Price Plan Changes and Overall Price Increase - Q & A

Electric Ireland: David

Hi everyone,

We very much regret to inform you that ESB Electric Ireland's prices will be increased from 1st October 2011. Also, our price plan offerings have been modified, effective from today. (You can find the press release here.)

By how much is ESB Electric Ireland increasing electricity prices?

Customers will see their bills increase by approximately 12% or €2.42 per week, or €126 per year (Incl. VAT). ESB Electric Ireland unit rates and standing charges will increase by 14.8% but the effect on customer bills will be reduced to around 12% when the reduced PSO Levy (also effective 1st October) is taken into account.

We have held off implementing this increase for as long as possible. The decision to increase our rates was not taken lightly. Unfortunately, as everyone will be aware, international fuel prices have been on a steep increase over the past 12 months, with international gas prices currently running at 40% above this time last year. While we have put off increasing our prices up to now, international wholesale prices continue to stay at a very high level and it is no longer possible to sustain our current rates. The coinciding PSO reduction will help lessen the impact on customer’s bills.

Business customers will see similar increases.

Why are you increasing your prices by 14.8% when you competitors have increased by just 12.3%?

As with any other fuel dependent business - like airlines, transport and petrol stations – fluctuations in fuel prices and the timing of purchases significantly impact the underlying cost of the product. Hence in a competitive energy supply market not all prices are going to be the same. ESB Electric Ireland received pricing freedom to set our own prices in April 2011. It was only then that we could start purchasing energy for the following 12 months. We are now taking the full brunt of the significant spike in wholesale gas price increases that took place earlier this year. Unlike our competitors, we did not have the advantage of being able to purchase energy before the major gas increases in March. Sustained increases in international gas and oil prices have left us with no option but to increase prices. We have held off introducing these increases for as long as we possibly could in the hope that fuel prices would fall, but regrettably, we must reflect some of these increases in the prices we charge now.

What about your price plans announced in April? What's happened to them?

They have been replaced with new price plans effective from today. Customers who opted for our price plans introduced in April will continue to receive their agreed level of discounts up to 31st March 2012, albeit against a higher standard price from 1st October. We are maintaining our Household Budget Plan offer to customers who are experiencing difficulty and have payment arrangements in place and are making a genuine effort to meet their bills. Customers who opt for this plan will continue to receive a 6% discount on their electricity.

Details of our new price plans can be found here.

Are you increasing the price of gas to your new gas customers as well?

ESB Electric Ireland’s gas price is aligned to the regulated Bord Gáis tariff, and we will continue to provide discounts of up to 6% against the prevailing Bord Gáis Energy gas prices.

Psychedelic

ESB made an operating profit of €339 million in 2010

And now ESB are increasing prices. Disgraceful.

number_1

I've 2 questions that I hope David can answer:

1) Customers on Supersaver plans have their discounts applied until the end of March 2012. What happens after this? Do these customers revert to having no discount, paying the new standard unit rates? Or do they get transferred to these new Valuesaver plans with the lower discounts applied?

2) How does the change in the discounts affect customers on the free electricity allowance? Correct me if I'm wrong, but if I remember correctly they were put on a different (ie. not Supersaver) discount scheme which had no expiry date, continuing indefinitely beyond March 2012. Can these customers retain the higher discount levels indefinitely or will their discounts be chopped to a lower level too?

Savman

Psychedelic wrote: »

ESB made an operating profit of €339 million in 2010

And now ESB are increasing prices. Disgraceful.

Don't forget €8m on "rebranding"
http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/1020/esb.html

SimpeSam

number_1 wrote: »

I've 2 questions that I hope David can answer:

1) Customers on Supersaver plans have their discounts applied until the end of March 2012. What happens after this? Do these customers revert to having no discount, paying the new standard unit rates? Or do they get transferred to these new Valuesaver plans with the lower discounts applied?

2) How does the change in the discounts affect customers on the free electricity allowance? Correct me if I'm wrong, but if I remember correctly they were put on a different (ie. not Supersaver) discount scheme which had no expiry date, continuing indefinitely beyond March 2012. Can these customers retain the higher discount levels indefinitely or will their discounts be chopped to a lower level too?

1) As far as I'm aware, there are no clear cut intentions of what they plan to do in March 2012. Or at least, none that they have informed their staff of. They have used the line "We will continue to add value to our service for our customers", in response to this. Which is the answer you will get if you call up either Sales or Service.

2) FEA customers are currently receiving 400 free units, as opposed to receiving a sum of money in the bank or by cheque. Now, these units will be reduced to 300 as the government have made cutbacks, but their Price Plans are the same as any other customer who applied for them, be it Reward or SuperSaver, the discounts simply apply to the units used after the 400/300 threshold.

number_1

The discount scheme applied to FEA customers had no expiry date, whereas the discount (Supersaver) scheme for "normal" customers did - March 2012. The question now is whether this means that FEA customers can maintain their up-to-14% discounts for as long as they want or will this be cut along with the discounts given to "normal" customers.

ted1

Why is the standing charge going up ? These are for fixed costs that are not affected by changes in gas or oil prices.

Electric Ireland: David

number_1 wrote: »

Customers on Supersaver plans have their discounts applied until the end of March 2012. What happens after this? Do these customers revert to having no discount, paying the new standard unit rates? Or do they get transferred to these new Valuesaver plans with the lower discounts applied?... How does the change in the discounts affect customers on the free electricity allowance? Correct me if I'm wrong, but if I remember correctly they were put on a different (ie. not Supersaver) discount scheme which had no expiry date, continuing indefinitely beyond March 2012. Can these customers retain the higher discount levels indefinitely or will their discounts be chopped to a lower level too?

Hi number_1,

The discount schemes applied to FEA customers were either the Supersaver (if they were returning customers) or the Reward price plan (if they were customers of ours for 12 months or more). In other words, they were the same price plans available to other customers. The only difference of note was the way in which the discounts were shown on the bill (in the case of an FEA customer, it would show as an ex-gratia credit, which would work out the same as the discount).

When the price plans in question expire on 31st March 2012, all customers (FEA included) who were signed up to them will revert to the standard rates, as outlined in our terms and conditions. However, we would hope to have other competitive offerings available by that time.

number_1 wrote:

The discount scheme applied to FEA customers had no expiry date, whereas the discount (Supersaver) scheme for "normal" customers did - March 2012.

Our apologies if you were misinformed on this point. If you have any further questions please don't hesitate to ask.

Thanks,

David.

djrichard

There has never been a better time to switch suppliers.

.BrianJM

djrichard wrote: »

There has never been a better time to switch suppliers.

From who to who and why?

djrichard

Auld-Yin wrote: »

From who to who and why?

From whoever you are with to whichever is the cheapest because it saves you money and you dont have to fund the ridiculous wage bill that semi-state companies have.

www.bonkers.ie

Priori

djrichard wrote: »

There has never been a better time to switch suppliers.

Auld Yin wrote:

From who to who and why?

If he tells you who to switch to explicitly (although his hints are fairly obvious), he'd probably be booted off thread (again) for blowing his cover as an Airtricity agent... Hopefully there will always be a good reason to change suppliers, just like there always seems to be a tempting reason to switch mobile phone providers - isn't that what a competitive market is all about?

djrichard wrote:

www.bonkers.ie

But according to the latest bonkers.ie blog it is a semi-state that is currently cheapest (ESB), and it will be another semi-state that is cheapest after Oct 1st (BG). Your beloved Airtricity seem to be caught out in the middle there dj.

djrichard

Priori wrote: »

If he tells you who to switch to explicitly (although his hints are fairly obvious), he'd probably be booted off thread (again) for blowing his cover as an Airtricity agent... Hopefully there will always be a good reason to change suppliers, just like there always seems to be a tempting reason to switch mobile phone providers - isn't that what a competitive market is all about?



But according to the latest bonkers.ie blog it is a semi-state that is currently cheapest (ESB), and it will be another semi-state that is cheapest after Oct 1st (BG). Your beloved Airtricity seem to be caught out in the middle there dj.

Im not going to get involved in ANOTHER debate about Airtricity. Im sure everyone is getting bored of it now.

When I searched on Bonkers the results came up as Airtricity as the cheapest for electric and flogas as the cheapest for gas. If you wanted both fuels from the same supplier, then Airtricity show as the cheapest. If I didnt know something that I cannot mention here (sworn to secrecy), then I wouldve changed my gas to Flogas, but I shall just wait until we publically announce something in October.

Im backing out of this now, its in the Electric Ireland thread and as youve said, I dont want to be seen to be rocking the boat. Even though many others are allowed to.

Priori

Ah c'mon dj, I for one like it when you post here - makes it more interesting!

Boards would be an awful boring place without a little controversy.

EI: Una

ted1 wrote: »

Why is the standing charge going up ? These are for fixed costs that are not affected by changes in gas or oil prices.

Hi ted1

The single biggest change in our prices is as a direct result of increases in fuel costs. However, as part of our price review, all fixed and variable cost elements are examined to ensure that our prices reflect the costs incurred in serving customers across all consumption bands. In the case of our standing charges, these have been increased in line with the underlying costs. Had this not happened, then our percentage increase in the unit rates would have been higher.
ESB Electric Ireland has maintained the standing charges at the same level for the last four years, and our new standing charges still remain in line with our competitors.

Regards,
Una

ted1

Electric Ireland: Una wrote: »

ted1 wrote: »

Why is the standing charge going up ? These are for fixed costs that are not affected by changes in gas or oil prices.

Hi ted1

The single biggest change in our prices is as a direct result of increases in fuel costs. However, as part of our price review, all fixed and variable cost elements are examined to ensure that our prices reflect the costs incurred in serving customers across all consumption bands. In the case of our standing charges, these have been increased in line with the underlying costs. Had this not happened, then our percentage increase in the unit rates would have been higher.
ESB Electric Ireland has maintained the standing charges at the same level for the last four years, and our new standing charges still remain in line with our competitors.

Regards,
Una

How come the private industry can reduce costs and overheads but yet semi state companies can't?

djrichard

ted1 wrote: »

How come the private industry can reduce costs and overheads but yet semi state companies can't?

Massive wage bills and ridiculous bonus structure. Chief Executive at ESB gets over 700k each year!

Its great if you are an employee of ESB, they pay on average between 75-95k. Big lumbering semi-state giants are always slow to rspond to market changes. Having said that, considering youve had 2 years to change to cheaper electric, many are still with Electric Ireland on their standard rates without any discount. Loads of people Ive spoken to that havent switched in the past, were under the assumption that they had got a discount when they were allowed to set their own electric prices. Clever advertising about 17% reductions caused this. It gave me great pleasure to change over 13 Electric Ireland customers today after I pointed this out to them and asked them why they were willing to continually support astronomical wage bills, the largest price rise on their electric AND gas in the country, when the country is going through a deep recession. I advised them that the reason the fat cats are willing and able to increase the countries already most expensive electric rate by the largest increase, is because they have half of the country who are either ill-informed or too lazy to shop around. I asked them why on earth does it require me to come out and point out the obvious facts? You already actively shop around for your car insurance once a year, so why not apply the same logic to your gas and electric bills???

At the end of the day, everyone is expensive for energy bills, this situation in only going to get worse, so you have to choose the best of a bad bunch.

There isnt any point in complaining about energy prices when you have not shopped around for a better deal, its been opened up to give you the choice. We can give you the choice, but its up to you to take it. The fact that so many have not taken the choice is the exact reason that EI and BG are charging the highest rates, because you let them get away with it.

dudara

djrichard I think it might be best if you leave the comments about average pay out of this discussion, as well as the fact that you work for Airtricity. The fact a small number of employees receive high wages provides a distorted average, and it's not fair to quote it as I'm sure there are many ESB employees who receive less.

The rest of your advice urging people to shop around is spot on. Just clean up your posts a little.

dudara

djrichard

Of course the fat cats at the top of the table will cause the average wage bill to rise. I never suggested that the majority of ESB employees were on 75k+, thats why I used the word "average". I assumed people reading this have a good enough grasp of English to figure that out.

Several other threads have almost exactly the same comments by other community members, yet just because I happen to work for Airtricity its my comments that incur an official warning. I dont see that because I work for Airtricity, I should be censored or treated differently to anyone else posting on boards. Ive made it clear in the past under similar circumstances, that Im posting my own opinions. I couldnt care less what Airtricity, Bord Gais, Flogas or Electric Irelands official company lines are. Im speaking my own personal mind. Which should actually be a welcome relief to the marketing drivel we are being spoon fed.

Every single customer I have changed has been told that after one year, the discounted rates I have signed them up for, will expire. I suggest that in a years time it would be advisable to take another look at the market and seek out a better deal if there is one available. I inform them that the days of brand loyalty has long gone and the only person they should be loyal to is themselves. Obviously all the energy suppliers would prefer to give the discounted rates for 1 year and then the customer is too lazy or distracted by other things in life to shop around, thats when they start to make the real money.

In my warning today about my previous post, I was sent a pm warning accussed of "Underhanded shilling for your employer" and informed that I shouldnt be promoting Airtricity on the Electric Ireland forum as they pay boards for it. I dont believe there is anything underhand about giving good advice. Perhaps I missed out the rule that stated I wasnt allowed to talk as open and honestly in this particular forum as its being funded by another supplier. Is there a rule specific to this section of the forum? Because EI pay for it, does that mean its censored so as not to upset them and perhaps risk them not paying in the future? If this is the case, and its clearly stated in the rules, then please point it out and I shall not point out the blindingly obious facts that I stated in my post above.

I dont exactly know what "shilling" means, I checked in a dictionary and only found the old monetary reference, but I can guess from the context.

I was accussed of deliberately undermining Electric Ireland at every opportunity. I dont intentionally set out to undermine EI or anyone else, if however they set themselves up for criticism, then I WILL post about it, unless of course its pointed out to me in the rules whereby I cant comment as freely as others and have to censor any opinion I have in the EI forum here. As EI are semi-state, isnt it the Irish people who are paying for this thread themselves? Just a thought...

Have you seen me criticise flogas anywhere? No, I have not. Why not? Because they are offering a good product and as a small company, they are fighting hard to remain competative in a market surrounded by the big guns. So Im not just trying to advertise Airtricity, in all honesty I dont really care who you pay the bills to, I just like to let people know what is happening and I have very strong opinions on the matter.

In previous posts, I was heavily criticised for not mentioning that I worked for Airtricity, and asked by posters that I shouldve made it clear I worked for them. Cant win either way!

Its this diversity of opinions on almost every subject you can think of, that makes boards such a great place to be.

At the end of the day its a public forum, and I have not been abusive or insulting to anyone.

dudara

djrichard If you have a complaint about the moderation, then please take it to the Feedback forum or take it up via PM. Please do not do so on the thread.

dudara

token101

djrichard wrote: »

Massive wage bills and ridiculous bonus structure.
Its great if you are an employee of ESB, they pay on average between 75-95k. Big lumbering semi-state giants are always slow to rspond to market changes.

Yeah that's right. 75 to 90k. Wonder what Airtricity execs are on? :rolleyes: I've got two mates working for ESB in Cork and they don't even get close to a quarter of that.

Slow to change? They're on Boards aren't they???? Where are Airtricity??? Oh that's right, they're off door to door codding grannies about savings and service. Keep drinking that Kool Aid there

Priori

token101 wrote:

I've got two mates working for ESB in Cork and they don't even get close to a quarter of that.

Puts a little perspective on things, and pretty much answers ted1's question above about how semi-states cut costs and overheads!

djrichard wrote:

I never suggested that the majority of ESB employees were on 75k+, thats why I used the word "average". I assumed people reading this have a good enough grasp of English to figure that out.

But you did say:

djrichard wrote:

Its great if you are an employee of ESB, they pay on average between 75-95k.

A person with a competent and nuanced grasp of the English language will naturally assume you did mean the majority of ESB employees - otherwise it wouldn't be "great" at all to work for them, bearing in mind the ridiculous disparity between top level management and front-line staff.

djrichard wrote:

I dont believe there is anything underhand about giving good advice.

Airtricity aren't the cheapest supplier at the moment (ESB are) nor will they be after October 1st (Bord Gais will be) - source. So surely your advice should be in line with this, if it's any good?

token101 wrote:

they're off door to door codding grannies about savings and service.

No exaggeration there - that's probably why Scottish and Southern (who own them) are being forced to pull out of door to door sales:

SSE calls a halt to door to door selling

Their marketing materials were judged to be "misleading" and they were found guilty of "mis-selling"... Who knew?

I think good advice would be to steer well clear of Airtricity. Just my opinion.

Dav

djrichard wrote: »

At the end of the day its a public forum, and I have not been abusive or insulting to anyone.

No, it's not. This is a fourm hosted by Boards.ie (a private company) on behalf of and paid for by ESB Electric Ireland. The people who pay for this forum aren't asking that there be no discussion or even comparisons to their competitors, but when a person who identifies themselves as an employee of their competitor is consistently seeking to undermine their business and company and making underhanded suggestions that his own employers are a better option (or so it reads to me, and I don't imagine I'm alone), then you have crossed a line.

As I said to djrichard in the warning I sent, I will be contacting Airtricity to ask for some sort of clarification as to how they view their employees bringing their company into disrepute with such practices.

I am also banning djrichard from this forum for ignoring the warning.

Anita M.

So with the increase of 14.8% on both standing charges and charges per kwh the esb will be the same price as aritricity from October onwards. Same price so dont go and fight about who is better.

Discodog

The prices will always be about the same. Look at the UK where all competition has done is result in similar prices. The cake is big enough for all the companies to make a fortune so no one is going to rock the boat. Supermarkets are a good example where, with the exception of Lidl & Aldi, the prices will be very similar for an identical basket of goods.

KELTICKNIGHTT

not really completion when all go through esb lines,these price increases will hurt family's already struggling more,all these electric companies have excuses to raise prices,like health insurance companies,
theres only so much they can get out of people

Electric Ireland: David

Hi KELTICKNIGHTT,

KELTICKNIGHTT wrote:

these price increases will hurt family's already struggling more

We understand your concern, and held off increasing our prices for as long as possible.

We are maintaining our Household Budget Plan offer to customers who are experiencing difficulty and have payment arrangements in place and are making a genuine effort to meet their bills.

For more information on getting help to pay your bill, see here.

Thanks,

David.

paddyjoe183

Electric Ireland: David wrote: »

Hi everyone,

We very much regret to inform you that ESB Electric Ireland's prices will be increased from 1st October 2011. Also, our price plan offerings have been modified, effective from today. (You can find the press release here.)

By how much is ESB Electric Ireland increasing electricity prices?

Customers will see their bills increase by approximately 12% or €2.42 per week, or €126 per year (Incl. VAT). ESB Electric Ireland unit rates and standing charges will increase by 14.8% but the effect on customer bills will be reduced to around 12% when the reduced PSO Levy (also effective 1st October) is taken into account.

We have held off implementing this increase for as long as possible. The decision to increase our rates was not taken lightly. Unfortunately, as everyone will be aware, international fuel prices have been on a steep increase over the past 12 months, with international gas prices currently running at 40% above this time last year. While we have put off increasing our prices up to now, international wholesale prices continue to stay at a very high level and it is no longer possible to sustain our current rates. The coinciding PSO reduction will help lessen the impact on customer’s bills.

Business customers will see similar increases.

Why are you increasing your prices by 14.8% when you competitors have increased by just 12.3%?

As with any other fuel dependent business - like airlines, transport and petrol stations – fluctuations in fuel prices and the timing of purchases significantly impact the underlying cost of the product. Hence in a competitive energy supply market not all prices are going to be the same. ESB Electric Ireland received pricing freedom to set our own prices in April 2011. It was only then that we could start purchasing energy for the following 12 months. We are now taking the full brunt of the significant spike in wholesale gas price increases that took place earlier this year. Unlike our competitors, we did not have the advantage of being able to purchase energy before the major gas increases in March. Sustained increases in international gas and oil prices have left us with no option but to increase prices. We have held off introducing these increases for as long as we possibly could in the hope that fuel prices would fall, but regrettably, we must reflect some of these increases in the prices we charge now.

What about your price plans announced in April? What's happened to them?

They have been replaced with new price plans effective from today. Customers who opted for our price plans introduced in April will continue to receive their agreed level of discounts up to 31st March 2012, albeit against a higher standard price from 1st October. We are maintaining our Household Budget Plan offer to customers who are experiencing difficulty and have payment arrangements in place and are making a genuine effort to meet their bills. Customers who opt for this plan will continue to receive a 6% discount on their electricity.

Details of our new price plans can be found here.

Are you increasing the price of gas to your new gas customers as well?

ESB Electric Ireland’s gas price is aligned to the regulated Bord Gáis tariff, and we will continue to provide discounts of up to 6% against the prevailing Bord Gáis Energy gas prices.

Bull****! Bank increasing the mortgage rates then ESB go and stick their prices up! BALLS! :mad:

jor el

paddyjoe183, keep it civil or we will remove your posting privileges.

Hal Emmerich

The first episode of the new Season of Watchdog on BBC1 had a big overly complicated (mainly due to the Power Companies over there making it so with the over 400 hundred different Tariffs with just £22 in the difference:eek: of them all) segment, that at the end, concluded after talking to all the appropiate experts/companies that Wholesale prices are now lower than November 2010 Levels and Electricity prices should have come down over the Summer not went up.

More than obvious with the record profits these last few years, more than a joke to tell Customers otherwise.

I'd been meaning to check/switch supplier and held off till the usual Winter price hikes were in and just checked Bonkers there, Bord Gais cheapest for me now as a result of ESB hike.

24 Tariffs poped up (1 with a supposedly €70 saving that is actually more expensive than what I'm currently on as far as I can see)

12 Airtricity (UK Company at similar crack here with the Tariffs)
7 Electric Ireland
5 Bord Gais

overly complicated to wade through.

Watchdog.

Anita M.

paddyjoe183 wrote: »

Bull****! Bank increasing the mortgage rates then ESB go and stick their prices up! BALLS! :mad:

paddyjoe183, keep it civil or we will remove your posting privileges.
yes paddyjoe183 it should have been civil b?lls!