were sent his way and there were often two men on him and one of them could clear easily. My heart sank at a Halloran Mahony Dillon HF line but they seemed to do better than before. It of course helped a lot that the backs were on top and with a strong breeze could send ball directly into FF. I'm not suggesting this should always be how we line up.

I'd disagree with a comment earlier. I generally thought Nagle had a decent game and used the ball well. He's a good striker of the ball given time and often uses it intelligently. With so many of our backs being poor strikers of the ball it's essential to have someone like him who can clear it long rather than handpassing everywhere. He's obviously not as dominant as a half back should ideally be but I think we need someone like him with the mix of other defenders. If someone else steps up who can dominate and strike well all well and good.

On a very minor issue that is dear to me I was delighted with how O'Sullivan hassled Cummins at the end rather than fouling him as the vast majority of players would have done. For forwards stopping the backs giving good ball out of defence is in my opinion more important than trying to win the ball. Winning the ball is unlikely. A bad clearance leaves your own defence favourite to win the ball and return a good delivery to yourself.

Mountainlad

Morte wrote: »

On a very minor issue that is dear to me I was delighted with how O'Sullivan hassled Cummins at the end rather than fouling him as the vast majority of players would have done. For forwards stopping the backs giving good ball out of defence is in my opinion more important than trying to win the ball. Winning the ball is unlikely. A bad clearance leaves your own defence favourite to win the ball and return a good delivery to yourself.

Very important point and it's what Kilkenny's success is built on. Couldn't get over the pressure they put on the ball against us (even though its always on the borders of the rules, but I guess if you can get away with it more power to ya).

deiseach

We've got a poor record against Galway in the League. P34 W12 D1 L21. We've won the last two but had previously lost six on the bounce, so I wouldn't put any stock in that return. The Championship, on the other hand . . .

Black Suir

deiseach wrote: »

But if it comes down to head-to-head, we've beaten both Clare and Tipp. If that match ends in a draw, we have to finish ahead of both of them.

Head to head only counts when two teams finish level on points. When three or more finish level on points, its score difference thats used. I could be wrong but our score difference is worse than both. It is on Clare anyway.

robopaddy

Straight Talker wrote: »

Well done to Waterford on a brilliant win and well done to Michael Ryan for sticking it up to the critics by keeping the team in the division.Hopefully we'll see ye in the summer and hopefully our lad's might pop that bubble.:D As for the comment above they said before that Down never lost an all ireland football final.All i heard on the week of that match was that Cork won't win Down don't lose all ireland finals.They reality was that Down didn't play enough all ireland finals to lose just like how Waterford haven't played Galway that often.So i would be careful with that sort of arrogant talk.There was Down fans probably saying the same thing as yourself until Cork beat them in the 2010 all ireland final!

ah would you go way out of it, making it out to sound like ye proved the world wrong in a David v Goliath clash. Cork were raging hot favourites going into that game and actually struggled to get over the line in the end against one of the poorest teams to reach an AI final in recent years.

you say Galway would have beaten us last year well they were supposed to beat us in 09 and 2011 aswell when they looked to be steam-rolling their way through the AI qualifiers. Our record against them in the league is poor but traditionally we do not fear them and our championship record will tell you that. Of course they are going to beat us eventually but dont be comparing it to some non-existent theory just so you can start a gloating session about yere AI win in 2010

robopaddy

Best of luck to Dungarvan Colleges today against St Kierans in the AI Colleges Semi Final

mccarthy37

robopaddy wrote: »

Best of luck to Dungarvan Colleges today against St Kierans in the AI Colleges Semi Final

A big test for the lads it would be brilliant if they could win. Best of luck to them. Is this game on in Carriganore. I see Kilkenny CBS awaits the winners.

kensutz

mccarthy37 wrote: »

A big test for the lads it would be brilliant if they could win. Best of luck to them. Is this game on in Carriganore. I see Kilkenny CBS awaits the winners.

Yep out in Carriganore

solarith

Dungarvan Colleges 4-3.
St. Kierans 0-5.

Coming up to half time.

Deskjockey

Masita Gaa All Ireland Colleges SF (1st half,22 min) St Kieran's College 0-4 Dungarvan Colleges 3-3

As per @KKhurlingscores twitta

solarith

We've 2 other sources on twitter saying it's Dungarvan Colleges 4-3 to St Kierans 0-6!

ManFromCheese

5-4 to 6 points now...i had to double take when i saw that scoreline

Deskjockey

Masita Gaa All Ireland Colleges SF (2nd half,51 min) St Kieran's College 0-10 Dungarvan Colleges 5-7 #Hurling”

robopaddy

Deskjockey wrote: »

Masita Gaa All Ireland Colleges SF (2nd half,51 min) St Kieran's College 0-10 Dungarvan Colleges 5-7 #Hurling”

Hope they can hold out....

Mountainlad

5-08 to 1-10 they won.

When will the final be? Looking forward to seeing them play

Deise_2012

finished 5-8 to 1-10, great win

deiseach

The principal of St Kieran's prepares for the return of the team that lost to a shower of mudbloods:

Deskjockey

deiseach wrote: »

The principal of St Kieran's prepares for the return of the team that lost to a shower of mudbloods:

Lol. Some hammering.

Giveitfong

Final is in Thurles on Saturday week, April 6.

Sorry couldn't make the game today so no match report.

There is a good report on www.thescore.ie (click GAA tab).

Anybody know when the All-Ireland B final between Dungarvan CBS and St Mary's Belfast will be played?

robopaddy

deiseach wrote: »

The principal of St Kieran's prepares for the return of the team that lost to a shower of mudbloods:

dont be fooled though lads Kilkenny CBS will be a way better team. Kierans may be the traditional power-houses but this KK CBS team have been exceptional all the way up since Rice Cup.

Hope our lads can pull it off they deserve it. Have been a super team over the past couple years and have done their clubs county proud

Straight Talker

deiseach wrote: »

We've got a poor record against Galway in the League. P34 W12 D1 L21. We've won the last two but had previously lost six on the bounce, so I wouldn't put any stock in that return. The Championship, on the other hand . . .

I mentioned the issue about Waterfords championship record to a Galway fan.Now bear in mind that i have no great gra for Galway im just telling you what he told me!He said well at least a few of our all ireland wins were captured on coloured tv.:D

mccarthy37

Well done Dungarvan Colleges on a brilliant victory, another Kilkenny school to face in the final should be a cracker.

Straight Talker

robopaddy wrote: »

ah would you go way out of it, making it out to sound like ye proved the world wrong in a David v Goliath clash. Cork were raging hot favourites going into that game and actually struggled to get over the line in the end against one of the poorest teams to reach an AI final in recent years.

you say Galway would have beaten us last year well they were supposed to beat us in 09 and 2011 aswell when they looked to be steam-rolling their way through the AI qualifiers. Our record against them in the league is poor but traditionally we do not fear them and our championship record will tell you that. Of course they are going to beat us eventually but dont be comparing it to some non-existent theory just so you can start a gloating session about yere AI win in 2010

Well that Cork team played the best football all year in 09 but a lack of experience cost them in the final that year.Despite the hatred and begrudgery they deserved that all ireland.At least we won enough all irelands between all grades and codes in the GAA to be begrudged for them i suppose.:D Im not gloating about anything but Galway pushed Kilkenny all the way last year.They would have beaten Waterford last year that may not sit well with some people but im just calling it as i see it.Anyway back to the match i have to say that Kevin Moran fella must be the most underrated hurler in Ireland.He's a great bit of stuff and i don't think Jamie Nagle is as bad a hurler as some Waterford fans would have you believe either!

Sidenote Don't be too offended by anything i said there im just stooping to Paddys level because it's the only language the mans capable of understanding.

deiseach

robopaddy wrote: »

dont be fooled though lads Kilkenny CBS will be a way better team. Kierans may be the traditional power-houses but this KK CBS team have been exceptional all the way up since Rice Cup.

Hope our lads can pull it off they deserve it. Have been a super team over the past couple years and have done their clubs county proud

You might well be right, but the patricians losing to the plebs . . . you have to laugh.

deiseach

Giveitfong wrote: »

Sorry couldn't make the game today so no match report.

Thomas Keane has one on his blog.

Mountainlad

Straight Talker wrote: »

I mentioned the issue about Waterfords championship record to a Galway fan.Now bear in mind that i have no great gra for Galway im just telling you what he told me!He said well at least a few of our all ireland wins were captured on coloured tv.:D

Sure when you get a by to the semi final every year, your bound to win one or two...

Straight Talker

Mountainlad wrote: »

Sure when you get a by to the semi final every year, your bound to win one or two...

That's actually true LOL.:pac:

dzilla

Straight Talker wrote: »

Well that Cork team played the best football all year in 09 but a lack of experience cost them in the final that year.Despite the hatred and begrudgery they deserved that all ireland.At least we won enough all irelands between all grades and codes in the GAA to be begrudged for them i suppose.:D Im not gloating about anything but Galway pushed Kilkenny all the way last year.They would have beaten Waterford last year that may not sit well with some people but im just calling it as i see it.Anyway back to the match i have to say that Kevin Moran fella must be the most underrated hurler in Ireland.He's a great bit of stuff and i don't think Jamie Nagle is as bad a hurler as some Waterford fans would have you believe either!

Sidenote Don't be too offended by anything i said there im just stooping to Paddys level because it's the only language the mans capable of understanding.

Your a subtle troll.

tonc76

From @officialgaa

To clarify, if two teams finish on equal points in the Allianz Leagues then positioning is decided by their head to head meeting (1/2)

If more than two teams are on equal points in the Allianz Leagues then positioning will be determined by scoring difference (2/2) #GAA

fricatus

Straight Talker wrote: »

I mentioned the issue about Waterfords championship record to a Galway fan.Now bear in mind that i have no great gra for Galway im just telling you what he told me!He said well at least a few of our all ireland wins were captured on coloured tv.:D

That's a case of the tuppence looking down on the ha'penny if I ever heard one!

Deskjockey

What is the story on Tony Browne. Why won't he come out to say he will or won't make himself available this year. He is a legend and owes Waterford hurling absolutely nothing but shouldn't he come out and confirm one way or the other about this year? Looking at how strong we have looked 2-9 in the league so far you'd imagine opportunities will be limited for him this year....
Time waits for no man and all that.

robopaddy

Straight Talker wrote: »

At least we won enough all irelands between all grades and codes in the GAA to be begrudged for them i suppose.:D Im not gloating about anything

sounds like contradiction of the year