Make Drogheda Toll Free

bigneacy

borderlinemeath wrote: »

While the congestion in Drogheda has improved, it shouldn't be congested at all but town planners seem to have another agenda. Have a read of the thread about the amount of traffic lights through the town on the existing roads!

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056286668

Try using the existing roads at rush hour in the morning when little darlings are being dropped off to school or the Dublin Road each way for the past few days while the Marsh Rd was closed? Poorhouse lane was also closed for months due to a wall that the HSE were responsible for collapsed and they dragged out fixing it for months on end.

At least Dundalk has the bypass down by the coes road, plenty of roundabouts and freeflowing traffic. Something Drogheda is severly lacking.

But these points are all to do with Drogheda Borough Council and the town planners - not the NRA, CRG or RSA, HSE, RTE, AIB, MTV, FAI or any other 3 letter word places. (:pac:)

The travesty that is west street and the general lack of development in and around drogheda in terms of decent free flowing arterial town routes are down to a local issue, not to do with the motorway. The Drogheda town planners don't benefit from increased tolls.

Perhaps this is the real fight that Cllr. Healy (O'Heilligh?) should be going after, not a nonsensical and unrealistic campaign against a private company who own that stretch of Motorway.

Lord TSC

bigneacy wrote: »

Apparently not.

Its what drives me nuts about a lot of local politicians and internet petitions in general; they sound great in theory and are obviously designed to generate good publicity but when you ask for alternatives or the practicallities, those aspects of the debate get ignored

borderlinemeath

bigneacy wrote: »

But these points are all to do with Drogheda Borough Council and the town planners - not the NRA, CRG or RSA, HSE, RTE, AIB, MTV, FAI or any other 3 letter word places. (:pac:)

The travesty that is west street and the general lack of development in and around drogheda in terms of decent free flowing arterial town routes are down to a local issue, not to do with the motorway. The Drogheda town planners don't benefit from increased tolls.

Perhaps this is the real fight that Cllr. Healy (O'Heilligh?) should be going after, not a nonsensical and unrealistic campaign against a private company who own that stretch of Motorway.

The town planners don't benefit from the tolls, but I do feel there are other powers at work here.
Why would the Dept of Transport give Drogheda Borough Council funds to build an arterial route when the motorway is there. ie forcing people to use the tolls.

There's never a queue at the mini tolls on the ramps into the town. I would be interested to know the breakdown of the intake at the mini tolls as opposed to the main toll.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

end a eknny wrote: »

you just love to give away money dont you

Do you pay for anything??:rolleyes:

amacachi

I shall ask again so. Have any pre-existing roads had tolls placed on them?

bigneacy

amacachi wrote: »

I shall ask again so. Have any pre-existing roads had tolls placed on them?

Are you asking the forum in general or is the question directed towards digitaldarragh?

Kaylee

amacachi wrote: »

I shall ask again so. Have any pre-existing roads had tolls placed on them?

No, is the answer.

You are, in my view, missing the point.

The point is that the town has been 'developed' but the road infrastructure has not. So the pre existing roads which are not tolled are currently inadequate. I don't imagine the money is there to build another public road.

I get the point about the private road and the investment and the expected return etc. It's unfortunate that public need is not served by the current set up.

Ruth85

Right I had read the tread and I find most of the comments negative. The normal person in drogheda is being affected by this charge weather it be congestion within the town or financially. I am a mother of two children and a worker. During the school year I must leave my household extremely early to get to the school on time and then I have to try and get to work with the traffic flow on the main street crazy. I know people who suffer with this on a daily basis weather they use public transport or a private car everyone is affected.

It is a unnecessary charge to go into our town. It is costly if you go trough it regularly.

Also I see alot of people attacking a man for trying to do right, something he seems to believe in. Just because he is a councilor.

And in fact if yous had a problem a councilor would be the first people you would contact if yous had a problem like housing, anti social behavior , housing adaption grants and various other issues. Stop complaining about the person and talk about the real issue here. The Drogheda Tolls.

I would encourage anyone to sign the petition if yous are against the tolls on www.makedroghedatollfree.com. If your not fine that is your choice, just dont rant to me about it.

CMpunked

Welcome to a discussion forum, Ruth! :pac:

Lord TSC

Kaylee wrote: »

I get the point about the private road and the investment and the expected return etc. It's unfortunate that public need is not served by the current set up.

Well, that's slightly debatable. The road certainly does serve the public, provided what you need is a road which can get you to Dublin quick. I'm old enough now to remember the days when a trip to Dublin would take hours and hours of battling through little towns. In terms of making life easier on the commuter who has to travel up and down to Dublin, it has served the public, albeit at a price.

I do understand what people are saying about roads around the town not being adequete enough to cope with the overflow of people who don't want to pay, but personally, I think that's an issue with different solutions; regular user discounts, trucks being allowed to get through tolls free so they aren't eating up the roads, better roads around the town, etc would all help.

Its just, to me, to say "NO MORE TOLLS!" is a tad naive of a stand point, but one prevelant in Ireland. We want the benefits of an improved infrastructure but don't want the cost.

What this really comes down to is whether you're happy to pay for the benefit of a shorter journey or not. Excuse me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't you have had long journeys, congestion in the same places and so forth before the toll road as well? Maybe I'm too young now, and my memory is a little inadequete, but the problems people are blaming on the toll....would they have not been there before that road was opened and allowed people to speed past Drogheda and on to Dublin?

CMpunked

I figured out the solution..
We need to get rid of that feckin river! That's the one causing all this mess!!

bigneacy

Ruth85 wrote: »

.... just dont rant to me about it.

Sorry ruth....











:pac:

Kaylee

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

What this really comes down to is whether you're happy to pay for the benefit of a shorter journey or not. Excuse me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't you have had long journeys, congestion in the same places and so forth before the toll road as well? Maybe I'm too young now, and my memory is a little inadequete, but the problems people are blaming on the toll....would they have not been there before that road was opened and allowed people to speed past Drogheda and on to Dublin?

Well... not really, because there are now two busy retail parks on either side of the town - Woodies/Smyths etc. on one side and TKMaxx/HomeStore& More etc. and Tesco Extra on the other. I don't know to be honest, but I presume that some or maybe a lot of the pressure on the Mell Rd. and Trinity Street is because of people from the 'far side' using the M1 Retail Park? and vice versa with the Donore Road. Also adding traffic to the canal. The landscape of the town has changed.

People who work in Dundalk and want avoid the Toll are using Mell also. Before the Motorway they used Georges street and their only option of the old Dundalk road. So you're right it is probably quicker for them than the old way, even with having to go up Mell to avoid the Toll - however, that doesn't solve the traffic issue on the Mell Road!

I think that you made a few great suggestions there with regard the Toll and these will probably be more palatable to the company that runs it.

By the way, somebody mentioned the affordability of the toll for commuters - many, many people who drive to Dublin to work or run businesses have taken pay cuts have other things to spend 18 euros on. And I remember the old Drogheda Dublin road also - one long slow car conveyer belt

Cllr. Ken O Heiligh

Hello to all.


An oral hearing on the Tolls took place in the Glenside Hotel Dublin road Drogheda on Tuesday 12 March 2002.
Mr Dom Hegarty BE Dip T & Cp Chartered Town Planner issued a report reflecting the proceedings of the hearing
Dom Hegarty did confirm in his assessment that Drogheda would be affected in a way that none of the other towns on the M1 corridor. 'Traffic moving in and around Drogheda is going to be inconvenienced in a way that it would not be there if there was no tolling'.

So we are now attempting to address this issue and minimise the negative impact of the the ramp Toll on our Town . We do not underestimate the challenge ahead. The support of the public is vital and we would urge people to sign in large numbers and send a clear message to those with the power to have the ramp Tolls removed from Drogheda. Visit our online petition on www.makedroghedatollfree.com and have your say. But this is not just an online petition we have set up stall and collected signitures from the public.

The Mayor of Drogheda Cllr. Kevin Callan said he was delighted to support the efforts to remove the ramp tolls on Drogheda and that he was delighted to have been invited to sign the petition.

"No one can be in any doubt that the tolls are having a negative impact on Drogheda and the ramp tolls at the Donore junction in particular. I have signed the petition which was presented to me by Cllr. O Heiligh and I will formally be seeking the approval of all of my Borough Council colleagues to have the petition formally accepted by the Council and placed in the lobby of the Borough Council from September where everyone living and working in the town can show their support for this effort".

The removal of the ramp Tolls campaign has recived the backing of all political partie in Drogheda and with two local TD's in Government we expect to make headway.

CMpunked

Fair dues Cllr, if you can make that happen then I suppose some views of you is to be changed.

Lord TSC

@Cllr.

Could you address...

Also, is there any chance of getting a response to the issue of "The toll is needed to pay for the lovely new ammenities provided"?

@Kaylee

I'll respond in the morning in more detail since its late now but thanks for that post

longhalloween

bigneacy wrote: »

That's your choice. The M1 motorway and the Donore road interchange was not built for the convenience of Drogheda residents.

Then why oh why are retail parks located strategically at J9 (Donore Rd Retail Park and J10 (M1 Retail Park) of the motorway.

I understand that they weren't built for our convenience but since we had to put up with years of construction and inconvenience as well as the noise from the damn thing maybe they could cut us some slack, remove the toll into the town itself and retain the toll along the actual motorway so the people they DID build it for can pay for it.

Who's going to pay for this idea?

CMpunked

Can someone just confirm, there are only one set of tolls to enter the town at donore on the south side, correct?

borderlinemeath

CMpunked wrote: »

Can someone just confirm, there are only one set of tolls to enter the town at donore on the south side, correct?

If you enter Drogheda at J10 (Drogheda North/M1 Retail Pk) you don't pay the toll on your way in. However if you exit at J9 (Drogheda Retail Pk) then you exit onto the motorway and pay the toll at the main toll plaza.

If you enter Drogheda at J9 then you pay the toll on the slip road. If you exit Drogheda the same way you have to pay the toll going North on the slip road or south on the main toll plaza. However if you ask for a receipt at the slip road, this provides payment at the main toll plaza to avoid paying twice within a 3hr limit.

While main Drogheda residents are aware of this, the majority of visitors, business or pleasure are probably not. And it's certainly not advertised approaching the toll, I think there may be an a4 sized sign at the booth but the assistants taking your money don't tell you about it. The only place to find details are on the NRA website.

The only way to avoid the toll southbound is to enter at J10 and exit at Julianstown, a long diversion.

locum-motion

CMpunked wrote: »

Can someone just confirm, there are only one set of tolls to enter the town at donore on the south side, correct?

I can confirm that there is no toll to enter any town anywhere in the country.
In various locations, there are tolls to use certain specified stretches of motorway.
In the case of the Drogheda area, the relevant section is between the junction at CityNorth hotel and the junction just north of the river.
It's simple, if you wish to use that section, you pay. If you don't want to pay, then don't use that section.
As has been pointed out, the toll doesn't deny the use of any pre-existing road to those who are unwilling to pay.

One major problem with the 'let the locals use it for free' argument is how to decide who gets to use it for free. Should it be everyone who lives in Drogheda, within a mile/2 miles/5 miles/whatever of the Donore junction? What about people who don't live in that radius, but do work within it? If the radius is set at say 2 miles, then what about the people who live 2.1 miles away? I say 'Bugger that!' If you start introducing exemptions, where do you stop? And anyway, it could easily be argued that those who live in Drogheda get the greatest benefit from the road's existence, as their quality of life must be greatly improved by the removal of so much traffic from the town. If locals don't have to pay, then those who benefit most don't have to pay. Sorry, but that's just unfair.

Another argument is this one: Tolls are an expense involved in running a car in this country, and should be regarded as such. Tax, Insurance, Fuel, Maintenance, Tolls. You all (hopefully!) pay the first four on that list. You aren't complaining about them. The fifth is just another fact of life. Quit whining, pay the effing toll if you want to use the road, and if you don't want to pay, don't use the road.

Your choice.

borderlinemeath

locum-motion wrote: »

I can confirm that there is no toll to enter any town anywhere in the country.
In various locations, there are tolls to use certain specified stretches of motorway.
In the case of the Drogheda area, the relevant section is between the junction at CityNorth hotel and the junction just north of the river.
It's simple, if you wish to use that section, you pay. If you don't want to pay, then don't use that section.
As has been pointed out, the toll doesn't deny the use of any pre-existing road to those who are unwilling to pay.

One major problem with the 'let the locals use it for free' argument is how to decide who gets to use it for free. Should it be everyone who lives in Drogheda, within a mile/2 miles/5 miles/whatever of the Donore junction? What about people who don't live in that radius, but do work within it? If the radius is set at say 2 miles, then what about the people who live 2.1 miles away? I say 'Bugger that!' If you start introducing exemptions, where do you stop? And anyway, it could easily be argued that those who live in Drogheda get the greatest benefit from the road's existence, as their quality of life must be greatly improved by the removal of so much traffic from the town. If locals don't have to pay, then those who benefit most don't have to pay. Sorry, but that's just unfair.

Another argument is this one: Tolls are an expense involved in running a car in this country, and should be regarded as such. Tax, Insurance, Fuel, Maintenance, Tolls. You all (hopefully!) pay the first four on that list. You aren't complaining about them. The fifth is just another fact of life. Quit whining, pay the effing toll if you want to use the road, and if you don't want to pay, don't use the road.

Your choice.

So easy for you to say when you don't live in Drogheda:rolleyes:.

I don't know how it would work but as I stated in an earlier reply something like a tax rebate may work if you have a Drogheda address.

It just frustrates me that the likes of Dundalk, Swords etc have outer relief roads but Drogheda does not and ALSO has the toll.

CMpunked

Ok, so lets say that the tolls on the south side of the town are abolished and there is a separate toll erected south of the river that would ask for payment of any vehicle in either direction over the big bridge.

Surely that would lure traffic into drogheda town who are dodging the tolls. HURRAH! Great news for the business' of locality, but surely will cause even more problems with the traffic?

It seems to be that there could be a cycle of complaining there.

southlouth type

locum-motion wrote: »

I can confirm that there is no toll to enter any town anywhere in the country.
In various locations, there are tolls to use certain specified stretches of motorway.
In the case of the Drogheda area, the relevant section is between the junction at CityNorth hotel and the junction just north of the river.
It's simple, if you wish to use that section, you pay. If you don't want to pay, then don't use that section.
As has been pointed out, the toll doesn't deny the use of any pre-existing road to those who are unwilling to pay.

One major problem with the 'let the locals use it for free' argument is how to decide who gets to use it for free. Should it be everyone who lives in Drogheda, within a mile/2 miles/5 miles/whatever of the Donore junction? What about people who don't live in that radius, but do work within it? If the radius is set at say 2 miles, then what about the people who live 2.1 miles away? I say 'Bugger that!' If you start introducing exemptions, where do you stop? And anyway, it could easily be argued that those who live in Drogheda get the greatest benefit from the road's existence, as their quality of life must be greatly improved by the removal of so much traffic from the town. If locals don't have to pay, then those who benefit most don't have to pay. Sorry, but that's just unfair.

Another argument is this one: Tolls are an expense involved in running a car in this country, and should be regarded as such. Tax, Insurance, Fuel, Maintenance, Tolls. You all (hopefully!) pay the first four on that list. You aren't complaining about them. The fifth is just another fact of life. Quit whining, pay the effing toll if you want to use the road, and if you don't want to pay, don't use the road.

Your choice.

Nonsense :eek: There are 25,000 car coming through julianstown every day with most coming through Drogheda to AVIOD the toll . Thats the point ffs !

locum-motion

southlouth type wrote: »

Nonsense :eek: There are 25,000 car coming through julianstown every day with most coming through Drogheda to AVIOD the toll . Thats the point ffs !

And there are 55,000 who are not going thru J'town!

locum-motion

borderlinemeath wrote: »

So easy for you to say when you don't live in Drogheda:rolleyes:.

No, I don't. I now live in Cork, but I'm from Dundalk. So now, when I go home for the weekend, I go through 4 tolls. Do you hear me complaining about it?
For most of the last 8 or so years, I was living in Dundalk and working predominantly in Dublin. Did you hear me complaining about the toll then?

borderlinemeath wrote: »

I don't know how it would work but as I stated in an earlier reply something like a tax rebate may work if you have a Drogheda address.

So you still don't really have an answer for how you decide who gets your "rebate", do you? I mean, how do you decide what "a Drogheda address" is?
And anyway, what makes a person with a Drogheda address so fecking special that they get a rebate and someone with a Donore/Duleek/Monasterboice/
Dunleer or even Dundalk address doesn't? Why should you get to use the motorway for free and I shouldn't?

borderlinemeath wrote: »

It just frustrates me that the likes of Dundalk, Swords etc have outer relief roads but Drogheda does not and ALSO has the toll.

I'm baffled. Perhaps you could enlighten me as to which 2 parts of Drogheda you would use the toll road to get to and from (IF it wasn't tolled), that aren't easier to travel between along the dual-carriageway and the Bridge of Peace anyway?
If I wanted to get from, say, Ballsgrove to Mell, I wouldn't go anywhere near the motorway anyway, toll or no toll.

Mr_Hat

It seems to me that what Cllr Healy should focus on is not wasting his time on some populist tosh about abolishing toll, that might get him in the paper. But look at a new traffic bridge across the Boyne. Which he might just be able to pull off. I actually think he has a better chance of getting two new bridges across the boyne. Then abolishing the toll.

But I suppose that would require some real polticking and not just silly stunts and polls that get you in the paper.

I also see Cllr Healy hasnt come back to answer any of the questions put to him. Says it all really

amacachi

I'm also wondering if people realise that it's an inter-city motorway, short journeys aren't the intention of such motorways.

CMpunked

Mr_Hat wrote: »

It seems to me that what Cllr Healy should focus on is not wasting his time on some populist tosh about abolishing toll, that might get him in the paper. But look at a new traffic bridge across the Boyne.

Isnt there, or at least, wasnt there some talk of a bridge connecting the entrance to the docks over to the end of the D hotel car park at the abandoned factory?

K nacker

I think a lot posters are missing the point here. The petition is to abolish the RAMP toll on the Donore road(which Im all for) not the M1 motorway toll. Correct me if I’m wrong.