Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12

nicklauski

gracehopper wrote: »

Isnt it great to have the two of them though? City buy them, we make them!

Oh without a doubt. It's a great problem for Fergie to have. Rooney, Chico, Welbeck, Berba, Owen & Macheda to a certain extent. Absolutely amazing options, each one bringing something different to the team.

n32

just back this morning from manchester and what a day! After all the David De Gea bashing that has gone on here since the Community Shield I had a little chuckle to myself yesterday because without him we wouldnt have won 8-2. The penalty save was crucial because we went straight down the field and Young got the second, then in the 2nd half when Arsenal had a spell of pressure he made a fantastic save from RVP which would have pulled it back to 3-2. ALso, his distribution is setting the tone for the style of play we have adopted. He s finding a man every time he kicks it out, last season too many balls were launched upfield and lost immediately. He is going to be a star of a goalkeeper.
Jones and Smalling were tremendous , they re both so comfortable with the ball at their feet coming out of defence. Evans was good but still is prone to switching off at vital times. Evra is a bit worrying at the moment, he s good going forward but defensively he looks a bit iffy.
Cleverley was excellent. His distribution and the pressure he put the Arsenal players under was first class. Ashley Young looks a bargain at 18m. He looks twice the player he did at Villa. Welbeck definitely offers more than Hernandez. Hernandez is a poacher whereas Welbeck can drop deep or out wide and be effective.
The only worry I would have from yesterday was we were almost cut open a few times by a very mediocre Arsenal team. City, Chelsea or Liverpool would have had the personnell to punish us. We still need a digger in midfield to break things up a bit because there will come a game where we wont be as fluent going forward and will have to dig in.

keane2097

Time for Evra to be dropped IMO.

Great to see Anderson and Cleverly continuing to crush, as predicted.

Ashley Young is fantastic, really shows up how terribad at managing Martin O'Neill and Gerard Houllolier are.

Felt a bit sick for Arsenal yesterday tbh, unreal performance from United though.

EDIT: Sickened for Welbeck, we definitely won't be as good without him.

MagicMarker

I was actually disappointed MOTD didn't show De Gea's double save as well as the save against RVP in the second half, which was a world class save IMO.

Will I Amnt

keane2097 wrote: »

Felt a bit sick for Arsenal yesterday tbh,

Same here,I've a lot of respect for Arsenal and the way they do things.
They're the only club who have been seriously challenging us regularly that have not benefited from the open cheque policy,would hate to see them fall apart completely.

Mitch Connor

MagicMarker wrote: »

I was actually disappointed MOTD didn't show De Gea's double save as well as the save against RVP in the second half, which was a world class save IMO.

Very annoying alright - some excellent stops (though for the double save I think the first save should have seen the ball out of play or a lot wider).

Just a quick comment on our style of performance (made on StretfordEnd.com)

With all the talk of Anderson and Cleverley doing very well so far this season, and I agree, I think they are still defensively suspect - and as such I think we need to take a look at how Phil Jones has been playing.

I think Jones' performances need to be looked at in terms of the midfield performance and shape. If you take a look at the chalkboards on the guardian site, it is clear to see how far up the pitch he is willing to come both with the ball and to get it. He is, a lot of the time, adding himself to the midfield game, which adds an extra player there for us and cuts out some of the space between the midfield players and defence that the oppo strikers may try to exploit - Ando and Cleveley do leave space behind.

For example - more than 40% of Jones' passing was in/around the halfway line, 38% of his tackles in the opposing half! 100% of his tackles, according to the chalkboard, vs Spurs were near halfway. Passing stats (from position) similar to the Arsenal game.

It may be that Jones is simply taking adavantage of the game that is playing out in front of him (we had control of both games for the most part) but I do think his ability to play so high up the pitch is a big reason for the success Cleverley and Anderson (and United) are having, and should not be overlooked.

dahat

keane2097 wrote: »

Time for Evra to be dropped IMO.

Great to see Anderson and Cleverly continuing to crush, as predicted.

Ashley Young is fantastic, really shows up how terribad at managing Martin O'Neill and Gerard Houllolier are.

Felt a bit sick for Arsenal yesterday tbh, unreal performance from United though.

EDIT: Sickened for Welbeck, we definitely won't be as good without him.

Alot of us here calling for the same,he has been poor a long time..FB looks like an area that needs bulking up next summer..

Hulk Hands

People are underrating Hernandez' technical ability here a bit. His touch mightn't be as slick as say Rooney but its by no means poor. The most important thing though is pace. Everything he does is lightning and that has been the single biggest trend of United's season so far. Sheer and utter pace throughout the side, its great to watch.

Hernandez didn't even play well yesterday but was still heavily involved and caused a sending off. He is a constant headache and makes the space for Rooney to flourish. An integral starter this season imo, even accounting for Welbecks brilliant form

Mitch Connor

dahat wrote: »

Alot of us here calling for the same,he has been poor a long time..FB looks like an area that needs bulking up next summer..

Izaguirre said that there were supposed to be talks with United late in the summer - he has done well at left back for Celtic, looks a very good player. I do wonder if the plan was to bring him in this summer as competition for Evra, and ruined by the injury he got which ruled him out til next year.

DM_7

Thats an interesting point about Jones. I wonder if having Smalling beside him helps as he has two centre backs to provide cover when he pushes up.

Nani, Young and Rooney are also appear to be taking up central positions at times to provide back up.

dahat

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Izaguirre said that there were supposed to be talks with United late in the summer - he has done well at left back for Celtic, looks a very good player. I do wonder if the plan was to bring him in this summer as competition for Evra, and ruined by the injury he got which ruled him out til next year.

Do remember that being quoted here alright,he does look a good alternative to Evra just now.
Fabio should get a run there at some point as Fergie has shown himself to be ruthless if he feels Evra is a weak link..

Son Of A Vidic

Life is good today.

Mitch Connor

DM-ICE wrote: »

Thats an interesting point about Jones. I wonder if having Smalling beside him helps as he has two centre backs to provide cover when he pushes up.

Nani, Young and Rooney are also appear to be taking up central positions at times to provide back up.

Smalling has been basically playing as a right winger in the last two games - so I don't think he has helped Jones too much so far!! But yeah, I do think the positioning and use of Smalling could be to provide more solid full back cover (in games where we need it).

dahat

Also we now have Fletcher back to add some numbers to the middle if we need it in any games..
A midfield of Ando--Clev--Fletcher,plenty energy and legs there if we need it

Hulk Hands

I'm not sure if Fergie is comfortable with Fabio on the left. He seems more comfortable on the right and was great there last season. We could always put Evans out there although we may lose a bit going forward. I'd personally be all for giving Fabio a run out.

I remember reading ratings of games 2 seasons back and you'd rarely see Evra without an average of at least 8 in every game. Mental to even think he was droppable back then

keane2097

I personally would be very slow to drop Phil Jones or Smalling, regardless of anybody else's fitness.

I'd have either of the twins in ahead of Evra at the moment if they're fit.

Commit to the youth thing and punish Evra for coasting at the same time.

Blatter

It's amazing that we probably have 4 of the best 6/7 centre backs in the league.

Definitely the best collection in Europe.

jambofc

@mitch,agree about the ando/tom defensive side of the game,before we took over completely yesterday there were times arse passed through our midfield with ease,i cant see that partnership playing against strong midfield opposition,watching tom closely a lot does seem to pass him by at times,your thoughts?

DM_7

Just thinking, Welbeck had a hamstring injury last season and it kept him out for two months. I hope he isn't going to keep suffering muscle injuries like that. He is still growing and putting on muscle, would that be a factor in these injuries?

The_Kew_Tour

I be honest I was a little skeptical about Young coming to United, but now 18million or whatever we paid for him looks a bargain..

Anderson so far is proving me right, keep it up.

I am bloody looking forward to Bolton match already.

Mitch Connor

jambofc wrote: »

@mitch,agree about the ando/tom defensive side of the game,before we took over completely yesterday there were times arse passed through our midfield with ease,i cant see that partnership playing against strong midfield opposition,watching tom closely a lot does seem to pass him by at times,your thoughts?

I have said it quite a bit - defensively Cleverley and Ando are suspect and mainly I would put that down to Cleverley not being positionally sure on defense. In fairness to him though, I don't think he has much experience at playing a 42 central midfield role, so it is a learning experience for him. We will get into trouble as a result of this, but long term it may pay off fantastically. I'm willing to see how it develops anyway - but it is a worry, especially short term.

Le King

Evra has been sitting too comfortably in his position despite being poor for a year. Time to give Fabio a go at left back.

homerjay2005

MagicMarker wrote: »

I was actually disappointed MOTD didn't show De Gea's double save as well as the save against RVP in the second half, which was a world class save IMO.

they only had about 10 or 12 minutes to show all the footage and when there is a red card, a missed peno, rooney off the bar to add into 10 goals, its easy to see why they couldnt show the saves!

who knows what might have happened yesterday had he not dived that way for the peno, 1-1 and same goes for his 4th save, that came at 3-1. we would still have won the game, but maybe it would have been 5-2 or something had it not been for de gea yesterday. for those saying he hadnt alot to do, arsenal had 15 shots on target and 4 of his saves were top top notch. we decided to go gung ho yesterday, even jones was playing as an attcking fullback at times.

just watched the highlights actually and had forgotten a few things -

park scored again against arsenal!!!

how on earth did that russian **** not get sent off for his tackle on young? potential ankle breaker and of course, sods law - webb missed it and 5 seconds later welbeck got injured. had he blown up to give the red card like he should have done, united would have taken him off (welbeck had signalled to the bench that he was feeling his hamstring)..horrible bad luck.

was really looking forward to the england match friday night, possibly 6 united players starting though not sure if he would go with jones/rio, i think only one of them would start and welbeck out now too. smalling, rio, young and rooney should all start, cleverly wont be far off selection also.

assuming we get no injuries, we should have everybody back for selection after the international break which just sums up our stunning squad at the moment.

Le King

Mitch Connor wrote: »

jambofc wrote: »

@mitch,agree about the ando/tom defensive side of the game,before we took over completely yesterday there were times arse passed through our midfield with ease,i cant see that partnership playing against strong midfield opposition,watching tom closely a lot does seem to pass him by at times,your thoughts?

I have said it quite a bit - defensively Cleverley and Ando are suspect and mainly I would put that down to Cleverley not being positionally sure on defense. In fairness to him though, I don't think he has much experience at playing a 42 central midfield role, so it is a learning experience for him. We will get into trouble as a result of this, but long term it may pay off fantastically. I'm willing to see how it develops anyway - but it is a worry, especially short term.

That was my worry Mitch when we were talking about Cleverley at the end of last season. I'm glad to have been proven wrong in many ways. I think he will develop that side of his game with a run of games. I'm really happy with our new midfield duo.

keane2097

Defensively suspect central midfielders who preside over a 13 goal first three games of the season?

I'll have that, ty.

MagicMarker

I'd say it'll be Jones and Smalling in the middle as Rio isn't in the squad.

edit: lol, I'm completely forgetting about Terry. Fúck it, Jones/Smalling > Terry/Lescott.

JimsAlterEgo

homerjay2005 wrote: »

they only had about 10 or 12 minutes to show all the footage and when there is a red card, a missed peno, rooney off the bar to add into 10 goals, its easy to see why they couldnt show the saves!

who knows what might have happened yesterday had he not dived that way for the peno, 1-1 and same goes for his 4th save, that came at 3-1. we would still have won the game, but maybe it would have been 5-2 or something had it not been for de gea yesterday. for those saying he hadnt alot to do, arsenal had 15 shots on target and 4 of his saves were top top notch. we decided to go gung ho yesterday, even jones was playing as an attcking fullback at times.

just watched the highlights actually and had forgotten a few things -

park scored again against arsenal!!!

how on earth did that russian **** not get sent off for his tackle on young? potential ankle breaker and of course, sods law - webb missed it and 5 seconds later welbeck got injured. had he blown up to give the red card like he should have done, united would have taken him off (welbeck had signalled to the bench that he was feeling his hamstring)..horrible bad luck.

was really looking forward to the england match friday night, possibly 6 united players starting though not sure if he would go with jones/rio, i think only one of them would start and welbeck out now too. smalling, rio, young and rooney should all start, cleverly wont be far off selection also.

assuming we get no injuries, we should have everybody back for selection after the international break which just sums up our stunning squad at the moment.

don't want any of them to play, could see a few getting "injured" this week

VW 1

First chance to post since getting back last night.

Absolutely amazing game to have witnessed. Free flowing football that leaves you lost for words. Two superb finishes from Young. Rooney's unbelievable free kicks (ff captain:p). Ando's actions with chesney were hilarious before the first free, every time he moved to try to see the ball Ando reflected his movement, up down side to side it was hilarious. Then when Rooney scored the faces Ando pulled at him. Brilliant. If he wasn't a footballer he would be living in a mental institute!

Jones is really turning out to be some player thus far, at one stage he was overlapping Nani on the right wing while Smalling held position at CB. So relaxed calm and assured with the ball at his feet and so solid defensively too.

Delighted for De Gea he was fantastic apart from one mistake (which was caused by a defensive brainfart and he shouldnt have been put in the position IMO) but the saves he made some were world class and others were crucial. Fair play to the lad he is looking stronger with every game.

Delighted the Cleverley and Ando pairing is still looking good even if it isnt the most defensive, with the amount of possession we are retaining it almost balances out.

Just a great day to be a United fan, so proud of the lads and how they have been playing so far.

homerjay2005

really difficult 3 games coming up, bolton (a), chelsea (h) and stoke (a), then liverpool (a) is not far away also.

why do we always get a sh*t away game after international break...

city could win their 3 and open up a gap

Le King

keane2097 wrote: »

Defensively suspect central midfielders who preside over a 13 goal first three games of the season?

I'll have that, ty.

That's true. You have to look at it both ways.

How does everybody feel on Rio and Vidic coming back?

Do you think they should walk back in? Evans is still suspect for me.

Wouldn't mind seeing Rafael Smalling Jones Fabio in the near future.

Blatter

I'd put big money on us beating Chelsea at OT at this moment in time.

Le King

Blatter wrote: »

I'd put big money on us beating Chelsea at OT at this moment in time.

@23/10 - I won't be, have a bit of faith. Chelsea have looked really poor so far this season, despite getting decent results. Don't understand that tbh.

EDIT: lol read that as if you were backing Chelsea. Ooops!

Peyton Manning

Le King wrote: »

@23/10 - I won't be, have a bit of faith. Chelsea have looked really poor so far this season, despite getting decent results. Don't understand that tbh.

That can't be true surely? I doub't we've ever been more than 2/1 for a home win

Edit: n/m, seen your edit!

The_Kew_Tour

it was kinda funny, but after scoring 8 fine goals it was actually the penalty save that most of the crowd seemed to go nuts for the most yesterday

Le King

Tom_Brady wrote: »

That can't be true surely? I doub't we've ever been more than 2/1 for a home win

Edit: n/m, seen your edit!

You would be lucky to get us at 2/1!

Blatter

What are we to beat them, 8/11 or something like that?

Sure we've won something like 16/17 games in a row at OT in the PL and Chelsea have looked cat so far.

Le King

Blatter wrote: »

What are we to beat them, 8/11 or something like that?

Sure we've won something like 16/17 games in a row at OT in the PL and Chelsea have looked cat so far.

21/20 with VC at the moment. I think we are evens with Ladbrokes.

Blatter

Le King wrote: »

21/20 with VC at the moment. I think we are evens with Ladbrokes.

That is very tasty I must say. I'd be surprised if we weren't backed into below evens when the game gets closer.

VW 1

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

it was kinda funny, but after scoring 8 fine goals it was actually the penalty save that most of the crowd seemed to go nuts for the most yesterday

The whole crowd at OT have been amazing to DeGea the last two games, constantly behind him and cheering/chanting when he does anything at all of note. It really is refreshing and fantastic to see them not getting on his back for a lapse in concentration.

His distribution is sick, he constantly finds players with his balls out rarely punting upfield unless he has no other options. He seems to love the diagonal ball out to Smalling when he is hugging the touchline halfway between the edge of the box and the halfway line. His accuracy borders on scary. His long balls up to Hernandez I think he played 3 or 4 were all perfect. His set up of quick incisive counter-attacks will win us vital points this year mark my words.

s_carnage

VW 1 wrote: »

The whole crowd at OT have been amazing to DeGea the last two games, constantly behind him and cheering/chanting when he does anything at all of note. It really is refreshing and fantastic to see them not getting on his back for a lapse in concentration.

His distribution is sick, he constantly finds players with his balls out rarely punting upfield unless he has no other options. He seems to love the diagonal ball out to Smalling when he is hugging the touchline halfway between the edge of the box and the halfway line. His accuracy borders on scary. His long balls up to Hernandez I think he played 3 or 4 were all perfect. His set up of quick incisive counter-attacks will win us vital points this year mark my words.

Ya there was one ball he played to Chico yesterday was just amazing. Think it was from a corner or something but with a quick kick out he planted it straight on Hernandez toe. Just a shame he was offside. He is going to be a huge asset with regards our quick counter attacks this season.

Backstreet Moyes

I really cant believe after yesterdays result i come on to see the things that have been said i cant wait for Sean's reaction when we lose a game. I cant argue with you De Gea has made some mistakes but i cant believe your comments about Wellbeck. He has started 2 scored 2 and got an assist what more do you want. Imo he is a better played than Carroll who Liverpool fans are excited about. But i supposse he cost 35 million so he must be better. I mean your comment all United strikers sohuld be worth 30 million. What are you smoking Fergie turns promising players into world class players and is doing it again with this squad. If you want to ignore youth and splash stupid money around go support City or Madrid. My only worry with Wellbeck is he seems a bit injury prone. He was doing well last year with Sunderland before he got injured. I do think we need a destroyer in midfield Anderson and Clev are grand at home when we are going to have alot of posession but away from home we could be too open.

The_Kew_Tour

VW 1 wrote: »

The whole crowd at OT have been amazing to DeGea the last two games, constantly behind him and cheering/chanting when he does anything at all of note. It really is refreshing and fantastic to see them not getting on his back for a lapse in concentration.

His distribution is sick, he constantly finds players with his balls out rarely punting upfield unless he has no other options. He seems to love the diagonal ball out to Smalling when he is hugging the touchline halfway between the edge of the box and the halfway line. His accuracy borders on scary. His long balls up to Hernandez I think he played 3 or 4 were all perfect. His set up of quick incisive counter-attacks will win us vital points this year mark my words.

In fairness down the years United fans have always got behind their players be it young lad or somebody out of form e.g Andy Cole...

Ya I think he turn out be great buy..He has made mistakes but all goalkeepers do and he only going to get better...

yesterday will have been big boost to him

VW 1

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

In fairness down the years United fans have always got behind their players be it young lad or somebody out of form e.g Andy Cole...

Ya I think he turn out be great buy..He has made mistakes but all goalkeepers do and he only going to get better...

yesterday will have been big boost to him

As I am sure has already been said about him, it is rather unfortunate that a mistake will often times lead to a goal conceded where DeGea is concerned and certain people will get on his back because of this.

If Cleverley makes a wrong choice with a pass and possession is given away it is probably not even noticed.

But no doubt the more games and confidence that DeGea gets the fewer his mistakes will become and he will go on to be top class for us.

Has anyone heard of any rumoured interest for PIG to move on or is he going to hold out for his free transfer at the end of next year?

Patsy fyre

Only 2 players that started yesterday, started the champions league final, bizarre!

Blatter

That's a good point about Welbeck being better than Carroll. I suppose it's all about opinions but I wouldn't swap Danny for him anyway.

VW 1

Patsy fyre wrote: »

Only 2 players that started yesterday, started the champions league final, bizarre!

Same team 3 games in a row too isnt it? It was something like 150 or so games without playing the same team twice up to a point last season, and now the same team has started against WBA, Spurs and Arsenal.

VW 1

Blatter wrote: »

That's a good point about Welbeck being better than Carroll. I suppose it's all about opinions but I wouldn't swap Danny for him anyway.

I never really understood the hype at all regarding Carroll, I genuinely thought it was a joke on deadline day when my mate was texting me with the updates on how high the bids were going. Sure he is big and can score with his head but he isnt prolific by any means with either his head or that "left boot" we hear bigged up so much. And its not as if his link up play is out of this world either.

Given a straight choice between him and Danny I would have Danny every day of the week, all money aside. I wonder how pool fans would feel about that.

Predalien

On the whole De Gea thing, once he has three or four mistake free games in a row he'll be fine I'd say, have to say I'm a little disappointed with him so far though, did not expect him to make a major error in each of his first 4 games. If he was a few years older he would be dropped for a few games. Glad for the inernational break though as it'll give him a break from the pressure.

Aside from that 8-2 was incredible, do feel for Arsenal fans though, they've been the only team to really challenge Fergie since he got United winning trophies, and the invincible team was arguably as good as any of the great United sides of the last twenty years.

Vanbis

VW 1 wrote: »

Given a straight choice between him and Danny I would have Danny every day of the week, all money aside. I wonder how pool fans would feel about that.

Not the biggest fan of Welbeck but he fully deserves his chance having scored two goals and a super assist. I'm starting to like him the more i see and i hope he gets his fair share of games this season. Unlucky with the injury too. I think he would've scored a couple of more yesterday had he stayed on.

Predalien

VW 1 wrote: »

Sure he is big and can score with his head but he isnt prolific by any means with either his head or that "left boot" we hear bigged up so much. And its not as if his link up play is out of this world either.

Given a straight choice between him and Danny I would have Danny every day of the week, all money aside. I wonder how pool fans would feel about that.

I think Carroll is pretty rubbish with his head! I guess like some of United's purchases a huge chunk of it was based on potential , very impressed with Danny though, like Hernandez last year his stlye seems to suit playing alongside Rooney and gets the best out of both of them.