Am I wrong?

housetypeb

I'm a landlord,I let a 4 bed house to 4 students who jointly signed a lease for a 9 month period.
Before they moved in ,one student told me that there was a chance he might have to leave after after six months,fair enough, when the six months were up he told me he was being transferred, so I returned his deposit.
Then two others told me that they were moving out as they had only a few classes left in their term,I wasn't happy about that but at the same time didn't think it's fair to make somebody stay against their will.
They told me that i could keep their deposit as compensation for breaking the lease early,to which I agreed.
That left one guy in there for the last two months of the agreed term of the lease, he continued paying his 1/4 share of the total rent.
I had intended to return his deposit but my accountant told me that I was the one that was owned money here.
So I informed the student that I would not be returning his deposit because he had broken the lease by only paying 1/4 of the rent due.
Next thing, I had himself and his father out to my home,demanding his money and telling me that he was broke and had to have his money now.
He was at times bullying and at times cajoling,telling me he would picket my house etc, that he would take me to court-ignoring me when i pointed out that he would have to go through the prtb first and that his son had signed a contract.
Eventually I said I would return his deposit next month to get rid of him,as he seemed very stressed and volatile.
Now,I think that I am better off paying him and putting this behind me and moving on, but at the same time angry at his insistence that he was right and I was wrong,
So, what do you boardies think is the right thing to do here?

jesus_thats_gre

housetypeb wrote: »

I'm a landlord,I let a 4 bed house to 4 students who jointly signed a lease for a 9 month period.
Before they moved in ,one student told me that there was a chance he might have to leave after after six months,fair enough, when the six months were up he told me he was being transferred, so I returned his deposit.
Then two others told me that they were moving out as they had only a few classes left in their term,I wasn't happy about that but at the same time didn't think it's fair to make somebody stay against their will.
They told me that i could keep their deposit as compensation for breaking the lease early,to which I agreed.
That left one guy in there for the last two months of the agreed term of the lease, he continued paying his 1/4 share of the total rent.
I had intended to return his deposit but my accountant told me that I was the one that was owned money here.
So I informed the student that I would not be returning his deposit because he had broken the lease by only paying 1/4 of the rent due.
Next thing, I had himself and his father out to my home,demanding his money and telling me that he was broke and had to have his money now.
He was at times bullying and at times cajoling,telling me he would picket my house etc, that he would take me to court-ignoring me when i pointed out that he would have to go through the prtb first and that his son had signed a contract.
Eventually I said I would return his deposit next month to get rid of him,as he seemed very stressed and volatile.
Now,I think that I am better off paying him and putting this behind me and moving on, but at the same time angry at his insistence that he was right and I was wrong,
So, what do you boardies think is the right thing to do here?

This one guy paid his rent up to the end of the agreed term, is that right?

housetypeb

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

This one guy paid his rent up to the end of the agreed term, is that right?

Yes,but lease is for house and not room.

i71jskz5xu42pb

This is the only guy that stayed the term and you are punishing him for the other people having left early - even though you allowed those people to go.

Contractually you might be right but in terms of fairness you are being a bit unfair to the guy.

seanybiker

Personally I think it me man was grand. Its not his fault the rest of them moved out. Surely you dont want him to pay four times what he was paying?

housetypeb

Jazlynn Prehistoric Ceiling wrote: »

This is the only guy that stayed the term and you are punishing him for the other people having left early - even though you allowed those people to go.

Contractually you might be right but in terms of fairness you are being a bit unfair to the guy.

I agree.I said I would pay him now, just wondering who's right here.

Irish_Elect_Eng

Hmmm....

While you sound like quite a decent landlord, I think that you are wrong here.

You either had 1 contract with all 4 students:

In which case you agreed to the contract being broken when you let the first 3 students move out early, at that point you could have insisted that the 4th student move out as the contract was over, but you continued to accept his money and as such implicitly agreed to the new contractual situation.

Or you had individual contracts with each student:

In which case the 4th tenant fulfilled the full contract and you chose to penalise him by not returning his deposit.

Returning the deposit is the correct thing to do in this case.

housetypeb

HE did sign a lease jointly with the other lads,making them all liable for the full rent.
Its for my own peace of mind that I am trying to figure out whether i was right or wrong.
I intend to pay him as his father seemed very on the edge,stressed,and I don't want him doing something silly to either himself or me and mine.
Like I said,Its easier to pay him and move on .

housetypeb

Irish_Elect_Eng wrote: »

Hmmm....

While you sound like quite a decent landlord, I think that you are wrong here.

You either had 1 contract with all 4 students:

In which case you agreed to the contract being broken when you let the first 3 students move out early, at that point you could have insisted that the 4th student move out as the contract was over, but you continued to accept his money and as such implicitly agreed to the new contractual situation.

I saw it that way too.,before my accountant friend made me greedy,i guess.

Or you had individual contracts with each student:

In which case the 4th tenant fulfilled the full contract and you chose to penalise him by not returning his deposit.

Returning the deposit is the correct thing to do in this case.

Fair enough.

No1J

You broke the terms of the lease first by showing favor to the first guy that left, you excepted a gift of money from the next 2, and the last guy doesn't want to pay, I don't blame him. You got 50%, take it and move on.
It's all part of the fun of being a Land lord.
For the sake of €200-€300 it isn't worth it.
Ask him to sign an end of lease form stating that he had his deposit returned to him, then finish on good terms as I'm sure you have windows to think about.

invinciblePRSTV

You and your accountant OP are some pieces of work. Trying to stitch it all on the one guy who did everything like he was supposed to? You should read back your first post and see how ridiculous your position looks.

Snakeblood

invinciblePRSTV wrote: »

You and your accountant OP are some pieces of work. Trying to stitch it all on the one guy who did everything like he was supposed to? You should read back your first post and see how ridiculous your position looks.

To be fair to him, he's reconsidering his position. That is good.

mebird

invinciblePRSTV wrote: »

You and your accountant OP are some pieces of work. Trying to stitch it all on the one guy who did everything like he was supposed to? You should read back your first post and see how ridiculous your position looks.

The only mistake he made was listening to his accountant, who was correct in that tenants are jointly and severally liable. But knowing a little and not enough is dangerous.

As Irish_Elect_Eng indicated, it sounds like he verbally agreed a new tenancy with the last tenant when the others moved out.... which the accountant did not consider.

maryk123

at the end of the day treat people how you would like to be treated yourself and you wont go wrong.

you were happy until you spoke to your accountant. in fairness the tenant could have stayed there til the end of the month and just not paid you and kept the money but he was being honest and because of that he and his family have been dealing with a lot of stress.

you are doing the right thing now

he is in the right - the others were dealt with favourably and he ended up with the hassle

D3PO

Legally your not entitled to keep it. You are entitled to chase them for any rent owed jointly if they signed a joint lease.

Howeveer the fact you let 3 of them break that least probably sets precedent and you would likely lose in the event of pursuing this route.

Either way the discussion shouldnt even come to that. The one guy who stuck to the end of the term is the one your trying to screw. How hard is it to take a step back and see what kind of slumlord that would make you ?

give the guy his deposit back and stop being such an ass.

catch me if you can

I am a landlady. I too have 4 seperate people living in my rented house. I never ever tie poeople into a year lease or even a 6 month one. i work on the basis if you give me one months you get your deposit back. I think this is fair.
These guys are students and even if they werent i totally disagree with with holding peoples deposits if they have given you a months notice.
A deposit is not your money. I put my deposits into the credit union and do not touch them they belong to my tenants.
Also i think you should apologise to the young man in question and tell him you were going under ill advised advice and that you are in the wrong. and write him up a glowing reference too.
word of mouth about bad landlords can spread, you should apologise

wyndham

housetypeb wrote: »

That left one guy in there for the last two months of the agreed term of the lease, he continued paying his 1/4 share of the total rent.

You are in the wrong here. You agreed to this arrangement. Did it not occur to you at the time to object to this, given that you would be out of pocket in a big way? It was nasty of you to try and withhold the deposit at the 11th hour. Did you tell your accountant that you had agreed to alter the terms of the lease and accept one quarter rent? Very amateurish behaviour tbh and the country is full of landlords such as yourself with no idea how to operate professionally.

jmayo

I do think OP decided at last minute on advise from accountant to try and recoup some of the income that they had willingly agreed to forego by letting the other 3 guys out of the lease early.

No wonder the guy and his father were pis*ed.
The last tenant had stayed till the end and watched the other guys be allowed get out of their part of the contract.
Meanwhile they had not been told that they were going to be screwed because they were going to stay the distance.

Next time OP should make it clear that tenants either stay the term or they have to find adequate replacements if they leave before termination.