Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2011-2012

Brad1234

Deise_2012 wrote: »

Well you were against Ryan from day 1 so you must be absolutely delighted he's gone, you went very quiet on this after the Kilkenny game with the amount of people delighted with the performance. Darragh Fives was injured against Kilkenny you hardly thought he brought on tony browne just because he's tony browne.
You get me any manager in the country to coach this team, take away mullane and eoin kelly, then take into account the amount of people missing between working commitments, travelling and injuries and see how well they get on v Clare and Kilkenny.
Never met the man in my life, not from his local club either so you can stop talking about personal agendas.

But I have to agree with you with the minors, If that management team were any good they'd have beaten limerick in the 1st game, what kind of fellas are in charge at all? holding awards nights 2 days before the munster final sure what have they won yet this season? They still don't know what to do with the forward line, how Cormac Curran and Conor Gleeson don't start is beyond me. Roche and Farrell are too inconsistent but in fairness Roche wasn't fit enough yesterday, they'd want to sort out the goalkeeper puck outs too, hitting it straight to Kevin Daly who won't be allowed to get on the ball in the final. So many mistakes yesterday they'd seriously want to get it right for the final

Gleeson hasnt started cause the started enough games early on and did absolutely nothing.. I wouldnt have him near the team.. Cormac Curran is a great impact sub but i agree id have him in ahead of farrell.. Roche is a class act prob not his better day yesterday but he has chipped in with about 3 points from play in every other game at least..

i went quiet after KK game cause i was sick of the love in for an unsuccessful side.. You'd swear we won the game.. I dont like moral victories and the back slapping after losing a game we could easily have won as cork showed us with a team at a similar level was ridiculous...

Hidalgo

Does the Waterford Co Board necessarily need the finances for an outside manager, why not private backers.

Have someone in the board approach a few potential backers, tell them ye're interested in appointing whomever but the finances aren't there, is it possible for a group of private individuals to band together and form a package

if this is in the best interest of Waterford hurling

Mountainlad

Brad1234 wrote: »

Gleeson hasnt started cause the started enough games early on and did absolutely nothing.. I wouldnt have him near the team.. Cormac Curran is a great impact sub but i agree id have him in ahead of farrell.. Roche is a class act prob not his better day yesterday but he has chipped in with about 3 points from play in every other game at least..

i went quiet after KK game cause i was sick of the love in for an unsuccessful side.. You'd swear we won the game.. I dont like moral victories and the back slapping after losing a game we could easily have won as cork showed us with a team at a similar level was ridiculous...

http://tomasmccarthy.blogspot.ie/2013/08/waterford-minor-scorers-championship.html

Colm Roche has scored 2 more points than Gleeson this year. I think both are excellent young hurlers. Can't understand the motives of people who would openly berate 16 year olds I have to say.

Hidalgo

Deise_2012 wrote: »

Well you were against Ryan from day 1 so you must be absolutely delighted he's gone, you went very quiet on this after the Kilkenny game with the amount of people delighted with the performance. Darragh Fives was injured against Kilkenny you hardly thought he brought on tony browne just because he's tony browne.
You get me any manager in the country to coach this team, take away mullane and eoin kelly, then take into account the amount of people missing between working commitments, travelling and injuries and see how well they get on v Clare and Kilkenny.
Never met the man in my life, not from his local club either so you can stop talking about personal agendas.

But I have to agree with you with the minors, If that management team were any good they'd have beaten limerick in the 1st game, what kind of fellas are in charge at all? holding awards nights 2 days before the munster final sure what have they won yet this season? They still don't know what to do with the forward line, how Cormac Curran and Conor Gleeson don't start is beyond me. Roche and Farrell are too inconsistent but in fairness Roche wasn't fit enough yesterday, they'd want to sort out the goalkeeper puck outs too, hitting it straight to Kevin Daly who won't be allowed to get on the ball in the final. So many mistakes yesterday they'd seriously want to get it right for the final

Anyone claiming Eoin Kelly was a loss to Waterford this year is doting. Mullane on the other hand, most definitely

tomkelly99

A serious TK post for once.

This has descended into a complete mess really and is pretty embarrassing for Waterford GAA after the events of 2011 and the ousting of Justin McCarthy. Who is in charge here? The county board? The 2012 panel of players? The 2013 panel?

Personally I think the players have really handled this situation very,very poorly. They have created a split in the county with their actions and you really have to wonder who is leading this or where they are getting their advice. Whether they are right or wrong in their decision is another debate but there are elements to this that really annoy me.

Firstly, the timing of the meeting was absolutely scandalous and one wonders was it deliberate? Today we should be talking about the fantastic achievements of our minors and instead we are mired in talk about division,secret meetings,the county board,the next manager etc.etc. Dont anyone tell me the timing of this announcement was not deliberate. Clearly,the intention was to have this story sneak under the radar amidst the Cork/Dublin game, the USPGA,the Community Shield and the minors victory. They knew what they were doing and unless I hear good reason otherwise that is what I will believe.

Secondly, who gives the 2012 panel (if that is who made the decision) the right to dictate who is appointed to the post of manager for the 2014 season? Damian Tiernan said on RTE that players have assured him this is not player power and that it's a county board decision.. Total bollocks. Of course their vote of no confidence in Ryan is going to influence whether he goes for the job again. Would you go for a managerial job knowing that you don't have the support of the players,particularly having worked with that group for two years? I doubt it.

Thirdly, rather than taking a vote,would it not have been cleaner and more constructive for the current panel of players to give feedback to the county board regarding issues with Ryan's tenure and try to either change the way things or done OR suggest that perhaps Ryan's 'contract' not be renewed?

Fourth, Waterford fans would have more respect for the players if they had handled this with a bit more class. A prepared statement detailing what happened,perhaps an interview with one of the leaders of the group to get an insight into what their thinking was, avoiding a clash with the minor game and finally actually thanking the man for giving two years of his life would have gone a long way to smoothing things over. Instead,we got nothing but rumours and denials. I don't deny them their right to express their opinions but at least be men and don't hide behind your anonymity.

So where to now? A very very messy period lies ahead of us, an unfortunate distraction ahead of an All-Ireland final. Expect more revelations to come out in the next few weeks. The press will have a field day. Unnamed sources everywhere. County board needs to be strong on this and for once show some leadership. With regards to Ryans replacement, any of the names from within the county are quite simply not up to senior inter-county standard. Not Queally,Hartley,McGrath,Kevin Ryan,McGrath,Cullinane or any others. Ryan himself first day probably wasn't up to it but he was appointed mainly as a stopgap as we simply could not afford anyone else. I don't accept this argument that we have to get someone from within the county as they 'will care more and give it a more honest effort etc.etc' The plain and simple fact of it is we have not produced coaches of a sufficient standard to coach the very top class teams. Our most successful periods in recent times have come with outside managers. Allen in Limerick and Daly in Dublin this year alone have proved the worth. Place of birth shouldn't come into it...experience and credentials should be the most important.

I would like Donal O'Grady to get the job - strong disciplinarian, good tactician, hugely experienced and takes no **** from nobody. Not sure about Donal Ógs credentials from a managerial point of view. He'd certainly be motivated. Sheedy obviously would be intriguing but the common denominator here is? The expense. Our inept county board is still pretty penniless, so whoever is appointed will be poorly paid and operating in a shoestring budget. This limits our options hugely so I can see us appointing one of the Waterford men mentioned previously. Whoever it is, lets give him a chance and who knows? We could be kings again sooner than we think!

@thetomkelly99

dzilla

Brian Flannery sh1tting on the past 24 hours about the hurlers, player power etc blaa blaa blaa on twatter..... is he not one of the players with quelly and greeners who opennly undermined justin macarthy in winter 2003 and question hus management.... Pot kettle black

doz

Mountainlad wrote: »

Can't understand the motives of people who would openly berate 16 year olds I have to say.

Couldn't agree more, I would go so far as to say that the moderators should make a statement/charter as regards criticism of minor players. It is simply disgraceful to come on here openly criticising young kids who are doing their very best and representing their county and it is not the first time this member has done so.

Thinkstoomuch

doz wrote: »

Couldn't agree more, I would go so far as to say that the moderators should make a statement/charter as regards criticism of minor players. It is simply disgraceful to come on here openly criticising young kids who are doing their very best and representing their county and it is not the first time this member has done so.

Ger cunnigham Ul,wasnt he involved with ye in some way this year.

Our own Ger C,has a year left with JBM.

DALY ,id say will leave Dublin,he would be worth pursing .

Mountainlad

doz wrote: »

Couldn't agree more, I would go so far as to say that the moderators should make a statement/charter as regards criticism of minor players. It is simply disgraceful to come on here openly criticising young kids who are doing their very best and representing their county and it is not the first time this member has done so.

Spot on Doz, only one way to sort this.

WumBuster

Is there a need for a manager? Is there a need for a county board? Just let these players manage themselves and see how they get on. In no other county would this kind of debacle be tolerated. We seem to put the players up on too much of a pedastal in Waterford. Have they someone better in mind, who is affordable?

Did Ryan need to go? It was just some half hearted meeting with only half of the panel turning up, expressing their opinion, which seems to be far from unanimous. Of course we don't know what went on exactly, but maybe Ryan should have held his fire, met with the players and county board before making his decision rather than resigning immediately.

The county board may want Ryan to reconsider. I think he should take some time to reflect and do that. But my gut feeling is that the damage has been done and he will unlikely do a u-turn now. Not impressed at the way this has been handled by any of the parties involved. An absolute joke.

doz

As a slight aside from all the talk around the managerial situation, our kit supplier Azzuri has now been placed in examinership

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/examiner-confirmed-for-maker-of-azzuri-sportswear-29491949.html

Mountainlad

doz wrote: »

As a slight aside from all the talk around the managerial situation, our kit supplier Azzuri has now been placed in examinership

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/examiner-confirmed-for-maker-of-azzuri-sportswear-29491949.html

Gaelic gear it is so...

robopaddy

doz wrote: »

As a slight aside from all the talk around the managerial situation, our kit supplier Azzuri has now been placed in examinership

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/examiner-confirmed-for-maker-of-azzuri-sportswear-29491949.html

Never liked their gear always thought it was cheap looking and couldnt help be a bit envious of how much nicer other counties gear was

robopaddy

doz wrote: »

Couldn't agree more, I would go so far as to say that the moderators should make a statement/charter as regards criticism of minor players. It is simply disgraceful to come on here openly criticising young kids who are doing their very best and representing their county and it is not the first time this member has done so.

The ironic thing is the lad mentioned is actually a super talent and still minor again next year. Doesn't know what he's talking about

robopaddy

robopaddy wrote: »

Never liked their gear always thought it was cheap looking and couldnt help be a bit envious of how much nicer other counties gear was

Hope they survive though due to the local jobs at stake and the fact they provide the bit of competition for O'Neills which is essential in any marketplace. Actually like their recent stuff to be honest. Current Decie and Donegal templates are smashing and Waterford going back to white shorts was a good move.

dzilla

WumBuster wrote: »

In no other county would this kind of debacle be tolerated.

Cork and limerick have striked/refused to play in recent years.

Mr Tibbs

Anyway isn't it great to be looking forward to a game with a Waterford team playing in September. 21yrs is a mighty long time.

lovelypoint

WumBuster wrote: »

Is there a need for a manager? Is there a need for a county board? Just let these players manage themselves and see how they get on. In no other county would this kind of debacle be tolerated. We seem to put the players up on too much of a pedastal in Waterford. Have they someone better in mind, who is affordable?

Did Ryan need to go? It was just some half hearted meeting with only half of the panel turning up, expressing their opinion, which seems to be far from unanimous. Of course we don't know what went on exactly, but maybe Ryan should have held his fire, met with the players and county board before making his decision rather than resigning immediately.

The county board may want Ryan to reconsider. I think he should take some time to reflect and do that. But my gut feeling is that the damage has been done and he will unlikely do a u-turn now. Not impressed at the way this has been handled by any of the parties involved. An absolute joke.

In fairness, the players got the poor end of the stick in '08, where with the CB showing no balls to remove Justin well before that point, the players were forced to take action, and suffered for the CB's weakness, imo. I would not be so quick to judge the players this time around either, at least until all the facts emerge, as one would have to ask, would the players have been forced to act in this manner, if they had been consulted before the CB set along with reappointing Ryan for another term, and if the players were not consulted before the CB decided to make their decision, then why weren't they. In my mind, the CB would not seem to be blameless in this, yet again.

PTH2009

dzilla wrote: »

Cork and limerick have striked/refused to play in recent years.

Please god our senoir team doesnt go on strike and we have to play a second string Waterford team for the season eg like Limerick in 2010

Mountainlad

PTH2009 wrote: »

Please god our senoir team doesnt go on strike and we have to play a second string Waterford team for the season eg like Limerick in 2010

Won't happen, don't worry

Amprodude

Who do you think would take the job inside Waterford if they aren't looking for a manager outside county?

Mr Tibbs

I heard Chuck O'Connor, Derek McGrath and Paul Flynn are very interested and this came from a fairly good source.

Amprodude

Mr Tibbs wrote: »

I heard Chuck O'Connor, Derek McGrath and Paul Flynn are very interested and this came from a fairly good source.

Flynn would be an excellent choice IMO. Great analyst. I always listening to him when he gives pre and post match analyses. Knows his stuff. Great player in his day too. I think he would get the focus right for Waterford IMO.

Limestone1

Just back and watched the minor game ...jaysus two very harsh sendings off. I'd have to wonder about all the slagging off about going for goals/"showboating" - they missed an awful pile of chances for points in the 2nd half when they were obviously taking on the shot (probably after been directed since munster) so maybe we're better off with Bennett driving at the goal !

Speak Now

Mr Tibbs wrote: »

Anyway isn't it great to be looking forward to a game with a Waterford team playing in September. 21yrs is a mighty long time.

5 years?

Deskjockey

Mullane in the Indo today saying he had nothing to do with the players looking to get rid of Michael Ryan

http://www.independent.ie/sport/hurling/john-mullane-i-had-absolutely-nothing-to-do-with-heave-against-ryan-29493698.html

Think that clears up that then.

doz

Fair play to John for putting that in print. He could have just gone on WLR and batted it off but to put in a national newspaper in his own words was a good move. If only we could get a statement from the current panel as to what had happened...

robopaddy

dzilla wrote: »

Cork and limerick have striked/refused to play in recent years.

thats because the co board and management refused to roll over

Sam Swarek

I knew Mullane or none of 2012 were involved, Mullane wouldn't be that stupid. Horrible rumours about the man who has always had the best interests in Waterford hurling at heart. Hes a pundit now and paid to give his opinions, he cant be biased towards Waterford in his articles or else he wont last too long in his job. Give the man a break and leave him be to get on with whatever he wants to get on with. its a bad case that he has to go to the media to defend his name over stupid aul rumours.

Mr Tibbs

Jerry Seinfeld wrote: »

5 years?

Its the minor team we are talking about here. Hope it doesn't turn out like that complete disaster.

Sam Swarek

Appointing Michael Ryan first day was always going to end in disaster, anyone who knew anything about Waterford hurling knew that! Im not saying its Scullys fault, but the appointment was never going to work out, he wasn't a popular choice amongst players (obviously) and amongst the knowledgable hurling people in Waterford. Its the idiotic county boards fault yet again. Maybe the players should have went after their heads instead!

Professey Chin

Sam Swarek wrote: »

Appointing Michael Ryan first day was always going to end in disaster, anyone who knew anything about Waterford hurling knew that! Im not saying its Scullys fault, but the appointment was never going to work out, he wasn't a popular choice amongst players (obviously) and amongst the knowledgable hurling people in Waterford. Its the idiotic county boards fault yet again. Maybe the players should have went after their heads instead!

And who are all these knowledgeable people? Id love to know so I could see if they're really people whos opinions actually matter or just barstoolers with an axe to grind.

chinguetti

Fair enough Sam Swarek that you're not a fan of his but this mess is something he didn't cause and he comes out of this far better than the CB and the players.

And it was the players who on the morning of a minor All Ireland semi final who met under the cover of the minor match to vote against him in some form, be it him or his management team. They could have had a meeting with the CB and Ryan and discussed this like they were all on the one track and tried to resolve any problems/issues. Does anyone remember 2008 at all?

No word from the players (they were fast enough to talk on Sunday and have now disappeared again) means that the county is ripping itself apart and putting more division in an already divided scene. I guess the players never thought that this would lead to such a mess but 2008 isn't that long ago.

noiniho

I can’t see how Donal Og would be a good fit for a county board with no money, all the battles he had with Cork county board down the years he is not a guy that will go with the flow and the money isn’t there to pay him and it wouldn’t be there to prepare the team to the standard he would expect either. He has a cussie number now on the Sunday game, he is regarded its best analyst, has his columns, the talk is he would get Eoin Kelly back, I think that is laughable, I cant see Donal Og being the kind of character to molly coddle that fool, he probably wouldn’t last a week with him! I suppose the only incentive for D, Og to do it would be to make a name for himself with an up and coming team and eventually be Cork manager, but he wont be involved with Frank Murphy around anyway.

He would be a great manager id say, but not a good fit for us at this time

Sam Swarek

Chinpool wrote: »

And who are all these knowledgeable people? Id love to know so I could see if they're really people whos opinions actually matter or just barstoolers with an axe to grind.

these knowledgable people certainly aren't most of the spoofers that post here that's for sure!! Ive certainly no axe to grind with Scully, I don't know the man but I know when it comes to hurling that he is a bluffer and should never have been left near the job first day! I said it all along that he was the wrong appointment and it was going to end badly, now Ive been vindicated!

doz

Sam Swarek wrote: »

these knowledgable people certainly aren't most of the spoofers that post here that's for sure!! Ive certainly no axe to grind with Scully, I don't know the man but I know when it comes to hurling that he is a bluffer and should never have been left near the job first day! I said it all along that he was the wrong appointment and it was going to end badly, now Ive been vindicated!

Given that there was zero interest in the job when Davy went who would you have appointed instead of Michael Ryan?

To be fair you have only been 'vindicated' because it appears that the players took the cowardly option in trying to remove him. I don't know what circles you keep company with but the vast majority of people I have spoken to in Waterford have huge sympathy for Ryan and are furious with the players.

Sam Swarek

doz wrote: »

Given that there was zero interest in the job when Davy went who would you have appointed instead of Michael Ryan?

To be fair you have only been 'vindicated' because it appears that the players took the cowardly option in trying to remove him. I don't know what circles you keep company with but the vast majority of people I have spoken to in Waterford have huge sympathy for Ryan and are furious with the players.

I have sympathy for Ryan too and it was the wrong way to go about things, the players don't look good at all. What I'm saying was that this situation would have been avoided if he hadn't been appointed in the first place, it was the wrong option from day 1, the county board should have known it would end badly. there was interest in the job, but there was no money due to the county boards inability to manage their finances. saying that, if they tried they could and should have found better than Scully.

DeiseforLiam

Amprodude wrote: »

Flynn would be an excellent choice IMO. Great analyst. I always listening to him when he gives pre and post match analyses. Knows his stuff. Great player in his day too. I think he would get the focus right for Waterford IMO.

He should clean up his twitter account and stop trolling female golfers if he's going to be in the public eye. Would make you wonder about his personality and people skills. Hurling knowledge not in doubt.

Deskjockey

noiniho wrote: »

I can’t see how Donal Og would be a good fit for a county board with no money.... the talk is he would get Eoin Kelly back, I think that is laughable, I cant see Donal Og being the kind of character to molly coddle that fool, he probably wouldn’t last a week with him!

e

Another Keyboard warrior having a cheap dig at someone who gave blood, sweat and tears for the cause of Waterford hurling for over 10 years plus. The doing that Eoin Kelly gets on here really annoys me sometimes.

I will choose to remember Eoin Kelly for the points and outrageous goals that he scored for Waterford over the first 7 or 8 years he played for us rather than the uninterested and kind of petulant player he was for the last one or two. On his day and in his prime he was an absolutely magnificent player.

robopaddy

Sam Swarek wrote: »

these knowledgable people certainly aren't most of the spoofers that post here that's for sure!! Ive certainly no axe to grind with Scully, I don't know the man but I know when it comes to hurling that he is a bluffer and should never have been left near the job first day! I said it all along that he was the wrong appointment and it was going to end badly, now Ive been vindicated!

well why dont you bugger off then for once and for all. youve been barred before yet keep coming back so we cant be that bad all the same.

A lot of genuine GAA people on here are feeling a bit low over whats happened and entitled to express their opinions and your using this to get your kicks with your 'i told ye so' attitude. get yourself a life

Sam Swarek

robopaddy wrote: »

well why dont you bugger off then for once and for all. youve been barred before yet keep coming back so we cant be that bad all the same.

A lot of genuine GAA people on here are feeling a bit low over whats happened and entitled to express their opinions and your using this to get your kicks with your 'i told ye so' attitude. get yourself a life

I was banned once before for something totally unrelated to Waterford hurling!!

im a genuine gaa man and a proud Waterford man, I don't like what has happened more than the next person.
People should really know what they are talking about before they post, the amount of cluelessness in this thread about hurling and what really goes on within the gaa in general is embarrassing.

Sam Swarek

Posters here cant even analyse a game of hurling properly. lads firing about names for potential managers without having a clue of there credentials or situation. there was 1 chap the other day saying he didn't know why the players got rid of ryan because "he heard good things inside and outside the county" about him, if the same chap didn't realise that he contradicted himself within the same sentence what business does he have been here talking smack about something he doesn't know the first thing about.

HillFarmer

Sam Swarek wrote: »

Posters here cant even analyse a game of hurling properly. lads firing about names for potential managers without having a clue of there credentials or situation. there was 1 chap the other day saying he didn't know why the players got rid of ryan because "he heard good things inside and outside the county" about him, if the same chap didn't realise that he contradicted himself within the same sentence what business does he have been here talking smack about something he doesn't know the first thing about.

What a moron! please enlighten us on how to analyse a game...

cleaboy boy

Some of the petty arguments in here are laughable, the county needs to get together as a whole and drive forward now, no point in looking back, we are in a minor All Ireland Final, let's concentrate on this, and get behind whoever is tasked with bringing our hurlers to the promised land. Some of the posters here wouldnt know a hurley if it hit them....

robopaddy

Sam Swarek wrote: »

Posters here cant even analyse a game of hurling properly. lads firing about names for potential managers without having a clue of there credentials or situation. there was 1 chap the other day saying he didn't know why the players got rid of ryan because "he heard good things inside and outside the county" about him, if the same chap didn't realise that he contradicted himself within the same sentence what business does he have been here talking smack about something he doesn't know the first thing about.

ok.

why dont you go off somewhere all your own intelligent type are then and you wont have to put up with us delinquents anymore

Ri na hEireann

I have no real insight on what happened here beyond what has been reported, but I'd have to say that the day of players being expected to go along with a project unconditionally, where they have little or no faith in the person or people guiding it are long gone and I certainly don't think we should all be lambasting them for that.

The game has changed so much over the past 5 years or so and the level of commitment required of intercounty players is outrageous; there is nothing 'amateur' about it at all. Given the time and effort involved in being a member of a county panel the county board has a duty of care to the players to ensure that they are provided with the best possible direction and guidance that can be given taking into account the individual county's relative strength, goals and resources. Waterford's medium-long term aim, I would imagine, is ultimately to be contesting for All-Ireland championships. We've have a golden era of considerable success at provincial level but we never reached the summit and all that's behind us so the appointment of a manager and management team should reflect our ambition as a county.

Equally, there has been a huge step up in professionalism at other levels within the county over the past few years, ranging from Harty teams in the county's colleges to the increase in standards at most senior clubs, and that's not even mentioning the various third-level set ups many of the panel are apart of, be it out in Carriganore or up in UCC, for example. The very least they can expect is a similar approach. They may have the physical & conditioning side down to a tee but at the end of the day a county team is at nothing in trying to develop if the modern tactical nous that is needed to get that edge over the Kilkennys and Tipps isn't there. The rise of other counties, and the reason Clare, Dublin, Cork and Limerick were this year's semi-finalists, is down to them having their systems well-adapted tactically. This idea that Waterford doesn't have the players at the moment is a nonsense. Look how far JBM has brought this Cork team in such a short amount of time! We're not short on talent but the next year or so will be decisive in seeing if we can get the best out of what we do have.

Whatever anyone in this thread feels about Michael Ryan as a person you need only know a few players involved in the senior set up to know that there isn't an abundance of faith in his capabilities as a manager of a top-level hurling county. Sam Swarek may be a bit confrontational in making his points but they do reflect some of the sentiment within the camp from what I've heard myself, and I wouldn't have any great insight at all. The players invest so much time into hurling at such a high level I think they're entitled to indicate to the county board their feelings when they feel they've reached a bit of a quagmire. In a perfect world the CB would pick up on these things and deal with them properly, but that would be expecting a bit much so these sort of things happen. Maybe it can be orchestrated more tactfully by players - be it the Cork, Limerick or Waterford hurlers - but at the same time you can't say players shouldn't have some sort of voice in the process. At the end of the day they're the ones who put in all the hours with the only reward being the the county's glory, which we all share in.

alllcounty

Sam Swarek wrote: »

Posters here cant even analyse a game of hurling properly. lads firing about names for potential managers without having a clue of there credentials or situation. there was 1 chap the other day saying he didn't know why the players got rid of ryan because "he heard good things inside and outside the county" about him, if the same chap didn't realise that he contradicted himself within the same sentence what business does he have been here talking smack about something he doesn't know the first thing about.

Many people had held michael ryan in high regard not only in waterford. After tipperary beat waterford in last years munster final Paul Curran the tipperary captain gave huge praise to michael ryan and said he was a a great man to have as a manager. He was speaking form experience from the time Ryan was at mullinahone when they were south tipp champions. On the sunday game Eddie Brennan and Liam Sheady were shocked he stepped down and both agread he had done a very good job this year.

For the past year you have been constantly negative towards Ryan and at the same time mentioning your buddy friend Derek McGrath should be manager. Derek loves himself and has a big ego as many former pupils of DLS college will tell you. He also spent a fortune in 07/08 managing DLS harty teams and it is not surprising the minister of education had to bring in a inspector to oversee the spending in the college given their huge bank loans. Derek McGrath would cripple waterford hurling financially and would piss many players off with his own self importance.

doz

Ri na hEireann wrote: »

Maybe it can be orchestrated more tactfully by players - be it the Cork, Limerick or Waterford hurlers - but at the same time you can't say players shouldn't have some sort of voice in the process. At the end of the day they're the ones who put in all the hours with the only reward being the the county's glory, which we all share in.

I think this is the crux of the issue and the opinion shared by the vast majority here. I don't think anybody is disputing that the players should not have a voice but there is a way of going about it and the way they have apparently done so has shown a huge lack of respect to a) a manger who gave a huge amount of time and committment to a cause shared by all and b) the county minor panel who were playing in Croke Park the same day.

Equally I don't think there is anybody here saying that Ryan was a fantastic irreplaceable manager. He is of course open to criticism, that is the nature of the job, and he made some mistakes which have been discussed at length here. However whatever one's opinion of him as a manager was, surely he is entitled to be treated with a bit more respect then he has been shown. I have stated already and believe that if the right channels were followed and the players expressed that they did honestly not believe that Ryan was the way forward he would have made the decision himself without being pushed into it.

tomkelly99

doz wrote: »

I think this is the crux of the issue and the opinion shared by the vast majority here. I don't think anybody is disputing that the players should not have a voice but there is a way of going about it and the way they have apparently done so has shown a huge lack of respect to a) a manger who gave a huge amount of time and committment to a cause shared by all and b) the county minor panel who were playing in Croke Park the same day.

Equally I don't think there is anybody here saying that Ryan was a fantastic irreplaceable manager. He is of course open to criticism, that is the nature of the job, and he made some mistakes which have been discussed at length here. However whatever one's opinion of him as a manager was, surely he is entitled to be treated with a bit more respect then he has been shown. I have stated already and believe that if the right channels were followed and the players expressed that they did honestly not believe that Ryan was the way forward he would have made the decision himself without being pushed into it.

Absolute nail on the head here. Noone is naive enough to think that the players do not deserve the right to give constructive feedback, whether it's positive or negative. Of course they do, they invest so much of their time in it, But to arrange a meeting like this, at the time they fixed it for and clearly without the backing of Ryan or the county board, and to decide his future based on that meeting is ridiculous.

This could have been handled so much better if the players had kept their powder dry and actually put some thought into what strategy they were going to take. They have damaged themselves hugely with their handling of this as it will be difficult for a new manager to come in and impose his authority on a squad of players he knows have basically jettisoned their previous manager.

Bottom line - of course players have the right to give feedback and let their views be known through the appropriate channels, Michael Ryan is a solid if unspectacular coach who deserved a better end to his reign than he was afforded by the players and the county board are lacking in the required leadership to clean this up as quickly as possible and put an end to the rumours and gossip that has been flying around the last few days.

This situation could be controlled but requires leadership from the board and from the players. Sadly, once again it looks like we are not going to get that leadership.

lovelypoint

doz wrote: »

I think this is the crux of the issue and the opinion shared by the vast majority here. I don't think anybody is disputing that the players should not have a voice but there is a way of going about it and the way they have apparently done so has shown a huge lack of respect to a) a manger who gave a huge amount of time and committment to a cause shared by all and b) the county minor panel who were playing in Croke Park the same day.

I'm not sure, I know there is still probably more to trickle out in this story, but until that does, and blame can be attributed correctly, I would not be in any hurry to judge.

For example, one scenario that cannot be ruled out yet, is that without any proper pulse taking from the players, that Ryan was about to be summarily reappointed for another term. If this was the case, were the players not right to make an appeal to the CB before any reappointment was made? Obviously a lot is still to emerge yet, but if the aforementioned is the what happened, I would not be lambasting the players, but rather the CB, after once again putting the players in such a position where the burden of any real leadership (and the resultant flak) is laid at the players door.

Of course, if it emerges that this was a left field coup by a selection of players, after their opinions had been solicited, then I have no sympathy for the players at all, and this looks very bad. My own personal issue, is that without any proper and full clarity as to what did happen, this is what most people would seem to be concluding.

I really do hope its not the latter.